WBB: Stanford 61 USC 74 - Printable Version

WBB: Stanford 61 USC 74 - Printable Version

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WBB: Stanford 61 USC 74 - 81alum - 03-09-2024

Preview:

We take on USC for the Pac 12 Tournament Championship Sunday, 2pm. The game is televised on ESPN.

USC survived double overtime against UCLA on Friday, and phenom Juju Watkins tweeked an ankle, to advance. We survived a dismal first half and came from 16 points behind to defeat Oregon State to advance.

Ranking: AP Stanford 2, USC 5. Coaches Stanford 2, USC 8.
NET: Stanford 2 USC 13
Massey: Stanford 2 USC 12
Records: Stanford 28-4 USC 25-5

Our last preview and thread on the (only) USC game we played this year can be found here:

https://thecardboard.org/board/showthread.php?tid=24751&pid=407835&highlight=WBB%3A+Stanford+58#pid407835

To review, we lost at Maples 58-67 in a game that was winnable despite Juju Watkins hitting 51 points. So much attention was focused on her phenomenal night that our own anemic offense against the USC defense was overlooked. Tara said as much in the presser, words to the effect that "we could have survived Juju's night if we had run our own offense efficiently."

This is important to remember, because Watkins might (or might not) be hobbled. She tweaked an ankle in the UCLA win, went out, came back in, and helped them to win, but was noticeably limping after the game. But if Watkins does not score 51 this will create opportunities for other talented USC players to score, so a USC without Watkins at 100% is not necessarily going to lose a dramatic amount of offense--some yes, but it is not like you can subtract 51 from their final score.

But if we score only 58 points against their defense, we will lose, no matter what Watkins does or does not do. So getting our offense on track against yet another overly physical, athletic, and talented defense is critical. Here are a few Tara quotes about that first game:

Quote:"It is early enough in the season that our team can learn and listen and improve. We cannot expect to beat a really good team taking the shots that we took, turning the ball over the way we turned it over, not getting O-boards, and not keeping THEM off the glass....We did not give ourselves a chance....It's disappointing. We are better than that....I think you will see a much more competitive game on Sunday."

"Once you start taking bad shots then even your good ones don't go in."

"We could have survived her 51 points if we are running offense and we are not turning the ball over and we are getting on the O-boards and we are playing the way we are capable of."

So, our priority has to be to defend Watkins as well as possible but to get our own offense into high gear to outscore Watkins and company. That is easier said than done. USC is the team I least wanted to play in the finals--and we could face them again in the NCAAs if both teams keep winning. But somehow it is fitting and just that we do face them. A victory will be redemptive, if it comes.

Watkins is such a versatile player that she defies scouting report defense. For example, when we played USC at Maples the vast majority of her 51 points were jump shots--often with a hand in her face. Yes, she got open some of the time, but she was draining perfect net-only jumpers even when well defended. She is tall enough that none of our guards bother her on jumpshots, but athletic enough to drive around any player her own size or taller. Against us, she really did not need to drive.

But last night, the vast majority of her shots were on drives to the basket and free throws. Just like Kelsey Plum, Juju drives and leaps into defenders while shooting acrobatic shots that almost always go in, or that generating fouls and free throws. Some of the best body control in the game. Last night, 14 of her 33 points game on free throws. Against us last time, 17 of her points came on free throws. So she does not only score, she knocks opposing players out of games.

I have no idea what we can do to defend her. Agara is the right height to defender her, but cannot keep up with her lateral speed. Lepolo has the lateral speed but gives up 7 inches. Not quite as much as Londyn Jones gave up trying to defend her at times last night. Charisma Osborne did a very creditable job last night but gives up 5 inches, and even her excellent defense did not stop 33 points. I think we will be lucky to keep Watkins in the 30s, unless her injury prevents her from playing.

Something we can control more is our own offense, and what we do against the USC defense. We were pretty cold against USC last time out. We did not take that many three point shots and missed those we did. And Brink and Iriafen were not efficient inside, going 10/32 collectively. USC tied us in rebounding and had more O-boards than we did. Rayah Marshall fouled out but not before she messed up our inside game sufficiently. Watkins was the offense (Forbes had 12, no one else on USC more than 2) and that left 4 players free to concentrate on defense. And we wound up shooting a miserable 32% on offense. We will need more than the 3 offensive threats of Brink, Iriafen, and Jump. We will need some genuine production out of Lepolo, Bosgana, and the bench if we expect to win. We may need to score close to 80 points, and the USC defense is not a sieve.

All in all, a great opportunity for us to redeem ourselves. But a very tough task ahead.

RE: WBB: Stanford vs. USC 2pm Sunday Pac 12 Tourney Championship - M T - 03-09-2024

Great preview as always.

Naturally your preview focuses on the opponent’s strengths and our weaknesses.

I think it would be interesting if someone wrote a preview of Stanford from the point of view of the opponent.

RE: WBB: Stanford vs. USC 2pm Sunday Pac 12 Tourney Championship - Maple Leaf - 03-09-2024

(03-09-2024, 09:36 AM)81alum Wrote: Preview:

We take on USC for the Pac 12 Tournament Championship Sunday, 2pm. The game is televised on ESPN.

USC survived double overtime against UCLA on Friday, and phenom Juju Watkins tweeked an ankle, to advance. We survived a dismal first half and came from 16 points behind to defeat Oregon State to advance.

Ranking: AP Stanford 2, USC 5. Coaches Stanford 2, USC 8.
NET: Stanford 2 USC 13
Massey: Stanford 2 USC 12
Records: Stanford 28-4 USC 25-5

Our last preview and thread on the (only) USC game we played this year can be found here:

https://thecardboard.org/board/showthread.php?tid=24751&pid=407835&highlight=WBB%3A+Stanford+58#pid407835

To review, we lost at Maples 58-67 in a game that was winnable despite Juju Watkins hitting 51 points. So much attention was focused on her phenomenal night that our own anemic offense against the USC defense was overlooked. Tara said as much in the presser, words to the effect that "we could have survived Juju's night if we had run our own offense efficiently."

This is important to remember, because Watkins might (or might not) be hobbled. She tweaked an ankle in the UCLA win, went out, came back in, and helped them to win, but was noticeably limping after the game. But if Watkins does not score 51 this will create opportunities for other talented USC players to score, so a USC without Watkins at 100% is not necessarily going to lose a dramatic amount of offense--some yes, but it is not like you can subtract 51 from their final score.

But if we score only 58 points against their defense, we will lose, no matter what Watkins does or does not do. So getting our offense on track against yet another overly physical, athletic, and talented defense is critical. Here are a few Tara quotes about that first game:

Quote:"It is early enough in the season that our team can learn and listen and improve. We cannot expect to beat a really good team taking the shots that we took, turning the ball over the way we turned it over, not getting O-boards, and not keeping THEM off the glass....We did not give ourselves a chance....It's disappointing. We are better than that....I think you will see a much more competitive game on Sunday."

"Once you start taking bad shots then even your good ones don't go in."

"We could have survived her 51 points if we are running offense and we are not turning the ball over and we are getting on the O-boards and we are playing the way we are capable of."

So, our priority has to be to defend Watkins as well as possible but to get our own offense into high gear to outscore Watkins and company. That is easier said than done. USC is the team I least wanted to play in the finals--and we could face them again in the NCAAs if both teams keep winning. But somehow it is fitting and just that we do face them. A victory will be redemptive, if it comes.

Watkins is such a versatile player that she defies scouting report defense. For example, when we played USC at Maples the vast majority of her 51 points were jump shots--often with a hand in her face. Yes, she got open some of the time, but she was draining perfect net-only jumpers even when well defended. She is tall enough that none of our guards bother her on jumpshots, but athletic enough to drive around any player her own size or taller. Against us, she really did not need to drive.

But last night, the vast majority of her shots were on drives to the basket and free throws. Just like Kelsey Plum, Juju drives and leaps into defenders while shooting acrobatic shots that almost always go in, or that generating fouls and free throws. Some of the best body control in the game. Last night, 14 of her 33 points game on free throws. Against us last time, 17 of her points came on free throws. So she does not only score, she knocks opposing players out of games.

I have no idea what we can do to defend her. Agara is the right height to defender her, but cannot keep up with her lateral speed. Lepolo has the lateral speed but gives up 7 inches. Not quite as much as Londyn Jones gave up trying to defend her at times last night. Charisma Osborne did a very creditable job last night but gives up 5 inches, and even her excellent defense did not stop 33 points. I think we will be lucky to keep Watkins in the 30s, unless her injury prevents her from playing.

Something we can control more is our own offense, and what we do against the USC defense. We were pretty cold against USC last time out. We did not take that many three point shots and missed those we did. And Brink and Iriafen were not efficient inside, going 10/32 collectively. USC tied us in rebounding and had more O-boards than we did. Rayah Marshall fouled out but not before she messed up our inside game sufficiently. Watkins was the offense (Forbes had 12, no one else on USC more than 2) and that left 4 players free to concentrate on defense. And we wound up shootings a miserable 32% on offense. We will need more than the 3 offensive threats of Brink, Iriafen, and Jump. We will need some genuine production out of Lepolo, Bosgana, and the bench if we expect to win. We may need to score close to 80 points, and the USC defense is not a sieve.

All in all, a great opportunity for us to redeem ourselves. But a very tough task ahead.

Oregon State did a very good job in defending Watkins and that was without Beers playing. It seemed that OSU did a good job of getting a hand up in her face when she started to shoot. OSU has two guards that are 6'-1" each who played 23 and 31 minutes and one that is 6'-2" who played 17 minutes. Don't know how much time they spent guarding Watkins. The OSU coach is know for his ability to develop a defensive game plan to slow down the other team's best shooters.

76lsjumb - 76lsjumb - 03-09-2024

Seems to me that a box and one is clearly the best defense against Watkins. 4 players on her and 1 player on everyone else…

RE: WBB: Stanford vs. USC 2pm Sunday Pac 12 Tourney Championship - BillBradley - 03-09-2024

I was glad to see Tara use the 2-3 zone against OSU. I'd love for her to roll it out against USC too. Padilla is a great 3 point shooter, but I'd like to see the rest launch some deep ones with tired legs. There's rebounding risk to using a zone, but we did fine against OSU who is a great rebounding team also.

I thought Osborne did a great job defending Juju. Yes she got 33, but 1) It was a double OT game and 2) She was 9-27 from the field and 1-6 from 3. If we can hold her to that level of efficiency, we'll win going away even if she gets 30+.

Last note - I don't think there's any chance that Juju doesn't play tomorrow. She will be ready to go, just like Cam. They are both warriors. That said, there's a reason that both of them are struggling shooting. Physicality, less calls, their bodies are banged up...We really need to match physicality tomorrow or we'll be in trouble. No Stanford nice!

RE: WBB: Stanford vs. USC 2pm Sunday Pac 12 Tourney Championship - glovsave - 03-09-2024

(03-09-2024, 09:36 AM)81alum Wrote: Preview:

We take on USC for the Pac 12 Tournament Championship Sunday, 2pm. The game is televised on ESPN.

USC survived double overtime against UCLA on Friday, and phenom Juju Watkins tweeked an ankle, to advance. We survived a dismal first half and came from 16 points behind to defeat Oregon State to advance.

Ranking: AP Stanford 2, USC 5. Coaches Stanford 2, USC 8.
NET: Stanford 2 USC 13
Massey: Stanford 2 USC 12
Records: Stanford 28-4 USC 25-5

Our last preview and thread on the (only) USC game we played this year can be found here:

https://thecardboard.org/board/showthread.php?tid=24751&pid=407835&highlight=WBB%3A+Stanford+58#pid407835

To review, we lost at Maples 58-67 in a game that was winnable despite Juju Watkins hitting 51 points. So much attention was focused on her phenomenal night that our own anemic offense against the USC defense was overlooked. Tara said as much in the presser, words to the effect that "we could have survived Juju's night if we had run our own offense efficiently."

This is important to remember, because Watkins might (or might not) be hobbled. She tweaked an ankle in the UCLA win, went out, came back in, and helped them to win, but was noticeably limping after the game. But if Watkins does not score 51 this will create opportunities for other talented USC players to score, so a USC without Watkins at 100% is not necessarily going to lose a dramatic amount of offense--some yes, but it is not like you can subtract 51 from their final score.

But if we score only 58 points against their defense, we will lose, no matter what Watkins does or does not do. So getting our offense on track against yet another overly physical, athletic, and talented defense is critical. Here are a few Tara quotes about that first game:

Quote:"It is early enough in the season that our team can learn and listen and improve. We cannot expect to beat a really good team taking the shots that we took, turning the ball over the way we turned it over, not getting O-boards, and not keeping THEM off the glass....We did not give ourselves a chance....It's disappointing. We are better than that....I think you will see a much more competitive game on Sunday."

"Once you start taking bad shots then even your good ones don't go in."

"We could have survived her 51 points if we are running offense and we are not turning the ball over and we are getting on the O-boards and we are playing the way we are capable of."

So, our priority has to be to defend Watkins as well as possible but to get our own offense into high gear to outscore Watkins and company. That is easier said than done. USC is the team I least wanted to play in the finals--and we could face them again in the NCAAs if both teams keep winning. But somehow it is fitting and just that we do face them. A victory will be redemptive, if it comes.

Watkins is such a versatile player that she defies scouting report defense. For example, when we played USC at Maples the vast majority of her 51 points were jump shots--often with a hand in her face. Yes, she got open some of the time, but she was draining perfect net-only jumpers even when well defended. She is tall enough that none of our guards bother her on jumpshots, but athletic enough to drive around any player her own size or taller. Against us, she really did not need to drive.

But last night, the vast majority of her shots were on drives to the basket and free throws. Just like Kelsey Plum, Juju drives and leaps into defenders while shooting acrobatic shots that almost always go in, or that generating fouls and free throws. Some of the best body control in the game. Last night, 14 of her 33 points game on free throws. Against us last time, 17 of her points came on free throws. So she does not only score, she knocks opposing players out of games.

I have no idea what we can do to defend her. Agara is the right height to defender her, but cannot keep up with her lateral speed. Lepolo has the lateral speed but gives up 7 inches. Not quite as much as Londyn Jones gave up trying to defend her at times last night. Charisma Osborne did a very creditable job last night but gives up 5 inches, and even her excellent defense did not stop 33 points. I think we will be lucky to keep Watkins in the 30s, unless her injury prevents her from playing.

Something we can control more is our own offense, and what we do against the USC defense. We were pretty cold against USC last time out. We did not take that many three point shots and missed those we did. And Brink and Iriafen were not efficient inside, going 10/32 collectively. USC tied us in rebounding and had more O-boards than we did. Rayah Marshall fouled out but not before she messed up our inside game sufficiently. Watkins was the offense (Forbes had 12, no one else on USC more than 2) and that left 4 players free to concentrate on defense. And we wound up shootings a miserable 32% on offense. We will need more than the 3 offensive threats of Brink, Iriafen, and Jump. We will need some genuine production out of Lepolo, Bosgana, and the bench if we expect to win. We may need to score close to 80 points, and the USC defense is not a sieve.

All in all, a great opportunity for us to redeem ourselves. But a very tough task ahead.

As the PAC-12 winds down, some thoughts.

81, thank you for another season of previews. They're appointment reading for me and really help me get ready for the games.

For all the carping about officiating I hope deep down all of you are enjoying the moment. This team, at this time.

The under tone of melancholy as the PAC-12 comes to an end is certainly understandable. It breaks my heart as well. If I could send a message to the new PAC-12 commissioner it would be one of hope. As in, don't engage in any conference agreements that prevent you from uncoupling for the purpose of returning to a new version of the Pacific Athletic Conference. It wouldn't be a surprise to see the long travel requirements to the east coast for conference games to quickly become untenable, followed by a desire to reform the PAC. Sans U$C of course.

I've enjoyed the discourse here on the Cardboard this season and will be cheering the team tomorrow and into the Dance.

Go Card!

RE: WBB: Stanford vs. USC 2pm Sunday Pac 12 Tourney Championship - qwerty49 - 03-09-2024

UCLA did a good job of physically collapsing on Watkins when she drove the key; less so when Watkins could get a step on the defender and drive the right side. I think the bad ankle also had an effect on her ability to get the mid-range jumper off. But Close seems to be the new CTT when it comes to coaching maul-ball.

At least we won't have to defend Beers or Betts for a while. Both of them were so hard to stop on those turnaround muscle shots.

All in all, I'd rather be playing USC than UCLA. Let's see who steps up tomorrow.

RE: WBB: Stanford vs. USC 2pm Sunday Pac 12 Tourney Championship - M T - 03-09-2024

(03-09-2024, 02:45 PM)glovsave Wrote: The under tone of melancholy as the PAC-12 comes to an end is certainly understandable. It breaks my heart as well. If I could send a message to the new PAC-12 ....

I am really hoping Stanford can send a message to USC on Sunday.

RE: WBB: Stanford vs. USC 2pm Sunday Pac 12 Tourney Championship - martyup - 03-09-2024

This game is the classic contest of good vs evil, light side vs dark side, good guys vs bad guys, league traitors vs league champions. Stanford cannot lose. It's pre-ordained.

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RE: WBB: Stanford vs. USC 2pm Sunday Pac 12 Tourney Championship - 81alum - 03-09-2024

(03-09-2024, 05:59 PM)martyup Wrote: This game is the classic contest of good vs evil, light side vs dark side, good guys vs bad guys, league traitors vs league champions. Stanford cannot lose. It's pre-ordained.

I want to agree, given that USC represents everything that is wrong with athletics, plus I have hated them for decades. But USC has three Ivy league transfers on their roster, giving me a major case of cognitive dissonance.

RE: WBB: Stanford vs. USC 2pm Sunday Pac 12 Tourney Championship - martyup - 03-09-2024

I hope the team doesn't forget to spring forward. Don't want them to be late for the game.

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RE: WBB: Stanford vs. USC 2pm Sunday Pac 12 Tourney Championship - BostonCard - 03-09-2024

(03-09-2024, 05:59 PM)martyup Wrote: This game is the classic contest of good vs evil, light side vs dark side, good guys vs bad guys, league traitors vs league champions. Stanford cannot lose. It's pre-ordained.

The universe does not weep when the sun sets.

RE: WBB: Stanford vs. USC 2pm Sunday Pac 12 Tourney Championship - Nan3cy - 03-09-2024

(03-09-2024, 09:27 PM)martyup Wrote: I hope the team doesn't forget to spring forward. Don't want them to be late for the game.

That could be a bit too much of a halftime deficit to overcome.

RE: WBB: Stanford vs. USC 2pm Sunday Pac 12 Tourney Championship - M T - 03-10-2024

While you've probably set your DVR to record ESPN from 2-4 Pacific Daylight Liars Time, you might also want to record PAC-12 Bay Area from 4 to 6 PM, which is labelled "Basketball Post Game", just in case Stanford wins. Hmmm... You might even want to start recording that at 3:30 in case our game finishes early.

Gads, it's 4AM already! Where did the time go?

RE: WBB: Stanford vs. USC 2pm Sunday Pac 12 Tourney Championship - mbdude - 03-10-2024

close was upset about ft disparity, 37 to 17.
feels Watkins gets benefit of calls. approximately 1/4 of Watkins points come at free throw line. be interesting to see what happens today on national TV

RE: WBB: Stanford vs. USC 2pm Sunday Pac 12 Tourney Championship - 81alum - 03-10-2024

(03-10-2024, 11:15 AM)mbdude Wrote: close was upset about ft disparity, 37 to 17.
feels Watkins gets benefit of calls. approximately 1/4 of Watkins points come at free throw line. be interesting to see what happens today on national TV

Watkins is very Plum-like that way.

RE: WBB: Stanford vs. USC 2pm Sunday Pac 12 Tourney Championship - Griffins78 - 03-10-2024

One of my favorite experiences following Stanford teams to the post season on the road is when the Stanford Band sends the team off. For those not here in Las Vegas I hope these two video links work and you get a chance to see and feel the Stanford pre-game vibe

Video 1
Video 2 team entrance

RE: WBB: Stanford vs. USC 2pm Sunday Pac 12 Tourney Championship - 76lsjumb - 03-10-2024

(03-09-2024, 11:05 PM)Nan3cy Wrote:
(03-09-2024, 09:27 PM)martyup Wrote: I hope the team doesn't forget to spring forward. Don't want them to be late for the game.

That could be a bit too much of a halftime deficit to overcome.

Well, we won the last two games without showing up for the first half. No reason we couldn’t do it again…

RE: WBB: Stanford vs. USC 2pm Sunday Pac 12 Tourney Championship - 81alum - 03-10-2024

(03-10-2024, 12:59 PM)Griffins78 Wrote: One of my favorite experiences following Stanford teams to the post season on the road is when the Stanford Band sends the team off. For those not here in Las Vegas I hope these two video links work and you get a chance to see and feel the Stanford pre-game vibe

Video 1
Video 2 team entrance

Beautiful! Thank you for video and posting!

RE: WBB: Stanford vs. USC 2pm Sunday Pac 12 Tourney Championship - old spanish trail - 03-10-2024

(03-10-2024, 12:59 PM)Griffins78 Wrote: One of my favorite experiences following Stanford teams to the post season on the road is when the Stanford Band sends the team off. For those not here in Las Vegas I hope these two video links work and you get a chance to see and feel the Stanford pre-game vibe

Video 1
Video 2 team entrance

Thanks. Fun.