Men's BB: Stanford 53 -- Colorado 70 :•( - Printable Version
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RE: Men's BB: Stanford vs Colorado, 7 pm Saturday, ESPNU - JJJ - 02-19-2022
(02-19-2022, 09:50 PM)martyup Wrote: This is just sad.
I second that emotion.
(02-19-2022, 09:51 PM)JJJ Wrote:(02-19-2022, 09:50 PM)martyup Wrote: This is just sad.
I second that emotion.
Can we be last year's Oregon State?
RE: Men's BB: Stanford vs Colorado, 7 pm Saturday, ESPNU - PVTree - 02-19-2022
We're outscored 41-22 in the second half and lost 70-53.
Yet another sad February outing.
RE: Men's BB: Stanford vs Colorado, 7 pm Saturday, ESPNU - BostonCard - 02-19-2022
Somehow the score was worse than my expectations, and then seeing how we got there makes it even worse.
BC
RE: Men's BB: Stanford vs Colorado, 7 pm Saturday, ESPNU - JJJ - 02-19-2022
(02-19-2022, 09:57 PM)BostonCard Wrote: Somehow the score was worse than my expectations, and then seeing how we got there makes it even worse.
BC
Baseball had me deflated to begin with. This didn't help. And I even wore my lucky Casey Jacobsen jersey!
RE: Men's BB: Stanford vs Colorado, 7 pm Saturday, ESPNU - chrisk - 02-19-2022
(02-19-2022, 09:55 PM)PVTree Wrote: We're outscored 41-22 in the second half and lost 70-53.
Yet another sad February outing.
It was tied with 12 minutes to go. Outscored 25-8 from that point.
RE: Men's BB: Stanford 53 -- Colorado 70 :•( - burger - 02-19-2022
The offense was a trainwreck tonight (and most of this season).
Every possession begins with someone starting to drive, getting stopped by the defense, and then desperately searching for someone to pass to. By the time we reset, the shot clock is under 10, and we end up with a bad shot.
Was Raynaud suspended for the first half? Or was this just the another inexplicable lineup decision by Haase this season.
Hard to see us beating Cal next week.
RE: Men's BB: Stanford vs Colorado, 7 pm Saturday, ESPNU - needle - 02-19-2022
These players are just soft. They have no pride. I am embarrassed for them.
Who on this team is angry? No one, and that is the problem.
RE: Men's BB: Stanford vs Colorado, 7 pm Saturday, ESPNU - martyup - 02-19-2022
(02-19-2022, 10:27 PM)needle Wrote: These players are just soft. They have no pride. I am embarrassed for them.
Who on this team is angry? No one, and that is the problem.
Delaire is angry at the refs every time he gets his shot blocked or misses from under the basket.
RE: Men's BB: Stanford vs Colorado, 7 pm Saturday, ESPNU - FarmTeam - 02-19-2022
(02-19-2022, 10:27 PM)needle Wrote: These players are just soft. They have no pride. I am embarrassed for them.
Who on this team is angry? No one, and that is the problem.
I hate these lazy, knee-jerk responses. I was at the game, am close enough to hear them talk, and they're playing hard. It's Haase, not the players. He doesn't put them in a position to succeed. The offensive scheme makes zero sense for this roster, and the substitution patterns are baffling. All the forced shots as time is running out on the shot clock are on the coach. Seriously. Haase needs to go x1000.
RE: Men's BB: Stanford 53 -- Colorado 70 :•( - needle - 02-19-2022
Effort is not the same thing as toughness. Hustle does little to reduce turnovers. The team lacks the ability to function in high-pressure situations, and there’s not an individual with the determination to take it upon himself to at least try to lead and hold others accountable during these crucial stretches.
RE: Men's BB: Stanford 53 -- Colorado 70 :•( - Phogge - 02-19-2022
Farm team... they have almost zero at PG. If you say they played hard I believe you.
They just aren’t very good basketball players. Did they draw more than 500?
RE: Men's BB: Stanford 53 -- Colorado 70 :•( - old spanish trail - 02-20-2022
Didn't get to watch the game, but looked at the stats. Has Ingram hit the wall? Did Raynaud play enuf? Wha happened in the last 15 minutes? Were they having any fun at all? Crowd?
RE: Men's BB: Stanford 53 -- Colorado 70 :•( - cardfan77 - 02-20-2022
Another unbearable game to watch. Haase substitution patterns are wild and make zero sense. How do you have Kisunas and Beskind on the court at the same time. The defense only has to focus on the 3 other players. Haase has played Beskind a lot this season and I just don’t understand why. I’m sure he is a great kid and practices hard.
Another imploding season.
Hopefully the women’s team play a more inspiring game against the Quacks and deliver a positive result
RE: Men's BB: Stanford 53 -- Colorado 70 :•( - Phogge - 02-20-2022
Five Davis Harbours could beat this team... easily.
Yeah Haase can get five stars but he is blind to kids like Mendez, Moseley and Sauer who are smart and play hard every minute they are on the court. There are no glue players on his teams.
RE: Men's BB: Stanford 53 -- Colorado 70 :•( - gailtate - 02-20-2022
(02-20-2022, 08:13 AM)Phogge Wrote: Five Davis Harbours could beat this team... easily.
Yeah Haase can get five stars but he is blind to kids like Mendez, Moseley and Sauer who are smart and play hard every minute they are on the court. There are no glue players on his teams.
The Glue Factor is a facet of coaching. Yes, the HC isn't out there on the floor but he must know everything his system needs, recruit to it and instill the style that the system calls for. What little I've seen of Haase's teams, year after year, is a dog's breakfast: there is no Haase System. Yes, he manages to get some skilled basketball athletes but once they're here? Bupkis, for the most part. Or, how Gertrude Stein described Oaktown. Haase is another one who must be shown the door that Bernie can't find.
RE: Men's BB: Stanford vs Colorado, 7 pm Saturday, ESPNU - winflop - 02-21-2022
(02-19-2022, 10:58 PM)FarmTeam Wrote:(02-19-2022, 10:27 PM)needle Wrote: These players are just soft. They have no pride. I am embarrassed for them.
Who on this team is angry? No one, and that is the problem.
I hate these lazy, knee-jerk responses. I was at the game, am close enough to hear them talk, and they're playing hard. It's Haase, not the players. He doesn't put them in a position to succeed. The offensive scheme makes zero sense for this roster, and the substitution patterns are baffling. All the forced shots as time is running out on the shot clock are on the coach. Seriously. Haase needs to go x1000.
I don't know enough to question Haase's methods, and I doubt any of us does unless we've played or coached at this level.
I just know that the results aren't good enough, the team fades at the end of the season, and Maples is cavernous and silent. That's why we need a new HC.
RE: Men's BB: Stanford 53 -- Colorado 70 :•( - Sam Leopold - 02-21-2022
Actually, there does appear to be a Haase System, to wit:
![[Image: rnbqkbnr_pppppppp_8_8_PPPPPPPP_PPPPPPPP_...PPPPPP.gif]](https://chessgames.com/fen/p88/rnbqkbnr_pppppppp_8_8_PPPPPPPP_PPPPPPPP_PPPPPPPP_PPPPPPPP.gif)
Someone hinted at it in an earlier thread, when claiming that our players are not interchangeable. This works just fine at a place like UAB, which is known for this sort of thing, and where Haase effected his previous tourney appearance. It doesn't work so well here, certainly not with our current personnel.
Stanford has been known for size since before I became a fan of the program and we should implement a vision that plays to that.
RE: Men's BB: Stanford 53 -- Colorado 70 :•( - BillBradley - 02-21-2022
Coaches all have their philosophies and their preferred styles of play. Examples:
Coach K has gone on record multiple times saying they really don't have plays at Duke. They are more like spots on the floor and a loose set of movement rules and the players themselves get to read and create on their own. The advantage is that they are very hard to prepare for as the offense is unstructured and unpredictable. he can also intermingled players as its largely positionless. But you need the right type of player - not just highly talented but also a high enough bball iq to make the right reads and everyone needs to be a good passer. As a side note, after he coached Banchero in international play he talked about how much he loved his feel for the game. Always in the right place and always making the right reads.
Tara manages games at a finer level of detail. The offense is based on the Princeton system which allows for lots of scripted plays and very defined positions and movements. Practically all plays are called from the bench. Players are often substituted like for like.
Monty was an efficiency guy. He wanted lots of low block touches and shots, wings who could shoot the sh!t out of it, and tough as nails point guards. The offense was based around the principle that if we get these guys these shots at these spots, we will out-efficient you. But it was highly structured and if you were a wing who didn't shoot it well you didn't playmuch, regardless of your talent level. Posts played post positions and they didn't get to roam around the perimeter and shoot threes.
There are tons of other styles and many that are based on slower tempo, like the Virginia's and Wisconsin's who want to play slow, highly structured offense, go deep into the shot clock and win the possession game. Turnovers are cardinal wins as are o boards by the opposition.
Haase seems to be all over the place. It seems like he leans toward the Duke philosophy of unstructured play where everyone is on equal footing and everyone has the green light with lots of freedom. Positions aren't well defined. he's got guys shooting who can't shoot, guys attacking when nothing is there, the ball doesn't move because players are confused, strange combinations because he thinks all his players can play positionless basketball, posts shooting threes, etc, etc. He clearly hasn't recruited the kind of player who can play the Duke style. Not sure what the answer is at this point to get the ball moving and to eliminate confusion on the court, but it sure is painful to watch!
RE: Men's BB: Stanford 53 -- Colorado 70 :•( - magnus - 02-21-2022
(02-20-2022, 01:33 AM)cardfan77 Wrote: Another unbearable game to watch. Haase substitution patterns are wild and make zero sense. How do you have Kisunas and Beskind on the court at the same time. The defense only has to focus on the 3 other players. Haase has played Beskind a lot this season and I just don’t understand why. I’m sure he is a great kid and practices hard.
Kisunas and Beskind started due to Senior Night. They actually left the game with a 5 pt or so lead after 4 minutes.
RE: Men's BB: Stanford 53 -- Colorado 70 :•( - burger - 02-21-2022
(02-21-2022, 12:30 PM)BillBradley Wrote: Coaches all have their philosophies and their preferred styles of play. Examples:
Coach K has gone on record multiple times saying they really don't have plays at Duke. They are more like spots on the floor and a loose set of movement rules and the players themselves get to read and create on their own. The advantage is that they are very hard to prepare for as the offense is unstructured and unpredictable. he can also intermingled players as its largely positionless. But you need the right type of player - not just highly talented but also a high enough bball iq to make the right reads and everyone needs to be a good passer. As a side note, after he coached Banchero in international play he talked about how much he loved his feel for the game. Always in the right place and always making the right reads.
Tara manages games at a finer level of detail. The offense is based on the Princeton system which allows for lots of scripted plays and very defined positions and movements. Practically all plays are called from the bench. Players are often substituted like for like.
Monty was an efficiency guy. He wanted lots of low block touches and shots, wings who could shoot the sh!t out of it, and tough as nails point guards. The offense was based around the principle that if we get these guys these shots at these spots, we will out-efficient you. But it was highly structured and if you were a wing who didn't shoot it well you didn't playmuch, regardless of your talent level. Posts played post positions and they didn't get to roam around the perimeter and shoot threes.
There are tons of other styles and many that are based on slower tempo, like the Virginia's and Wisconsin's who want to play slow, highly structured offense, go deep into the shot clock and win the possession game. Turnovers are cardinal wins as are o boards by the opposition.
Haase seems to be all over the place. It seems like he leans toward the Duke philosophy of unstructured play where everyone is on equal footing and everyone has the green light with lots of freedom. Positions aren't well defined. he's got guys shooting who can't shoot, guys attacking when nothing is there, the ball doesn't move because players are confused, strange combinations because he thinks all his players can play positionless basketball, posts shooting threes, etc, etc. He clearly hasn't recruited the kind of player who can play the Duke style. Not sure what the answer is at this point to get the ball moving and to eliminate confusion on the court, but it sure is painful to watch!
This is a really nice analysis and diagnosis of the Haase situation. And, of course, all of that confusion creates turnovers. It's no coincidence that Haase's teams have been near the bottom of division I in turnover rate every year except Haase's first, when he inherited a fairly talented veteran team.
I would feel better about Haase if I saw any evidence that his offenses were going better, but I don't see it. We've cycled
through multiple classes with Haase now, and each year it's the same.