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CMAC not playing in Sun Bowl?!? - Printable Version

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Re: CMAC not playing in Sun Bowl?!? - ThePassionOfTheChryst - 12-21-2016

(12-21-2016, 07:27 AM)DC 86 link Wrote:[quote author=TreesAndBirds link=topic=16303.msg183108#msg183108 date=1482195981]

I think I read that CM had $5M insurance for an injury that resulted in him not being drafted. $3M if injury significantly reduced his draft position. Dont remember where I read it so maybe I am mis-remembering or am flat out wrong.
You are correct. He has a $5M policy for complete disability, and a $3M policy for loss of value if injury causes him to be drafted later than 40th overall.
[/quote]

That's interesting. For perspective, I just looked up the rough numbers from the 2016 draft. The 23rd pick of the draft (roughly where McCaffrey could go), WR Laquon Treadwell, signed a deal worth $9.5 million guaranteed. The 41st pick (where the loss of value kicks in), LB Reggie Ragland, signed a deal worth $3.2 million guaranteed. So, using those figures as a guide, an injury in the Sun Bowl could potentially cost McCaffrey $3.5 million or more, assuming the cold medicine I'm on hasn't compromised my basic arithmetic abilities.

Re: CMAC not playing in Sun Bowl?!? - ThePassionOfTheChryst - 12-21-2016

(12-21-2016, 07:27 AM)DC 86 link Wrote:[quote author=TreesAndBirds link=topic=16303.msg183108#msg183108 date=1482195981]

I think I read that CM had $5M insurance for an injury that resulted in him not being drafted. $3M if injury significantly reduced his draft position. Dont remember where I read it so maybe I am mis-remembering or am flat out wrong.
You are correct. He has a $5M policy for complete disability, and a $3M policy for loss of value if injury causes him to be drafted later than 40th overall.
[/quote]

That's interesting. For perspective, I just looked up the rough numbers from the 2016 draft. The 23rd pick of the draft (roughly where McCaffrey could go), WR Laquon Treadwell, signed a deal worth $9.5 million guaranteed. The 41st pick (where the loss of value kicks in), LB Reggie Ragland, signed a deal worth $3.2 million guaranteed. So, using those figures as a guide, an injury in the Sun Bowl could potentially cost McCaffrey $3.5 million or more, assuming the cold medicine I'm on hasn't compromised my basic arithmetic abilities.

Re: CMAC not playing in Sun Bowl?!? - TreesAndBirds - 12-21-2016

How Clemson tried to deal with the distraction caused by players focusing on their future NFL career.

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/clemson-safety-says-it-was-obvious-some-teammates-had-eyes-on-nfl-in-2015-173458616.html

To be clear, I'm sure that CM gave his all in every game he played. This is not about him. This  is just about how another team addressed the NFL issue.

Re: CMAC not playing in Sun Bowl?!? - TreesAndBirds - 12-21-2016

How Clemson tried to deal with the distraction caused by players focusing on their future NFL career.

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/clemson-safety-says-it-was-obvious-some-teammates-had-eyes-on-nfl-in-2015-173458616.html

To be clear, I'm sure that CM gave his all in every game he played. This is not about him. This  is just about how another team addressed the NFL issue.

Re: CMAC not playing in Sun Bowl?!? - CornFed - 12-21-2016

(12-21-2016, 01:39 PM)ThePOC link Wrote:[quote author=DC 86 link=topic=16303.msg183302#msg183302 date=1482330444]
[quote author=TreesAndBirds link=topic=16303.msg183108#msg183108 date=1482195981]

I think I read that CM had $5M insurance for an injury that resulted in him not being drafted. $3M if injury significantly reduced his draft position. Dont remember where I read it so maybe I am mis-remembering or am flat out wrong.
You are correct. He has a $5M policy for complete disability, and a $3M policy for loss of value if injury causes him to be drafted later than 40th overall.
[/quote]

That's interesting. For perspective, I just looked up the rough numbers from the 2016 draft. The 23rd pick of the draft (roughly where McCaffrey could go), WR Laquon Treadwell, signed a deal worth $9.5 million guaranteed. The 41st pick (where the loss of value kicks in), LB Reggie Ragland, signed a deal worth $3.2 million guaranteed. So, using those figures as a guide, an injury in the Sun Bowl could potentially cost McCaffrey $3.5 million or more, assuming the cold medicine I'm on hasn't compromised my basic arithmetic abilities.
[/quote]

Wouldn't that negative impact be felt for several years by starting from a lower level?  I mean, sure, if he lights it up or falls flat, his individual career salary path will vary.  But a generalized notion of the impact of an injury on his salary would probably be felt for more than one year.

Re: CMAC not playing in Sun Bowl?!? - CornFed - 12-21-2016

(12-21-2016, 01:39 PM)ThePOC link Wrote:[quote author=DC 86 link=topic=16303.msg183302#msg183302 date=1482330444]
[quote author=TreesAndBirds link=topic=16303.msg183108#msg183108 date=1482195981]

I think I read that CM had $5M insurance for an injury that resulted in him not being drafted. $3M if injury significantly reduced his draft position. Dont remember where I read it so maybe I am mis-remembering or am flat out wrong.
You are correct. He has a $5M policy for complete disability, and a $3M policy for loss of value if injury causes him to be drafted later than 40th overall.
[/quote]

That's interesting. For perspective, I just looked up the rough numbers from the 2016 draft. The 23rd pick of the draft (roughly where McCaffrey could go), WR Laquon Treadwell, signed a deal worth $9.5 million guaranteed. The 41st pick (where the loss of value kicks in), LB Reggie Ragland, signed a deal worth $3.2 million guaranteed. So, using those figures as a guide, an injury in the Sun Bowl could potentially cost McCaffrey $3.5 million or more, assuming the cold medicine I'm on hasn't compromised my basic arithmetic abilities.
[/quote]

Wouldn't that negative impact be felt for several years by starting from a lower level?  I mean, sure, if he lights it up or falls flat, his individual career salary path will vary.  But a generalized notion of the impact of an injury on his salary would probably be felt for more than one year.

Re: CMAC not playing in Sun Bowl?!? - fullmetal - 12-21-2016

(12-21-2016, 06:14 AM)Mick link Wrote:Good point.  It's not like there are Texas high school football players and coaches watching the Sun Bowl.  We certainly don't need to recruit in Texas, so there's that.

You really think Stanford will lose the Sun Bowl without CMac?  Also, I guess that means you're not supportive of the decision to play Rice in Sydney next season...I think missing out on a Houston game would have a much bigger impact than whether CMac plays in El Paso or not.

Re: CMAC not playing in Sun Bowl?!? - fullmetal - 12-21-2016

(12-21-2016, 06:14 AM)Mick link Wrote:Good point.  It's not like there are Texas high school football players and coaches watching the Sun Bowl.  We certainly don't need to recruit in Texas, so there's that.

You really think Stanford will lose the Sun Bowl without CMac?  Also, I guess that means you're not supportive of the decision to play Rice in Sydney next season...I think missing out on a Houston game would have a much bigger impact than whether CMac plays in El Paso or not.

Re: CMAC not playing in Sun Bowl?!? - ThePassionOfTheChryst - 12-21-2016

(12-21-2016, 02:23 PM)CornFed link Wrote:[quote author=ThePOC link=topic=16303.msg183318#msg183318 date=1482352751]
[quote author=DC 86 link=topic=16303.msg183302#msg183302 date=1482330444]
[quote author=TreesAndBirds link=topic=16303.msg183108#msg183108 date=1482195981]

I think I read that CM had $5M insurance for an injury that resulted in him not being drafted. $3M if injury significantly reduced his draft position. Dont remember where I read it so maybe I am mis-remembering or am flat out wrong.
You are correct. He has a $5M policy for complete disability, and a $3M policy for loss of value if injury causes him to be drafted later than 40th overall.
[/quote]

That's interesting. For perspective, I just looked up the rough numbers from the 2016 draft. The 23rd pick of the draft (roughly where McCaffrey could go), WR Laquon Treadwell, signed a deal worth $9.5 million guaranteed. The 41st pick (where the loss of value kicks in), LB Reggie Ragland, signed a deal worth $3.2 million guaranteed. So, using those figures as a guide, an injury in the Sun Bowl could potentially cost McCaffrey $3.5 million or more, assuming the cold medicine I'm on hasn't compromised my basic arithmetic abilities.
[/quote]

Wouldn't that negative impact be felt for several years by starting from a lower level?  I mean, sure, if he lights it up or falls flat, his individual career salary path will vary.  But a generalized notion of the impact of an injury on his salary would probably be felt for more than one year.
[/quote]

Those values I gave were on four year contracts for both guys. And obviously this wasn't a terribly scientific way to go about it, but I thought it was a nice piggyback on the discussion of his insurance policy.

Re: CMAC not playing in Sun Bowl?!? - ThePassionOfTheChryst - 12-21-2016

(12-21-2016, 02:23 PM)CornFed link Wrote:[quote author=ThePOC link=topic=16303.msg183318#msg183318 date=1482352751]
[quote author=DC 86 link=topic=16303.msg183302#msg183302 date=1482330444]
[quote author=TreesAndBirds link=topic=16303.msg183108#msg183108 date=1482195981]

I think I read that CM had $5M insurance for an injury that resulted in him not being drafted. $3M if injury significantly reduced his draft position. Dont remember where I read it so maybe I am mis-remembering or am flat out wrong.
You are correct. He has a $5M policy for complete disability, and a $3M policy for loss of value if injury causes him to be drafted later than 40th overall.
[/quote]

That's interesting. For perspective, I just looked up the rough numbers from the 2016 draft. The 23rd pick of the draft (roughly where McCaffrey could go), WR Laquon Treadwell, signed a deal worth $9.5 million guaranteed. The 41st pick (where the loss of value kicks in), LB Reggie Ragland, signed a deal worth $3.2 million guaranteed. So, using those figures as a guide, an injury in the Sun Bowl could potentially cost McCaffrey $3.5 million or more, assuming the cold medicine I'm on hasn't compromised my basic arithmetic abilities.
[/quote]

Wouldn't that negative impact be felt for several years by starting from a lower level?  I mean, sure, if he lights it up or falls flat, his individual career salary path will vary.  But a generalized notion of the impact of an injury on his salary would probably be felt for more than one year.
[/quote]

Those values I gave were on four year contracts for both guys. And obviously this wasn't a terribly scientific way to go about it, but I thought it was a nice piggyback on the discussion of his insurance policy.

Re: CMAC not playing in Sun Bowl?!? - Farm93 - 12-21-2016

(12-21-2016, 05:50 AM)Mick link Wrote:[quote author=Farm93 link=topic=16303.msg183253#msg183253 date=1482272847]
[quote author=JPRI link=topic=16303.msg183251#msg183251 date=1482268828]
Yeah, when Bill Walsh led us to the Sun Bowl in 1977 he was treated like a conquering hero. Now it is a "meaningless" game.
Interesting.
They are all less meaningful now.  The folks at ESPN will try to deny reality, but reality is very clear at this point. 
Back in that day most teams were rarely on TV during the regular season.  A bowl game was a real chance to showcase the school, the program, etc.
Back in the day very few teams actually got into bowl games.  Now teams with a 5-7 record, and a decent APR ;), will get into some bowl or other.
In many cases coaches jump ship prior to a bowl game to join their new programs.  That used to be rare, now it happens every season.  This is not really much different.

Football is a business.  CMAC left his unpaid internship early because he is likely set to get a sweet paid position with a different employer.  Coaches leave all of the time even though they have contracts and a salary.  Really hate that the unpaid students keep getting held to a different standard.
[/quote]


I'm confused.  I didn't realize the McCaffrey family was paying full freight tuition, room and board, training table, coaching salaries etc.  I actually thought McCaffrey was on a football scholarship, that he is paying nothing out of pocket.  I didn't realize it was an unpaid internship.

And let me also point out that if it weren't for his football skills, his high school 3.35 GPA -- and I'm just WAGging it here -- may not have been sufficient to get him into Stanford, a school and degree from which he will receive opportunities literally throughout his life that he couldn't touch had he gone to college in Fort Collins or Boulder.
[/quote]

No W-2. No income. No income tax.  A.k.a. unpaid internship.  Unpaid internships often have lots of meals with execs, access to computers, travel to meetings and conferences, and corporate training and other resources that the intern can utilize to enhance their career, but they are still unpaid internships.  The analogy holds.  If some team of students worked together at an unpaid internship at HP, I am confident that the team would "understand" if a teammate left the internship early to accept a multi-million signing bonus to work on AI with Waymo or Tesla.

Moving on ...The idea that a legacy offspring, or any player, only could get in because of his football ability is a very slippery slope.  But let's say he only gets in because of football, does that mean IYHO that he MUST play football to stay at Stanford?  You do realize that is not the case right?  Once you are admitted that's it.  An athlete could quit the sport before even arriving on campus, and they would still be Stanford students.

I think most Stanford alums know a few athletes that opted to leave a team with eligibility remaining to focus on MCATs or LSATs or getting their Stanford degree.  It happens.

In the end, I guess I have no problem with any Stanford student doing whatever they think is in their best interest as long as they comply with NCAA rules.

I hope CMAC runs a sub 4.5 40 at the Combine and that this choice works out for him. And I hope the Stanford program wins in El Paso.

Re: CMAC not playing in Sun Bowl?!? - Farm93 - 12-21-2016

(12-21-2016, 05:50 AM)Mick link Wrote:[quote author=Farm93 link=topic=16303.msg183253#msg183253 date=1482272847]
[quote author=JPRI link=topic=16303.msg183251#msg183251 date=1482268828]
Yeah, when Bill Walsh led us to the Sun Bowl in 1977 he was treated like a conquering hero. Now it is a "meaningless" game.
Interesting.
They are all less meaningful now.  The folks at ESPN will try to deny reality, but reality is very clear at this point. 
Back in that day most teams were rarely on TV during the regular season.  A bowl game was a real chance to showcase the school, the program, etc.
Back in the day very few teams actually got into bowl games.  Now teams with a 5-7 record, and a decent APR ;), will get into some bowl or other.
In many cases coaches jump ship prior to a bowl game to join their new programs.  That used to be rare, now it happens every season.  This is not really much different.

Football is a business.  CMAC left his unpaid internship early because he is likely set to get a sweet paid position with a different employer.  Coaches leave all of the time even though they have contracts and a salary.  Really hate that the unpaid students keep getting held to a different standard.
[/quote]


I'm confused.  I didn't realize the McCaffrey family was paying full freight tuition, room and board, training table, coaching salaries etc.  I actually thought McCaffrey was on a football scholarship, that he is paying nothing out of pocket.  I didn't realize it was an unpaid internship.

And let me also point out that if it weren't for his football skills, his high school 3.35 GPA -- and I'm just WAGging it here -- may not have been sufficient to get him into Stanford, a school and degree from which he will receive opportunities literally throughout his life that he couldn't touch had he gone to college in Fort Collins or Boulder.
[/quote]

No W-2. No income. No income tax.  A.k.a. unpaid internship.  Unpaid internships often have lots of meals with execs, access to computers, travel to meetings and conferences, and corporate training and other resources that the intern can utilize to enhance their career, but they are still unpaid internships.  The analogy holds.  If some team of students worked together at an unpaid internship at HP, I am confident that the team would "understand" if a teammate left the internship early to accept a multi-million signing bonus to work on AI with Waymo or Tesla.

Moving on ...The idea that a legacy offspring, or any player, only could get in because of his football ability is a very slippery slope.  But let's say he only gets in because of football, does that mean IYHO that he MUST play football to stay at Stanford?  You do realize that is not the case right?  Once you are admitted that's it.  An athlete could quit the sport before even arriving on campus, and they would still be Stanford students.

I think most Stanford alums know a few athletes that opted to leave a team with eligibility remaining to focus on MCATs or LSATs or getting their Stanford degree.  It happens.

In the end, I guess I have no problem with any Stanford student doing whatever they think is in their best interest as long as they comply with NCAA rules.

I hope CMAC runs a sub 4.5 40 at the Combine and that this choice works out for him. And I hope the Stanford program wins in El Paso.

Re: CMAC not playing in Sun Bowl?!? - TreesAndBirds - 12-21-2016

A football scholarship is not an unpaid internship. Yes it is untaxed, which actually makes it worth a lot more than the value of the tuition, room and board received. Just because the compensation isnt paid in cash or isnt taxed doesnt mean there isn't any compensation.



Re: CMAC not playing in Sun Bowl?!? - TreesAndBirds - 12-21-2016

A football scholarship is not an unpaid internship. Yes it is untaxed, which actually makes it worth a lot more than the value of the tuition, room and board received. Just because the compensation isnt paid in cash or isnt taxed doesnt mean there isn't any compensation.



Re: CMAC not playing in Sun Bowl?!? - CornFed - 12-21-2016

At some point further discussion amounts to simply honing one's debate skills.  It is, though, why I love reading the CardBoard.  You folks have some chops.  Great points have been made.

Re: CMAC not playing in Sun Bowl?!? - CornFed - 12-21-2016

At some point further discussion amounts to simply honing one's debate skills.  It is, though, why I love reading the CardBoard.  You folks have some chops.  Great points have been made.

Re: CMAC not playing in Sun Bowl?!? - martyup - 12-21-2016

(12-21-2016, 04:45 PM)CornFed link Wrote:At some point further discussion amounts to simply honing one's debate skills.  It is, though, why I love reading the CardBoard.  You folks have some chops.  Great points have been made.

True.  Seventeen pages on this topic.  A very heated debate about a very significant decision by a very significant player in Stanford football history.  I'm glad this debate didn't devolve into ad hominem.

Re: CMAC not playing in Sun Bowl?!? - martyup - 12-21-2016

(12-21-2016, 04:45 PM)CornFed link Wrote:At some point further discussion amounts to simply honing one's debate skills.  It is, though, why I love reading the CardBoard.  You folks have some chops.  Great points have been made.

True.  Seventeen pages on this topic.  A very heated debate about a very significant decision by a very significant player in Stanford football history.  I'm glad this debate didn't devolve into ad hominem.

Re: CMAC not playing in Sun Bowl?!? - JJJ - 12-21-2016

(12-21-2016, 06:05 PM)martyup link Wrote:[quote author=CornFed link=topic=16303.msg183333#msg183333 date=1482363909]
At some point further discussion amounts to simply honing one's debate skills.  It is, though, why I love reading the CardBoard.  You folks have some chops.  Great points have been made.

True.  Seventeen pages on this topic.  A very heated debate about a very significant decision by a very significant player in Stanford football history.  I'm glad this debate didn't devolve into ad hominem.
[/quote]
I agree this has been a very interesting read. I found myself agreeing more often than not to points made on both sides of the issue. Like watching a long rally in tennis, head swiveling from side to side, wondering who's going to win. Well-played, all of you!

Re: CMAC not playing in Sun Bowl?!? - JJJ - 12-21-2016

(12-21-2016, 06:05 PM)martyup link Wrote:[quote author=CornFed link=topic=16303.msg183333#msg183333 date=1482363909]
At some point further discussion amounts to simply honing one's debate skills.  It is, though, why I love reading the CardBoard.  You folks have some chops.  Great points have been made.

True.  Seventeen pages on this topic.  A very heated debate about a very significant decision by a very significant player in Stanford football history.  I'm glad this debate didn't devolve into ad hominem.
[/quote]
I agree this has been a very interesting read. I found myself agreeing more often than not to points made on both sides of the issue. Like watching a long rally in tennis, head swiveling from side to side, wondering who's going to win. Well-played, all of you!