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Re: WSU Game Thread - Goose - 11-04-2017

(11-04-2017, 04:12 PM)washingtonismoney link Wrote:Interesting that Shaw claims KJ’s poor performance was on him (in presser.) saying they should’ve called more passes, mixed it up more.

Also saying they were “one block away” on many run plays.
Not sure it would matter what he called. Calling more passes may have helped if KJ didn't get killed. Probably the resulting scrambles would have helped. What I would have liked to see is more two back sets, because today, without a FB, there were 3 guys in the backfield wearing the wrong jersey on every play (it seemed). Love had no chance. Maybe Marx could have cleaned some of that up. God knows the OL didn't.

Re: WSU Game Thread - Stymie - 11-04-2017

(11-04-2017, 03:40 PM)washingtonismoney link Wrote:That route over the middle is killing the d

Are you really allowed to pass the ball over the middle?!  Shock!  Horror!  If true, somebody send a polite letter to Shawvaitagren informing them of this.  IMHO.

Re: WSU Game Thread - JJJ - 11-04-2017

(11-04-2017, 04:10 PM)stupac2 link Wrote:[quote author=JJJ link=topic=17902.msg210641#msg210641 date=1509836651]
Thanks to the lightning delay for the other game, I missed most of this one on my DVR. When I did watch live, #75 seemed to be having trouble. And we didn't seem to be mimicking the play calls of the teams that beat WSU. Again, I didn't get to watch much, so my impression could be way off.

We didn't make the playcalls of the teams that beat WSU because the actual plan is "beat the crap out of Falk". When we were hitting him we started winning. When we stopped, we started losing.

This game was close and all close games have a lot of places where they can turn, but to me the big thing is that our lines are not good enough. DL we suspected wouldn't be very good, but the OL being this disastrous on the road is somewhat surprising. What's the fix for that? I dunno, but it's strange.
[/quote]
Thank you for the color. Sad that it ended this way, but as others have commented, we can still take the Pac-12 North if we play lights out next week.

Re: WSU Game Thread - stupac2 - 11-04-2017

(11-04-2017, 04:18 PM)Stymie link Wrote:[quote author=washingtonismoney link=topic=17902.msg210573#msg210573 date=1509835204]
That route over the middle is killing the d

Are you really allowed to pass the ball over the middle?!  Shock!  Horror!  If true, somebody send a polite letter to Shawvaitagren informing them of this.  IMHO.
[/quote]

??? They passed over the middle. The big problem was that we ran 47 plays (WSU had 77). We were constantly in 2nd-and-long because the OL was getting blown up, and couldn't convert on 3rd downs (3/12). The weird thing is that it wasn't a disaster of a game like against ORST, we still made plays on occasion, and even put together a few drives, but the OL just left so much on the field that we didn't have much chance to succeed.

Re: WSU Game Thread - Jerry - 11-04-2017

(11-04-2017, 04:12 PM)washingtonismoney link Wrote:Interesting that Shaw claims KJ’s poor performance was on him (in presser.) saying they should’ve called more passes, mixed it up more.

Also saying they were “one block away” on many run plays.

how do i watch the press conferences? so stressed about result

Re: WSU Game Thread - Goose - 11-04-2017

(11-04-2017, 04:23 PM)stupac2 link Wrote:??? They passed over the middle. The big problem was that we ran 47 plays (WSU had 77). We were constantly in 2nd-and-long because the OL was getting blown up, and couldn't convert on 3rd downs (3/12). The weird thing is that it wasn't a disaster of a game like against ORST, we still made plays on occasion, and even put together a few drives, but the OL just left so much on the field that we didn't have much chance to succeed.
Totally agree.

Re: WSU Game Thread - washingtonismoney - 11-04-2017

(11-04-2017, 04:23 PM)stupac2 link Wrote:The big problem was that we ran 47 plays (WSU had 77).

Yeah, that's a feature of the Shaw offense that I've never been terribly warm about. The offense simply doesn't run enough plays, in my opinion. And the pace of the team has been declining over time:

2011: 71.9 plays/game
2012: 67.7 plays/game
2013: 63.9 plays/game
2014: 66 plays/game
2015: 66.2 plays/game
2016: 63.6 plays/game
2017: 58.5 plays/game

Now, on some level the number of plays isn't correlated with offensive quality. On the other hand, it's just weird plays per game keeps on tumbling and the team just does so little per game now. If Shaw wants to get his players more opportunities, and feels like he's "one block away," one way of overcoming that kind of variance is...giving yourself a bigger sample size to do it in.


Re: WSU Game Thread - Viking_Guy - 11-04-2017

Two plays exemplify the o-line's struggles today:

- Bright powers up out of his stance on the snap into no one and falls flat on his face. The look was so bad I don't even have a clue who he was supposed to be block
- One play where 4 Cougar defenders wrapped up a combination of Love and either Marx or Costello 3 yards deep in the backfield - and there wasn't a single offensive lineman in the picture.

VG


Re: WSU Game Thread - jacketree - 11-04-2017

Thanks for posting those plays per game statistics WIM.  I know they don’t necessarily correlate to points to game, but this dicking around on every snap is starting to bug me.

Re: WSU Game Thread - JJJ - 11-04-2017

(11-04-2017, 04:30 PM)washingtonismoney link Wrote:[quote author=stupac2 link=topic=17902.msg210658#msg210658 date=1509837826]The big problem was that we ran 47 plays (WSU had 77).

Yeah, that's a feature of the Shaw offense that I've never been terribly warm about. The offense simply doesn't run enough plays, in my opinion. And the pace of the team has been declining over time:

2011: 71.9 plays/game
2012: 67.7 plays/game
2013: 63.9 plays/game
2014: 66 plays/game
2015: 66.2 plays/game
2016: 63.6 plays/game
2017: 58.5 plays/game

Now, on some level the number of plays isn't correlated with offensive quality. On the other hand, it's just weird plays per game keeps on tumbling and the team just does so little per game now. If Shaw wants to get his players more opportunities, and feels like he's "one block away," one way of overcoming that kind of variance is...giving yourself a bigger sample size to do it in.
[/quote]

WOW. We underperformed our already low average by 10+ plays today?!?!  :o

Re: WSU Game Thread - Mick - 11-04-2017

(11-04-2017, 02:13 PM)hurlburt88 link Wrote:I was unimpressed with accuracy on multiple throws.  Let's see what 2nd half brings . . .

With respect, it's 37 degrees in rain and snow and sleet, and it's his first meaningful action in...ever.  Maybe cut him a sliver of slack.

Re: WSU Game Thread - Viking_Guy - 11-04-2017

The other part of the play count is what Papa said in commentary - our running game is either a homerun or 2 yards.  There's little consistent 4-6 YPP to be had - which again may be on the OL.  But it leads to many more three-and-outs and a lot more of the defense being on the field, either following a positive or a negative outcome.

Also a brobdingnagian part of that is the opponent's willingness to stack the box and rely on our QB and receivers being unable to beat them consistently, whether because they don't have time to get open, the QB is inaccurate, or whatever the cause.  On almost every play before the last drive, all 11 defenders were within 8-10 yards of the line - no deep coverage was deemed necessary.

One other thing - anecdotally, it feels like all of the receivers are getting NO separation on routes - even the fades are well covered.  The only exception appears to be stop routes and other comeback plays, which have very little opportunity for YAC.  At least, that's what I've ben seeing.

VG


Re: WSU Game Thread - MiamiCard - 11-04-2017

I don't get it. I can  remember only ONE play called for a tight end (Parkinson catch). What's the point of having  this amazing stable TEs if were not using them. Shaw needs to incorporate them better in the offense.

Re: WSU Game Thread - Jerry - 11-04-2017

can someone tell me how i can watch the press conferences?

Re: WSU Game Thread - Goose - 11-04-2017

(11-04-2017, 04:43 PM)Viking_Guy link Wrote:The other part of the play count is what Papa said in commentary - our running game is either a homerun or 2 yards.  There's little consistent 4-6 YPP to be had - which again may be on the OL.  But it leads to many more three-and-outs and a lot more of the defense being on the field, either following a positive or a negative outcome.
Yes, and that is the problem. In the past, Stanford had long, slow, boring drives. But we got first downs. The last two (actually three) years, we couldn't (or didn't) do that. In 2015, we didn't need to do that. CMAC made lots of yards and in most games that was enough. Shaw couldn't really "turtle" because CMAC would pop one for 40 yards, but that was fine. The last two years, we have not had the OL play to control the ball. The fans, and probably the coaches to a large extent, have taken solace in the fact we sometimes get enough home runs to win. That isn't "Stanford Football" as we have known it. That isn't necessarily bad, but if we are going to an "all or nothing" offense on a regular basis, other things will have to change to match. We will, for example, need much more aggressive play calling in order to score enough to win.

Re: WSU Game Thread - washingtonismoney - 11-04-2017

Special teams was an underrated boon (Bailey punts, Scarlett kickoff returns...) and bane (12 men on field, letting Bailey's last punt drop into the endzone, early inability to catch Coug punts pinning offense deep) this game. That's been a bit of a yearlong story. There have been several great and mind-numbingly dumb plays this year. Overall, it rates out pretty well on the computer systems that track such things. But boom and bust is no way to run a railroad, and in its fashion it's a synecdoche for the whole team. Very inconsistent.

That's maybe understandable for the offense. It's the youngest on record in the Shaw era, by my calculations earlier in the year. More troubling is the defense, which is actually very experienced. While the defensive side of the ball has had some nice performances, on the whole, it's been pretty bland -- despite having many highly-recruited players. (Barton, Alfieri, Okereke, Perez, Robinson, Reid, Simmons, Buncom, Williams are all highly-touted recruits playing at least a marginal role on defense.) I know it's more fashionable to criticize offensive coaching than defensive, but I think you can make a solid argument it's the true underachieving unit this year.

Re: WSU Game Thread - stupac2 - 11-04-2017

(11-04-2017, 06:02 PM)washingtonismoney link Wrote:I know it's more fashionable to criticize offensive coaching than defensive, but I think you can make a solid argument it's the true underachieving unit this year.

On the whole, and considering personnel, this is absolutely true. I know we have no pass rush and don't blitz often, but we were expecting that to not matter much because the secondary would make up for it. But we haven't really see that many coverage sacks this year. Our best DBs have had some pretty bad games. It's been kind of weird, but since we're not really getting boatraced (other than USC) it's sort of flown under the radar.

All in all this has been a very weird for us, if we could play near our peak every game we'd be a top-10 team. But for whatever reason, we can't.

Re: WSU Game Thread - ADPATERSON - 11-04-2017

No matter how good your talent, other teams watch film.  If you run the same plays every week, and not much variation in pass route combos, you become easier to defend.
We need to hire an innovative Offensive Coordinator to bring in some juice.  A run-oriented one who beat us, like Jeff Horton (SDSU), would still maintain the identity of the team. 
We don't need to run Mike Leach's Air Raid. 

Re: WSU Game Thread - Hurlburt88 - 11-04-2017

I continue to agree with the perspective of wanting a fresh viewpoint from a new assistant.  Diversity of thought

Separately and word on Little? 
Was good to see buncom back in the game

Re: WSU Game Thread - cardcrimson - 11-04-2017

(11-04-2017, 04:40 PM)Mick link Wrote:[quote author=hurlburt88 link=topic=17902.msg210350#msg210350 date=1509829988]
I was unimpressed with accuracy on multiple throws.  Let's see what 2nd half brings . . .

With respect, it's 37 degrees in rain and snow and sleet, and it's his first meaningful action in...ever.  Maybe cut him a sliver of slack.
[/quote]

That's why Falk went 34 of 48 for 337 with 3 tds and 1 int., while Costello went 9 of 20 for 105 and no tds and 1 pick. The weather was much worse when we had the ball. At least their QBRs were about the same.

Costello looked good in the games earlier this season. Today, not so much. The weather was irrelevant, the scheme on the other hand. . . .