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Re: ND-Stanford - NDIrish - 09-30-2014

(09-30-2014, 10:17 AM)washingtonismoney link Wrote:I guess it depends on how you define "football factory." To me, football factories demean athletes' education in the name of football, and coddle them and their coaches off-the-field by not exposing them to the same accountability systems that normal students and faculty adhere to.

N.D. graduates a lot of its players, and some of them in pretty difficult majors. So that's good. But in terms of accountability they're rather weak. Kelly's scandals. The botched rape investigation. This plagiarism affair is tough to slot -- normal students do plagiarize, and the players have been taken off the field. That's to their credit. It's hard to further evaluate without more information. But still, I would say N.D.'s off-the-field activities are pretty much what I'd expect from a football factory.

The rape investigation was not botched.  That was a very sad case of a very sick girl.  There was a full investigation and there was zero credibility to the girls story - i know someone involved in the investigation.  She had issues and was looking for attention.  There was NO RAPE.  I hate when people bring that up, no proof of anything was found, there is no cover up.  She made it up....

Re: ND-Stanford - NDIrish - 09-30-2014

(09-30-2014, 10:15 AM)2 for 2028 link Wrote:[quote author=NDIrish link=topic=10754.msg99874#msg99874 date=1412096332]
[quote author=Hulk01 link=topic=10754.msg99866#msg99866 date=1412095081]
We are glad that you have nothing but respect for Stanford.

But you will not find that reciprocated here. Most of us do not respect the University of Dead Fake Girlfriends and many of us would never consider it as a school and would discourage our kids from considering it, too.  I say that from experience.

You clearly underestimate how deep the dislike of the University of Dead Fake Girlfriends is outside of its rabid fan club and alumni. 

And perhaps more than anything else, many--perhaps most--of us loathe Brian Kelly and his absurd sideline behavior are televised upbraiding of his players.

Clearly that is the case, so i guess its just going to make it sweeter when we beat you guys again. 
[/quote]

Again?
[/quote]

ND leads the series 18-10

Re: ND-Stanford - NDIrish - 09-30-2014

(09-30-2014, 10:03 AM)81alum link Wrote:I enjoy hearing from knowledgeable fans of our weekly opponents and welcome NDIrish and his input.  NDI is a little chauvinistic toward his team and university--but that is expected of all football fans and I do not hold that against him.

But NDIrish also needs to understand that respect and civility does not mean agreement.  I do think that the University of Dead Fake Girlfriends is a reputable major university by academic standards, and I do think that the University of Dead Fake Girlfriends has done fairly well on the APR front. 

I think my problem with the University of Dead Fake Girlfriends is that its fan base tends to be so rabid that it contributes to an unhealthy ethos in which athletes behave like they are above the rules, coaches scream and rant, and fans are bellicose.  I can't blame NDIrish for this, since he seems reasonable to me.  But I do not much like the company he has to keep.

As far as football is concerned, I am worried about this game.  I think the the University of Dead Fake Girlfriends offense seems marginally superior to ours at the moment, and our defense seems somewhat superior to the University of Dead Fake Girlfriends's.  I would expect a low scoring game that could be determined by turnovers, special teams, or penalties.  I also think the critical factor will be to observe which offensive line does a better job.  Ours has had issues and the University of Dead Fake Girlfriends's has been patchwork.  Which ever line can come together and improve its game compared with last week will probably contribute mightily to a win.


Understood, i did not expect agreement, just didn't thought it would be more about football and less about "dead fake girlfriends"....

But thank you, and i agree your defense is superior.  i could see a mistake by either in the 4q being the deciding factor.



Re: ND-Stanford - washingtonismoney - 09-30-2014

(09-30-2014, 10:22 AM)NDIrish link Wrote:The rape investigation was not botched.  That was a very sad case of a very sick girl.  There was a full investigation and there was zero credibility to the girls story - i know someone involved in the investigation.  She had issues and was looking for attention.  There was NO RAPE.  I hate when people bring that up, no proof of anything was found, there is no cover up.  She made it up....

Extremely serious. Independent of whether her allegations were true the investigation was not properly conducted. N.D. police did not interview anyone until after her suicide. That's awful police work.

And Kelly's comment that he couldn't understand why the Chicago Tribune had so many reporters on the case was inappropriately flippant. And let's not forget the reports of N.D. players intimidating Seeberg through text.

Claiming everything that happened was on the ethical up-and-up is the height of delusion.

Re: ND-Stanford - Leftcoast - 09-30-2014

Here's the results from the last ten games in the series.  After the expected shellacking Stanford received during our down years the series has been competitive with the good guys taking four of the last five. 

I see very few, if any, upsets if we believe AP rankings.  Here's hoping we see one this weekend.  And yes I realize the betting line does not reflect ND's AP ranking advantage.

2004   N. Dame 23   Stanford 15 N. Dame Stadium
2005    N. Dame 38  Stanford 31 Stanford Stadium
2006   #12 N. Dame 31. Stanford 10 N. Dame Stadium
2007   N. Dame 21 Stanford 14 Stanford Stadium
2008   N. Dame 28   Stanford 21 N. Dame Stadium
2009   Stanford 45. N. Dame 38 Stanford Stadium
2010   #16 Stanford 37. N. Dame 14  N. Dame Stadium
2011   #4 Stanford 28  #22 N. Dame 14 Stanford Stadium
2012   #7 N. Dame 20  #17 Stanford 13   N. Dame Stadium
2013  #8 Stanford. #25  N. Dame. 20 Stanford Stadium


Re: ND-Stanford - Bruce Wang - 09-30-2014

(09-30-2014, 10:22 AM)NDIrish link Wrote:The rape investigation was not botched.  That was a very sad case of a very sick girl.  There was a full investigation and there was zero credibility to the girls story - i know someone involved in the investigation.  She had issues and was looking for attention.  There was NO RAPE.  I hate when people bring that up, no proof of anything was found, there is no cover up.  She made it up....

You do realize you sound like a criminal defense attorney here.

NDI, you do seem like a reasonable fan especially by Hunchback standards.  You have to expect some sharp elbows in addition to serious football talk.  Many of us, if not all, love to hate you guys.  Almost as much as our shared rival, the only school that surpasses you in pure evil.

Re: ND-Stanford - NDIrish - 09-30-2014

(09-30-2014, 10:01 AM)Hulk01 link Wrote:Yes, Kelly has found himself in some tough spots.

Take that day when the wind was blowing up to 40 miles per hour.  Talk about tough; we have an important practice and we need to photograph it.  But the wind could knock over that photographer's crain and cause him serious injury.

What to do, what to do?  "Damn it, we are the University of Dead Fake Girlfriends and the University of Dead Fake Girlfriends wins football games.  And people sacrifice for that.  A photographer should, too."  Now that's a devoted coach.

And so it went.  To which irish fans say, it was just one of those things.  They are right: it was one of those things.  One of those things that could have been avoided and Kelly chose not to.

Are you getting the message?  Among other things, few if any of us care if you think you have a neat team.  ND fans always think that.  And they thought Tommy Rees was a great kid who would never lay a hand on a girl who wasn't asking for it.  Yep.  He's a the University of Dead Fake Girlfriends player.  Our players may be necrophiles, as one of their famous linebackers was, but by God they aren't rapists.


You know, people should really look at an entire situation before they think they know what they are talking about...


You really think kelly had anything to do with that?  you think he forced the kid up there?  It was a major oversite by the university and whoever is in charge of that department, and that is a terrible thing that happened, but kelly made no decision on it and probably didn't even realize the kid was up there.  and most importantly, if the child's parents are satisfied with the what took place before during and after, what the heck are you to question it?  I could see if they were raising a fuss, but they are still supportive of the university.

Re: ND-Stanford - NDIrish - 09-30-2014

(09-30-2014, 10:34 AM)Publius link Wrote:[quote author=NDIrish link=topic=10754.msg99885#msg99885 date=1412097730]
The rape investigation was not botched.  That was a very sad case of a very sick girl.  There was a full investigation and there was zero credibility to the girls story - i know someone involved in the investigation.  She had issues and was looking for attention.  There was NO RAPE.  I hate when people bring that up, no proof of anything was found, there is no cover up.  She made it up....

You do realize you sound like a criminal defense attorney here.

NDI, you do seem like a reasonable fan especially by Hunchback standards.  You have to expect some sharp elbows in addition to serious football talk.  Many of us, if not all, love to hate you guys.  Almost as much as our shared rival, the only school that surpasses you in pure evil.
[/quote]

thanks and understood,  they are the team to love to hate, lol, i hope we can take them down at the end of the year

Re: ND-Stanford - washingtonismoney - 09-30-2014

And, one last point on the Seeberg case: if the investigation wasn't botched, why did the Department of Education have a seven-month investigation and why did the school settle with the government? Hardly suggests an ethical institution.

Re: ND-Stanford - NDIrish - 09-30-2014

(09-30-2014, 10:30 AM)washingtonismoney link Wrote:[quote author=NDIrish link=topic=10754.msg99885#msg99885 date=1412097730]

The rape investigation was not botched.  That was a very sad case of a very sick girl.  There was a full investigation and there was zero credibility to the girls story - i know someone involved in the investigation.  She had issues and was looking for attention.  There was NO RAPE.  I hate when people bring that up, no proof of anything was found, there is no cover up.  She made it up....

Extremely serious. Independent of whether her allegations were true the investigation was not properly conducted. N.D. police did not interview anyone until after her suicide. That's awful police work.

And Kelly's comment that he couldn't understand why the Chicago Tribune had so many reporters on the case was inappropriately flippant. And let's not forget the reports of N.D. players intimidating Seeberg through text.

Claiming everything that happened was on the ethical up-and-up is the height of delusion.
[/quote]

everything was not ethical, but it was not a botched rape case.  These kids put themselves (on both sides) in a very bad situation.  I felt awful that it ended with a death  instead of a girl getting help, but this situation is not a slam on kelly.

Re: ND-Stanford - Rfed013 - 09-30-2014

As an ND fan, I don't care about being a "football factory" or the SAT scores or grades. And thats being honest. I think if you took a survey of fanbases accross the country, most would agree. I don't pay to watch them take a test in the Chemistry class. I don't pay to cheer them on while they study. I pay to watch them play on saturday. And when they play, I hope they win. Do I like it when theres hoaxes and student video guys dying and academic investigations? No. It sucks. But that stuff happens. I'd love for every kid to get a 4.0 and then have the team win the National Championship, but that will never happen. My point is, you can argue until you're blue in the face about academic standards and which kids could get in here or there.

Let it be known, I like David Shaw..dude is a great coach and runs a great program. Saying that, if BK were to leave or get fired, I'd love for ND to pursue Shaw. But, ND is the better team right now. Stanford should be (yes, that was a brutal call against SC) undefeated. But ND is still better across the board. Better QB, better receivers (say hello to Will Fuller, who is better than Nelson Agholor) and has the defense to win these types of games. And if it comes down to special teams, Kyle Brindza will kick in the NFL. ND 27 Stanford 20


Re: ND-Stanford - CTcard - 09-30-2014

(09-30-2014, 10:42 AM)Rfed013 link Wrote:As an ND fan, I don't care about being a "football factory" or the SAT scores or grades. And thats being honest. I think if you took a survey of fanbases accross the country, most would agree. ...


But ND is still better across the board. Better QB, better receivers (say hello to Will Fuller, who is better than Nelson Agholor) and has the defense to win these types of games. And if it comes down to special teams, Kyle Brindza will kick in the NFL. ND 27 Stanford 20

You have nicely framed two issues here.

I absolutely agree with you that most fan bases across the country care not for the academic or personal welfare of the players they cheer for on Saturdays. That is rather obvious from the results. There are certainly some Stanford fans who agree with you. However, the majority of the Stanford fan base does not. There may be some hair-splitting as to whether the interest is in the welfare of the players themselves or the institution, but if many of the issues we see rampant across the country were to happen at Stanford there would be massive pressure to first clean it up and if not then to drop top-level football.
Of course the real answer is to make sure it never comes to that. For the moment that looks okay - but it's always dangerous.


The second issue is the description of the football team. You roughly sum up what I read - N.-D. is better across the board, better qb, better receivers, better coach, better everything. This is then followed by a prediction of a home win of typically 3-7 points.
Something does not add up.

Re: ND-Stanford - washingtonismoney - 09-30-2014

Will Fuller is better than Agholor LOLOLLLLLLLLL no way.

Thinking the echoes have awoken in the form of voices heard only in one's head.

Re: ND-Stanford - Rfed013 - 09-30-2014


The second issue is the description of the football team. You roughly sum up what I read - N.-D. is better across the board, better qb, better receivers, better coach, better everything. This is then followed by a prediction of a home win of typically 3-7 points.
Something does not add up.


What doesn't add up? I predicted 27-20 in favor of ND. Is the home team supposed to win by more or something?

Re: ND-Stanford - Leftcoast - 09-30-2014

On the other hand the point on place kicking stings.  Here's to hoping Jordan Williamson finds his stroke in time for his next pressure filled kick.

Re: ND-Stanford - stupac2 - 09-30-2014

(09-30-2014, 10:17 AM)NDIrish link Wrote:yes, as much as anyone would talk about stanford if you took away your football team.. college football is the most popular ncaa sport, its the reason we hear about most universities... i dont see many headlines about stanford baseball, but i know they have a respectable program, but since i dont hear about them, does that mean stanford is only a football factory?

This is hilariously delusional.

Re: ND-Stanford - CTcard - 09-30-2014

(09-30-2014, 11:01 AM)Rfed013 link Wrote:The second issue is the description of the football team. You roughly sum up what I read - N.-D. is better across the board, better qb, better receivers, better coach, better everything. This is then followed by a prediction of a home win of typically 3-7 points.
Something does not add up.


What doesn't add up? I predicted 27-20 in favor of ND. Is the home team supposed to win by more or something?

You don't really need it explained to you, do you?



Re: ND-Stanford - NDIrish - 09-30-2014

(09-30-2014, 11:03 AM)stupac2 link Wrote:[quote author=NDIrish link=topic=10754.msg99882#msg99882 date=1412097434]yes, as much as anyone would talk about stanford if you took away your football team.. college football is the most popular ncaa sport, its the reason we hear about most universities... i dont see many headlines about stanford baseball, but i know they have a respectable program, but since i dont hear about them, does that mean stanford is only a football factory?

This is hilariously delusional.
[/quote]

please explain how?  If you took away stanford football, how often would they be on espn, cbs, fox sports?

Re: ND-Stanford - yvonne - 09-30-2014

(09-30-2014, 11:03 AM)stupac2 link Wrote:[quote author=NDIrish link=topic=10754.msg99882#msg99882 date=1412097434]yes, as much as anyone would talk about stanford if you took away your football team.. college football is the most popular ncaa sport, its the reason we hear about most universities... i dont see many headlines about stanford baseball, but i know they have a respectable program, but since i dont hear about them, does that mean stanford is only a football factory?

This is hilariously delusional.
[/quote]
Yeah, nobody talks about those eight northeastern schools that don't give athletic scholarships  ::). Heck, for most of its history nobody had heard of our rival across the Bay.

Re: ND-Stanford - PrinceLightfoot - 09-30-2014

(09-30-2014, 10:23 AM)NDIrish link Wrote:ND leads the series 18-10

Stanford has won 4 of the last 5. Kelly has controversially "beaten" us once. Before you go beating your chest on Notre Dame football superiority how many BCS bowl games did your team win? How about BCS level bowls over the last 20 years?

(09-30-2014, 10:17 AM)NDIrish link Wrote:yes, as much as anyone would talk about stanford if you took away your football team.. college football is the most popular ncaa sport, its the reason we hear about most universities... i dont see many headlines about stanford baseball, but i know they have a respectable program, but since i dont hear about them, does that mean stanford is only a football factory?

The last question has to be a lapse from reality. Stanford is known WORLDWIDE. Notre Dame is known for a hunchback.

You obviously only read topics concerning college sports if you believe that to be true. Here is a hint: College sports writers particularly college sports writers will cater to the largest fan bases to ensure readership and will occassionaly venture outside of that formula if something is truly news worthy. Case and point - Michigan has sucked for several years now but still receive plenty of media attention. You will see stories like "When will Michigan return to respectability?" and endless coaching search stories...you wont see the same attention going towards Baylor if they fall off their perch.

Btw how many Director's Cups have we earned? Troll on...