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lex24 - lex24 - 05-03-2023

(05-03-2023, 03:29 AM)OutsiderFan Wrote:  Feeling a bit vindicated for not being as down on Poole as others were. He really stepped up his game as his track record suggested he could, and even had 0 turnovers with 6 assists in addition to great shooting.

Told my buddy right before the game that I haven’t seen anyone make any confident predictions about Warriors-Lakers. It’s all if this happens, it will be W’s. If that happens, it will be Lakers. So I said to me it comes down to if !Klay Thompson shoots well the W’s win. If he doesn’t the Lakers win. I should have added if Draymond scores double figures (because he will get a ton of opportunities) W’s will win.

If Klay shoots 9-25 and 4-19 as he has the last 2 games the Warriors will lose the series.

It’s shocking when team with 14 more shot attempts that sinks 21 3s to the opponent’s 6 loses.

But it’s also rare to lose when outscoring the opponent by 20 at the Free Throw line. I call bullshit on the Lakers committing only 3 fouls per quarter and the W’s 6 per quarter. If fouls are close to even, W’s win, but Thompson simply must shoot at least 40% FG for Warriors to win given his high volume of shots.


Can’t believe the Knicks struggled to beat Heat without Butler.

Lakers attacked the basket considerably more than Warriors,  That accounts for foul shot differential. I think this is a bad matchup for Warriors. Davis is the problem imo.  Warriors don’t have an answer.  Plus he and James can sag essentially ignore Dray and Looney and protect the rim.  

Wonder if Kerr will play some zone.

I’ll stay with my thought - for warriors to win they need the Wiggins of last years Finals.

RE: lex24 - gocard14 - 05-03-2023

(05-03-2023, 06:44 AM)lex24 Wrote:  
(05-03-2023, 03:29 AM)OutsiderFan Wrote:  Feeling a bit vindicated for not being as down on Poole as others were. He really stepped up his game as his track record suggested he could, and even had 0 turnovers with 6 assists in addition to great shooting.

Told my buddy right before the game that I haven’t seen anyone make any confident predictions about Warriors-Lakers. It’s all if this happens, it will be W’s. If that happens, it will be Lakers. So I said to me it comes down to if !Klay Thompson shoots well the W’s win. If he doesn’t the Lakers win. I should have added if Draymond scores double figures (because he will get a ton of opportunities) W’s will win.

If Klay shoots 9-25 and 4-19 as he has the last 2 games the Warriors will lose the series.

It’s shocking when team with 14 more shot attempts that sinks 21 3s to the opponent’s 6 loses.

But it’s also rare to lose when outscoring the opponent by 20 at the Free Throw line. I call bullshit on the Lakers committing only 3 fouls per quarter and the W’s 6 per quarter. If fouls are close to even, W’s win, but Thompson simply must shoot at least 40% FG for Warriors to win given his high volume of shots.


Can’t believe the Knicks struggled to beat Heat without Butler.

Lakers attacked the basket considerably more than Warriors,  That accounts for foul shot differential. I think this is a bad matchup for Warriors. Davis is the problem imo.  Warriors don’t have an answer.  Plus he and James can sag essentially ignore Dray and Looney and protect the rim.  

Wonder if Kerr will play some zone.

I’ll stay with my thought - for warriors to win they need the Wiggins of last years Finals.

It is a tough matchup no doubt, as Davis at the rim significantly impacts the warriors ability to drive and get points in the paint and free throws. 

The obvious solution is to limit the Dray and Looney minutes and play 4 shooters. That means more Poole, more DDV, more moody, and more JMG. This isn't a great matchup for GP2 as the lakers have multiple decent ball handlers but not a great one to shut down.

4 of Steph, Klay, Poole, Wiggins, DDV, Moody, JMG should be on the court at all times. Maybe Kuminga or GP2 if it seems like their shot is falling. We may even benefit from running 5 out with JMG at the center. 

On D I agree we should throw different looks at them, more zone. Looney unfortunately struggles with the AD matchup for whatever reason, I'd like to see more of Dray at the 5 who guards him well.

RE: NBA Discussion - OutsiderFan - 05-03-2023

Might a 2-3 zone be useful against the Lakers with Davis on the court, at least some of the time? 

I'd rather be beat by the Lakers making 3pt shots that they aren't great at, than have Davis do non-stop damage doing what he is great at.

RE: NBA Discussion - cardcrimson - 05-04-2023

Methinks Steve Kerr knows how to coach. . ..

RE: NBA Discussion - OutsiderFan - 05-05-2023

Man will I gladly take 20 points and 12 assists from Curry every game, to go with a near triple double from Draymond, every game. But again, it all comes down to Klay Thompson. A 9-25 won’t get it done but an 11-18 will.

Draymond Green was simply brilliant in Game 2. His ability to find the open shooters, including himself, whether off the pick n roll, in transition, or in chaos after scrums in the paint, is remarkable. And his defense is tremendous.

IOW, it’s still all about Curry, Thompson, and Green. Obvious big props to JaMychal Green. Wiggins was better, Poole worse but a net positive, and the rotation has been shrunk, with GP2 apparently playing himself out of the rotation now. Crazy to think J. Green only got so many mins cuz Looney was sick and he might turn out to be more valuable than GP2 in the series.

All I could think at halftime was there is no way James can continue that level of shooting in the second half, but I never thought he’d score just 2 points. 

The Lakers would be better off slowing the pace and playing straight up defense. They didn’t get their top defensive rating by doubling teams with Curry, Green and Thompson.

RE: NBA Discussion - lex24 - 05-05-2023

(05-05-2023, 03:47 AM)OutsiderFan Wrote:  Man will I gladly take 20 points and 12 assists from Curry every game, to go with a near triple double from Draymond, every game. But again, it all comes down to Klay Thompson. A 9-25 won’t get it done but an 11-18 will.

Draymond Green was simply brilliant in Game 2. His ability to find the open shooters, including himself, whether off the pick n roll, in transition, or in chaos after scrums in the paint, is remarkable. And his defense is tremendous.

IOW, it’s still all about Curry, Thompson, and Green. Obvious big props to JaMychal Green. Wiggins was better, Poole worse but a net positive, and the rotation has been shrunk, with GP2 apparently playing himself out of the rotation now. Crazy to think J. Green only got so many mins cuz Looney was sick and he might turn out to be more valuable than GP2 in the series.

All I could think at halftime was there is no way James can continue that level of shooting in the second half, but I never thought he’d score just 2 points. 

The Lakers would be better off slowing the pace and playing straight up defense. They didn’t get their top defensive rating by doubling teams with Curry, Green and Thompson.

No one can play Curry straight up.  Especially when you consider the Warriors screening ability.

At the end of the day, Lakers did what they needed to do in SF.  These series are always fascinating cause there are adjustments each game. 

Davis was passive.  That helped.  Don’t  expect it again.  Thompson obviously got going Wiggins was better than game 1.  He is, imo, their key.  Play like he did in Finals and they win.

leftcoast - Leftcoast - 05-05-2023

Something was going on with Lebron and AD.  Those late season injuries (especially Lebron’s?) might be more concerning then they let on.  If they play more games like this the Warriors are in the Western Conference finals.

I think Klay finding his shot was a good sign.  Not sure the Lakers have the players to guard both Thompson and Curry creating a “choose your poison” situation.  Klay’s 6’-7” size and quick release is a tough assignment on the arc when his shot is on.

RE: NBA Discussion - Mick - 05-05-2023

I think Davis has a stress injury in his right foot. I know he played 33 minutes, but it might be a lingering issue.

RE: NBA Discussion - CompSci87 - 05-05-2023

Moody has quietly become a solid contributor. Not to say a major factor, but he's given good minutes.

RE: NBA Discussion - French Rage - 05-05-2023

(05-05-2023, 09:20 AM)Mick Wrote:  I think Davis has a stress injury in his right foot. I know he played 33 minutes, but it might be a lingering issue.

There was a stat somewhere about how poorly he plays in games after he has a really good game, so maybe this was a bit of that?  Not saying there might not be injury issues, that has been a thing for the Lakers all year, but he has problems following up one great game with another.  I don't know how he does in the game after the bad game after the good game, though.

RE: NBA Discussion - OutsiderFan - 05-06-2023

I've seen one analyst say Davis didn't come up high enough on pick n rolls in Game 2, and then another say Davis shouldn't have come out as high and played drop coverage to defend it.

The suggestion for dropping Davis was with Steph pick n roll with Draymond, the idea being let Vanderbilt fight over the screen to stay with Steph, and instead of Davis blitzing Steph and ignoring Draymond so Draymond can slip, so he gets the ball with a 4 on 3, keep Davis in the paint.

But, the W's can also put Klay Thompson in pick n roll with Looney or Green, and Austin Reeves can't defend him like Vanderbilt can defend Curry.  In that case, Davis must come out further on Klay pick n rolls to help Reeves.

So Davis has to know when Steph is in pick n roll, and when he is, drop. Then when Klay is in pick in roll, come out high.  But what does he do if Steph and Klay are in the pick n roll together? The Warriors rarely use this action, but it is something we might see in Game 3, as defending the pick n roll is going to be a top priority the Lakers have in Game 3.

Another option the Lakers have is to switch, which would in most cases leave Curry isolated with Davis at the 3pt line, probably something the Warriors would love. Not only do you get Curry on a guy he can destroy off the dribble, the get Davis out of the paint.

The Warriors seem to have more things they can do than the Lakers. The Lakers tried denying Curry the ball in Game 1, and the Warriors made their comeback using more high screens to free him up. That continued in Game 2, and the Warriors blew them out. The Lakers are betting only Curry can beat them. I don't think this is the case. Poole almost beat them in Game 1. Thompson did beat them in Game 2.  Wiggins is going to have a big shooting game at some point too. I remain convinced that unless the Lakers are willing to play the Warriors straight up, they will lose the series, but even if they do, Curry can beat them too.

RE: NBA Discussion - gocard14 - 05-06-2023

(05-06-2023, 06:05 AM)OutsiderFan Wrote:  I've seen one analyst say Davis didn't come up high enough on pick n rolls in Game 2, and then another say Davis shouldn't have come out as high and played drop coverage to defend it.

The suggestion for dropping Davis was with Steph pick n roll with Draymond, the idea being let Vanderbilt fight over the screen to stay with Steph, and instead of Davis blitzing Steph and ignoring Draymond so Draymond can slip, so he gets the ball with a 4 on 3, keep Davis in the paint.

But, the W's can also put Klay Thompson in pick n roll with Looney or Green, and Austin Reeves can't defend him like Vanderbilt can defend Curry.  In that case, Davis must come out further on Klay pick n rolls to help Reeves.

So Davis has to know when Steph is in pick n roll, and when he is, drop. Then when Klay is in pick in roll, come out high.  But what does he do if Steph and Klay are in the pick n roll together? The Warriors rarely use this action, but it is something we might see in Game 3, as defending the pick n roll is going to be a top priority the Lakers have in Game 3.

Another option the Lakers have is to switch, which would in most cases leave Curry isolated with Davis at the 3pt line, probably something the Warriors would love. Not only do you get Curry on a guy he can destroy off the dribble, the get Davis out of the paint.

The Warriors seem to have more things they can do than the Lakers. The Lakers tried denying Curry the ball in Game 1, and the Warriors made their comeback using more high screens to free him up. That continued in Game 2, and the Warriors blew them out. The Lakers are betting only Curry can beat them. I don't think this is the case. Poole almost beat them in Game 1. Thompson did beat them in Game 2.  Wiggins is going to have a big shooting game at some point too. I remain convinced that unless the Lakers are willing to play the Warriors straight up, they will lose the series, but even if they do, Curry can beat them too.

Vanderbilt, while a great one on one defender, actually isn’t great screen navigator. If AD sits in the paint, Dray can just keep re-screening Vanderbilt until Steph gets enough room for an open shot. 

The key to this is keeping 4 shooters on the floor. If there is a second non-shooter they can sag off him to help on curry while keeping AD in the paint. We need to stay small with only one of Dray or Looney on the court at the same time. Or go “big” with Dray and JMG. 

The key will be our 2nd tier shooters, the Wiggins, moodys, JMGs, DDVs, etc hitting the open looks that they will keep getting. 

I expect the lakers to go back to a more traditional drop coverage and force us to hit shots. Curry and Dray just destroyed them on the trap game for the 4 on 3 and wide open layups. They also need AD to be more aggressive on offense and try to get Dray into foul trouble early.

RE: NBA Discussion - lex24 - 05-06-2023

(05-05-2023, 09:44 PM)French Rage Wrote:  
(05-05-2023, 09:20 AM)Mick Wrote:  I think Davis has a stress injury in his right foot. I know he played 33 minutes, but it might be a lingering issue.

There was a stat somewhere about how poorly he plays in games after he has a really good game, so maybe this was a bit of that?  Not saying there might not be injury issues, that has been a thing for the Lakers all year, but he has problems following up one great game with another.  I don't know how he does in the game after the bad game after the good game, though.


Mediocre….. :)

RE: NBA Discussion - cardcrimson - 05-06-2023

W's jump out to a lead in the first quarter, and the refs take over. Was it three or four technicals called on the W's? Lakers 21 free throws. The Warriors 6. And it's not due to driving in the paint. Sheesh. This is nearly unwatchable.

RE: NBA Discussion - Leftcoast - 05-06-2023

Lakers on a 30 -8 run to close the half.  The Lakers made the first half choppy and physical and the Warriors let it get to them. Floor technicals, bench technicals, constant arguing, flagrants are all signs the refs are in the team’s head and led to the Lakers’ desired pace.

The Warriors need to play fast, smooth, and win on the open court.  Don’t let the Lakers decide the pace and game style.

Hoping for a more watchable second half …

RE: NBA Discussion - jonnyss - 05-06-2023

(05-06-2023, 07:06 PM)Leftcoast Wrote:  Lakers on a 30 -8 run to close the half.  The Lakers made the first half choppy and physical and the Warriors let it get to them.  Floor technicals, bench technicals, constant arguing, flagrants are all signs the refs are in the team’s head and led to the Lakers’ desired pace.

The Warriors need to play fast, smooth, and win on the open court.  Don’t let the Lakers decide the pace and game style.

Hoping for a more watchable second half …

me, too, but we didn't get it.

RE: NBA Discussion - OutsiderFan - 05-07-2023

Fully expected the Warriors to lose Game 3. But when they went up 11 in the 2nd quarter after Moody 3, I thought maybe I had underestimated the Dubs. Then, Russell missed a 3 and Curry threw away a pass to Thompson on the break and it was ALL downhill from there.

It's really hard to identify anything that changed from a schematic standpoint. The Warriors just started playing dumb. More turnovers, the idiotic flagrant on Moody, more fouling and technical fouls. Why? 

Both teams were called for about the same number of fouls unlike in Game 1, but the Lakers still took 20 more FTs, and the Warriors were terrible form 3pt line while the Lakers were great.

Jordan Poole had 4 turnovers in limited minutes but the Warriors seemed to play better when he was on the floor despite poor shooting.

Based on having the worst +/- in the Kings series (-36), and his -20 through 3 games of the Lakers series, it sure seems GP2 has been a bust as a trade pickup if they got him for the playoffs. He couldn't slow De'Arron Fox and he's not stopping anyone on the Lakers.

RE: NBA Discussion - lex24 - 05-07-2023

Series is all about Davis.  Looney absolutely cannot handle him.  Too quick and too much space to cover. So, this may be a series where he gets very few minutes from this point on. Question is, who gets them?  JMG is not likely to have another Game 2. He was bad yesterday. Kerr wants 4 scoring threats  on the floor for spacing reasons.  But he doesn’t have great options. Going to be interesting.

RE: NBA Discussion - gocard14 - 05-07-2023

Horrible game yesterday. Turnovers and fouls and poor shooting. The good news is that those things are fixable. 

Tactically a few notes. The lakers learned from game 2 and put AD on JMG instead of Greene so he wouldn’t get pulled into every pick and roll. In theory this is good for us  since it keeps AD out of the paint but that is only true if he has to respect JMGs shooting, which he didn’t yesterday. Some of that can be fixed by shooting luck. We can also use JMG in the pick and roll to bring AD in, but he just isn’t a great screener and roll man so that isn’t great. 

A few options:

1. Go smaller. Put GP2 in the JMG spot. Better defense, and he’s a good screener, but same streaky shooting issues. Or put DDV or Moody there. Run 3 guards with more lineups with Greene as the only big. Looney only comes in to spell green, ideally when AD is resting.  This will force AD on Greene or on a shooter and keep him out of the paint. We may lose some rebounding but force Rui or their other non AD bigs to defend in space. The issue is this relies on Dray to stay on the court and out of foul trouble which has been a problem in the two losses.

We can also try Kuminga. Same issue as JMG in that they will put AD on him and sag off but he can at least pressure the rim more and is a better defender then JMG.

RE: NBA Discussion - OutsiderFan - 05-07-2023

What an insanely close win for the Sixers in Game 4 over Celtics. I just don't know how the C's ever lose. They so obviously have the most best 2-way players, and more better players than the Sixers, but they just continue making small mistakes that hurt them.

I told my buddy if I could take any player to start an NBA team right now it would be Jaylen Brown. Jayson Tatum is a brilliant player. Derrick White, Malcolm Brogdon, and Marcus Smart are the three best defensive guards on one team in the NBA, and all can knock down threes. Brogdon was the 6th Man of the year.  Then Al Horford lets them space the floor with 5 guys who can shoot from 3.  Then they have Robert Williams who can come in and still have 4 shooters.

James Harden had to play almost a perfect game for the Sixers to win, including making the shot to force OT and the 3 to win in OT. Embiid looked to tire at the end of the game. I honestly don't know how they won, but I have zero confidence they can win another game in Boston.