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RE: NBA Discussion - TrumpCard - 05-07-2023

The Sixers have plenty of talent. The Celtics have several players with great reputations on the defensive end. Yet the didn’t have much of an answer for Embiid or Harden. Maxey also is an excellent player. Harris isn’t elite, but he’s not bad. He gets dismissed because his contract is so absurd, but at a reasonable price, he’d be in demand.

RE: NBA Discussion - OutsiderFan - 05-08-2023

Here are some insane stats from Nuggets-Suns Game 4…

After going 20-25 in Game 3 for 47, Devin Booker hits 14/18 for 38 and ends up -1 in 40 minutes. Kevin Durant goes 11-19 for 36 and is 0 net efficiency in 44 minutes. 

Nikola Jokic score 53 and was +2 in 39 minutes. If he played 44 minutes like KD the Nuggets probably win. What an offensive show these teams put on display. Both teams shot 56% FG in a playoff game! Where’s the D? Or is the offensive skill just not something defense can slow down? If they played poor defense, could they both have shot 60% FG?

Anyway, the difference was Landry Shamet hitting hitting 5-9 threes off bench, while Michael Porter Jr. was just 2-9 from three.

RE: NBA Discussion - gocard14 - 05-08-2023

(05-08-2023, 03:14 AM)OutsiderFan Wrote:  Here are some insane stats from Nuggets-Suns Game 4…

After going 20-25 in Game 3 for 47, Devin Booker hits 14/18 for 38 and ends up -1 in 40 minutes. Kevin Durant goes 11-19 for 36 and is 0 net efficiency in 44 minutes. 

Nikola Jokic score 53 and was +2 in 39 minutes. If he played 44 minutes like KD the Nuggets probably win. What an offensive show these teams put on display. Both teams shot 56% FG in a playoff game! Where’s the D? Or is the offensive skill just not something defense can slow down? If they played poor defense, could they both have shot 60% FG?

Anyway, the difference was Landry Shamet hitting hitting 5-9 threes off bench, while Michael Porter Jr. was just 2-9 from three.

Both things are true. Great shotmaking, poor D, especially on Jokic. Maybe we are spoiled since green and looney at least slow him down a bit. 

I still favor the nuggets since Jokics points are just coming so much easier and more sustainably then the ridiculous shotmaking coming from Durant and especially Booker. It seems impossible to keep that up. But it’s 3 games, so who knows?

RE: NBA Discussion - OutsiderFan - 05-08-2023

(05-08-2023, 10:32 AM)gocard14 Wrote:  
(05-08-2023, 03:14 AM)OutsiderFan Wrote:  Here are some insane stats from Nuggets-Suns Game 4…

After going 20-25 in Game 3 for 47, Devin Booker hits 14/18 for 38 and ends up -1 in 40 minutes. Kevin Durant goes 11-19 for 36 and is 0 net efficiency in 44 minutes. 

Nikola Jokic score 53 and was +2 in 39 minutes. If he played 44 minutes like KD the Nuggets probably win. What an offensive show these teams put on display. Both teams shot 56% FG in a playoff game! Where’s the D? Or is the offensive skill just not something defense can slow down? If they played poor defense, could they both have shot 60% FG?

Anyway, the difference was Landry Shamet hitting hitting 5-9 threes off bench, while Michael Porter Jr. was just 2-9 from three.

Both things are true. Great shotmaking, poor D, especially on Jokic. Maybe we are spoiled since green and looney at least slow him down a bit. 

I still favor the nuggets since Jokics points are just coming so much easier and more sustainably then the ridiculous shotmaking coming from Durant and especially Booker. It seems impossible to keep that up. But it’s 3 games, so who knows?

Booker's shooting over last two games has never been seen before in NBA history, so it seems some serious regression to the mean is in order for him.

At same time...like the ESPN Radio guy said today, when Chris Paul went out, we thought it was over for the Suns. Now do we have to ask ourselves if they've found a formula without Paul that is unstoppable?

The pace the Suns play without Paul is way faster than with him, and so too is their offensive efficiency. But bench players usually play better at home. Don't think Shamet is going 5-9 from three in Denver.

RE: NBA Discussion - OutsiderFan - 05-09-2023

Anyone want to guess why and make a case for not playing GP2 more than 2 mins in 4th quarter of Game 4? I mean it looked to me like his quickness gave the Lakers fits. Moody may be a better shooter but doesn’t have GP2’s quickness.

But again, another shit game from Klay Thompson. He’s killing the W’s with his terrible shooting. Just 3/11, and he let Walker go off for 6-9 and that was the difference in the game.

It’s literally if Klay Thompson shoots well the W’s win, if he doesn’t they lose. Warriors fans be blaming Poole for all that ails them, but Thompson is the real problem and he knows it.

RE: NBA Discussion - lex24 - 05-09-2023

(05-09-2023, 03:23 AM)OutsiderFan Wrote:  Anyone want to guess why and make a case for not playing GP2 more than 2 mins in 4th quarter of Game 4? I mean it looked to me like his quickness gave the Lakers fits. Moody may be a better shooter but doesn’t have GP2’s quickness.

But again, another shit game from Klay Thompson. He’s killing the W’s with his terrible shooting. Just 3/11, and he let Walker go off for 6-9 and that was the difference in the game.

It’s literally if Klay Thompson shoots well the W’s win, if he doesn’t they lose. Warriors fans be blaming Poole for all that ails them, but Thompson is the real problem and he knows it.

There is more than one problem.  Thompson played poorly.  Poole atrociously.  Wiggins meh.  Shot selection down the stretch was awful. Then there is the FT disparity.  Lakers were not called for a foul until about 18 minutes into the game.

Course when the 10th guy on the roster scores more in the 4 th than in his previous playoff career, maybe it’s not your night.

Not over.  But bleak.  And if they do lose, it’s the end of an era.  Changes will be coming.  Lacob isn’t going to pay a massive tax for a roster that isn’t a threat to win it.  The Poole contract was a big mistake.
I’ll say it now.  If I’m Kerr I start Poole in game 5.  For the Warriors to win, they need some combo of Thompson, Wiggins and Poole to go off.  Curry is getting very little help.

I know Poole has stunk.  Badly.  But maybe he gets off early.  If he starts and stinks, fine.  Sit him the rest of the game.  But he’s the only one of Moody, DDV, GP that can go off and give you 25. 

Looney is a non factor and will continue to be.  Just a bad matchup for him.  He gets a few minutes spelling Green.  

Moody, DDV and GP will get minutes.  Depending on productivity.  All three provided some decent minutes. 

But they need someone besides Curry to go off.  Right now, he’s been their only real threat. 

As for the foul disparity, some of it is to be expected given regular season numbers. And Lakers have attacked more throughout the series - although not so much last night. But with my bias eyes, the Lakers seem to get benefit of ticky tack fouls more than Warriors.  I mean, remember when James blocked Curry from behind.  Clean up high, got a little of the body.  Good non call.  But let’s say Looney did the same to James on a drive. Any question he gets the call? Also, 17 minutes without a foul? C’mon…..

RE: NBA Discussion - OutsiderFan - 05-09-2023

I agree Poole should start. The data shows he's better starting than coming off bench.

It's truly remarkable that the Warriors could be down 1 with 16 seconds to go and their top "Shooting" Guards a combined 3-15. That tells you they are not out of the series.

If W's get over 40% shooting from Thompson they win. Can he shoot this well three games straight? Yes. Will he? Seems doubtful based on his playoff numbers this year.

RE: NBA Discussion - qwerty49 - 05-09-2023

It was painful to watch the Lakers run that screen repeatedly with Curry ending up having to guard LeBron.

RE: NBA Discussion - McKenwood - 05-09-2023

(05-09-2023, 10:00 AM)OutsiderFan Wrote:  I agree Poole should start. The data shows he's better starting than coming off bench.

It's truly remarkable that the Warriors could be down 1 with 16 seconds to go and their top "Shooting" Guards a combined 3-15. That tells you they are not out of the series.

If W's get over 40% shooting from Thompson they win. Can he shoot this well three games straight? Yes. Will he? Seems doubtful based on his playoff numbers this year.

Tough to see how the Warriors win the series but Game 5 is winnable. I'd start GP2 again and run pick and roll against AD until he collapses. W's stopped running this action in the fourth quarter and reverted back to trying to get open threes that of course were not falling. AD was not really a factor in the second half because he had to work so hard in the first. GP2 also negated DeAR and could have been a factor against LWIV if he had been allowed more than a token appearance in Q4.

Not sure where Kerr can go to get help for Steph when Poole makes himself unplayable. Initially I blamed Klay but his playoff stats this year are consistent with his career numbers so he isn't really the issue except when he goes hero ball without a good handle. Bob Myers gifted Steve Kerr an undersized roster with holes in it (the Igodala spot was a brobdingnagian mistake). Trading Wiseman was probably the right call but W's needed a taller/bigger player in return.

I'm interested to see what happens in the offseason. Another finals appearance then keep the gang together. Anything else move on from DG and KT. Andre, DDV and JG are all gone. But then where does that leave Steph if you don't have a championship core around him?

RE: NBA Discussion - gocard14 - 05-09-2023

Not too much to add, gotta say this site has higher level analysis then most. 

Agree with spamming the PNR with Steph and whoever AD is guarding. It generated tons of great looks. The problem is that it is a Huuuuge workload for Steph. Some of the mistakes and settling for step back 3s in the end comes from that fatigue IMO. Another potential issue is that it relegates the rest of the offense to standing in the corner. That’s fine for GP2 or DDV, but may be why Klay had trouble getting going. Not that we shouldn’t do it, we absolutely should, but it’s not an “I win” button. We also should give Poole a shot at it early, since if he has some success it would take the load off Steph. Some of this is overanalaysis, however. A lot of woes would have been solved if we just hit more open shots. We generated a ton of good looks that just didn’t go in. 

On D we overall played a good game. Lonnie walker of all people couldn’t miss a shot. It happens. But I agree we can’t give up the Lebron Steph switch so easily. Make them earn it.  Steph did a pretty good job on Lebron, but that leads to fouls on Steph and tires Steph out. Pre switch, hedge and recover, trap, play zone, there are a lot of options here.

RE: NBA Discussion - OutsiderFan - 05-10-2023

So last night - because I didn't think the outcome would be in question - I didn't watch Sixers-Celtics Game 5.  Then I saw the score with about a minute left in 3rd only to see Sixers leading by 18!?!?!?

WTF has happened to the Celtics?  Last year's finalists are both on the brink of elimination. There was a lot of reason to doubt the W's based on their regular season, but the Celtics seemed to have everything, and now appear to have lost their defensive edge in search of three point shots. When you do that and go 12-38, you are in trouble.

As for Poole...  I can understand his beef. He sees Klay stinking up the joint and wonders why only he gets pulled when he is struggling. Some may say but Klay has the resume. My response is the W's are suppose to be ego-less, nobody ahead of the team.  When Klay plays terribly, he doesn't get pulled, it looks like he is being put ahead of the team. Why should Poole be treated different?

I heard someone on radio say Poole is a player who thrives on confidence. Tough for him to have it when he is pulled after struggling a bit. I said last year that I thought Poole should start and bring Klay off the bench because Poole plays better as a starter ostensibly because he's more confident starting. It worked out with him coming off the bench last year in playoffs, but Klay was playing better too.

If I was Kerr, my starting lineup for Game 5:

Green, Wiggins, GP2, Poole (show confidence in him), Curry with bench of Thompson, Moody, DiVincenzo, Looney bench

My fear is it will be:

Green, Wiggins, GP2, Thompson, Curry with bench limited to Moody, DiVinCenzo, and Looney, and no Poole at all.

This will only erode the relationship with Poole and the Warriors.

RE: NBA Discussion - Leftcoast - 05-10-2023

He’s been awful on the court and awful off it.  It’s pretty clear it’s not just the coaches who are frustrated with Poole.

RE: NBA Discussion - gocard14 - 05-10-2023

I also would like to see a Kuminga sighting early in the game. He adds D and rim pressure especially if we can pull AD out of the paint. We talk him like he can’t shoot but he shot 37% for the year. Especially at home he can hit some open shots. We can always pull him if he is struggling but I think he could be a difference maker.

RE: NBA Discussion - McKenwood - 05-10-2023

(05-10-2023, 08:52 AM)Leftcoast Wrote:  He’s been awful on the court and awful off it.  It’s pretty clear it’s not just the coaches who are frustrated with Poole.

If he has been awful off the court this season (I don't know one way or another) the coaching staff and management bear significant responsibility here. They should not be stuck in the playoffs relying on a guy with a bad attitude.

This gets back to not addressing the issues with Poole and Kuminga during the season. All that playing time for Anthony Lamb and Ty Jerome was a big waste.

RE: NBA Discussion - gocard14 - 05-10-2023

(05-10-2023, 11:06 AM)McKenwood Wrote:  
(05-10-2023, 08:52 AM)Leftcoast Wrote:  He’s been awful on the court and awful off it.  It’s pretty clear it’s not just the coaches who are frustrated with Poole.

If he has been awful off the court this season (I don't know one way or another) the coaching staff and management bear significant responsibility here. They should not be stuck in the playoffs relying on a guy with a bad attitude.

This gets back to not addressing the issues with Poole and Kuminga during the season. All that playing time for Anthony Lamb and Ty Jerome was a big waste.


Maybe. But remember we were 1 game out of the play in. We needed every win we could get. Kuminga definitely got minutes. Moody did not and arguably could have used some of lamb’s minutes. The problem is we needed a secondary ball handler (Ty Jerome) when Steph was out and a 4 more then we needed another 2/3.

RE: NBA Discussion - old spanish trail - 05-10-2023

(05-10-2023, 08:52 AM)Leftcoast Wrote:  He’s been awful on the court and awful off it.  It’s pretty clear it’s not just the coaches who are frustrated with Poole.

Awful off the court? Care to elaborate?

RE: NBA Discussion - Leftcoast - 05-10-2023

Maybe the offseason will see an adjustment by Poole and a new commitment from Kerr/GSW staff.  It PROBABLY will given the investment the team made just 8 months ago. But right now that locker room with Poole isn't healthy.  You don't have to look too deep to see it.

*  Team frustration with shot selection, out of control drives, and lack of passing (numerous reaction shots during playoff TV, including one where Draymond was open underneath the basket and Poole took a contested, off balance three)
*  Curry calling for teammates to only get on the bus to game 7 if they were committed (hmmhh ... probably aimed at several folks but my bet is Poole was one)
*  Draymond Green calling out how happy he is to go to battle with his teammates in tonight's game 5 and naming each of the players .... except Poole (May 10 Draymond Green Show podcast)
*  Body language throughout the playoffs when pulled from the court (not just me on this - Google "Poole body language" for a list of national figures thinking Golden State has a problem and some funny videos that remind me of, well, my 16 year old)
*  Kerith Burke, embedded reporter, discussing the tension in the locker room when Poole finally responds to reporter questions after game 4 and blames his production on a lack of opportunity (listen for yourself, link below)

The above is just from the last few days but it's been growing since the season started.  It went from most of the players supporting Poole (and letting DG know he overstepped the line) to where we are now.

Again, maybe 2023/2024 brings a new year and a new attitude but when the wheels fall off the pressure shows the team's fissures. Poole isn't handling that pressure on a team that has historically regrouped in tough times.  This gets noticed... Sometimes by fans, sometimes by coaches, sometimes by national media, but most damagingly by the guys sitting beside Poole and wearing his color jersey.

https://www.nbcsports.com/bayarea/video/kerith-burke-provides-inside-look-jordan-pooles-tense-postgame-scrum

RE: NBA Discussion - lex24 - 05-10-2023

(05-10-2023, 05:00 PM)Leftcoast Wrote:  Maybe the offseason will see an adjustment by Poole and a new commitment from Kerr/GSW staff.  It PROBABLY will given the investment the team made just 8 months ago. But right now that locker room with Poole isn't healthy.  You don't have to look too deep to see it.

*  Team frustration with shot selection, out of control drives, and lack of passing (numerous reaction shots during playoff TV, including one where Draymond was open underneath the basket and Poole took a contested, off balance three)
*  Curry calling for teammates to only get on the bus to game 7 if they were committed (hmmhh ... probably aimed at several folks but my bet is Poole was one)
*  Draymond Green calling out how happy he is to go to battle with his teammates in tonight's game 5 and naming each of the players .... except Poole (May 10 Draymond Green Show podcast)
*  Body language throughout the playoffs when pulled from the court (not just me on this - Google "Poole body language" for a list of national figures thinking Golden State has a problem and some funny videos that remind me of, well, my 16 year old)
*  Kerith Burke, embedded reporter, discussing the tension in the locker room when Poole finally responds to reporter questions after game 4 and blames his production on a lack of opportunity (listen for yourself, link below)

The above is just from the last few days but it's been growing since the season started.  It went from most of the players supporting Poole (and letting DG know he overstepped the line) to where we are now.

Again, maybe 2023/2024 brings a new year and a new attitude but when the wheels fall off the pressure shows the team's fissures.  Poole isn't handling that pressure on a team that has historically regrouped in tough times.  This gets noticed... Sometimes by fans, sometimes by coaches, sometimes by national media, but most damagingly by the guys sitting beside Poole and wearing his color jersey.

https://www.nbcsports.com/bayarea/video/kerith-burke-provides-inside-look-jordan-pooles-tense-postgame-scrum

Well said.  He’s played a little better tonight.

Wiggins. To me, he’s their key. They got finals Wiggins tonight. When he plays like that, they don’t lose.

RE: NBA Discussion - Leftcoast - 05-11-2023

Yup, the Warriors need this Andrew Wiggins for Game 6 in LA.  When the Warriors doubled Steph it was Andrew Wiggins and, to a lesser but unexpected extent, Draymond Green who made them pay.

Game 6 decides the series - If it comes back to SF then the Warriors will be moving on barring LJ rolling back time.

RE: NBA Discussion - OutsiderFan - 05-11-2023

Last year in the Finals I remember Andrew Wiggins went to a coach (don’t remember if Kerr or assistant) and said he wanted to guard Jayson Tatum full court. That changed the series. 

His picking up LeBron full court in Game 5 of this series is akin to stepping up and asserting himself like in the playoffs last year. That assertiveness really inspired the whole team last year. It’s almost like he doesn’t want to assert himself over any of the big three, but the reality is Wiggins is the team’s most gifted player. The W’s need him to be that guy. 

I also noticed a new confidence and level of seriousness from him in his post Game comments. When asked if he could feel James getting tired, he did not take the bait. He very stoically said he can’t tell and just needs to put in the effort. This mentality that you will give everything you have even when there is no guarantee of anything in return, is one of the hallmarks of winners. Andrew Wiggins is taking on the challenge of LeBron James in the most assertive way possible on a basketball court. You know that has to inspire the entire team and all of Dubs Nation.