Outside Topic NBA Discussion - Printable Version
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RE: NBA Discussion - cardcrimson - 05-17-2023
(05-17-2023, 04:04 PM)lex24 Wrote:(05-16-2023, 08:42 PM)OutsiderFan Wrote: Should Nuggets fans be concerned? Jokic 34, 21, 14, but only win by 6 with terrible defense. It must dramatically improve if they are to make Finals.
No. Denver is up 1-0. Game 2 will see adjustments and be entirely different. As will game 3 etc.
I thought the season was over. . . .
RE: NBA Discussion - OutsiderFan - 05-17-2023
I simply am amazed at the Heat beating the Celtics. Don’t know what seems more unlikely, them beating the C’s or shooting 16-31 from 3.
How can Miami be the worst offensive team in the NBA regular season and now be scoring 123 in Boston during conference finals? Jimmy Butler is simply amazing.
RE: NBA Discussion - Mick - 05-18-2023
Based on everything I've been reading, Bob Myers will end up departing GSW, as the two sides are VERY far apart on contract numbers and terms. Get ready for Mike Dunleavy, Jr. to take over.
RE: NBA Discussion - Leftcoast - 05-18-2023
(05-18-2023, 04:43 PM)Mick Wrote: Based on everything I've been reading, Bob Myers will end up departing GSW, as the two sides are VERY far apart on contract numbers and terms. Get ready for Mike Dunleavy, Jr. to take over.
It it's just money (yeah, I know) then I think Meyers stays but matches his contract length to Curry's. I can see a scenario where Meyers, Curry, Thompson, and Green all ride off into their career sunset together.
RE: NBA Discussion - OutsiderFan - 05-18-2023
Impressive defensive turnaround by Nuggets. Didn't think they had it in them.
Jamal Murray started 3-15, but then went 8-9 to end up 11-24 and 6-14 from 3. That's what Klay Thompson could not do.
RE: NBA Discussion - lex24 - 05-19-2023
(05-17-2023, 08:37 PM)OutsiderFan Wrote: I simply am amazed at the Heat beating the Celtics. Don’t know what seems more unlikely, them beating the C’s or shooting 16-31 from 3.
How can Miami be the worst offensive team in the NBA regular season and now be scoring 123 in Boston during conference finals? Jimmy Butler is simply amazing.
Eric Spoelstra is also amazing.
RE: NBA Discussion - OutsiderFan - 05-19-2023
(05-19-2023, 07:12 AM)lex24 Wrote:(05-17-2023, 08:37 PM)OutsiderFan Wrote: I simply am amazed at the Heat beating the Celtics. Don’t know what seems more unlikely, them beating the C’s or shooting 16-31 from 3.
How can Miami be the worst offensive team in the NBA regular season and now be scoring 123 in Boston during conference finals? Jimmy Butler is simply amazing.
Eric Spoelstra is also amazing.
And Joe Muzzulla is not.
RE: NBA Discussion - Chupacabra - 05-19-2023
Word is there are other sports "leagues" that are interested in Meyers. He may just be ready for the next challenge. If he leaves the Warriors then I'll raise a glass to a job well done.
(05-18-2023, 04:59 PM)Leftcoast Wrote:(05-18-2023, 04:43 PM)Mick Wrote: Based on everything I've been reading, Bob Myers will end up departing GSW, as the two sides are VERY far apart on contract numbers and terms. Get ready for Mike Dunleavy, Jr. to take over.
It it's just money (yeah, I know) then I think Meyers stays but matches his contract length to Curry's. I can see a scenario where Meyers, Curry, Thompson, and Green all ride off into their career sunset together.
RE: NBA Discussion - OutsiderFan - 05-20-2023
Boston is now 4-5 at home in these playoffs. Their meltdowns at crucial times can no longer be seen as flukes or minor bumps. It appears fatal weaknesses have been exposed as happens in the crucible of playoff intensity.
Jimmy Butler’s postgame comments seemed to highlight the contrast between the Heat and the Celtics and Warriors. He said how tight their team is, how everyone plays their roles and that they always stay together. The Celtics falter in crunch time like the Warriors did on the road. There are reasons for each and they have been exploited.
The Celtics seem to be a tight team, but are finding ways to lose close games. It’s hard to wrap my head around why Grant Williams played more minutes than Robert in Game 2. Give Mizzulla credit for trying Grant on Butler, but it clearly didn’t work and Robert was better as it was. Jayson Tatum has 0 FGs in two 4the quarters of the series and 5 turnovers. It’s time to double Butler and make other guys beat them, but the Celtics may have run out of it regardless. My pre-season Title pick is on life support and may not make it through the weekend. Becoming first team to lose Game 2 at home in playoffs after dropping Game 1 for first time in 17 such cases means Game 3 is a must win for Boston. Anyone think they can do it?
RE: NBA Discussion - Mick - 05-20-2023
Myers has really had a remarkable run. I realize that others were involved in selecting and signing players, but their draft picks alone -- particularly given where they drafted -- were really quite good: Green, Thompson, Barnes, Looney, Poole, Kuminga, Ezeli, Moody, Baldwin, Jones, Evans, etc. The only real clinker was James Wiseman. There were a number of low-ish draft selections that didn't work out at all (Mannion, Jessup, Oni, Paschall, Kuzmic, Santos, Martin), but that's to be expected. BTW, on a per-36 minute basis, Wiseman's numbers for Detroit weren't all that different than his numbers for Golden State.
Myers' moves, with almost no salary to work with, were also extraordinary. From Bogut to GP2, most worked out pretty well, especially relative to the salary range he had to work with. And he has great relationships with Green, Curry, Thompson et al.
Hall of Famer, in my opinion. I'd hate to lose him.
(05-19-2023, 08:43 AM)Chupacabra Wrote: Word is there are other sports "leagues" that are interested in Meyers. He may just be ready for the next challenge. If he leaves the Warriors then I'll raise a glass to a job well done.
(05-18-2023, 04:59 PM)Leftcoast Wrote:(05-18-2023, 04:43 PM)Mick Wrote: Based on everything I've been reading, Bob Myers will end up departing GSW, as the two sides are VERY far apart on contract numbers and terms. Get ready for Mike Dunleavy, Jr. to take over.
It it's just money (yeah, I know) then I think Meyers stays but matches his contract length to Curry's. I can see a scenario where Meyers, Curry, Thompson, and Green all ride off into their career sunset together.
RE: NBA Discussion - lex24 - 05-20-2023
Anyone read Bruce Jenkins today? Focused on comments by both Kerr and Green that “The Punch” hurt the Warriors all year.
It was not well handled. Green should have been suspended, without pay, for a period of time. By not so doing, they both failed to send a message to Green that some of his “antics” are not acceptable and will not be tolerated. And they failed, in a big way, to support a key young player to whom they previously appeared committed.
I don’t think going forward there is any way both stay. Meyers may be the key. If he leaves, I suspect Green will as well.
RE: NBA Discussion - Mick - 05-20-2023
I think Green has some self-destructive tendencies. He basically ran Kevin Durant off the team. Way too many technical fouls every year, punches Poole, shouts at Steve Kerr in public, stomps on Sabonis' chest, and best of all, kicks LeBron between the legs and gets suspended, losing the 2016 NBA Finals.
Draymond has the 14th most career technical fouls in the NBA with 184. He's lost $1.3 milion in fines. He's finished first or second in the NBA in technical fouls in a season five times, and except for his rookie year, has never finished lower than sixth in technical fouls in a season. Ejected from Christmas Day 2013 game when he elbowed Blake Griffin in the neck. In 2016, he kneed Steven Adams in the groin. Kicked James Harden in the head, and received a flagrant foul in 2016. ALmost took Imam Schumpert's head off in the 2016/2017 Finals, received a foul, and then argued the call. Got into a fight with Bradley Bean in the 2018 season that spilled into the stands. 2018 playoffs, shoved Harden in the throat, flagrant foul. Poked LeBron in the eye in 2018 playoffs, game one, got technical foul. Threw an elbow at Chris Paul's head in 2019 playoffs. Punched a Michigan State football player in 2016. What a guy.
RE: NBA Discussion - Goose - 05-20-2023
(05-20-2023, 03:20 PM)Mick Wrote: I think Green has some self-destructive tendencies. He basically ran Kevin Durant off the team. Way too many technical fouls every year, punches Poole, shouts at Steve Kerr in public, stomps on Sabonis' chest, and best of all, kicks LeBron between the legs and gets suspended, losing the 2016 NBA Finals.The thing I have never understood is that Kerr seems to be willing to accept this kind of behavior. Yes, he may have a role on the team, but at what cost? There are other guys that can bring what Draymond brings without the negatives. It could at least in the past be argued that Draymond's aggression was always directed outward, towards opponents. IMHO that wouldn't justify/excuse it, but that just isn't the case. He really crossed the line this year and should be gone. Unfortunately, he probably won't be.
Draymond has the 14th most career technical fouls in the NBA with 184. He's lost $1.3 milion in fines. He's finished first or second in the NBA in technical fouls in a season five times, and except for his rookie year, has never finished lower than sixth in technical fouls in a season. Ejected from Christmas Day 2013 game when he elbowed Blake Griffin in the neck. In 2016, he kneed Steven Adams in the groin. Kicked James Harden in the head, and received a flagrant foul in 2016. ALmost took Imam Schumpert's head off in the 2016/2017 Finals, received a foul, and then argued the call. Got into a fight with Bradley Bean in the 2018 season that spilled into the stands. 2018 playoffs, shoved Harden in the throat, flagrant foul. Poked LeBron in the eye in 2018 playoffs, game one, got technical foul. Threw an elbow at Chris Paul's head in 2019 playoffs. Punched a Michigan State football player in 2016. What a guy.
RE: NBA Discussion - gocard14 - 05-20-2023
(05-20-2023, 04:04 PM)Goose Wrote:(05-20-2023, 03:20 PM)Mick Wrote: I think Green has some self-destructive tendencies. He basically ran Kevin Durant off the team. Way too many technical fouls every year, punches Poole, shouts at Steve Kerr in public, stomps on Sabonis' chest, and best of all, kicks LeBron between the legs and gets suspended, losing the 2016 NBA Finals.The thing I have never understood is that Kerr seems to be willing to accept this kind of behavior. Yes, he may have a role on the team, but at what cost? There are other guys that can bring what Draymond brings without the negatives. It could at least in the past be argued that Draymond's aggression was always directed outward, towards opponents. IMHO that wouldn't justify/excuse it, but that just isn't the case. He really crossed the line this year and should be gone. Unfortunately, he probably won't be.
Draymond has the 14th most career technical fouls in the NBA with 184. He's lost $1.3 milion in fines. He's finished first or second in the NBA in technical fouls in a season five times, and except for his rookie year, has never finished lower than sixth in technical fouls in a season. Ejected from Christmas Day 2013 game when he elbowed Blake Griffin in the neck. In 2016, he kneed Steven Adams in the groin. Kicked James Harden in the head, and received a flagrant foul in 2016. ALmost took Imam Schumpert's head off in the 2016/2017 Finals, received a foul, and then argued the call. Got into a fight with Bradley Bean in the 2018 season that spilled into the stands. 2018 playoffs, shoved Harden in the throat, flagrant foul. Poked LeBron in the eye in 2018 playoffs, game one, got technical foul. Threw an elbow at Chris Paul's head in 2019 playoffs. Punched a Michigan State football player in 2016. What a guy.
The problem is there aren’t guys who can bring what Dray does. He is the best 1-5 defender in the league. He’s not the rim protector AD or JJJ or Bam is but his ability to guard fast guards and big centers is unmatched and has been the key to many of the warriors best lineups. He is one of one on the defensive end, and while his lack of shooting hurts his offense, his passing and ability to run the offense off the 4on3 makes people pay for leaving him alone.
Not justifying his behavior. We can play the game of “do the warriors need his fire” or not, not sure what the answer is there. I also wouldn’t overpay too much to keep him since I don’t want to pay for past results but we definitely get worse without him, since with our cap situation we can’t sign someone else with that slot. Maybe we sign and trade him and get someone useful back in return.
RE: NBA Discussion - Goose - 05-20-2023
(05-20-2023, 07:49 PM)gocard14 Wrote:I totally agree there is nobody else that can fill the exact role Draymond does. There are no "interchangeable pieces" out there. Whatever the Warriors do if Draymond is not on the team it will require an adjustment. I DO think there are players out there that could be integrated into the lineup and result in an equal or better net result. The Warriors will be required to do that pretty soon anyway. The question is whether keeping Draymond for up to 3 more years is a "good idea". It may be they can do a sign and trade, but it also may be they are stuck with his salary next year no matter what.(05-20-2023, 04:04 PM)Goose Wrote: The thing I have never understood is that Kerr seems to be willing to accept this kind of behavior. Yes, he may have a role on the team, but at what cost? There are other guys that can bring what Draymond brings without the negatives. It could at least in the past be argued that Draymond's aggression was always directed outward, towards opponents. IMHO that wouldn't justify/excuse it, but that just isn't the case. He really crossed the line this year and should be gone. Unfortunately, he probably won't be.The problem is there aren’t guys who can bring what Dray does. He is the best 1-5 defender in the league. He’s not the rim protector AD or JJJ or Bam is but his ability to guard fast guards and big centers is unmatched and has been the key to many of the warriors best lineups. He is one of one on the defensive end, and while his lack of shooting hurts his offense, his passing and ability to run the offense off the 4on3 makes people pay for leaving him alone.
Not justifying his behavior. We can play the game of “do the warriors need his fire” or not, not sure what the answer is there. I also wouldn’t overpay too much to keep him since I don’t want to pay for past results but we definitely get worse without him, since with our cap situation we can’t sign someone else with that slot. Maybe we sign and trade him and get someone useful back in return.
In the past, one could say Draymond made everybody better by this presence. This year, there is one potentially critical player for which the opposite was emphatically the case. It may be that was an over-reaction by that player, but if you are a team leader, you have to make that not happen. Draymond is supposed to be a "team leader", and he couldn't/didn't fix it. There is no reason to believe next year will be different. IMO the team has to fix that problem, one way or another.
RE: NBA Discussion - OutsiderFan - 05-21-2023
Don't know if I will ever see someone score 30in first half and 0 in 3rd quarter ever again. If Nuggets win the LOB trophy, the odds are we will hear a lot of voices trying to take away from the W's last championship given they played Denver without Jamal Murray and Michael Porter Jr.. However, only after the trade deadline did the Nuggets also have Bruce Brown and Kentavious Caldwell-Pope, who make them a championship team, IMO.
Did any of you read the story on Kevon Looney today in the Mercury? It was all about how he could become a bigger offensive threat with a legit jumper, including from 3. Said he was referred to as "Baby Durant" in High School because he was so offensively talented, able to do everything.
Would be a game-changer if he did. Says he very well could work on adding shooting to his game this Summer if the Warriors ask him to do so.
RE: NBA Discussion - Sam Leopold - 05-21-2023
The Celtics are favored by -4 to win tonight's game IN Miami and will probably be given a similar line for Game 4 in a couple of days. Also, the Heat are only a modest favorite at -170 to advance to the Finals in spite of winning both of the first two games in Boston.
I have never bet real money on sports and don't currently have the infrastructure in place to do so, but if I did, these Heat lines would stick out to me as an outstanding value. The Heat certainly appear to be the superior team psychologically.
If the Celtics were to get out of this hole and grace the Finals, the most likely route (among various unlikely ones) appears to be to win Games 3, 5, 6 and 7, although evening the series in South Beach is not totally inconceivable. Home court advantage in the playoffs doesn't seem to have much meaning to the Celtics this year.
RE: NBA Discussion - Mick - 05-21-2023
(05-21-2023, 10:45 AM)OutsiderFan Wrote: Did any of you read the story on Kevon Looney today in the Mercury? It was all about how he could become a bigger offensive threat with a legit jumper, including from 3. Said he was referred to as "Baby Durant" in High School because he was so offensively talented, able to do everything.
Would be a game-changer if he did. Says he very well could work on adding shooting to his game this Summer if the Warriors ask him to do so.
I did read it, very interesting. Two points: (1) it notes his hip labrum surgery on both hips (separate years). (2) He's bulked up to survive as a 5/center, and has most recently made very strong gains in his rebounding ability. The amount of work he'd need to do to get back to Baby Durant status might not be workable after his surgeries and physical transformation.
RE: NBA Discussion - CompSci87 - 05-21-2023
Yes. Also, he may have been a relatively great distance shooter in his high school days and even as a college freshman, but that doesn't imply he can necessarily bring his 3-pointer up to NBA level.
RE: NBA Discussion - OutsiderFan - 05-22-2023
(05-21-2023, 10:59 AM)Sam Leopold Wrote: The Celtics are favored by -4 to win tonight's game IN Miami and will probably be given a similar line for Game 4 in a couple of days. Also, the Heat are only a modest favorite at -170 to advance to the Finals in spite of winning both of the first two games in Boston.
I have never bet real money on sports and don't currently have the infrastructure in place to do so, but if I did, these Heat lines would stick out to me as an outstanding value. The Heat certainly appear to be the superior team psychologically.
If the Celtics were to get out of this hole and grace the Finals, the most likely route (among various unlikely ones) appears to be to win Games 3, 5, 6 and 7, although evening the series in South Beach is not totally inconceivable. Home court advantage in the playoffs doesn't seem to have much meaning to the Celtics this year.
Last year ESPN’s analytics program gave Celtics an 86% chance to beats Dubs before the Finals tipped off.
Apparently, even down in series 3-0, and even with teams being 0-149 all time in series after that point, ESPN’s analytics program is still picking Celtics to win the series. I’d say the algorithm isn’t factoring in some very important data, like probably some manifestation of the eyeball test.
What an absolute face plant by Boston in Game 3. Just unbelievable how dominated they were in most important game of their season.