WBB: Looking ahead to 22-23 - Printable Version

WBB: Looking ahead to 22-23 - Printable Version

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RE: WBB: Looking ahead to 22-23 - jonnyss - 04-06-2022

(04-05-2022, 09:45 PM)AxeMan89 Wrote: I had the impression that South Carolina was loaded, with HG 2021 #2,3, and 4, all guards, as freshmen this year who didn't really even play. I wouldn't see room for her.

plus incoming talaysia cooper, who is fabulous.

RE: WBB: Looking ahead to 22-23 - spike5882 - 04-06-2022

One thing that will come into play are scholarships. Louisville seems pretty full. I don’t know their exact count, but scholarship availability is going to dictate how some transfers do go.

RE: WBB: Looking ahead to 22-23 - WBB fan - 04-06-2022

(04-05-2022, 07:08 PM)CompSci87 Wrote:
(04-05-2022, 11:51 AM)81alum Wrote:
(04-04-2022, 09:13 PM)teejers1 Wrote:
(04-04-2022, 05:58 PM)M T Wrote: Wow... I can't find that anyone has mentioned this yet here. I saw it on GoStanford hours ago.

Lexie declares for WNBA draft

I wish her all the best.

Short discussion on TOS. Will be tough to make WNBA roster - need to find a team that puts a premium on her "Swiss Army Knife" game.
Europe will be there, though, regardless.
The road wasn't easy for Kiana Williams, but she is on the Phoenix roster atm. I wonder if Lexie has a greater or a lesser chance?

I don't see Kiana listed on the Phoenix roster, but Wikipedia says she signed a training camp contract with them on March 1, so at least she'll get a chance to make it.

She has been playing in Australia (as recently as March 26). Of course the US season starts after most overseas leagues are done for the season.

https://basketball.eurobasket.com/player/Kiana-Williams/Pac12/Stanford-University/441397?Women=1

Re Kiana and Phoenix, I talked with a couple of ASU fans at Tourney Town in Minneapolis during the FF. They are also Phoenix fans and were excited about having Kiana coming for training camp. Also about having Vanessa N as the new head coach. And oh yes, they said they were going to be cheering for Stanford.

RE: WBB: Looking ahead to 22-23 - dcnav - 04-06-2022

Supposedly Owusu is on her way to SC. And maybe Reese as well. At any rate, I saw somewhere that she had a 'b' average in HS so doubtful the academics would be enough anyway.

At any rate, aren't all our scholarships taken. I think we already have 15 next year.

RE: WBB: Looking ahead to 22-23 - BobK - 04-06-2022

With Brown we have 15 for next season.

RE: WBB: Looking ahead to 22-23 - 2006alum - 04-06-2022

(04-06-2022, 10:09 AM)dcnav Wrote: Supposedly Owusu is on her way to SC. And maybe Reese as well. At any rate, I saw somewhere that she had a 'b' average in HS so doubtful the academics would be enough anyway.

At any rate, aren't all our scholarships taken. I think we already have 15 next year.

[tweet]https://twitter.com/Reese10Angel/status/1511758994968395779[/tweet]

Don't believe everything you see on twitter. Some sites are notorious for peddling in half truths.

RE: WBB: Looking ahead to 22-23 - M T - 04-06-2022

(04-06-2022, 08:28 AM)spike5882 Wrote: One thing that will come into play are scholarships. Louisville seems pretty full. I don’t know their exact count, but scholarship availability is going to dictate how some transfers do go.

Why is that a limitation? A school just tells a player, "Sorry, we got a player we needed more than you. She got your scholarship."

I think it is terrible, but I'm sure it happens at some schools.

I would also think some schools will stick with their players and will expect them to stick with the school. They will have a rule that if you announce you want to transfer, then your scholarship for the next year is gone and will be given to someone other than you even if you find no one else wants you that much. As a result, some players are likely to wind up without a school (or at least a scholarship).

For instance, if one of our beloved Stanford players started shopping around for another school, I would want Tara to have to hold open that scholarship for the player just in case. I'd think Stanford should say "Ok, we'll use your scholarship for someone else. If you want to play next year here, you'll have to do it without a scholarship. Good luck & close the door on your way out."

RE: WBB: Looking ahead to 22-23 - qwerty49 - 04-06-2022

(04-06-2022, 01:47 PM)M T Wrote: For instance, if one of our beloved Stanford players started shopping around for another school, I would want Tara to have to hold open that scholarship for the player just in case. I'd think Stanford should say "Ok, we'll use your scholarship for someone else. If you want to play next year here, you'll have to do it without a scholarship. Good luck & close the door on your way out."

I'm having a senior moment but IIRC that happened with one of our key posts on the Men's team some time ago, who took his time deciding if he was coming back, and I remember there was some discussion that it may have hurt our recruiting that year.

RE: WBB: Looking ahead to 22-23 - teejers1 - 04-06-2022

(04-06-2022, 02:57 PM)qwerty49 Wrote:
(04-06-2022, 01:47 PM)M T Wrote: For instance, if one of our beloved Stanford players started shopping around for another school, I would want Tara to have to hold open that scholarship for the player just in case. I'd think Stanford should say "Ok, we'll use your scholarship for someone else. If you want to play next year here, you'll have to do it without a scholarship. Good luck & close the door on your way out."

I'm having a senior moment but IIRC that happened with one of our key posts on the Men's team some time ago, who took his time deciding if he was coming back, and I remember there was some discussion that it may have hurt our recruiting that year.

Jason Collins (pretty sure; may have been Jarron) hemmed and hawed on his return and Monty kept scholie for him.
As a result, UConn nabbed Emeka Okafor, who Stanford wanted but couldn't offer scholie until Collins decided.

As a result, UConn won an NCAA title and Stanford was deprived of (at least one) NCAA title.

Nah . . . that one doesn't bother me at all after all these years . . .

RE: WBB: Looking ahead to 22-23 - BobK - 04-06-2022

Stanford could have offered Okafor Pryor to November as could have UConn. Neither did so then april came and UConn had the opening that Stanford didn’t.
Yes Jason Collins

RE: WBB: Looking ahead to 22-23 - 81alum - 04-06-2022

I was a big proponent of guaranteed four year scholarships. But it seems unfair that players can shop around and leave whenever they like, but the team has a four year commitment. If players can be mercenary with their services, then why can't teams be mercenary with their scholarships?

I hope that at Stanford neither of those things come to pass.

RE: WBB: Looking ahead to 22-23 - BostonCard - 04-06-2022

Chaps my hide too. I think there may be a weird psychological difference between the draft and a transfer, though.

BC

RE: WBB: Looking ahead to 22-23 - jonnyss - 04-06-2022

(04-06-2022, 03:44 PM)81alum Wrote: I was a big proponent of guaranteed four year scholarships. But it seems unfair that players can shop around and leave whenever they like, but the team has a four year commitment. If players can be mercenary with their services, then why can't teams be mercenary with their scholarships?

I hope that at Stanford neither of those things come to pass.

imo there are a few reasons why the relationship is asymmetric.

for the moment at least, these are student athletes. (non-athlete) students generally get to stay for 4 years unless they fail or break significant rules. students get to transfer after 1, 2, 3 years. the school doesn't get to kick them out or revoke a scholarship if better students come along.

also, from an ethical point of view, top athletes find new schools easily, but the athletes who would lose their scholarships when they are recruited over are usually bench players and are at a big disadvantage in finding a new school. often, they have been compromising their studies in favor of long hours of practice. the school can more easily find new players than the student find a new school.

RE: WBB: Looking ahead to 22-23 - 81alum - 04-06-2022

(04-06-2022, 05:14 PM)jonnyss Wrote:
(04-06-2022, 03:44 PM)81alum Wrote: I was a big proponent of guaranteed four year scholarships. But it seems unfair that players can shop around and leave whenever they like, but the team has a four year commitment. If players can be mercenary with their services, then why can't teams be mercenary with their scholarships?

I hope that at Stanford neither of those things come to pass.

imo there are a few reasons why the relationship is asymmetric.

for the moment at least, these are student athletes. (non-athlete) students generally get to stay for 4 years unless they fail or break significant rules. students get to transfer after 1, 2, 3 years. the school doesn't get to kick them out or revoke a scholarship if better students come along.

also, from an ethical point of view, top athletes find new schools easily, but the athletes who would lose their scholarships when they are recruited over are usually bench players and are at a big disadvantage in finding a new school. often, they have been compromising their studies in favor of long hours of practice. the school can more easily find new players than the student find a new school.

I would make it symmetric again not by getting rid of the four year guarantee, but by putting the transfer restrictions back on again. Enforce some level of commitment from both sides.

As for "student athletes," I entirely agree with this concept which is why I am aghast at the changes underway that are undermining it. To me, whenever a student transfers to gain an athletic advantage they are proving that they are athlete-students, that athletics comes before academics. When 20-25% of WBB players are in the portal, that tells me that most of them are not choosing schools as students, but as athletes, and the student-athlete concept dies a little more.

RE: WBB: Looking ahead to 22-23 - 2006alum - 04-06-2022

(04-06-2022, 02:57 PM)qwerty49 Wrote:
(04-06-2022, 01:47 PM)M T Wrote: For instance, if one of our beloved Stanford players started shopping around for another school, I would want Tara to have to hold open that scholarship for the player just in case. I'd think Stanford should say "Ok, we'll use your scholarship for someone else. If you want to play next year here, you'll have to do it without a scholarship. Good luck & close the door on your way out."

I'm having a senior moment but IIRC that happened with one of our key posts on the Men's team some time ago, who took his time deciding if he was coming back, and I remember there was some discussion that it may have hurt our recruiting that year.

This post is what the young folk would call "triggering" for many of us around here. *shudder*

RE: WBB: Looking ahead to 22-23 - PalmTree - 04-06-2022

(04-06-2022, 03:08 PM)teejers1 Wrote:
(04-06-2022, 02:57 PM)qwerty49 Wrote:
(04-06-2022, 01:47 PM)M T Wrote: For instance, if one of our beloved Stanford players started shopping around for another school, I would want Tara to have to hold open that scholarship for the player just in case. I'd think Stanford should say "Ok, we'll use your scholarship for someone else. If you want to play next year here, you'll have to do it without a scholarship. Good luck & close the door on your way out."

I'm having a senior moment but IIRC that happened with one of our key posts on the Men's team some time ago, who took his time deciding if he was coming back, and I remember there was some discussion that it may have hurt our recruiting that year.

Jason Collins (pretty sure; may have been Jarron) hemmed and hawed on his return and Monty kept scholie for him.
As a result, UConn nabbed Emeka Okafor, who Stanford wanted but couldn't offer scholie until Collins decided.

As a result, UConn won an NCAA title and Stanford was deprived of (at least one) NCAA title.

Nah . . . that one doesn't bother me at all after all these years . . .

And....AND (!!!), Okafor had been accepted - IIRC - the incoming frosh class would've been Hernandez, Childress, Little & Okafor - not that it bothers me after all these years, either - nope, not me. But I digress - it's a tough world out there....

RE: WBB: Looking ahead to 22-23 - teejers1 - 04-06-2022

(04-06-2022, 07:57 PM)PalmTree Wrote:
(04-06-2022, 03:08 PM)teejers1 Wrote:
(04-06-2022, 02:57 PM)qwerty49 Wrote:
(04-06-2022, 01:47 PM)M T Wrote: For instance, if one of our beloved Stanford players started shopping around for another school, I would want Tara to have to hold open that scholarship for the player just in case. I'd think Stanford should say "Ok, we'll use your scholarship for someone else. If you want to play next year here, you'll have to do it without a scholarship. Good luck & close the door on your way out."

I'm having a senior moment but IIRC that happened with one of our key posts on the Men's team some time ago, who took his time deciding if he was coming back, and I remember there was some discussion that it may have hurt our recruiting that year.

Jason Collins (pretty sure; may have been Jarron) hemmed and hawed on his return and Monty kept scholie for him.
As a result, UConn nabbed Emeka Okafor, who Stanford wanted but couldn't offer scholie until Collins decided.

As a result, UConn won an NCAA title and Stanford was deprived of (at least one) NCAA title.

Nah . . . that one doesn't bother me at all after all these years . . .

And....AND (!!!), Okafor had been accepted - IIRC - the incoming frosh class would've been Hernandez, Children, Little & Okafor - not that it bothers me after all these years, either - nope, not me. But I digress - it's a tough world out there....

Yep. And I should have added in my original post - for those young 'uns around here who did not live the saga real-time - that Jason Collins eventually bailed on Stanford and didn't use the scholie. So Monty's nice, respectful gesture was for naught. [Don't recall if that scholie went to a different late recruit, or gave a walk-on a one-year scholie, or whatever. Only remember being so bummed that Okafor didn't stick it out and call the bluff of UConn's coach, Jim Calhoun - who pressured Okafor by saying "you better take it by __, or it we're giving it to somebody else." Okafor was so SUPREMELY TALENTED that I guarantee you Calhoun would have kept it open for Okafor for as long as he needed. And lastly, Okafor was a Stanford kid through and through, or at least that was my impression at the time. Yep. Still stings a bit after all these years.

Emeka Okafor: the ultimate "one that got away."

RE: WBB: Looking ahead to 22-23 - spike5882 - 04-07-2022

(04-06-2022, 01:47 PM)M T Wrote:
(04-06-2022, 08:28 AM)spike5882 Wrote: One thing that will come into play are scholarships. Louisville seems pretty full. I don’t know their exact count, but scholarship availability is going to dictate how some transfers do go.
Why is that a limitation? A school just tells a player, "Sorry, we got a player we needed more than you. She got your scholarship."

I think it is terrible, but I'm sure it happens at some schools.

I would also think some schools will stick with their players and will expect them to stick with the school. They will have a rule that if you announce you want to transfer, then your scholarship for the next year is gone and will be given to someone other than you even if you find no one else wants you that much. As a result, some players are likely to wind up without a school (or at least a scholarship).

For instance, if one of our beloved Stanford players started shopping around for another school, I would want Tara to have to hold open that scholarship for the player just in case. I'd think Stanford should say "Ok, we'll use your scholarship for someone else. If you want to play next year here, you'll have to do it without a scholarship. Good luck & close the door on your way out."

Schools have to honor a 4 year scholarship, no? Or did that change?

RE: WBB: Looking ahead to 22-23 - PVTree - 04-07-2022

I was under the impression that ALL scholarships are for one year, and the schools are under no obligation to renew the scholarship (although most are for the remaining 3 years).

RE: WBB: Looking ahead to 22-23 - 81alum - 04-07-2022

(04-07-2022, 10:48 AM)spike5882 Wrote: Schools have to honor a 4 year scholarship, no? Or did that change?

Since 2016 the Pac 12 has guaranteed 4 year scholarships:
https://www.espn.com/college-sports/story/_/id/11775571/pac-12-passes-athlete-reforms-including-guaranteed-4-year-scholarships

Quote:Starting in 2016-17, if an athlete leaves an institution in good standing and has completed at least 50 percent of their degree, they can "return and receive necessary educational expenses for the remaining terms of the agreement."

There also seems to be a "right of return" "vests" after two years, so-to-speak.