recruiting seniors - Printable Version
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RE: recruiting seniors - BostonCard - 12-09-2019
(12-07-2019, 04:16 PM)SamuelMcF Wrote: Not taking one in '18 hurts. You can kind of argue that whole class will affect us for multiple years too:
- No TE
- Only 1 OL who has been hurt his entire career here
- Only 1 RB (despite Heimuli-Lund's departure and Wedington moving to WR) who probably won't contribute...especially if we land EJ Smith
- Only 3 DBs (despite being very thin there and only taking 2 in the previous class), 2 of whom probably won't contribute due to frequent injury (Bonner) or being passed up by true frosh walk-ons on STs (Logan)
- Only 1 DL (assuming Fox stays at OLB), who didn't RS so only has 2 eligible years left. Only taking 1 again in '19 will prove to be the real killer here. Needed more in at least one of those two classes, if not both.
- A QB who we offered too early (at age 15!!!) who didn't develop much in HS...we saw what happened when he played. Rumor has it he's the reason we're waiting so long to offer QBs now, including '21 (but there is a short list and I think/hope an offer is coming soon after HS playoffs finish).
- A scholarship FB not even in the same universe as previous wrecking balls Daniel Marx and Ryan Hewitt. It's one thing to get a scholarship FB who's clearly a beast, but it's another to...uh...not. Two years in a row. I think staff has learned.
Having a couple holes/whiffs in a large class is expected and not usually a big deal. But when it's over half the class of just 14 guys and you don't have the depth to support it? Massive yikes.
Yup, the class of 2108 is going to hurt us for another couple years. This is a class that would make up our juniors next year, and thus should be close to peak contribution. Here are the starters or significant contributors from that class:
Semi Fehoko (but he was originally in the 2016 class)
Michael Wilson
Thomas Booker
Kendell Williamson (more out of necessity than anything else)
Andres Fox
Ricky Miezan and/or JMF (if healthy, contribution TBD)
And that's it. Good the class of 2017 was pretty good (though small and a bit disappointing compared to its ranking) and that 2019 has so far contributed more than expected, and 2020 looks to be decent. But still, the combination of small classes in 2017 and 2018 and major holes in 2018 don't augur well for next year, when those classes will be juniors and seniors.
I'm a bit more bullish after that
BC
RE: recruiting seniors - CardinalSagehen - 12-09-2019
Looks like Curtis Robinson is sticking around for year 5. Given his position change and his status as a starter, this seems like a good call.
[twitter]https://twitter.com/_curtisrobinson/status/1203825158001053697[/twitter]
RE: recruiting seniors - SamuelMcF - 12-09-2019
(12-09-2019, 09:56 AM)BostonCard Wrote: Yup, the class of 2108 is going to hurt us for another couple years. This is a class that would make up our juniors next year, and thus should be close to peak contribution. Here are the starters or significant contributors from that class:
Semi Fehoko (but he was originally in the 2016 class)
Michael Wilson
Thomas Booker
Kendell Williamson (more out of necessity than anything else)
Andres Fox
Ricky Miezan and/or JMF (if healthy, contribution TBD)
And that's it. Good the class of 2017 was pretty good (though small and a bit disappointing compared to its ranking) and that 2019 has so far contributed more than expected, and 2020 looks to be decent. But still, the combination of small classes in 2017 and 2018 and major holes in 2018 don't augur well for next year, when those classes will be juniors and seniors.
I'm a bit more bullish after that
BC
I think Umerah will become a significant contributor, and Bonner has a chance if he ever stays healthy.
RE: recruiting seniors - Phogge - 12-09-2019
Agree totally on Umerah. Hope the coaches are correct on Bonner. If he is as good as they think he will start right away.
RE: recruiting seniors - BostonCard - 12-09-2019
(12-09-2019, 12:06 PM)SamuelMcF Wrote: I think Umerah will become a significant contributor, and Bonner has a chance if he ever stays healthy.
Thanks, good point on Umerah, though I may have read too much into Andres Fox' move to OLB. Then again, linebackers in the 2019 and 2020 classes are sparse.
I had mentally placed Bonner in the Stratford category, but hope I'm wrong
BC
RE: recruiting seniors - SamuelMcF - 12-09-2019
(12-09-2019, 12:48 PM)BostonCard Wrote:(12-09-2019, 12:06 PM)SamuelMcF Wrote: I think Umerah will become a significant contributor, and Bonner has a chance if he ever stays healthy.
Thanks, good point on Umerah, though I may have read too much into Andres Fox' move to OLB. Then again, linebackers in the 2019 and 2020 classes are sparse.
I had mentally placed Bonner in the Stratford category, but hope I'm wrong
BC
Umerah had a series against UW that showed how downright terrifying he can become. Wish he hadn't gotten hurt.
I hope you're wrong about Bonner too, lol :) He has at least practiced a bunch, played STs (and a little corner I think? Maybe?) in the last 4 games of last season to preserve his shirt, and supposedly had a solid fall camp that excited the coaches before whatever injury happened. Stratford has never even practiced.
RE: recruiting seniors - Treebound - 12-09-2019
(12-09-2019, 09:36 AM)Goose Wrote:(12-07-2019, 04:45 PM)Mick Wrote:(12-06-2019, 10:46 PM)Goose Wrote: At the risk of some thread drift, I have a few questions. Does anybody recall a football player that was enrolled in the GSB while playing football? Ditto for the Law School and Med School? I don't remember any, but I must admit I haven't looked for this previously. I would assume it has happened at some point, but I don't recall it.
LB Kurt Colehower received his BA in Communications and his Master's in Sociology from Stanford, and he may have begun it as a fifth year senior during his last year of football.
After giving people time to respond, it appears that nobody has gone to Law School, Med School, or the GSB as a "5th year" student while also playing football at Stanford, at least that anybody here is aware. Bill McColl did attend medical school, but he was playing professionally at the time. It would seem that what Dylan Powell is doing has never happened at Stanford.
The four year eligibility for football came into effect in the 1972-73 season. Before that, you only had three years of eligibility and had to play "freshman football". From that time forward, it would at least theoretically possible to red-shirt and also play four years of football. I would like to expand my original question a bit. It appears that at least Kurt Colehower got a masters while playing football. I am pretty sure there are others. I would appreciate others chiming in with names or guys who got an advanced degree while playing football and receiving a football scholarship.
What I am trying to determine here is how viable an option is it to actually do this at Stanford. I know this "poll" approach is a bit unscientific, but I have no other way to determine how common this may be. If it is quite uncommon, that would just add another reason to look elsewhere during a 5th year. I am sure plenty of guys need the 5th year just to manage the extra load of football coupled with academics. I am also sure some guys just want an "easy" last year for whatever reason. However, I would imagine that most guys who are 1) qualified to graduate, 2) not trying to improve their NFL draft position, and 3) intend to receive a football scholarship and play during their 5th year want to actually accomplish a tangible goal, like get an MA/MS. If that is so hard to do that few attempt it, that will also cause people to look elsewhere.
Goose,
A few thoughts for you:
1) Patrick Skov: made the graduate transfer to Georgia Tech, I believe, and played his final year of eligibility there and also attended GT's business school. I think he is off in Europe working in the Financial/investment sector now.
2) Kevin Scott '87/'87 (RB not DB), completed his Electrical Engineering Masters as a 5th year, before playing in the NFL. Not Med, Law or Business, but very challenging none the less. I'm sure there are others that have taken a similar approach.
I think it is extremely unlikely for a 5th year football player to gain admission to the GSB. 1) it's rare for a person to be admitted to the GSB right out of undergrad, unless you had some stellar entrepreneurial experience. 2) Given the rigors of football, I think it's even more unlikely that a football player could study, practice, play and have a start-up business on the side that would enable them to gain admission to a top tier business school, 3) Undergrads with little or no business experience would add very little to the business class discussions and culture, so most business schools like at least 2-3 years of post undergrad work experience. 4) Starting the Stanford GSB, Med or Law school, while playing football in the fall would be incredibly challenging to try and balance the workloads. Not saying it can't be done, but that's a ton of work on multiple fronts.
RE: recruiting seniors - SamuelMcF - 12-09-2019
Scooter Harrington is in the portal. Probably quells any hope that Fisk would move to DE.
RE: recruiting seniors - BostonCard - 12-09-2019
(12-09-2019, 03:05 PM)SamuelMcF Wrote: Scooter Harrington is in the portal. Probably quells any hope that Fisk would move to DE.
The wishful thinking/glass half-full interpretation is that this is done with knowledge of Parkinson’s impending decision about the NFL. The realistic interpretation is that the two are unlinked, because the timeline for entering the portal is long before the timeline for going pro, and I doubt Parkinson is going to make any sort of decision before he gets an evaluation and feedback.
BC
RE: recruiting seniors - CowboyIndian - 12-09-2019
(12-09-2019, 09:56 AM)BostonCard Wrote: Semi Fehoko (but he was originally in the 2016 class)
He kept on truckin, though.
RE: recruiting seniors - BostonCard - 12-09-2019
(12-09-2019, 11:39 PM)CowboyIndian Wrote:(12-09-2019, 09:56 AM)BostonCard Wrote: Semi Fehoko (but he was originally in the 2016 class)
He kept on truckin, though.
Just wait until the full Fehoko comes.
BC
RE: recruiting seniors - ColoradoTree - 12-10-2019
(12-06-2019, 10:46 PM)Goose Wrote: At the risk of some thread drift, I have a few questions. Does anybody recall a football player that was enrolled in the GSB while playing football? Ditto for the Law School and Med School? I don't remember any, but I must admit I haven't looked for this previously. I would assume it has happened at some point, but I don't recall it.
Bill McColl was offered up as an answer, but from my admittedly quick look into it, it looks like he went to med school at the University of Chicago. Does anyone know if he started at med school while still at Stanford? Goose, I suspect you're right. The great Alan Page did something similar (law school at the University of Minnesota while playing for the Vikings), but I understood the question to be specific to Stanford's business, law, and medical schools. And as you note, it seems highly likely that it's happened due to how absurdly competitive those programs are.
Others have noted anecdotes of other master's degrees, of course, and at least when I was there ('99-'03), it was very common for athletes playing a fifth year to do a co-term and leave after five years with a BA/MA--but again, not in business, medicine, or law.
A debt-free MBA for Powell? Well played, sir.
RE: recruiting seniors - BobK - 12-10-2019
Bill McColl started at the U of Chicago then Northwestern to fit in with Bears practice.
I sat listening to Bill describe his med school and football at a tailgate a couple of years ago.
RE: recruiting seniors - 82lsju - 12-10-2019
(12-10-2019, 11:57 AM)BobK Wrote: Bill McColl started at the U of Chicago then Northwestern to fit in with Bears practice.
I sat listening to Bill describe his med school and football at a tailgate a couple of years ago.
and Milt McColl went to Stanford med while playing for the 49ers
Quote:After being ignored in the 1981 draft, McColl didn’t think he’d get to play in the NFL. So he applied to Stanford Medical School. He landed a tryout with the 49ers, and in the same week in training camp, he found out that he was accepted and, to his surprise, had made the team, too.
https://www.sfchronicle.com/49ers/article/Milt-McColl-helped-49ers-win-a-Super-Bowl-At-59-14072074.php
RE: recruiting seniors - SamuelMcF - 12-10-2019
Back to the topic. Keeping in mind those in the portal COULD elect to return, here is where we are in terms of attrition for the scholarship seniors with eligibility (redshirt juniors):
Introduced on senior day:
Swann (portal)
Williams (portal)
Harrington (portal)
Stewart
Richardson
Pryts
Costello
Hamilton
Maddox
Hattis
Schaffer
NOT introduced on senior day:
Antoine (returning)
Robinson (returning)
Powell (Indiana)
Eboh (portal)
Peek (portal)
Butler
Speights
J. Fox
Toner
Parson?
RE: recruiting seniors - BostonCard - 12-10-2019
Thanks Sam. Far be it for me to propose splitting a topic, but I wonder if it would make sense to have the list be the first post in a new thread, that can be updated as new information arrives.
Also, you drew a distinction between the guys we would like back (for example, our Williams and Swann) who nonetheless entered the portal, and those who are unlikely to be contributors and thus not too much of a loss if they transfer (Peek, for example).
BC
RE: recruiting seniors - slide - 12-10-2019
(12-10-2019, 12:35 PM)SamuelMcF Wrote: Back to the topic. Keeping in mind those in the portal COULD elect to return, here is where we are in terms of attrition for the scholarship seniors with eligibility (redshirt juniors):
Introduced on senior day:
Swann (portal)
Williams (portal)
Harrington (portal)
Stewart
Richardson
Pryts
Costello
Hamilton
Maddox
Hattis
Schaffer
NOT introduced on senior day:
Antoine (returning)
Robinson (returning)
Powell (Indiana)
Eboh (portal)
Peek (portal)
Butler
Speights
J. Fox
Toner
Parson?
and we need what roughly 17 to 20 for the incoming scholarship class?
5 open scholarships
5 graduated
5 portal
1 portal to Indiana
1 expected medical retirement (not listed above)
right?
RE: recruiting seniors - 82lsju - 12-10-2019
(12-10-2019, 02:55 PM)slide Wrote: and we need what roughly 17 to 20 for the incoming scholarship class?
5 open scholarships
5 graduated
5 portal
1 portal to Indiana
1 expected medical retirement (not listed above)
right?
Question, do walk-ons who have been given a scholarship have it guaranteed through their senior year after getting the scholarship?
RE: recruiting seniors - SamuelMcF - 12-10-2019
I took BC's suggestion and started a new thread tracking our 5th year decisions: https://thecardboard.org/board/showthread.php?tid=18712
(12-10-2019, 02:55 PM)slide Wrote: and we need what roughly 17 to 20 for the incoming scholarship class?
5 open scholarships
5 graduated
5 portal
1 portal to Indiana
1 expected medical retirement (not listed above)
right?
Should be right around 20, I think. Good question from 82lsju, to which I don't know the answer.
RE: recruiting seniors - BostonCard - 12-10-2019
76 scholarships held by players with eligibility remaining.
One transferring out (Powell)
Five more portal entries (Swann, Williams, Peek, Enoch, Harrington)
One possible medical retirement (Stratford)
Three academic juniors with NFL potential (Little, Parkinson, Adebo)
If all the above go, we would need no more attrition, plus we haven’t accounted for Costello.
BC