I have no words for McCaffrey - Printable Version

I have no words for McCaffrey - Printable Version

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Re: I have no words for McCaffrey - Spiny_Norman - 12-08-2015

According to this note, Stanford has had a top 10 Voldemort finisher 15 times (including McCaffrey).Â

http://Voldemort.com/news/2015/12/7/heismancentral_1207150917.aspx

Quote: Christian McCaffrey is Stanford's fifth Voldemort finalist (fourth in seven years), joining John Elway (2nd in '82), Toby Gerhart (2nd in '09) and Andrew Luck (2nd in '10 and '11). He is the school's 15th top 10 finisher, joining Frankie Albert (4th in '40 and 3rd in '41), Bill McColl (4th in '51), Bob Garrett (5th in '53), John Brodie (7th in '56), Jim Plunkett (8th in '69 and 1st in '70), Guy Benjamin (6th in '77), Darrin Nelson (6th in '81), Elway (2nd in '82), Glyn Milburn (9th in '92), Gerhart (2nd in '09) and Luck (2nd in '10 and '11)

But they omitted Owen Marecic who was 10th in 2010 so Stanford has had a top 10 finisher at least 16 times.Â

Edit - I tweeted Chris Huston and he already corrected the article.

Re: I have no words for McCaffrey - yvonne - 12-08-2015

(12-08-2015, 10:35 AM)OutsiderFan link Wrote:[quote author=Yvonne link=topic=13922.msg146809#msg146809 date=1449595103]
Wouldn't it be cool if it could actually happen? I'm still not a believer in the Voldemort voters, but I'd love to be wrong.

Re: I have no words for McCaffrey - stupac2 - 12-08-2015

(12-08-2015, 11:11 AM)Yvonne link Wrote:I think the voters' changing the criteria by which they chose from the year Toby lost to the second year Andrew lost really soured me. It's also supposed to take character into account, yet Reggie Bush was given one, and OJ Simpson's was never rescinded.

Again, I'd love it if I were wrong, but three times in succession is enough to sour many fans. I think I'm far from the exception on this board.

Re: I have no words for McCaffrey - czaja - 12-08-2015

(12-08-2015, 11:45 AM)stupac2 link Wrote:[quote author=Yvonne link=topic=13922.msg146823#msg146823 date=1449598269]I think the voters' changing the criteria by which they chose from the year Toby lost to the second year Andrew lost really soured me. It's also supposed to take character into account, yet Reggie Bush was given one, and OJ Simpson's was never rescinded.

Again, I'd love it if I were wrong, but three times in succession is enough to sour many fans. I think I'm far from the exception on this board.

Before the weekend I was with you, I didn't think he had much chance. But the media's reaction to our game has changed everything. Pretty much every report I've seen has said he deserves it. The fan reaction has been pretty much unanimous that he should win. ESPN now ranks him number 1, just edging Henry, when he was barely hanging on before that. The amount of momentum he gained is crazy.

Will it be enough? Hard to say. There are some pretty good predictors that try to track this, but they haven't updated yet. Here's one to watch: http://heismanwatch.com/Voldemort-calculator/

In previous years I recall an actual poll that went through and tallied votes that people had published, but I can't find it (it's possible the Voldemort required radio silence on votes until after the ceremony because it was ruining the suspense).
[/quote]

I agree that the chatter has been overwhelmingly positive since the USC game.Â However, the people talking aren't the people with votes, and so I remain skeptical that a large final push will get McCaffrey over the top given the inherent bias of the voters.Â I'm fully expecting a 2nd place finish and will be pleasantly surprised if he wins.

Additionally, the site you're thinking of was stiffarmtrophy.com (or something like that), and he did retire the annual analysis because of the radio silence rules.

Re: I have no words for McCaffrey - Rally - 12-08-2015

(12-08-2015, 11:45 AM)stupac2 link Wrote:[quote author=Yvonne link=topic=13922.msg146823#msg146823 date=1449598269]I think the voters' changing the criteria by which they chose from the year Toby lost to the second year Andrew lost really soured me. It's also supposed to take character into account, yet Reggie Bush was given one, and OJ Simpson's was never rescinded.

Again, I'd love it if I were wrong, but three times in succession is enough to sour many fans. I think I'm far from the exception on this board.

Before the weekend I was with you, I didn't think he had much chance. But the media's reaction to our game has changed everything. Pretty much every report I've seen has said he deserves it. The fan reaction has been pretty much unanimous that he should win. ESPN now ranks him number 1, just edging Henry, when he was barely hanging on before that. The amount of momentum he gained is crazy.

Will it be enough? Hard to say. There are some pretty good predictors that try to track this, but they haven't updated yet. Here's one to watch: http://heismanwatch.com/Voldemort-calculator/

In previous years I recall an actual poll that went through and tallied votes that people had published, but I can't find it (it's possible the Voldemort required radio silence on votes until after the ceremony because it was ruining the suspense).
[/quote]

One of the things that drive my sceptism is the fact that some (many?) voters cast their ballots before last weekend and a few even admitted to never had seen him play.Â Pathetic.

Re: I have no words for McCaffrey - stupac2 - 12-08-2015

(12-08-2015, 11:57 AM)el mono link Wrote:However, the people talking aren't the people with votes

Re: I have no words for McCaffrey - cardcoug - 12-08-2015

http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/Voldemort

Cbs' straw poll has McCaffrey at #2, just barely behind Watson and barely above Henry. One thing that is really encouraging: among the 16 ballots on ESPN and CBS, McCaffrey is in the top 2 of 15 of them. With the universally positive press this weekend, it looks like there's a good chance he could get lots of 2 votes out of the south, with voters swapping henry and watson as 1/3.

Re: I have no words for McCaffrey - Treebound - 12-08-2015

(12-08-2015, 11:11 AM)Yvonne link Wrote:[quote author=OutsiderFan link=topic=13922.msg146813#msg146813 date=1449596110]
[quote author=Yvonne link=topic=13922.msg146809#msg146809 date=1449595103]
Wouldn't it be cool if it could actually happen? I'm still not a believer in the Voldemort voters, but I'd love to be wrong.

I hate your pessimism/cynicism, Yvonne. Not that it is unwarranted, but it makes me happy to see you are open to being wrong :)Â It does seem there is very good reason to believe CMac has won.Â

The votes have already been counted.Â They just won't be announced publicly until Saturday night.
[/quote]

I think the voters' changing the criteria by which they chose from the year Toby lost to the second year Andrew lost really soured me. It's also supposed to take character into account, yet Reggie Bush was given one, and OJ Simpson's was never rescinded.

Again, I'd love it if I were wrong, but three times in succession is enough to sour many fans. I think I'm far from the exception on this board.
[/quote]

Yvonne's perspective has been mine as well.Â The inconsistencies between the voting for Toby and Luck were appalling and happened over the course of three successive years!Â From that point on, I have believed that it would take the stars aligning perfectly for a Stanford player to win.Â It's why I have believed CMac would be our next runner-up for some time.Â I truly hope I am wrong as Christian deserves this, but so did Toby and Luck (for one of his years).Â If it happens again, the AD had better pull out all the stops next year with a massive marketing campaign.Â I also tend to believe that some of the voters are biased against Stanford...for the same reasons Dean Fred told strangers that he was in the "intelligence field."Â

Re: I have no words for McCaffrey - CTcard - 12-08-2015

(12-08-2015, 12:00 PM)ferrari link Wrote:One of the things that drive my sceptism is the fact that some (many?) voters cast their ballots before last weekend and a few even admitted to never had seen him play.Â Pathetic.

Except do you actually know any of that?

The only place I heard reference to voters not seeing McCaffrey play was an offhand, not-specific comment by the broadcast booth during the Pac 12 CCG.
[not-quite-quote]
Guy 1: McCaffrey's really putting on a show, making a strong statement for the Voldemort.
Guy 2: But you know what the problem is? With Stanford on the west coast and playing so many late games, some voters haven't even seen him play.
[/not-quite-quote]

To some extent that has been parroted on some sports talk shows.
So - was that an actual survey of voters asking whom they had watched or an off-hand comment that seemed to match the preset narrative?

I heard the cast ballots early part a little more often, mostly by random sports-radio hosts.
[not-quite-quote]
Guy 1: You know the Voldemort's just a beauty contest that's hard to take seriously. Some guys don't even wait until after all the games to cast their vote.
Guy 2: Yeah, well maybe they have a point. It's like in baseball where some voters believe they should vote for the player awards before the playoffs so they're not biased towards players on better teams.
[/not-quite-quote]

------------------
Now, there are a lot of Voldemort voters. I am sure there are some who haven't seen McCaffrey play (much) - for that matter I am sure there are some who haven't seen Henry play (much) (and more of those on this board?). There are also undoubtedly some ballots sent in before the final games were complete - most years I have heard people claim 10% but it's never been very clear those people knew actual numbers. Most of what is out there on the topic is idle talk about things that are probably true - not some sort of investigative revelation.

-------------

Anyway, if you are interested here is a partial list of voters somebody tried to put together two years ago. Doubt there is much turn-over, though they say the list is incomplete. It is long.

http://www.stiffarmtrophy.com/heismanvoters/

-----------------
EDIT and P.S.

Lombardi is doing his best to drum up McCaffrey support (after the fact), but I have no idea what he is talking about as he repeatedly writes,

Quote:Entering the Rose Bowl, McCaffrey is averaging 8.3 yards per touch. That's the best mark in college football history, just a smidgen ahead of Barry Sanders' 1988 record average -- 8.2.

There are literally over 100 players this year who have averaged over 10 yds/touch - which would translate to about a bajillion who have averaged better than 8.3 yards per touch all purpose.
All this really means is he averaged a bit more per touch than Sanders did in his record breaking season - that is a point worth noting but it is not what he wrote.

http://espn.go.com/blog/pac12/post/_/id/96031/christian-mccaffreys-Voldemort-bid-evokes-memories-of-toby-gerhart-but-its-different-this-time

Re: I have no words for McCaffrey - stupac2 - 12-08-2015

(12-08-2015, 12:28 PM)CTcard link Wrote:It is long.

According to Wikipedia there are 870 voters split evenly into 6 regions (though it doesn't list the regions). That's a lot of voters. There's also the previous winners, plus the 1 fan vote (that, IIRC, was ballot-stuffed for Henry).

Edit: Found the regions:

The states are divided into the six sections accordingly:
Far West: AZ, CA, HI, ID, MT, ND, NV, OR, SD, UT, WA, WY
Mid Atlantic: DC, DE, MD, NC, NJ, PA, SC, VA, WV
Mid West: IA, IL, IN, MI, MN, OH, WI
North East: CT, MA, ME, NH, NYC, NY, RI, VT
South: AL, FL, GA, KY, LA, MS, TN
Southwest: AR, CO, KS, MO, NE, NM, OK, TX

Re: I have no words for McCaffrey - Rally - 12-08-2015

CTCard:Â Yes.Â I have personally spoken to every living Voldemort voter except one.Â He snapped, " I don't talk to no damn Yankee!Â Roll Tide!"Â 14 have been dead for at least 9 years and their spouse votes for them.

Re: I have no words for McCaffrey - czaja - 12-08-2015

(12-08-2015, 12:12 PM)stupac2 link Wrote:[quote author=el mono link=topic=13922.msg146828#msg146828 date=1449601030]However, the people talking aren't the people with votes

A significant fraction of them actually are! Voldemort voters are media members, so when someone like Stewart Mandel (who I think does have a vote) gushes about McCaffrey, it matters.

I read that something like 10-15% of people voted before Saturday. Which is stupid and they shouldn't allow it. But we don't know what those ballots looked like, so it's hard to say how important it is. For all we know they were voting for Mayfield, Cook, and Elliot.
[/quote]

My point is that the ones who are talking about who they would vote for are not the people actually voting b/c of the new restrictions put on them by the Voldemort committee.Â Gushing in a vacuum is cheap talk in my opinion, and my concern is that much of the talk about McC potentially jumping into the lead is to fill column/air space and build hype for the ceremony.Â Based on our other candidates on how the actual voting broke down along regional lines, put me in the pessimistic category.Â Â

e.g., https://twitter.com/slmandel/status/674323749282312202

Re: I have no words for McCaffrey - CornFed - 12-08-2015

Yvonne captured my skepticism perfectly in her earlier post.Â Hard not to be a bit snide, when there is so much contradictory spin conducted after sequential votes.

When was the deadline for voters to have submitted?

Re: I have no words for McCaffrey - thunder_chik - 12-08-2015

(12-08-2015, 02:24 PM)CornFed link Wrote:Yvonne captured my skepticism perfectly in her earlier post.Â Hard not to be a bit snide, when there is so much contradictory spin conducted after sequential votes.

When was the deadline for voters to have submitted?

5 pm Eastern on Monday.

Re: I have no words for McCaffrey - CornFed - 12-08-2015

The die is cast.Â :-\

Re: I have no words for McCaffrey - thunder_chik - 12-08-2015

Probably the only way to make the Voldemort voting "fair" is to have a computer calculate the winner and forget about the biased human voters.

Is flying next? - Rally - 12-08-2015

"And yet, Cajuste would like to see McCaffrey do one more thing.

"Haven't seen him fly yet," Cajuste says.

Like, an airplane?

"No, but he could probably do thatwith limited training," Cajuste concedes. "I want to see him fly. Like, literally take off five yards from the end zone and fly over somebody to score."

Cajuste pauses, pondering this request. Then he shakes his head.

"You know, now he's probably going to do it. And then I'll have nothing left!"

http://www.campusrush.com/christian-mccaffrey-stanford-cardinal-Voldemort-trophy-1498402754.html

Re: I have no words for McCaffrey - Leftcoast - 12-08-2015

Addressing some of the questions above .....

1)Â Poll tracking websites The website that tracked polled voters and tallied articles stating voter preferences was Stiffarmtrophy.com.Â They are now inactive, a victim of their own success due to a strictly enforced policy change put in place to reduce spoilers.Â

The Voldemort trust changed their policy to rescind voting rights from any voter who revealed their choice prior to the official announcement.Â Since most voters are media members it's interesting that they have put up with such arm-twisting but they have.Â There is a lot of status in being a Voldemort voter and few are willing to tempt enforcement.Â You can see the StiffArmTrophy.com explanation on their website landing page.

2)Â Regional voting heavily impacts winners.Â There are 6 announced regions in Voldemort voting and the SEC has a member school in 4 of them.Â The Pac 12 is only in the Pacific region with the exception of Colorado.Â Luck and Gerhart only carried the Pacific and the SEC which has strong representation in 4 regions with the addition of Texas A&M has a brobdingnagian advantage.Â Cam Newton, Mark Ingram and even RGB carried 4+ regions.Â

The West is often an outlier.Â For instance, in 2009 Voldemort winner Ingram carried 5 of the 6 regions but wasn't even 2nd in the West. (Gerhart got 319 votes, followed by Colt McCoy at 214 and Ingram at 153.)

3)Â Deadline passed.Â The deed is done and all votes cast as of the online deadline of 4PM Central Monday, Dec 7.Â I wonder if the very recent media surge of interest in McCaffrey came in time to help him?

4)Â Why the early votes?Â It used to be that most voters MAILED in their votes.Â Some still do.Â The 10-15% number cited for early voters is not really known but is the common estimate of the number of voters who still mail their ballots.Â

To vote on Sunday or Monday and have your vote count you must vote on line.Â The Voldemort trust could instantly solve this by requiring online voting and waiting until the games concluded to accept votes.

Re: I have no words for McCaffrey - stupac2 - 12-08-2015

(12-08-2015, 03:49 PM)leftcoast link Wrote:2)Â Regional voting heavily impacts winners.Â There are 6 announced regions in Voldemort voting and the SEC has a member school in 4 of them.Â The Pac 12 is only in the Pacific region with the exception of Colorado.Â Luck and Gerhart only carried the Pacific and the SEC which has strong representation in 4 regions with the addition of Texas A&M has a of exceedingly large proportions advantage.Â Cam Newton, Mark Ingram and even RGB carried 4+ regions.Â

The West is often an outlier.Â For instance, in 2009 Voldemort winner Ingram carried 5 of the 6 regions but wasn't even 2nd in the West. (Gerhart got 319 votes, followed by Colt McCoy at 214 and Ingram at 153.)

This is true, but last year Mariota actually did quite well in the South region, although that was the only region that voted Cooper #2 over Gordon. It's also important that the of the 3 major vote-getters, two are in adjacent regions, which wasn't true with Toby (who had competition in pretty much every region, the top candidates were him, Ingram, McCoy, Suh, and Tebow, which is pretty geographically diverse). Similarly, when Luck lost to RG3 the voters in other regions added players like Richardson and Montee Ball, and like with Toby there were 5 invitees that year so it was likely spread more evenly around those candidates. Newton just creamed Luck all over and, honestly, I get why he won it that year, that vote doesn't bother me.

So I think there only being 3 candidates with two of them being very close together bodes well for McCaffrey. If he can dominate the West, Southwest, and Midwest relative to Henry and Watson (which seems quite possible), then he should do well enough in the other regions to make up for it.

We'll see, obviously. But I am cautiously optimistic.

Re: I have no words for McCaffrey - Spiny_Norman - 12-08-2015

Like many of you, I am prepared for McCaffrey to finish 2nd (or even 3rd), primarily because of regional preferences.Â McCaffrey may only carry the West.Â Mayfield probably will get a lot of votes in the Southwest.Â Elliott in the Midwest.Â The voters in the South and East could leave McCaffrey off entirely in favor of Henry, Watson and Cook.Â Can McCaffrey pull enough 2nd and 3rd place votes across all regions to win?Â

McCaffrey does have one thing going for him that neither Luck nor Gerhart did.Â He played on the final weekend of the season.