OT Giants staff next year - Printable Version

OT Giants staff next year - Printable Version

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OT Giants staff next year - Phogge - 09-29-2020

Since Perry and Marichal aren't available and thinking that Glausman and Smily join Cueto where are the other starters coming from? Webb? probably but still a work in progress. Corry and Jelly need a year in AA or AAA. I have little faith in Tyler A but he is signed through. Any ideas?

Bullpen needs to be restructured. I hope they bring Watson and the two Latin lefties back. Perhaps Selman can start. Still need a closer in free agency.

RE: OT Giants staff next year - Mick - 09-29-2020

(09-29-2020, 12:06 PM)Phogge Wrote: Since Perry and Marichal aren't available and thinking that Glausman and Smily join Cueto where are the other starters coming from? Webb? probably but still a work in progress. Corry and Jelly need a year in AA or AAA. I have little faith in Tyler A but he is signed through. Any ideas?

Bullpen needs to be restructured. I hope they bring Watson and the two Latin lefties back. Perhaps Selman can start. Still need a closer in free agency.

Blach and Beede were supposed to be pretty good. Last year, Beede had a 2.34 ERA in AAA with the balls made by Titleist.

Suarez and Rodriguez couldn't handle it after a fast start.

I actually like both Baragar and Menez, both of whom started in the minors and did well for the Giants. Baragar had 21 starts for Richmond and the 4th lowest WHIP in the league.

There's nothing at the AA level.

Maybe Matt Frisbee, played for San Jose. 20 starts, 3.17 ERA, 131 K's and 22 BB's in 116 innings, 1.066 WHIP

lex24 - lex24 - 09-29-2020

Rogers, Baragar, J. Garcia are keepers. Rogers can be a valuable guy as a 6th or 7th inning guy. Plus he’s durable. Shaun Anderson took a step back. I think that whole thing with Trout hurt him a bit But I like his stuff out of the bullpen so to me he’s a keeper. Giants supposedly high on Rico Garcia. Didn’t show much.

I like Watson. Pretty sure he signs elsewhere, though. He should be able to get a pretty decent salary from a contender. Left-handers that are equally proficient getting out right handers don't grow on trees

Menez and Selmen are both guys who have started in the minor leagues. I think the former may be more suited to start than the laotter, so Selmen another guy think you keep for the pen.

And I don’t give up on an arm like Coonrad’s. Although he may be damaged goods as far as the Giants are concerned.

Phogge I agree it’s important to have somebody slotted for the ninth. But there is no way they’re going to go out spend a lot of money for a closer. Nor should they. First they break down way too often, second there’s not that many of them out there and third you can develop one from within.

Reyes Moranta will be back. Maybe he helps.

As for starters that could be a black hole. Cueto will be back. But I’m not sure if they’re gonna be able to sign either Gausman or Smily. Webb Is it working progress but I think will definitely be in the rotation next year. My guess is Farhan looks for a couple of low end rotation starters starters in the free-agent market – assuming there are any out there. Tyler Andersen showed flashes. But inconsistent. And Mick’s right there’s not a whole lot of immediate help in the minor leagues when it comes to starting pitching. Beede, who knows. I’m kind of to the point with him where anything he shows is a plus. And frankly I think he may be more suited for the bullpen.

RE: OT Giants staff next year - old spanish trail - 09-29-2020

Beede made a big leap forward last year before injury. He'll get a chance. Gausman and Smiley will benefit from the year like Pomerantz and accept a higher offer than the Giants put forth. Farhan will find a couple more reclamation projects, stick with them so long as they are good and G's are in the race, and trade them for prospects if not. I think they are looking to 2022 as the comeback year.

I agree Watson will sign for more elsewhere. Baragar was terrific and they'll take a look at him as starter. The other lefties remain in the pen. They might be able to get something for Coonrod.

RE: lex24 - Giants - 09-29-2020

(09-29-2020, 10:14 PM)lex24 Wrote: Rogers, Baragar, J. Garcia are keepers. Rogers can be a valuable guy as a 6th or 7th inning guy. Plus he’s durable. Shaun Anderson took a step back. I think that whole thing with Trout hurt him a bit But I like his stuff out of the bullpen so to me he’s a keeper. Giants supposedly high on Rico Garcia. Didn’t show much.

I like Watson. Pretty sure he signs elsewhere, though. He should be able to get a pretty decent salary from a contender. Left-handers that are equally proficient getting out right handers don't grow on trees

Menez and Selmen are both guys who have started in the minor leagues. I think the former may be more suited to start than the laotter, so Selmen another guy think you keep for the pen.

And I don’t give up on an arm like Coonrad’s. Although he may be damaged goods as far as the Giants are concerned.

Phogge I agree it’s important to have somebody slotted for the ninth. But there is no way they’re going to go out spend a lot of money for a closer. Nor should they. First they break down way too often, second there’s not that many of them out there and third you can develop one from within.

Reyes Moranta will be back. Maybe he helps.

As for starters that could be a black hole. Cueto will be back. But I’m not sure if they’re gonna be able to sign either Gausman or Smily. Webb Is it working progress but I think will definitely be in the rotation next year. My guess is forehead looks for a couple of low end rotation starters starters in the free-agent market – assuming there are any out there. Tyler Andersen showed flashes. But inconsistent. And Mick’s right there’s not a whole lot of immediate help in the minor leagues when it comes to starting pitching. Beede, who knows. I’m kind of to the point with him where anything he shows is a plus. And frankly I think he may be more suited for the bullpen.

I hope that Moronta will be the closer. He pitched well last year prior to his injury.

RE: OT Giants staff next year - BobK - 09-30-2020

Shark and his $20M or so are gone so if Farham can’t sign both Gausman and Smyly who they paid a total of $13M this season then that’s the definition of surrender monkey

lex24 - lex24 - 09-30-2020

(09-30-2020, 06:57 AM)BobK Wrote: Shark and his $20M or so are gone so if Farham can’t sign both Gausman and Smyly who they paid a total of $13M this season then that’s the definition of surrender monkey

I don’t think it’s a money issue as much as an issue of where they want to play. And number of years. Both are going to shoot for multi year contracts. Gausman will get one. 3 years maybe. Not so sure about Smily with injury history.

I’ll guess Gausman 3 years 40 Million. Smily 2 years 20 Million.

RE: OT Giants staff next year - BobK - 09-30-2020

Well that’s a money issue Lex.

RE: OT Giants staff next year - Mick - 09-30-2020

How much money do the Giants have to play with? In part, it depends upon whether Buster returns or not. It is highly unlikely that a commercial vaccine is available next spring. I suspect MLB will still give players the option to sit out the season, eliminating another year from their contract. Buster's contract has a $22,177,777 price tag. He's still listed as "reserve/exempt" on Spotrac, for 2021.

When 2020 began, the Giants were $54 million below the Competitive Balance Tax (CBT). The Giants had $41 mms. in contracts expire at the end of the 2020 season, including Samardzija ($18m), Gausman ($9m), Smyly ($4m), Watson ($3m), Pence ($3m), Sandoval ($2m) and Cahill ($2m).

Six players are eligible for arbitration; Dickerson, Solano, Anderson, Gott, J. Garcia, Moronta. Solano will get a big bump. The rest, small bumps. And Anderson may be non-tendered.

All that means the Giants will have roughly $80 million to spend. They'll be able to afford some pitching, particularly given that other teams may be reluctant to spend.

Separately, Buster's contract is up after the 2021 season. So is Belt, Crawford, Cueto and Flores, though the club will probably exercise the $3.5 million option in Flores' case and they'll pay the $3m and $5m buyouts to Posey and Cueto respectively. Only Longoria is signed through 2022. So the 2022 season is (mainly) a blank slate, salary-wise.
https://www.spotrac.com/mlb/san-francisco-giants/payroll/2022/

For 2021, Posey, Cueto, Belt, Longoria, Crawford and Flores are signed. No others.
https://www.spotrac.com/mlb/san-francisco-giants/payroll/2021/

RE: OT Giants staff next year - Giants - 09-30-2020

(09-30-2020, 01:23 PM)Mick Wrote: How much money do the Giants have to play with? In part, it depends upon whether Buster returns or not. It is highly unlikely that a commercial vaccine is available next spring. I suspect MLB will still give players the option to sit out the season, eliminating another year from their contract. Buster's contract has a $22,177,777 price tag. He's still listed as "reserve/exempt" on Spotrac, for 2021.

When 2020 began, the Giants were $54 million below the Competitive Balance Tax (CBT). The Giants had $41 mms. in contracts expire at the end of the 2020 season, including Samardzija ($18m), Gausman ($9m), Smyly ($4m), Watson ($3m), Pence ($3m), Sandoval ($2m) and Cahill ($2m).

Six players are eligible for arbitration; Dickerson, Solano, Anderson, Gott, J. Garcia, Moronta. Solano will get a big bump. The rest, small bumps. And Anderson may be non-tendered.

All that means the Giants will have roughly $80 million to spend. They'll be able to afford some pitching, particularly given that other teams may be reluctant to spend.

Separately, Buster's contract is up after the 2021 season. So is Belt, Crawford, Cueto and Flores, though the club will probably exercise the $3.5 million option in Flores' case. Only Longoria is signed through 2022. So the 2022 season is (mainly) a blank slate, salary-wise.

https://www.spotrac.com/mlb/san-francisco-giants/payroll/2022/

For 2021, Posey, Cueto, Belt, Longoria, Crawford and Flores are signed. No others.

https://www.spotrac.com/mlb/san-francisco-giants/payroll/2021/

The Giants NEED Buster. He is a key element in the plans for next year. Take a look at Evan Longorio’s take on the matter.
https://www.sfchronicle.com/giants/article/Giants-Longoria-Bart-felt-isolated-in-15601883.php

RE: OT Giants staff next year - Mick - 09-30-2020

(09-30-2020, 01:42 PM)Giants Wrote: The Giants NEED Buster. He is a key element in the plans for next year. Take a look at Evan Longorio’s take on the matter.
https://www.sfchronicle.com/giants/article/Giants-Longoria-Bart-felt-isolated-in-15601883.php

You know what? He's not wrong. I remember when Bengie Molina took Buster under his wing. Buster really accelerated once he had that support. it's really a shame that Buster couldn't/wouldn't/didn't support Joey Bart in that same way.

RE: OT Giants staff next year - BobK - 09-30-2020

Also today the Giants announced they will look for an exerienced catcher to back up Posey. Bart to AAA.

RE: OT Giants staff next year - Phogge - 09-30-2020

Mick, the kids who will be on the AA level next year are the best in the system. Not so much for those who will pitch in Sacto.

I like Baragar too. Needs some refinement. Not crazy about Menez.

lex24 - lex24 - 09-30-2020

(09-30-2020, 02:33 PM)Mick Wrote:
(09-30-2020, 01:42 PM)Giants Wrote: The Giants NEED Buster. He is a key element in the plans for next year. Take a look at Evan Longorio’s take on the matter.
https://www.sfchronicle.com/giants/article/Giants-Longoria-Bart-felt-isolated-in-15601883.php

You know what? He's not wrong. I remember when Bengie Molina took Buster under his wing. Buster really accelerated once he had that support. it's really a shame that Buster couldn't/wouldn't/didn't support Joey Bart in that same way.

What are you talking about. He and his wife adopted two babies that were prematurely born. He chose his family. How terrible. I guarantee you that Buster when he comes back will mentor Bart and/or Bailey.

RE: lex24 - teejers1 - 09-30-2020

(09-30-2020, 06:49 PM)lex24 Wrote:
(09-30-2020, 02:33 PM)Mick Wrote:
(09-30-2020, 01:42 PM)Giants Wrote: The Giants NEED Buster. He is a key element in the plans for next year. Take a look at Evan Longorio’s take on the matter.
https://www.sfchronicle.com/giants/article/Giants-Longoria-Bart-felt-isolated-in-15601883.php

You know what? He's not wrong. I remember when Bengie Molina took Buster under his wing. Buster really accelerated once he had that support. it's really a shame that Buster couldn't/wouldn't/didn't support Joey Bart in that same way.

What are you talking about. He and his wife adopted two babies that were prematurely born. He chose his family. How terrible. I guarantee you that Buster when he comes back will mentor Bart and/or Bailey.

A lot of chatter for an over-the-hill, slappy-hitting catcher. [And do the Giants really want two DP machines in the lineup in Flores and Posey?]
Never the same since the collision at home plate. Understandable. Still a shame, though.

What's Vogt doing?

lex24 - lex24 - 09-30-2020

(09-30-2020, 09:43 PM)teejers1 Wrote:
(09-30-2020, 06:49 PM)lex24 Wrote:
(09-30-2020, 02:33 PM)Mick Wrote:
(09-30-2020, 01:42 PM)Giants Wrote: The Giants NEED Buster. He is a key element in the plans for next year. Take a look at Evan Longorio’s take on the matter.
https://www.sfchronicle.com/giants/article/Giants-Longoria-Bart-felt-isolated-in-15601883.php

You know what? He's not wrong. I remember when Bengie Molina took Buster under his wing. Buster really accelerated once he had that support. it's really a shame that Buster couldn't/wouldn't/didn't support Joey Bart in that same way.

What are you talking about. He and his wife adopted two babies that were prematurely born. He chose his family. How terrible. I guarantee you that Buster when he comes back will mentor Bart and/or Bailey.

A lot of chatter for an over-the-hill, slappy-hitting catcher. [And do the Giants really want two DP machines in the lineup in Flores and Posey?]
Never the same since the collision at home plate. Understandable. Still a shame, though.

What's Vogt doing?

He was MVP and league batting champ in ‘12. After the collision. Look at his lifetime numbers. You are dead wrong. Again.

(09-30-2020, 10:56 PM)lex24 Wrote:
(09-30-2020, 09:43 PM)teejers1 Wrote:
(09-30-2020, 06:49 PM)lex24 Wrote:
(09-30-2020, 02:33 PM)Mick Wrote:
(09-30-2020, 01:42 PM)Giants Wrote: The Giants NEED Buster. He is a key element in the plans for next year. Take a look at Evan Longorio’s take on the matter.
https://www.sfchronicle.com/giants/article/Giants-Longoria-Bart-felt-isolated-in-15601883.php

You know what? He's not wrong. I remember when Bengie Molina took Buster under his wing. Buster really accelerated once he had that support. it's really a shame that Buster couldn't/wouldn't/didn't support Joey Bart in that same way.

What are you talking about. He and his wife adopted two babies that were prematurely born. He chose his family. How terrible. I guarantee you that Buster when he comes back will mentor Bart and/or Bailey.

A lot of chatter for an over-the-hill, slappy-hitting catcher. [And do the Giants really want two DP machines in the lineup in Flores and Posey?]
Never the same since the collision at home plate. Understandable. Still a shame, though.

What's Vogt doing?

He was MVP and league batting champ in ‘12. After the collision. Look at his lifetime numbers. Hell as late as ‘17 he hit .320.

Specifics. Post ‘11
12. 336/408/549/957
13 294/371/450/821
14 311/364/490/854
15 318/379/470/849
16 288/362/434/796
17 320/400/462/861
18 284/359/352/741
19 257/320/358/688

He had surgery for hip impingement in Aug 18. Had you watched that year and paid attention you’d have noticed around May that he couldn’t turn on the ball. All hands. Should have been shut down way earlier. Might have come back stronger in ‘19. Hes the face of three world championships. Just a slapsy hitting guy since that injury in ‘11. Vogt is in Arizona. Hit .167 with 1 HR this year.

RE: lex24 - Giants - 09-30-2020

(09-30-2020, 06:49 PM)lex24 Wrote:
(09-30-2020, 02:33 PM)Mick Wrote:
(09-30-2020, 01:42 PM)Giants Wrote: The Giants NEED Buster. He is a key element in the plans for next year. Take a look at Evan Longorio’s take on the matter.
https://www.sfchronicle.com/giants/article/Giants-Longoria-Bart-felt-isolated-in-15601883.php

You know what? He's not wrong. I remember when Bengie Molina took Buster under his wing. Buster really accelerated once he had that support. it's really a shame that Buster couldn't/wouldn't/didn't support Joey Bart in that same way.

What are you talking about. He and his wife adopted two babies that were prematurely born. He chose his family. How terrible. I guarantee you that Buster when he comes back will mentor Bart and/or Bailey.

Posey and Bart communicated regularly. That wasn’t the issue. The problem was there is a brobdingnagian difference between phone conversations and in-person tutoring. Posey is a leader. He clearly understands his role in that capacity. Anyone who thinks that he wouldn’t support Bart is dead wrong.

RE: lex24 - teejers1 - 10-01-2020

(09-30-2020, 10:56 PM)lex24 Wrote: He was MVP and league batting champ in ‘12. After the collision. Look at his lifetime numbers. Hell as late as ‘17 he hit .320.

Specifics. Post ‘11
12. 336/408/549/957
13 294/371/450/821
14 311/364/490/854
15 318/379/470/849
16 288/362/434/796
17 320/400/462/861
18 284/359/352/741
19 257/320/358/688

He had surgery for hip impingement in Aug 18. Had you watched that year and paid attention you’d have noticed around May that he couldn’t turn on the ball. All hands. Should have been shut down way earlier. Might have come back stronger in ‘19. Hes the face of three world championships. Just a slapsy hitting guy since that injury in ‘11. Vogt is in Arizona. Hit .167 with 1 HR this year.

Vogt, Buster, Bart, and a host of others are pretty interchangeable (as is true for the majority of major leaguers). None brings anything indispensable or uniquely important.

And to Giants, as for Buster being a leader . . . maybe. I don't know. Leaders typically don't "sit it out," but maybe you can find some examples to the contrary. More generally, you sound awfully certain of something that I think only Buster (or perhaps his family members) would know for sure. BTW, do you think Aaron Rodgers is a leader? Brett Favre? Joe Montana? [I don't think any of those guys were too interested in grooming their replacements, and that's asking a lot. But who knows, maybe baseball is just different . . . ].

P.S. If Buster does come back, maybe he will hit a bit better than his last 1.5 seasons. The field changes have seemed to help other older players on the Giants, so there's some hope . . .

lex24 - lex24 - 10-01-2020

(10-01-2020, 12:15 AM)teejers1 Wrote:
(09-30-2020, 10:56 PM)lex24 Wrote: He was MVP and league batting champ in ‘12. After the collision. Look at his lifetime numbers. Hell as late as ‘17 he hit .320.

Specifics. Post ‘11
12. 336/408/549/957
13 294/371/450/821
14 311/364/490/854
15 318/379/470/849
16 288/362/434/796
17 320/400/462/861
18 284/359/352/741
19 257/320/358/688

He had surgery for hip impingement in Aug 18. Had you watched that year and paid attention you’d have noticed around May that he couldn’t turn on the ball. All hands. Should have been shut down way earlier. Might have come back stronger in ‘19. Hes the face of three world championships. Just a slapsy hitting guy since that injury in ‘11. Vogt is in Arizona. Hit .167 with 1 HR this year.

Vogt, Buster, Bart, and a host of others are pretty interchangeable (as is true for the majority of major leaguers). None brings anything indispensable or uniquely important.

And to Giants, as for Buster being a leader . . . maybe. I don't know. Leaders typically don't "sit it out," but maybe you can find some examples to the contrary. More generally, you sound awfully certain of something that I think only Buster (or perhaps his family members) would know for sure. BTW, do you think Aaron Rodgers is a leader? Brett Favre? Joe Montana? [I don't think any of those guys were too interested in grooming their replacements, and that's asking a lot. But who knows, maybe baseball is just different . . . ].

P.S. If Buster does come back, maybe he will hit a bit better than his last 1.5 seasons. The field changes have seemed to help other older players on the Giants, so there's some hope . . .

Buster made it clear why he opted out. The premature twins they adopted were born just when the “second spring training” started. This is a rather unique situation, don’t you think? It’s not like he “sat it out” over a contract. As for who I believe he will be a strong mentor - I base it on what I’ve read and what Giants people say about his makeup and character.

RE: lex24 - teejers1 - 10-01-2020

(10-01-2020, 07:18 AM)lex24 Wrote:
(10-01-2020, 12:15 AM)teejers1 Wrote:
(09-30-2020, 10:56 PM)lex24 Wrote: He was MVP and league batting champ in ‘12. After the collision. Look at his lifetime numbers. Hell as late as ‘17 he hit .320.

Specifics. Post ‘11
12. 336/408/549/957
13 294/371/450/821
14 311/364/490/854
15 318/379/470/849
16 288/362/434/796
17 320/400/462/861
18 284/359/352/741
19 257/320/358/688

He had surgery for hip impingement in Aug 18. Had you watched that year and paid attention you’d have noticed around May that he couldn’t turn on the ball. All hands. Should have been shut down way earlier. Might have come back stronger in ‘19. Hes the face of three world championships. Just a slapsy hitting guy since that injury in ‘11. Vogt is in Arizona. Hit .167 with 1 HR this year.

Vogt, Buster, Bart, and a host of others are pretty interchangeable (as is true for the majority of major leaguers). None brings anything indispensable or uniquely important.

And to Giants, as for Buster being a leader . . . maybe. I don't know. Leaders typically don't "sit it out," but maybe you can find some examples to the contrary. More generally, you sound awfully certain of something that I think only Buster (or perhaps his family members) would know for sure. BTW, do you think Aaron Rodgers is a leader? Brett Favre? Joe Montana? [I don't think any of those guys were too interested in grooming their replacements, and that's asking a lot. But who knows, maybe baseball is just different . . . ].

P.S. If Buster does come back, maybe he will hit a bit better than his last 1.5 seasons. The field changes have seemed to help other older players on the Giants, so there's some hope . . .

Buster made it clear why he opted out. The premature twins they adopted were born just when the “second spring training” started. This is a rather unique situation, don’t you think? It’s not like he “sat it out” over a contract. As for who I believe he will be a strong mentor - I base it on what I’ve read and what Giants people say about his makeup and character.

Lex, I apologize. I throw stuff out there about Buster because I know it will get a rise out of you.
So let me be entirely serious for this post about Buster:

1. He was, certainly at his peak, a great Giant, and a key piece of the WS championships.
2. I think Buster has lost bat speed and power, perhaps attributable to the injury you cite (I don't know).
3. Do I think Buster would have helped put the Giants "over the top" and into the playoffs this year? No way to know for certain, but I lean yes (if only to help avoid some pitching meltdowns - Joey messing up signs couldn't possibly have helped things).
4. Am I bent that Buster decided to opt out this season? No. Completely his decision, for whatever reason.
5. Was the reasoning for his decision admirable? Yes. But I also think that Buster had the luxury (which he earned) of being able to afford such a decision. And that's not insignificant. If Joey Bart or any number of other Giants trying to establish themselves in the Bigs made a similar decision, well, that would be particularly impressive. [BTW, this is why I really admire the football players who opted out this season for family/health-related reasons. Those guys are giving up 1/4 of their career earnings (on average), and they don't make as much as NBAers or MLBers. [Otoh, if a third-year NFL pro and starter on a low-round rookie contract sits it out, then there might be other reasons for sitting it out . . . which I'd also understand/support, even if less "admirable."].
6. Do I think Buster is a "leader" and will mentor Bart? I have no idea.