WBB PAC 12 championship? - Printable Version
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WBB PAC 12 championship? - Mudhead - 01-27-2021
Anyone know how we figure out who is champion? Are all W -L records equal? Arizona has announced that games with UCLA and USC are permanently cancelled. That raises the question: is a record which has, say, only one game with say Stanford, UCLA , Oregon and Washington State given the same weight as a record which includes two games with each? It’s also fair to ask whether a record with all road games is better than a similar record with 50/50 home vs road.
I have no solution; just curious if anyone has thought through this.
RE: WBB PAC 12 championship? - Papa John - 01-27-2021
"Seeding: The seedings and pairings shall be determined upon completion of regular season play. The won-lost percentage record of the teams in regular season Conference play will determine tournament seedings. The team with the best won-lost percentage in Conference play will be seeded #1, the next best won-lost percentage in Conference play will be seeded #2, and so forth through all the seeds."
https://pac-12.com/womens-basketball-standings
There's (much) more for seeding via tiebreakers.
RE: WBB PAC 12 championship? - BobK - 01-27-2021
So Arizona plays one more game and wins others play and lose one then Arizona is the top seed
Doubt that in the Covid year :)
Mudhead - Mudhead - 01-27-2021
(01-27-2021, 10:00 AM)Papa John Wrote: "Seeding: The seedings and pairings shall be determined upon completion of regular season play. The won-lost percentage record of the teams in regular season Conference play will determine tournament seedings. The team with the best won-lost percentage in Conference play will be seeded #1, the next best won-lost percentage in Conference play will be seeded #2, and so forth through all the seeds."
https://pac-12.com/womens-basketball-standings
There's (much) more for seeding via tiebreakers.
Thanks. That says no adjustment .. which is t surprising . If Stanford stays on schedule, they will have two against Oregon, Arizona , UCLA and Washington State. I haven’t looked to see how UCLA, Arizona and Oregon will come out. I have no reason To believe that anyone would try and game the system but If all schedules are the same, the convenience of a Covid scratch could be tempting
RE: WBB PAC 12 championship? - Papa John - 01-27-2021
Personally I'd rather see seeding based on wins minus losses. With the rules posted on the Pac-12 site, reductio ad absurdum would yield that a 1-0 record would be seeded #1 over a 17-1 record.
If Stanford football had played and defeated WSU, we would have finished with a 4-2 record and a win over UW. But UW at 3-1 would have been North champs because they had a better winning percentage and fewer losses. With wins minus losses, Stanford and UW would have tied at +2 and Stanford would have won the head-to-head tiebreaker.
RE: WBB PAC 12 championship? - M T - 01-27-2021
Papa John, I agree with you.
But I pray that never again will this kind of seeding be a concern.
RE: WBB PAC 12 championship? - Papa John - 01-28-2021
(01-27-2021, 10:09 PM)M T Wrote: Papa John, I agree with you.
But I pray that never again will this kind of seeding be a concern.
Amen!
RE: WBB PAC 12 championship? - petersalas - 01-28-2021
Here’s the link to Michelle Smith’s article that addresses how conference champ determination:
https://pac-12.com/article/2021/01/13/michelle-smith-pac-12-womens-basketball-mailbag
RE: WBB PAC 12 championship? - Mudhead - 01-28-2021
Here’s what’s bugging me. Let’s look at the top four teams in tha PAC 12: Stanford, Arizona, UCLA and Oregon.
Stanford and Oregon will play 8 games against the top five teams in the conference. Arizona and UCLA will play only seven. Thus far, Stanford is 4-1 in five games against the top five, Arizona is 2-2 , UCLA is 3-2 and Oregon is 2-3. Stanford has 3 more games as do Oregon and Arizona. UCLA has 2.
Further, UCLA has been playing one game a week . Stanford, on the other hand, is playing four games in a Sunday to Sunday week. At least new of those is a make up game scheduled for Stanford that Stanford agreed to play in Pullman.
I know this is because of Santa Clara County’s inquest world perspective and I know we managed to Colorado, a non top five team. Yes we could have made most of this academic by beating Colorado.
But shouldn’t there be some recognition of schedule differences? UCLA has only to play 2. Maybe I’m guilty of whining and if it doesn’t affect NCAA seeding, i don’t care. But it bugs me.
RE: WBB PAC 12 championship? - chrisk - 01-28-2021
(01-28-2021, 05:50 PM)Mudhead Wrote: Here’s what’s bugging me. Let’s look at the top four teams in tha PAC 12: Stanford, Arizona, UCLA and Oregon.
Stanford and Oregon will play 8 games against the top five teams in the conference. Arizona and UCLA will play only seven. Thus far, Stanford is 4-1 in five games against the top five, Arizona is 2-2 , UCLA is 3-2 and Oregon is 2-3. Stanford has 3 more games as do Oregon and Arizona. UCLA has 2.
Further, UCLA has been playing one game a week . Stanford, on the other hand, is playing four games in a Sunday to Sunday week. At least new of those is a make up game scheduled for Stanford that Stanford agreed to play in Pullman.
I know this is because of Santa Clara County’s inquest world perspective and I know we managed to Colorado, a non top five team. Yes we could have made most of this academic by beating Colorado.
But shouldn’t there be some recognition of schedule differences? UCLA has only to play 2. Maybe I’m guilty of whining and if it doesn’t affect NCAA seeding, i don’t care. But it bugs me.
Has it been determined that the postponed games have been cancelled? Shouldn’t the games between top teams be rescheduled?
RE: WBB PAC 12 championship? - qwerty49 - 01-28-2021
Postponing or cancelling games is a nice option to have. Imagine what things would be like if it was either play or forfeit. Probably a lot of last-minute "chicken" to see who blinks first.
Mudhead - Mudhead - 01-29-2021
(01-28-2021, 07:21 PM)chrisk Wrote:(01-28-2021, 05:50 PM)Mudhead Wrote: Here’s what’s bugging me. Let’s look at the top four teams in tha PAC 12: Stanford, Arizona, UCLA and Oregon.
Stanford and Oregon will play 8 games against the top five teams in the conference. Arizona and UCLA will play only seven. Thus far, Stanford is 4-1 in five games against the top five, Arizona is 2-2 , UCLA is 3-2 and Oregon is 2-3. Stanford has 3 more games as do Oregon and Arizona. UCLA has 2.
Further, UCLA has been playing one game a week . Stanford, on the other hand, is playing four games in a Sunday to Sunday week. At least new of those is a make up game scheduled for Stanford that Stanford agreed to play in Pullman.
I know this is because of Santa Clara County’s inquest world perspective and I know we managed to Colorado, a non top five team. Yes we could have made most of this academic by beating Colorado.
But shouldn’t there be some recognition of schedule differences? UCLA has only to play 2. Maybe I’m guilty of whining and if it doesn’t affect NCAA seeding, i don’t care. But it bugs me.
Has it been determined that the postponed games have been cancelled? Shouldn’t the games between top teams be rescheduled?
Good question. I don’t think you have to make them up. That is it’s not a forfeit if you don’t. Stanford could have insisted that WSU travel to them to make up the game they postponed due to Covid. I don’t know if UCLA and Arizona will make up their game.. or what happens if only one team wants to.
By and large, my impression is that coaches have worked well to try and play the games. Tara has set the example . I just don’t know what will happen when push comes to shove.
RE: WBB PAC 12 championship? - CompSci87 - 01-29-2021
The last I heard, Stanford/WSU was the only "postponed" game that had actually been scheduled to be made up.
All teams have only one game scheduled in the 02/28/21-03/04/21 slot, against their travel partner, so it was contemplated that a makeup game could be added for each team then. As it turned out, though, of course, many teams postponed more than one game. So I imagine many of the postponed games won't be made up.
RE: WBB PAC 12 championship? - petersalas - 01-29-2021
It was also mentioned that the site was booked longer in Las Vegas for conference tournament to possibly allow for make up games there as well.
(01-29-2021, 11:32 AM)CompSci87 Wrote: The last I heard, Stanford/WSU was the only "postponed" game that had actually been scheduled to be made up.
All teams have only one game scheduled in the 02/28/21-03/04/21 slot, against their travel partner, so it was contemplated that a makeup game could be added for each team then. As it turned out, though, of course, many teams postponed more than one game. So I imagine many of the postponed games won't be made up.