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WBB: Pac 12 Preview: Colorado - BobK - 09-20-2022

PAC 12 Preview: Colorado

Last Season: Colorado went 22-9 overall, and 9 - 7 in the conference.
The Coaches: Head Coach JR Payne will be in her 7th year at Colorado after two seasons at Santa Clara. Payne led Santa Clara to its first winning season in 8 seasons and finished 23-9. JR, no periods, and real name Ali-Marie, is a graduate of St Mary’s where she played for now Oregon coach Kelly Graves. Her first coaching job was at age 23 for Graves when he started at Gonzaga.
Toriano Towns is the Associate Head Coach and is also in his 7th and also coached with Payne at Santa Clara. Towns coached at Gonzaga with Payne and later at Arizona where he was the Post coach for the great, late Polk.
Alex Earl is in her 7th year on the staff. Alex was an assistant with Payne three seasons ago at Santa Clara and played for years at ASU graduating in 2013. Alex was a HS teammate of JJ Hones on a team where all five starters player Division 1 basketball.
Tim Hayes is in his 1st season at Colorado. He was the Head Coach at Southeastern University where his record was 176-13.

Losses:
Shandrika Lee assistant coach who left after 6 seasons at Colorado to go into private business.
Mya Hollingshed who averaged 14 points and rebounds and was drafted by the WNBA.
Sirena (Peanut) Tuitele who averaged 7 points and 4 rebounds. Peanut transferred to Cal.
Maura Singer who played only 7 games. She may have retired.
Lesila Finau who averaged 4 points and 3 rebounds. She transferred to Cal Baptist.
Kylee Blacksten who averaged 2 points. She transferred to West Virginia.
Kennedy Taylor who played just 8 games. She transferred to Missouri State.


Additions:
Aaronette Vonleh, 6-3 Soph Post Center transfer from Arizona. Vonleh averaged 6 points and 2 rebounds at Arizona.
Jada Wynn, 6-0 Frosh Guard from SoCal daughter of the former Washington coaches, unranked
Lizzie Holder, 6-1 Frosh Forward from MN Unranked
Ali Fitzgerald, 6-2 Forward from Missouri, unranked
Brianna McLeod, 6-3 Frosh Forward from Canada

The Schedule:
The Buffs will play in the preseason NIT vs Texas Tech and Louisiana

The Team:
Jaylyn Sherrod, 5-7 Sr Point Guard who averaged 8 points and 4 assists.
Tameiya Sadler is a 5-8 Jr Guard Washington. Sadler averaged 15 ppg.
Quay Miller is a 6-3 Sr Post. Miller averaged 11 points and 5 rebounds.
Frieda Formann, 5-11 Jr Guard from Denmark. Formann averaged 7 points per game.
Charlotte Whittaker is a 6-4 Redshirt Sr Post from Australia who averaged 5 points and 2 rebounds two years ago but missed last season with an injury.
Tayanna Jones is a 6-1 5th year Guard who averaged 3 points and 2 rebounds.
Kindyll Wetta is a 5-9 Soph Guard who averaged 4ppg. Her Mom played Basketball at Colorado.
Sophie Gerber, 6-0 Redshirt Soph Guard who played just 7 games.


Predictions:
Hollingshed is a big loss but 4 solid players return. Miller, Sadler, Sherrod are solid Pac 12 players who won last season. Formann is a good three point shooter and both Wynn and Vonleh played very well on their trip to Spain recently. Are they top six? Close at least.

2023 Recruiting:
Ruthie Loomis-Golti, 6-3 Post from NE, ranked # 74
Kennedy Sanders, 5-8 PG from MN, ranked # 70
Saulele Tanuvasa, 5-11 Guard from NorCal, not ranked

RE: WBB: Pac 12 Preview: Colorado - 81alum - 09-20-2022

Colorado, with Payne's aggressive defensive style of coaching, will be a challenging team.  Surly not as talented as we are, but Payne always seems to figure out how to equalize for talent by using her defensive aggression and chipping away on offense.  Sherrod has sometimes given us trouble, and is the kind of player we will have trouble matching up with if we use a "big" lineup.

Why did Peanut transfer? Was it an academic move for an MA or a basketball move?

RE: WBB: Pac 12 Preview: Colorado - M T - 09-20-2022

BobK, I appreciate your scouting the other teams.  It helps to put a face to the team so they aren't an unknown when I first see them.

However, why is it that mainstream sources, and then the rest that echo their analysis style, think it is meaningful to give stats per game from last year, without also saying playing time?   An average of 5 points per game can be pretty impressive if a player only played 5 minutes a game, but not so impressive if they averaged 38 minutes a game.   Actually, I'd rather know how long the coach played them rather than how many points they scored.  If a player got the 8th or 10th or 13th most playing time seems more telling about their basketball skills, especially since offense is only half of the game.

I've always thought it was ludicrous when analysts claim to show a player has gotten better from year to year by showing their points per game year over year.   Usually it is more a product of playing time and role in the offense.

RE: WBB: Pac 12 Preview: Colorado - BobK - 09-20-2022

Peanut is in grad school at cal. Plus she’s from Chico
Sat near her Dad at Vegas great family

RE: WBB: Pac 12 Preview: Colorado - 81alum - 09-20-2022

(09-20-2022, 11:08 AM)BobK Wrote:  Peanut is in grad school at cal.  Plus she’s from Chico   
Sat near her Dad at Vegas great family
Very cool.  This is the kind of transfer I endorse--when there is an academic benefit to it.  Good luck to her.
(09-20-2022, 10:06 AM)M T Wrote:  BobK, I appreciate your scouting the other teams.  It helps to put a face to the team so they aren't an unknown when I first see them.

However, why is it that mainstream sources, and then the rest that echo their analysis style, think it is meaningful to give stats per game from last year, without also saying playing time?   An average of 5 points per game can be pretty impressive if a player only played 5 minutes a game, but not so impressive if they averaged 38 minutes a game.   Actually, I'd rather know how long the coach played them rather than how many points they scored.  If a player got the 8th or 10th or 13th most playing time seems more telling about their basketball skills, especially since offense is only half of the game.

I've always thought it was ludicrous when analysts claim to show a player has gotten better from year to year by showing their points per game year over year.   Usually it is more a product of playing time and role in the offense.
Yes, MT, I hear you and I mostly agree.  However, the one thing points-per-game does tell you is a combination/overall rating of how valuable the coach thought the player was and (a little less) how well the player executed in whatever minutes were available during the previous year. It says nothing about how many points the athlete could have scored if played 40 minutes, but one assumes that the coach had a good reason for playing her only 6 minutes, etc.  So the ppg needs to be largely taken as the coaches evaluation of the player rather than an indication of the player's innate performance.

I guess it comes down to whether you would prefer to know what the coach thought of the player (vis a vis the alternatives) vs. an abstract performance quotient of points-per-40.  To interpret the coach's award of minutes, one would have to know who was playing in front of the player.  Playing behind Kelsey Plum and getting 6 minutes per game is not necessarily a bad thing.  Playing behind a mediocre player means something different.  Points-per-40 seems not to need that kind of information, but of course it does.  What if the six minutes you get in a game are almost always at the end during a blowout win or loss, against 3rd string opposition?  Then what is the significance of points scored?

Sadly, there is just no substitute for watching a player in game situations, and ideally getting as many different kinds of information as possible.  All of the above. When I review an upcoming opponent I pay a lot of attention to mpg as well a ppg.