FB: Another incoming transfer - Printable Version
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FB: Another incoming transfer - SamuelMcF - 05-22-2023
[tweet]https://twitter.com/_SpencerLytle_/status/1660757113776291842[/tweet]
Wisconsin LB (and former Stanford target, IIRC) Spencer Lytle is grad transferring! He has 2 years to play and re-joins the defensive staff he's been playing under for the past few years. 3x Academic All-Big Ten. His career thus far has been hampered by injuries and a position switch (OLB --> ILB, where I hope he stays for us to provide needed depth).
Welcome and congrats Spencer!
RE: FB: Another incoming transfer - qwerty49 - 05-22-2023
Great news! Congrats Spencer and go Stanford!
RE: FB: Another incoming transfer - msqueri - 05-22-2023
Reactions:
* The biggest story is a macro one of the coaches looking at the most beleaguered position rooms on the roster and not being defeatist or resting on their laurels but rather trying to upgrade the roster via the transfer portal. Six transfers in one off-season is, obviously, a sea change for us. It will be interesting to get a few years of data points to see if this is a new feature of recruiting at Stanford rather than a transitional period of leeway for a new coaching staff with a half dozen open scholarships. Judging from Shaw's comments late in his tenure, this is ostensibly a new feature rather than something transitional. I hope so. The other thing to watch for will be if the quality of incoming transfers will improve with what I hope is a rebuild and eventually return to relevance for Stanford football. So far we're getting low Power Five level transfers at best but one can imagine a more successful Stanford program getting notable transfers.
* As is always the case with transfers, our best gauge of their quality is how they've played in college. In Lytle's case it's a very sparing amount he's played. He redshirted his first year, played only 29 snaps the COVID mulligan year (grading abysmally on a very small sample), played 43 snaps in 2021 (grading somewhat poorly on a very small sample), and played only six snaps in 2022 (too small a sample to mean anything). On special teams, he was never a major special teams player for Wisconsin but does have some punt return unit and kick return unit experience as a blocker (grading mediocre in 2021 and excellently in 2022, both on very small samples). Availability has been an issue in college and through four years he's appeared on defense in 12 games and on special teams in 10 games. Whether due to not being good enough compared to peers (likely a big part of it judging by the totality of evidence) or injury (Wisconsin's site notes he missed half the season in 2021 due to injury) or a combination, he has not been a significant player in college.
* The most optimistic read of this would be that April and D'Onofrio know Lytle well and after a spring with our woeful ILB group have enough eyeball evidence to be confident Lytle can help us. After all, Wisconsin is one of the best front sevens in America and Stanford in recent years has been one of the worst, and the ILB room going forward looks super bleak. A tantalizing tidbit for those looking for the rose colored interpretation is that Wisconsin mega star ILB Maema Njongmeta, the shining feather in D'Onofrio's cap, came in the same year as Lytle and Njongmeta himself only played 63 snaps those first three years (to Lytle's 72) before exploding last year. One can always hope for a magical turn of events. A data point that could be reassuring or troubling depending on how you look at it is that Lytle was an OLB the bulk of his time at Wisconsin before switching to ILB the year he only played six snaps. That's reassuring in the sense that it could support a view D'Onofrio in particular thinks this is an upgrade over our room. (And I'm fairly predisposed to believe this as our ILB room is a former walk-on who we know to be a plucky but limited former walk-on, an undersized guy who has been bad or mediocre at best at Stanford, an undersized guy who has been productive at the Group of Five level, a guy who looks the part but sent up major red flags last year by not being able to see the field, and two redshirt freshmen who were major reaches as recruits and never have seemed Power Five level) It's troubling in the sense that this is a profile of somebody with limited utility, and we certainly don't need OLB help of his ilk.
* The most pessimistic read of this is that our coaches have half a dozen unused scholarships and there's no skin off their nose giving a Stanford degree to a guy they know to be a good kid. If Spencer Jorgensen, Benjamin Hudson, and Matt Rose get to be on scholarship this year, why not Spencer Lytle? That the offer evidently came a month before players report suggests to me that the coaches beat the bushes to see what they could rustle up and, upon realizing that they weren't in danger of filling up with better players, threw Lytle the bone. It has the feel of the late cycle Plan Cs/class filler in the 2023 class. [By the way, Lytle talking about ending his athletic career at Stanford is a tell that this isn't a significant football prospect. Hopefully recruits in the Taylor era will have enough talent and confidence to want to play NFL football after Stanford]
* As I alluded to before, right now we're staring down the barrel of an ILB rotation of Jorgensen, Sinclair and Bernadel. My hope is that Bernadel's high level of run defense productivity translates a level up despite his size limitations. Regardless, I think the practical question determining whether Lytle is a helpful transfer or a bone to throw a nice kid is whether he can surpass one of these three. Can he save us from relying on Jorgensen, for instance? Lytle was ILB5 or ILB6 at Wisconsin but it wouldn't be crazy to be ILB3 at Stanford.
* Because of the 2020 COVID year, Lytle would be eligible for a sixth year in 2024. One can easily imagine a scenario in which two of our top three ILBs are gone after this year. In that case a lot rides on the underwhelming group of Dubre, Hudson, and Rose. Pretty easy to see use cases for Lytle being good-enough-to-help-given-woeful-depth. That's probably the bottom line: D'Onofrio has seen enough from his room to think this is worth a scholarship in 2023 and/or 2024.
* That being said, a guy meeting this description cuts against Taylor's own professed philosophy on transfers. He has been explicit we want guys in it for the long haul. Since this is obviously a rebuild and the coaches are leaning into that steady improvement mindset, fifth year transfers are not ideal. I wouldn't be surprised at all if the Wisconsin guys advocated for Lytle and Taylor needed convincing.
* I don't think high school football is relevant for a fifth year player so I'm not going to dig deep in there. But for those wondering, Lytle was a consensus very low 4-star/very high 3-star and a historically notable recruit by Wisconsin's standards, along with Nick Herbig a big part of Bobby April's reputation as a good recruiter. Rivals especially liked him as an edge, viewing him comparably to Ernest Cooper, Teva Tafiti, Wilfredo Aybar, Joey Alfieri, and Blake Lueders. At St. John Bosco as a senior, Lytle was the top tackler and number three sack/tackle for artist guy for his incredible team.
* I know I already took a stab at a bottom line but I'll offer another one for good measure: to me this is of a piece with every other transfer with the exception of Bernadel (who I think is a legitimately proven major college football player), a guy who can credibly help our competition given the low state of the roster at his position.
RE: FB: Another incoming transfer - terry - 05-22-2023
Thanks for the analysis, msqueri.
Our coaches are in an excellent position to evaluate this guy. So I'm optimistic about this.
You wrote, "One can always hope for a magical turn of events."
I saw Stanford beat the dominant Ohio State Buckeyes in the 1971 Rose Bowl.
I saw Stanford win the Big Game on a 50 yard FG on the last play in 1974.
I saw Stanford beat UCLA with a 56-yard FG on the last play in 1979.
I saw Stanford score 9 points in the last 12 seconds to win the Big Game in 1990.
I saw Stanford rebound from a 69-17 opening game loss to go to the Rose Bowl in the 1999 season.
I saw Stanford beat USC on a TD pass on the last play of the game in 2000.
I saw Stanford beat 41-point favorite USC in the Greatest Upset Ever in 2007.
I saw Stanford win a triple overtime game in the Coliseum against USC in 2011.
I saw Stanford drive the length of the field to beat ND on a FG as time expired in 2015.
I saw Stanford go to three Rose Bowls in four years in the 2012, 2013, and 2015 seasons.
I saw Stanford overcame a 17-point deficit with 18 minutes left to beat Oregon in Eugene in 2018.
I believe in "magical turns of events"!
RE: FB: Another incoming transfer - JohnR34231 - 05-23-2023
I think we all realize that given the current state of Stanford football we are not going to get creme de la creme transfers.
So we do as well as we can and hope for the best.
P.S. The 2018 Duck game was even more amazing when you realize that Oregon not only held a 17 point lead in the third quarter, but had the ball first down on our half yard line ready to go ahead by 24.
RE: FB: Another incoming transfer - Griffins78 - 05-23-2023
Thank you, Terry! So well said!
I saw almost all of those magical events too and it has made all the years cheering and rising and falling with the team worth it. Go Stanford!
(05-22-2023, 08:28 PM)terry Wrote: Thanks for the analysis, msqueri.
Our coaches are in an excellent position to evaluate this guy. So I'm going optimistic about this.
You wrote, "One can always hope for a magical turn of events."
I saw Stanford beat the dominant Ohio State Buckeyes in the 1971 Rose Bowl.
I saw Stanford win the Big Game on a 50 yard FG on the last play in 1974.
I saw Stanford beat UCLA with a 56-yard FG on the last play in 1979.
I saw Stanford score 9 points in the last 12 seconds to win the Big Game in 1990.
I saw Stanford rebound from a 69-17 opening game loss to go to the Rose Bowl in the 1999 season.
I saw Stanford beat USC on a TD pass on the last play of the game in 2000.
I saw Stanford beat 41-point favorite USC in the Greatest Upset Ever in 2007.
I saw Stanford win a triple overtime game in the Coliseum against USC in 2011.
I saw Stanford drive the length of the field to beat ND on a FG as time expired in 2015.
I saw Stanford go to three Rose Bowls in four years in the 2012, 2013, and 2015 seasons.
I saw Stanford overcame a 17-point deficit with 18 minutes left to beat Oregon in Eugene in 2018.
I believe in "magical turns of events"!
RE: FB: Another incoming transfer - BobK - 05-23-2023
Great post Terry.
RE: FB: Another incoming transfer - Mick - 05-23-2023
Thanks, Terry. Your post reminded me why I am a Stanford football fan in the first place.
RE: FB: Another incoming transfer - cardcrimson - 05-23-2023
Great post Terry. One of my favorites was freshman year in the Mausoleum, when Stanford stormed back to tie #1 USC, blocking a last second field goal attempt to clinch the win.
RE: FB: Another incoming transfer - CowboyIndian - 05-23-2023
(05-23-2023, 07:52 AM)cardcrimson Wrote: Great post Terry. One of my favorites was freshman year in the Mausoleum, when Stanford stormed back to tie #1 USC, blocking a last second field goal attempt to clinch the win.
Let us not forget Tuan Van Le! Thanks for that, Terry!
RE: FB: Another incoming transfer - Mick - 05-23-2023
(05-23-2023, 08:27 AM)CowboyIndian Wrote:(05-23-2023, 07:52 AM)cardcrimson Wrote: Great post Terry. One of my favorites was freshman year in the Mausoleum, when Stanford stormed back to tie #1 USC, blocking a last second field goal attempt to clinch the win.
Let us not forget Tuan Van Le! Thanks for that, Terry!
My single favorite Big Game play. I was sitting amongst all Cal fans in the 12th row when Le blocked Robbie Keen's 20 yard field goal attempt right in front of me to preserve an 18-18 tie. Keen had converted 21 of 24 FGAs during the season. All the fans around me were smug and confident.
RE: FB: Another incoming transfer - troyc - 05-24-2023
(05-23-2023, 07:52 AM)cardcrimson Wrote: Great post Terry. One of my favorites was freshman year in the Mausoleum, when Stanford stormed back to tie #1 USC, blocking a last second field goal attempt to clinch the win.
Funny you should bring up that game....not too long ago it got posted on YouTube! A fascinating watch. On many different levels.
Troy C
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[url=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nn868GJzSD4]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nn868GJzSD4
RE: FB: Another incoming transfer - Mick - 05-24-2023
Interesting names. Charles White rushing for 50 yards in the first 2 1/2 minutes. Kevin Williams. Joe St. Geme (passed up Harvard) tackling Marcus Allen. Don Mosebar, Keith van Horn leading student body sweeps. A very young John Elway rifling the ball to Andre Tyler, runs to Mike Dotterer, Dan Floyd throwing aside Keith van Horn and sacking Paul MacDonald.
RE: FB: Another incoming transfer - jacket3ree - 05-24-2023
(05-23-2023, 08:27 AM)CowboyIndian Wrote:(05-23-2023, 07:52 AM)cardcrimson Wrote: Great post Terry. One of my favorites was freshman year in the Mausoleum, when Stanford stormed back to tie #1 USC, blocking a last second field goal attempt to clinch the win.
Let us not forget Tuan Van Le! Thanks for that, Terry!
That almost cost my marriage before it began.
Other than that, a terrible, forgettable game. Celebrate a tie? Really? :)
Somewhat surprised Mick finds TVL to be his favorite BG play, over say the ending two years later. Or OT in '98. Or Casey Moore the year after that. Or Luck punishing Cattouse (sp). Or.... But a favorite is a favorite.
I too was amongst Bear Backers that afternoon in '88. On the 50 yard line. And I confess that I celebrated the tie. Really. I even concussed Calfiancé in the process of celebrating. The trudge home alone was worth it and now we have a daughter who has two children of her own and a son's wedding in a month.
I made the same trudge home alone the next BG at Memorial. When Hardy picked the 2-point conversion attempt, my now/then father-in-law actually made a point of laughing in my face, which was very out of character for him. I said only: "12 seconds is a long time."
RE: FB: Another incoming transfer - Mick - 05-25-2023
(05-24-2023, 06:31 PM)jacket3ree Wrote: Somewhat surprised Mick finds TVL to be his favorite BG play, over say the ending two years later. Or OT in '98. Or Casey Moore the year after that. Or Luck punishing Cattouse (sp). Or.... But a favorite is a favorite.
Loved all of those plays. I liked TVL's block because it was at Cal, the kicker was as close to automatic as it gets in college football (and an All-American punter, if memory serves) and I was surrounded by a sea of blue and gold, and it happened right in front of me. And a block of a chip shot field goal is so, so very rare. I just thought it was really cool. And it was in Coach Elway's last year, they had a lot of close losses, beginning with a 4 point loss to #8 USC in their opener. I thought that team should have achieved more.
RE: FB: Another incoming transfer - JohnR34231 - 05-25-2023
(05-25-2023, 08:25 AM)Mick Wrote:(05-24-2023, 06:31 PM)jacket3ree Wrote: Somewhat surprised Mick finds TVL to be his favorite BG play, over say the ending two years later. Or OT in '98. Or Casey Moore the year after that. Or Luck punishing Cattouse (sp). Or.... But a favorite is a favorite.
Loved all of those plays. I liked TVL's block because it was at Cal, the kicker was as close to automatic as it gets in college football (and an All-American punter, if memory serves) and I was surrounded by a sea of blue and gold, and it happened right in front of me. And a block of a chip shot field goal is so, so very rare. I just thought it was really cool. And it was in Coach Elway's last year, they had a lot of close losses, beginning with a 4 point loss to #8 USC in their opener. I thought that team should have achieved more.
You had to go for small victories in the '80's. Other than the one bowl game (which we lost) it was a pretty dismal decade for Stanford football.
RE: FB: Another incoming transfer - 82lsju - 06-23-2023
From gostanford
https://gostanford.com/news/2023/6/23/football-graduate-transfer-inside-linebacker.aspx
(05-22-2023, 03:09 PM)SamuelMcF Wrote: [tweet]https://twitter.com/_SpencerLytle_/status/1660757113776291842[/tweet]
Wisconsin LB (and former Stanford target, IIRC) Spencer Lytle is grad transferring! He has 2 years to play and re-joins the defensive staff he's been playing under for the past few years. 3x Academic All-Big Ten. His career thus far has been hampered by injuries and a position switch (OLB --> ILB, where I hope he stays for us to provide needed depth).
Welcome and congrats Spencer!