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MBB: SC 71 STAN 69 - washingtonismoney - 01-03-2013

In LA. T.rojan fans have been basically willing to fire their coach yesterday, for context. For further context, Kenpom thinks they're ranked #123 in the country. For even further context, we let another lead slip away -- up by nine at half, up by 6 about halfway through the second half.

Guessing we're going to see the first major hire of the Muir administration.

Re: MBB: SC 71 STAN 69 - StannyBoy - 01-03-2013

I didn't see the game but this has got to be one of their worst losses in years. USC lost by 44 to Riverside. I don't see anyone on their roster who could even start at Stanford. Dawkins really needs to get the team together. Not acceptable.

Re: MBB: SC 71 STAN 69 - Farm93 - 01-03-2013

Dawkins getting the team together?  Mmmmmm, I suspect that is not possible at this point.

SC is a very bad team, and probably WAS the worst team in the conference.  Saw just enough of the game on TV to suspect that Stanford is more talented at most positions, but was outcoached by a very bad Pac-12 coach.

Time to go a different direction. 



Re: MBB: SC 71 STAN 69 - OutsiderFan - 01-04-2013

Maybe Dawkins can get Coach K to go on Skype and talk to his team...

Nice missed put back dunk by Powell at the buzzer (that would have sent the game to OT at least) and 60% FT shooting.  :-[

At least Stanford wasn't robbed like Colorado was in Tucson.  Stanford did it to themselves.

Re: MBB: SC 71 STAN 69 - 97fan - 01-04-2013

I went to the game, my first Stanford basketball game in person in many years. In the first half, John Gage and Andy Brown were hot from behind the three-point line, which gave us a halftime lead that didn't seem all that likely to hold up. And sure enough, we blew it. But the way we lost -- with not just one but three missed second-half dunks by Dwight Powell -- was excruciating.

To me, the big story was Chasson Randle's complete disappearance. Randle looks nothing like the player he was touted to be coming out of high school, or the promising young player we saw last season. I don't know if there's a physical problem; he just appears to have lost his confidence. He had a poor first half, and early in the second half, after an ill-advised drive into traffic led to a turnover, Dawkins benched him. Randle sat on the bench from the 17-minute mark of the second half until the waning seconds of the game, when he was inserted to play defense. That set up the final play of the game, when Randle dribbled the length of the court, missed a running 10-footer, and Powell missed a follow dunk as the buzzer sounded. I would have liked to have seen Aaron Bright trying to make a play at the end of the game; he'd made a bunch of excellent plays in the second half to keep us in the game.


Re: MBB: SC 71 STAN 69 - burger - 01-04-2013

(01-04-2013, 07:05 AM)97fan link Wrote:Randle looks nothing like the player he was touted to be coming out of high school, or the promising young player we saw last season.

This is Dawkins' Stanford tenure in a nutshell: players--not just Randle--failing to live up to their potential or not developing like they should.  I was ready to give Dawkins a bye after the NIT, but he's lost my respect after another disappointing start.

Re: MBB: SC 71 STAN 69 - 76lsjumb - 01-04-2013

(01-04-2013, 07:49 AM)burger link Wrote:[quote author=97fan link=topic=7308.msg56460#msg56460 date=1357308334]Randle looks nothing like the player he was touted to be coming out of high school, or the promising young player we saw last season.

This is Dawkins' Stanford tenure in a nutshell: players--not just Randle--failing to live up to their potential or not developing like they should.  I was ready to give Dawkins a bye after the NIT, but he's lost my respect after another disappointing start.
[/quote]

Sad...but true.

Re: MBB: SC 71 STAN 69 - 76lsjumb - 01-04-2013

(01-04-2013, 01:11 AM)garvin link Wrote:I believe Johnny Dawkins has three more years on his contract after this one. I think it will take a total collapse to get him fired, not just sustained mediocrity.

Unfortunately, we look like we're a lot closer to the former than the latter at this point.

Re: MBB: SC 71 STAN 69 - fullmetal - 01-04-2013

(01-04-2013, 10:01 AM)76lsjumb link Wrote:[quote author=garvin link=topic=7308.msg56455#msg56455 date=1357287065]
I believe Johnny Dawkins has three more years on his contract after this one. I think it will take a total collapse to get him fired, not just sustained mediocrity.

Unfortunately, we look like we're a lot closer to the former than the latter at this point.
[/quote]

That was garvin being optimistic.

Re: MBB: SC 71 STAN 69 - washingtonismoney - 01-04-2013

I don't think we'll need to speculate too much -- one thing you notice about failing coaches is that when it goes wrong, it ALL goes wrong (see: T.edford -- I wonder if he'd been able to pull out one more win, whether he'd still be the Head Honcho 59er). So I expect things (unfortunately) to really start going wrong, especially given the strong trend of Dawkins teams to start conference play off better than they finish it.

At any rate, if Dawkins does finish middl(ish)-of-the-road, I wouldn't be shocked if Muir fires him anyway. Dawkins is below recent historical expectations; the new AD wants his own guy, and it seems especially likely Muir knows guys given that Muir's CV is more basketball-weighted. Dawkins may have a longterm contract, but it's all about the buyout. It's hard to imagine we're in a big money crunch, given the success of the football program and the new Pac-12 money. At this point, seemingly only a failure of will projects to stay Muir's hand.

Re: MBB: SC 71 STAN 69 - fullmetal - 01-04-2013

Is Muir a personable man?  I mean, he's got to be to some extent as an AD in order to handle donor relations, but has anyone ever met him?  I was standing stage left of the pep rally after my disastrous FedEx trip where Willie Shaw and Muir were congregating after Shaw's speech (which seemed a little cut off by the emcee).  Thought about introducing myself, but the band was going full-blast, I was paying more attention to them.  I wonder if Muir could coach a basketball team...ADs have been known to get hands-on as of late.

Re: MBB: SC 71 STAN 69 - 97fan - 01-04-2013

(01-04-2013, 10:46 AM)fullmetal link Wrote:Is Muir a personable man?  I mean, he's got to be to some extent as an AD in order to handle donor relations, but has anyone ever met him?

I was talking to someone who's known Muir for about 10 years -- this person is not connected to Stanford, but travels in NCAA circles -- and he could not have been more effusive in his praise. Muir clearly makes a good impression on people. But I'm not sure how relevant that is to the question of how he'll handle the Dawkins situation.

Re: MBB: SC 71 STAN 69 - Spiny_Norman - 01-04-2013

Dawkins' substitution patterns and other in-game decisions baffle me.  They seem to be completely random.  I wonder if we are seeing an effect of Dick Davey's retirement after last year.  For 4 years, Dawkins had an experienced former head coach on the bench with him.  Now Dawkins appears to be a first year head coach who is still figuring out how to manage a game. 

Maybe Coach K will retire and Duke will solve our problem by hiring Dawkins to replace him.  And maybe I will sprout wings and fly.

Re: MBB: SC 71 STAN 69 - fullmetal - 01-04-2013

Duke's not touching Dawkins, not after this kind of performance--their men's basketball program is the only jewel in a small athletics crown.  Auburn made a similar mistake with Gene Chizik, imho, after Chizik's poor showing at Iowa State.  But the NBA shows that the fortunes of basketball coaches rise and fall easily with the winds.

Re: MBB: SC 71 STAN 69 - washingtonismoney - 01-04-2013

(01-04-2013, 11:23 AM)fullmetal link Wrote:Duke's not touching Dawkins, not after this kind of performance--their men's basketball program is the only jewel in a small athletics crown.

Family reasons compel me to inform you that the Duke men's tennis team is excellent. (Also their soccer teams are pretty good too.)

Maybe Dawkins would be OK at Duke - JohnR34231 - 01-04-2013

The big problem seems to be he's trying to run a Duke style program with average talent.

Maybe with Duke-level talent he would be more successful.

Whether Duke would be willing to take a chance on that given his Stanford record is of course another question.

Re: MBB: SC 71 STAN 69 - washingtonismoney - 01-04-2013

I think the team is actually pretty talented. I don't think they are being organized or coached well. Development, as has been noted, is a problem. Minutes allocation is a problem -- for some reason Dawkins has an obsession with giving bad guards too many minutes every year now. At first it was Jarrett Mann but he's gone and now other guys (Gabe Harris, last night) are sopping up that time.

Re: MBB: SC 71 STAN 69 - fullmetal - 01-04-2013

(01-04-2013, 12:17 PM)washingtonismoney link Wrote:[quote author=fullmetal link=topic=7308.msg56478#msg56478 date=1357323806]
Duke's not touching Dawkins, not after this kind of performance--their men's basketball program is the only jewel in a small athletics crown.

Family reasons compel me to inform you that the Duke men's tennis team is excellent. (Also their soccer teams are pretty good too.)
[/quote]

Oops, mea culpa.  I have my Stanford-tinted glasses on when I shouldn't...