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From prosperity to chaos (or how kal screws its own students) - Printable Version

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From prosperity to chaos (or how kal screws its own students) - fullmetal - 09-08-2014

This is a longform article on a kal walk-on who earned a scholarship only to have it unknowingly taken away, and in doing so, immediately incurred a large financial debt with the university, forcing him to quit the team.

http://www.dailycal.org/2014/09/05/swimming-flood/

Sad story, hope things get made right for this guy.

Re: From prosperity to chaos (or how kal screws its own students) - Nan3cy - 09-08-2014

I like the suggestion by a commenter that the head coach chip in some of his millions in salary to help the kid out.


Re: From prosperity to chaos (or how kal screws its own students) - OutsiderFan - 09-08-2014

Walk-ons are given one year scholarships all the time.  These kinds of stories are no win situations for coaches.  If a coach goes out of his way for one, a precedent is set that every walk-on is going to get special treatment.  There could be 20-something walk-ons on a team.  It's up to everyone to make sure what the facts are in these types of situations, and to not make assumptions.

IMO, the outrage over this is misplaced when you consider the SEC schools take scholarships away from guys who were recruited and offered scholarships when they signed with the school, just because they don't develop into good players. 

Re: From prosperity to chaos (or how kal screws its own students) - Rally - 09-08-2014

Does Stanford offer full ride, 4 year athletic scholarships?  I honestly don't know.

As for this particular walk-on, as much as I sympathize with his predicament it's hard to understand how he was blindsided by the repayment issue.  From the story he must understand and appreciate the value of a dollar; he worked hard to support himself.  Did he never  wonder where that extra $11,000 came from?  Did he really just spend it without noticing?  If I had discovered $11,000 extra in my checking account (well, the story says he should have been handed an actual check) I damn sure would have wanted to know where it came from, whether it was a gift or a loan, and if a gift who to thank.  Or did he think he was getting need-based financial aid PLUS an athletic scholarship?  Something doesn't add up for me, but maybe I'm just slow.

Re: From prosperity to chaos (or how kal screws its own students) - 82lsju - 09-08-2014

(09-08-2014, 02:51 PM)ferrari link Wrote:Does Stanford offer full ride, 4 year athletic scholarships?

No.

Re: From prosperity to chaos (or how kal screws its own students) - Rally - 09-08-2014

A friend of mine at Stanford was on a football scholarship.  I think he played maybe 2 downs in 4 years.  I would think Ralston could have used that scholarship to better effect elsewhere but my friend kept it for 4 years.  He once told me that he didn't like the coach and that the coach "hated" him, but he needed that scholarship and worked hard and put up with it.

Re: From prosperity to chaos (or how kal screws its own students) - 71Bear - 09-08-2014

The kid knew the scholie was for one year (standard procedure for walk-on's).  The screw-up was the bureaucratic maze that is Sproul Hall.  No surprise there.  However, as stated by ferrari, there is more to the story than appears on the surface.

Bottom line - you have to ask questions when things don't add up.

This situation reminded me of something that happened where I work (a large bureaucractic organization).  An employee was mistakenly paid more than he should have received.  Instead of bringing the mix-up to the attention of his boss, he pocketed the money.  Sometime later, the error was discovered and he had to make arrangements to pay the entire overage back.  Should we feel sorry for him?

Nope and I don't really feel sorry for Grisom either.  He should have known better and he should have brought it to someone's attention.

Re: From prosperity to chaos (or how kal screws its own students) - Rally - 09-08-2014

(09-08-2014, 03:49 PM)71Bear link Wrote:The kid knew the scholie was for one year (standard procedure for walk-on's).  The screw-up was the bureaucratic maze that is Sproul Hall.  No surprise there.  However, as stated by ferrari, there is more to the story than appears on the surface.

Bottom line - you have to ask questions when things don't add up.

This situation reminded me of something that happened where I work (a large bureaucractic organization).  An employee was mistakenly paid more than he should have received.  Instead of bringing the mix-up to the attention of his boss, he pocketed the money.  Sometime later, the error was discovered and he had to make arrangements to pay the entire overage back.  Should we feel sorry for him?

Nope and I don't really feel sorry for Grisom either.  He should have known better and he should have brought it to someone's attention.

When our son was hired away by another firm there was little love lost between him and now former employer.  They overpaid his final commission check.  He knew and cleverly put the overage into a savings account, but spitefully didn't call it to their attention.  A year later they asked for the money.  He told them to pound sand.  When the letter arrived he sent them the money, feeling he had at least costed them the expense of outside counsel :). Bottom line, however, is that he knew the money wasn't his and would one day have to be paid back.  And it was a hell of a lot more than 11k.  It always amazes me how lax some companies are.  On a smaller scale, the little place where my wife has her nails done only accepts checks.  No cash, no credit cards.  They routinely take a month to deposit the check.  Go figure.

Re: From prosperity to chaos (or how kal screws its own students) - Mick - 09-08-2014

(09-08-2014, 03:58 PM)ferrari link Wrote:[quote author=71Bear link=topic=10589.msg97490#msg97490 date=1410216565]
The kid knew the scholie was for one year (standard procedure for walk-on's).  The screw-up was the bureaucratic maze that is Sproul Hall.  No surprise there.  However, as stated by ferrari, there is more to the story than appears on the surface.

Bottom line - you have to ask questions when things don't add up.

This situation reminded me of something that happened where I work (a large bureaucractic organization).  An employee was mistakenly paid more than he should have received.  Instead of bringing the mix-up to the attention of his boss, he pocketed the money.  Sometime later, the error was discovered and he had to make arrangements to pay the entire overage back.  Should we feel sorry for him?

Nope and I don't really feel sorry for Grisom either.  He should have known better and he should have brought it to someone's attention.

When our son was hired away by another firm there was little love lost between him and now former employer.  They overpaid his final commission check.  He knew and cleverly put the overage into a savings account, but spitefully didn't call it to their attention.  A year later they asked for the money.  He told them to pound sand.  When the letter arrived he sent them the money, feeling he had at least costed them the expense of outside counsel :). Bottom line, however, is that he knew the money wasn't his and would one day have to be paid back.  And it was a hell of a lot more than 11k.  It always amazes me how lax some companies are.  On a smaller scale, the little place where my wife has her nails done only accepts checks.  No cash, no credit cards.  They routinely take a month to deposit the check.  Go figure.
[/quote]



When I was building a house, I was overcredited $115,000.  I just left it in a savings account, figuring that they would figure it out.  They ultimately did.  I sure didn't spend any of it.

Re: From prosperity to chaos (or how kal screws its own students) - 81alum - 09-08-2014

Stanford does not offer formal four year athletic scholarships, but in my opinion it would be the ethical thing to do, so long as a four year scholie can be revoked for cause.  In practice it would be little different from the status quo, but it would give additional security to the students and make a statement that they are going to receive a Stanford education regardless of what happens in their athletic career.

Shockingly, unbelievably, my most hated university  in the world decided this year to offer 4 year scholarships:
http://espn.go.com/los-angeles/college-sports/story/_/id/11123599/usc-trojans-offer-four-year-scholarships-basketball-football

I am saddened that Stanford was not the first.  Four year scholarships will eventually happen--and we can be on the cutting edge or be dragged kicking and screaming into it.  To allow that slimey corruption-infested sanctuary-for-distended-egos to beat us to the punch is a revolting development.

As far as Grisom is concerned, I am not sympathetic about the arguments about the overpayment--you don't get to pocket money just because someone else makes a mistake and gives it to you. 

I am, however, appalled about the communication over his scholarship.  The receivers coach did not know that his receiver was not going to have his scholarship extended?  You can't put that on Grisom when the coach he works with was also blindsided.  This was a Sonny Dykes decision that was botched in communication to both the assistant coach and the player.  That botched communication is producing real hardship, and they ought to make it right.

Re: From prosperity to chaos (or how kal screws its own students) - Rally - 09-08-2014

(09-08-2014, 09:13 PM)Mick link Wrote:[quote author=ferrari link=topic=10589.msg97492#msg97492 date=1410217121]
[quote author=71Bear link=topic=10589.msg97490#msg97490 date=1410216565]
The kid knew the scholie was for one year (standard procedure for walk-on's).  The screw-up was the bureaucratic maze that is Sproul Hall.  No surprise there.  However, as stated by ferrari, there is more to the story than appears on the surface.

Bottom line - you have to ask questions when things don't add up.

This situation reminded me of something that happened where I work (a large bureaucractic organization).  An employee was mistakenly paid more than he should have received.  Instead of bringing the mix-up to the attention of his boss, he pocketed the money.  Sometime later, the error was discovered and he had to make arrangements to pay the entire overage back.  Should we feel sorry for him?

Nope and I don't really feel sorry for Grisom either.  He should have known better and he should have brought it to someone's attention.

When our son was hired away by another firm there was little love lost between him and now former employer.  They overpaid his final commission check.  He knew and cleverly put the overage into a savings account, but spitefully didn't call it to their attention.  A year later they asked for the money.  He told them to pound sand.  When the letter arrived he sent them the money, feeling he had at least costed them the expense of outside counsel :). Bottom line, however, is that he knew the money wasn't his and would one day have to be paid back.  And it was a hell of a lot more than 11k.  It always amazes me how lax some companies are.  On a smaller scale, the little place where my wife has her nails done only accepts checks.  No cash, no credit cards.  They routinely take a month to deposit the check.  Go figure.
[/quote]



When I was building a house, I was overcredited $115,000.  I just left it in a savings account, figuring that they would figure it out.  They ultimately did.  I sure didn't spend any of it.
[/quote]

Correct.  Are we related? :)

Re: From prosperity to chaos (or how kal screws its own students) - Mick - 09-08-2014

(09-08-2014, 09:18 PM)ferrari link Wrote:[quote author=Mick link=topic=10589.msg97530#msg97530 date=1410236021]
[quote author=ferrari link=topic=10589.msg97492#msg97492 date=1410217121]
[quote author=71Bear link=topic=10589.msg97490#msg97490 date=1410216565]
The kid knew the scholie was for one year (standard procedure for walk-on's).  The screw-up was the bureaucratic maze that is Sproul Hall.  No surprise there.  However, as stated by ferrari, there is more to the story than appears on the surface.

Bottom line - you have to ask questions when things don't add up.

This situation reminded me of something that happened where I work (a large bureaucractic organization).  An employee was mistakenly paid more than he should have received.  Instead of bringing the mix-up to the attention of his boss, he pocketed the money.  Sometime later, the error was discovered and he had to make arrangements to pay the entire overage back.  Should we feel sorry for him?

Nope and I don't really feel sorry for Grisom either.  He should have known better and he should have brought it to someone's attention.

When our son was hired away by another firm there was little love lost between him and now former employer.  They overpaid his final commission check.  He knew and cleverly put the overage into a savings account, but spitefully didn't call it to their attention.  A year later they asked for the money.  He told them to pound sand.  When the letter arrived he sent them the money, feeling he had at least costed them the expense of outside counsel :). Bottom line, however, is that he knew the money wasn't his and would one day have to be paid back.  And it was a hell of a lot more than 11k.  It always amazes me how lax some companies are.  On a smaller scale, the little place where my wife has her nails done only accepts checks.  No cash, no credit cards.  They routinely take a month to deposit the check.  Go figure.
[/quote]



When I was building a house, I was overcredited $115,000.  I just left it in a savings account, figuring that they would figure it out.  They ultimately did.  I sure didn't spend any of it.
[/quote]

Correct.  Are we related? :)
[/quote]


Possibly.  Or we could maybe have seen the same movie at an impressionable point in our lives.  Incidentally, my eldest son had that sweatshirt at college, one of his favorite article of clothing.

Re: From prosperity to chaos (or how kal screws its own students) - Rally - 09-09-2014

(09-09-2014, 11:31 AM)garvin link Wrote:Back in the 1950s, the army gave my father a pay raise he knew he wasn't entitled to. He contacted several different offices, pointing out what had happened, and was told in various different ways that the army didn't make mistakes. He finally gave up, and after about nine months used the extra money as down payment on a house. A couple of months after that, the army accountants discovered the leak in their accounts and wanted their money back. Their position that the army didn't make mistakes, however, remained unchanged, and they threatened my father with a court-martial for theft. Only the fact that he had been wise enough to put all his attempts to return the money into writing saved him. He did have to return it, via reductions in his regular salary checks over the next  nine months.

One of the few constants in life is the collective insistance of any bureaucracy to ever admit error.