[Giants]

1700069012[/url]']
Not being lawyer, I'm guessing the reason the 10 haven't tried to change venue is they will let UW fight the fight for now, and if they get adverse rulings in WA appeals, the other 9 schools could then sue in their preferred venue. For the 2, they want quick resolution so they can figure out next year and beyond, but for the 10 that is not so important, they can drag things out until OSU and WSU agrees to a "fair" settlement. As long as the threat of more lawsuits is around, nothing is really settled by what happens in WA.

Happy for someone who knows better to explain this venue deal though.

I think this is a pyrrhic victory for OSU and WSU.  At best, they invite members of the MWC to join them in a reconstituted PAC.  At worst, they simply join the MWC.  Either way the resultant conference is not going to be in the Power group.  

Also, given the judge’s admonition regarding dividing the conference spoils equitably, I’m not certain there is much to be gotten going the legal route, especially since the net value of the conference is a continuing mystery.  Good luck trying to unravel that mess.

[Giants]

1700069012[/url]']
Not being lawyer, I'm guessing the reason the 10 haven't tried to change venue is they will let UW fight the fight for now, and if they get adverse rulings in WA appeals, the other 9 schools could then sue in their preferred venue. For the 2, they want quick resolution so they can figure out next year and beyond, but for the 10 that is not so important, they can drag things out until OSU and WSU agrees to a "fair" settlement. As long as the threat of more lawsuits is around, nothing is really settled by what happens in WA.

Happy for someone who knows better to explain this venue deal though.

I think this is a pyrrhic victory for OSU and WSU.  At best, they invite members of the MWC to join them in a reconstituted PAC.  At worst, they simply join the MWC.  Either way the resultant conference is not going to be in the Power group.  

Also, given the judge’s admonition regarding dividing the conference spoils equitably, I’m not certain there is much to be gotten going the legal route, especially since the net value of the conference is a continuing mystery.  Good luck trying to unravel that mess.

[chrisk]

I may have missed it, but I haven't seen Ray Anderson's resignation earlier this week mentioned here.
He played at Stanford from 73-75 so is about 70. He has been heavily critcized for ASU's lack of success in
football and the disasterous hiring of Herm Edwards.

https://www.espn.com/college-football/st...on-resigns

[chrisk]

I may have missed it, but I haven't seen Ray Anderson's resignation earlier this week mentioned here.
He played at Stanford from 73-75 so is about 70. He has been heavily critcized for ASU's lack of success in
football and the disasterous hiring of Herm Edwards.

https://www.espn.com/college-football/st...on-resigns

[M T]

1700124629[/url]']
I may have missed it, but I haven't seen Ray Anderson's resignation earlier this week mentioned here.
He played at Stanford from 73-75 so is about 70.

I would guess he wasn’t a math major:
“As I approach my seventh decade of life…”
As I figure it, he’s just about done with his 7th decade of life.

[M T]

1700124629[/url]']
I may have missed it, but I haven't seen Ray Anderson's resignation earlier this week mentioned here.
He played at Stanford from 73-75 so is about 70.

I would guess he wasn’t a math major:
“As I approach my seventh decade of life…”
As I figure it, he’s just about done with his 7th decade of life.

[Giants]

1700127210[/url]']

1700124629[/url]']
I may have missed it, but I haven't seen Ray Anderson's resignation earlier this week mentioned here.
He played at Stanford from 73-75 so is about 70.

I would guess he wasn’t a math major:
“As I approach my seventh decade of life…”
As I figure it, he’s just about done with his 7th decade of life.

But he is a professor at ASU’s Law School.

https://www.statepress.com/article/2023/...n-contract

[Giants]

1700127210[/url]']

1700124629[/url]']
I may have missed it, but I haven't seen Ray Anderson's resignation earlier this week mentioned here.
He played at Stanford from 73-75 so is about 70.

I would guess he wasn’t a math major:
“As I approach my seventh decade of life…”
As I figure it, he’s just about done with his 7th decade of life.

But he is a professor at ASU’s Law School.

https://www.statepress.com/article/2023/...n-contract

[M T]

Tuesday: the judge signed a preliminary injunction.
Wednesday: UW filed a motion for an emergency stay with the Washington Supreme Court.
Thursday: The Washington Supreme Court issued a temporary stay.
Friday: The 2 schools file their opposition to a temporary stay.  The Washington Supreme Court Clerk indicated a ruling by Dec. 4.
https://www.mercurynews.com/2023/11/17/p...-approach/

[M T]

Tuesday: the judge signed a preliminary injunction.
Wednesday: UW filed a motion for an emergency stay with the Washington Supreme Court.
Thursday: The Washington Supreme Court issued a temporary stay.
Friday: The 2 schools file their opposition to a temporary stay.  The Washington Supreme Court Clerk indicated a ruling by Dec. 4.
https://www.mercurynews.com/2023/11/17/p...-approach/

[Mick]

State of Washington Supreme Court granted an emergency stay to prevent WSU and OSU from controlling the Pac-12 board. But the ruling was issued by the WSC Commissioner, not the judges. OSU and WSU plan to appeal directly to the judges to request a removal of the stay. Commissioner Johnston, who granted the emergency stay, is a UWashington graduate, quelle surprise.

Pac-12 legal fight: Court grants emergency stay, board biz frozen

Deadline for motions is December 12. If the Court sides with the defendants, it will take the case for review. If it sides with the plaintiffs, they'll decline the review and send the case to an appellate court. Interestingly, the Supreme Court is an hour from the UW campus. The appellate court is likely in Spokane, an hour from the WSU campus.

Washington Supreme Court commissioner grants stay in Pac-12 suit, pausing WSU's and OSU's grip on conference

OSU and WSU have reached an agreement to schedule 6 games each with Mountain West Conference opponents in 2024, 3 home, 3 away.

WSU, OSU to play in Mountain West Conference for 2024 | ktvb.com

What really happened to the Pac-12...

https://x.com/DNPSportsShow/status/17306...21462?s=20

[Mick]

State of Washington Supreme Court granted an emergency stay to prevent WSU and OSU from controlling the Pac-12 board. But the ruling was issued by the WSC Commissioner, not the judges. OSU and WSU plan to appeal directly to the judges to request a removal of the stay. Commissioner Johnston, who granted the emergency stay, is a UWashington graduate, quelle surprise.

Pac-12 legal fight: Court grants emergency stay, board biz frozen

Deadline for motions is December 12. If the Court sides with the defendants, it will take the case for review. If it sides with the plaintiffs, they'll decline the review and send the case to an appellate court. Interestingly, the Supreme Court is an hour from the UW campus. The appellate court is likely in Spokane, an hour from the WSU campus.

Washington Supreme Court commissioner grants stay in Pac-12 suit, pausing WSU's and OSU's grip on conference

OSU and WSU have reached an agreement to schedule 6 games each with Mountain West Conference opponents in 2024, 3 home, 3 away.

WSU, OSU to play in Mountain West Conference for 2024 | ktvb.com

What really happened to the Pac-12...

https://x.com/DNPSportsShow/status/17306...21462?s=20

[M T]

Washington Supreme Court has lifted the stay. 
https://www.mercurynews.com/2023/12/15/p...-the-case/

Minority control if the Majority’s assets this year.

[M T]

Washington Supreme Court has lifted the stay. 
https://www.mercurynews.com/2023/12/15/p...-the-case/

Minority control if the Majority’s assets this year.

[TonyLima]

Washington Supreme Court has lifted the stay. 
https://www.mercurynews.com/2023/12/15/p...-the-case/

Minority control if the Majority’s assets this year.

"Majority" is lame duck (at best).  Personally, I hope WSU and OSU get to keep it all.

[TonyLima]

Washington Supreme Court has lifted the stay. 
https://www.mercurynews.com/2023/12/15/p...-the-case/

Minority control if the Majority’s assets this year.

"Majority" is lame duck (at best).  Personally, I hope WSU and OSU get to keep it all.

[CompSci87]

They can keep the conference's debts then, too.

[CompSci87]

They can keep the conference's debts then, too.

[Giants]

1702695268[/url]']
They can keep the conference's debts then, too.

Exactly.  To date, no one has been able to determine the true value of the conference.  Until all the data is unraveled, what OSU and WSU may wind up with ranges from a conference name and a couple bucks or something worth salvaging.  Time will tell……

[Giants]

1702695268[/url]']
They can keep the conference's debts then, too.

Exactly.  To date, no one has been able to determine the true value of the conference.  Until all the data is unraveled, what OSU and WSU may wind up with ranges from a conference name and a couple bucks or something worth salvaging.  Time will tell……

[TonyLima]

They can keep the conference's debts then, too.

Of course.

[TonyLima]

They can keep the conference's debts then, too.

Of course.

[M T]

1702693059[/url]']

"Majority" is lame duck (at best).  Personally, I hope WSU and OSU get to keep it all.

It seems reasonable they decide on actions and revenue next year. But this year, 12 schools are playing in 30 sports.

If those 2 are the only votes for the PAC-12 this year, why not tell the other 10, “No, you get no money to play in the various championships,” or “We’ll choose who tells you which refs you get,” or “We’lll control who gets player of the week/year”. There are lots of ways to put a finger on the scale.

When you were a lame duck senior in college, did your class have no vote in the student body?

I believe the consensus here was that a motion would be filed in federal court (or maybe California, since the conference is registered in California)

[M T]

1702693059[/url]']

"Majority" is lame duck (at best).  Personally, I hope WSU and OSU get to keep it all.

It seems reasonable they decide on actions and revenue next year. But this year, 12 schools are playing in 30 sports.

If those 2 are the only votes for the PAC-12 this year, why not tell the other 10, “No, you get no money to play in the various championships,” or “We’ll choose who tells you which refs you get,” or “We’lll control who gets player of the week/year”. There are lots of ways to put a finger on the scale.

When you were a lame duck senior in college, did your class have no vote in the student body?

I believe the consensus here was that a motion would be filed in federal court (or maybe California, since the conference is registered in California)

[Giants]

1702720505[/url]']

1702693059[/url]']

"Majority" is lame duck (at best).  Personally, I hope WSU and OSU get to keep it all.

It seems reasonable they decide on actions and revenue next year. But this year, 12 schools are playing in 30 sports.

If those 2 are the only votes for the PAC-12 this year, why not tell the other 10, “No, you get no money to play in the various championships,” or “We’ll choose who tells you which refs you get,” or “We’lll control who gets player of the week/year”. There are lots of ways to put a finger on the scale.

When you were a lame duck senior in college, did your class have no vote in the student body?

I believe the consensus here was that a motion would be filed in federal court (or maybe California, since the conference is registered in California)

The judge in Washington who made the initial ruling told WSU and OSU to play fair during the current academic year or he would revisit his ruling that gave the two schools power to make conference decisions.

[Giants]

1702720505[/url]']

1702693059[/url]']

"Majority" is lame duck (at best).  Personally, I hope WSU and OSU get to keep it all.

It seems reasonable they decide on actions and revenue next year. But this year, 12 schools are playing in 30 sports.

If those 2 are the only votes for the PAC-12 this year, why not tell the other 10, “No, you get no money to play in the various championships,” or “We’ll choose who tells you which refs you get,” or “We’lll control who gets player of the week/year”. There are lots of ways to put a finger on the scale.

When you were a lame duck senior in college, did your class have no vote in the student body?

I believe the consensus here was that a motion would be filed in federal court (or maybe California, since the conference is registered in California)

The judge in Washington who made the initial ruling told WSU and OSU to play fair during the current academic year or he would revisit his ruling that gave the two schools power to make conference decisions.

[TonyLima]

1702720505[/url]']

1702693059[/url]']

"Majority" is lame duck (at best).  Personally, I hope WSU and OSU get to keep it all.

It seems reasonable they decide on actions and revenue next year. But this year, 12 schools are playing in 30 sports.

If those 2 are the only votes for the PAC-12 this year, why not tell the other 10, “No, you get no money to play in the various championships,” or “We’ll choose who tells you which refs you get,” or “We’lll control who gets player of the week/year”. There are lots of ways to put a finger on the scale.

When you were a lame duck senior in college, did your class have no vote in the student body?

I believe the consensus here was that a motion would be filed in federal court (or maybe California, since the conference is registered in California)

The judge in Washington who made the initial ruling told WSU and OSU to play fair during the current academic year or he would revisit his ruling that gave the two schools power to make conference decisions.

Thanks for that important tidbit.

[TonyLima]

1702720505[/url]']

1702693059[/url]']

"Majority" is lame duck (at best).  Personally, I hope WSU and OSU get to keep it all.

It seems reasonable they decide on actions and revenue next year. But this year, 12 schools are playing in 30 sports.

If those 2 are the only votes for the PAC-12 this year, why not tell the other 10, “No, you get no money to play in the various championships,” or “We’ll choose who tells you which refs you get,” or “We’lll control who gets player of the week/year”. There are lots of ways to put a finger on the scale.

When you were a lame duck senior in college, did your class have no vote in the student body?

I believe the consensus here was that a motion would be filed in federal court (or maybe California, since the conference is registered in California)

The judge in Washington who made the initial ruling told WSU and OSU to play fair during the current academic year or he would revisit his ruling that gave the two schools power to make conference decisions.

Thanks for that important tidbit.

[Mick]

1702720505[/url]']

1702693059[/url]']

"Majority" is lame duck (at best).  Personally, I hope WSU and OSU get to keep it all.

It seems reasonable they decide on actions and revenue next year. But this year, 12 schools are playing in 30 sports.

If those 2 are the only votes for the PAC-12 this year, why not tell the other 10, “No, you get no money to play in the various championships,” or “We’ll choose who tells you which refs you get,” or “We’lll control who gets player of the week/year”. There are lots of ways to put a finger on the scale.

When you were a lame duck senior in college, did your class have no vote in the student body?

I believe the consensus here was that a motion would be filed in federal court (or maybe California, since the conference is registered in California)

The judge in Washington who made the initial ruling told WSU and OSU to play fair during the current academic year or he would revisit his ruling that gave the two schools power to make conference decisions.

Thanks for that important tidbit.

I think OSU and WSU should play as fair as the other 10 did when they left the Pac-12 conference.

[Mick]

1702720505[/url]']

1702693059[/url]']

"Majority" is lame duck (at best).  Personally, I hope WSU and OSU get to keep it all.

It seems reasonable they decide on actions and revenue next year. But this year, 12 schools are playing in 30 sports.

If those 2 are the only votes for the PAC-12 this year, why not tell the other 10, “No, you get no money to play in the various championships,” or “We’ll choose who tells you which refs you get,” or “We’lll control who gets player of the week/year”. There are lots of ways to put a finger on the scale.

When you were a lame duck senior in college, did your class have no vote in the student body?

I believe the consensus here was that a motion would be filed in federal court (or maybe California, since the conference is registered in California)

The judge in Washington who made the initial ruling told WSU and OSU to play fair during the current academic year or he would revisit his ruling that gave the two schools power to make conference decisions.

Thanks for that important tidbit.

I think OSU and WSU should play as fair as the other 10 did when they left the Pac-12 conference.

[Giants]

1702789839[/url]']

1702768048[/url]']

1702747787[/url]']

1702720505[/url]']

1702693059[/url]']

"Majority" is lame duck (at best).  Personally, I hope WSU and OSU get to keep it all.

It seems reasonable they decide on actions and revenue next year. But this year, 12 schools are playing in 30 sports.

If those 2 are the only votes for the PAC-12 this year, why not tell the other 10, “No, you get no money to play in the various championships,” or “We’ll choose who tells you which refs you get,” or “We’lll control who gets player of the week/year”. There are lots of ways to put a finger on the scale.

When you were a lame duck senior in college, did your class have no vote in the student body?

I believe the consensus here was that a motion would be filed in federal court (or maybe California, since the conference is registered in California)

The judge in Washington who made the initial ruling told WSU and OSU to play fair during the current academic year or he would revisit his ruling that gave the two schools power to make conference decisions.

Thanks for that important tidbit.

I think OSU and WSU should play as fair as the other 10 did when they left the Pac-12 conference.

The handwriting was on the wall once UCLA and SC pulled the plug.  I don’t blame them at all for taking the money and running off to join the Big Ten.  Had Stanford and Cal been given the same option (instead of UCLA and SC) they would have been crazy not to do the same as the Bruins and Trojans.  

The entire mess was the collective fault of the Presidents and Chancellors.  Had they simply accepted ESPN’s offer to take over the Pac12 network, the conference would still have 12 members.  

https://www.nbcsports.com/college-footba...12-network

Oh well…….

[Giants]

1702789839[/url]']

1702768048[/url]']

1702747787[/url]']

1702720505[/url]']

1702693059[/url]']

"Majority" is lame duck (at best).  Personally, I hope WSU and OSU get to keep it all.

It seems reasonable they decide on actions and revenue next year. But this year, 12 schools are playing in 30 sports.

If those 2 are the only votes for the PAC-12 this year, why not tell the other 10, “No, you get no money to play in the various championships,” or “We’ll choose who tells you which refs you get,” or “We’lll control who gets player of the week/year”. There are lots of ways to put a finger on the scale.

When you were a lame duck senior in college, did your class have no vote in the student body?

I believe the consensus here was that a motion would be filed in federal court (or maybe California, since the conference is registered in California)

The judge in Washington who made the initial ruling told WSU and OSU to play fair during the current academic year or he would revisit his ruling that gave the two schools power to make conference decisions.

Thanks for that important tidbit.

I think OSU and WSU should play as fair as the other 10 did when they left the Pac-12 conference.

The handwriting was on the wall once UCLA and SC pulled the plug.  I don’t blame them at all for taking the money and running off to join the Big Ten.  Had Stanford and Cal been given the same option (instead of UCLA and SC) they would have been crazy not to do the same as the Bruins and Trojans.  

The entire mess was the collective fault of the Presidents and Chancellors.  Had they simply accepted ESPN’s offer to take over the Pac12 network, the conference would still have 12 members.  

https://www.nbcsports.com/college-footba...12-network

Oh well…….

[Mick]

1702789839[/url]']

1702768048[/url]']

1702747787[/url]']

1702720505[/url]']
It seems reasonable they decide on actions and revenue next year. But this year, 12 schools are playing in 30 sports.

If those 2 are the only votes for the PAC-12 this year, why not tell the other 10, “No, you get no money to play in the various championships,” or “We’ll choose who tells you which refs you get,” or “We’lll control who gets player of the week/year”. There are lots of ways to put a finger on the scale.

When you were a lame duck senior in college, did your class have no vote in the student body?

I believe the consensus here was that a motion would be filed in federal court (or maybe California, since the conference is registered in California)

The judge in Washington who made the initial ruling told WSU and OSU to play fair during the current academic year or he would revisit his ruling that gave the two schools power to make conference decisions.

Thanks for that important tidbit.

I think OSU and WSU should play as fair as the other 10 did when they left the Pac-12 conference.

The handwriting was on the wall once UCLA and SC pulled the plug.  I don’t blame them at all for taking the money and running off to join the Big Ten.  Had Stanford and Cal been given the same option (instead of UCLA and SC) they would have been crazy not to do the same as the Bruins and Trojans.  

The entire mess was the collective fault of the Presidents and Chancellors.  Had they simply accepted ESPN’s offer to take over the Pac12 network, the conference would still have 12 members.  

https://www.nbcsports.com/college-footba...12-network

Oh well…….

Right. To your point, USC and UCLA made the money grab, as did the other eight teams in NCAA musical chairs. OSU and WSU were left without chairs. This is their one and only chance to build a financial stake before they are forced to go to an oblivion too terrible to contemplate, which was the message that everyone conveyed about the MWC and AAC and other non-Power 5 conferences. So I wouldn't blame them if they completely screwed the other 10 schools...who would deserve it. And their explanation to the judge would be something like "we needed all the money to rebuild the Pac-12."

I actually hope OSU and WSU reconstitute the Pac-12 conference with the best of the MWC, AAC and independents. Maybe something like this (current college RPI in parens). It would be a fairly strong conference:

Tulane (#16)
OSU (#18)
UNLV (#31)
Fresno St (#37)
UTSA (#38)
Air Force (#39)
Memphis (#40)
Wyoming (#43)
Boise St (#47)
New Mex St (#51)
Washington St (#88)
SJSU (#54)

[Mick]

1702789839[/url]']

1702768048[/url]']

1702747787[/url]']

1702720505[/url]']
It seems reasonable they decide on actions and revenue next year. But this year, 12 schools are playing in 30 sports.

If those 2 are the only votes for the PAC-12 this year, why not tell the other 10, “No, you get no money to play in the various championships,” or “We’ll choose who tells you which refs you get,” or “We’lll control who gets player of the week/year”. There are lots of ways to put a finger on the scale.

When you were a lame duck senior in college, did your class have no vote in the student body?

I believe the consensus here was that a motion would be filed in federal court (or maybe California, since the conference is registered in California)

The judge in Washington who made the initial ruling told WSU and OSU to play fair during the current academic year or he would revisit his ruling that gave the two schools power to make conference decisions.

Thanks for that important tidbit.

I think OSU and WSU should play as fair as the other 10 did when they left the Pac-12 conference.

The handwriting was on the wall once UCLA and SC pulled the plug.  I don’t blame them at all for taking the money and running off to join the Big Ten.  Had Stanford and Cal been given the same option (instead of UCLA and SC) they would have been crazy not to do the same as the Bruins and Trojans.  

The entire mess was the collective fault of the Presidents and Chancellors.  Had they simply accepted ESPN’s offer to take over the Pac12 network, the conference would still have 12 members.  

https://www.nbcsports.com/college-footba...12-network

Oh well…….

Right. To your point, USC and UCLA made the money grab, as did the other eight teams in NCAA musical chairs. OSU and WSU were left without chairs. This is their one and only chance to build a financial stake before they are forced to go to an oblivion too terrible to contemplate, which was the message that everyone conveyed about the MWC and AAC and other non-Power 5 conferences. So I wouldn't blame them if they completely screwed the other 10 schools...who would deserve it. And their explanation to the judge would be something like "we needed all the money to rebuild the Pac-12."

I actually hope OSU and WSU reconstitute the Pac-12 conference with the best of the MWC, AAC and independents. Maybe something like this (current college RPI in parens). It would be a fairly strong conference:

Tulane (#16)
OSU (#18)
UNLV (#31)
Fresno St (#37)
UTSA (#38)
Air Force (#39)
Memphis (#40)
Wyoming (#43)
Boise St (#47)
New Mex St (#51)
Washington St (#88)
SJSU (#54)

[Mick]

I don't normally engage in schadenfreude (life is too short), but when USC lost five of its last six games to fall to the Holiday Bowl, I had to laugh. In this article, Pac-12 coaches (former Pac-12 coaches, I suppose I should say) opined as to USC's decline. In sum:

- Didn't sign an LB or DB during the 2020 recruiting cycle, and the 2021 recruits didn't live up to their rankings.
- Since-fired DC Alex Grinch doesn't have the answers and performances were flat against Utah in the title game loss. One coach said Grinch's former defenses were aggressive but sound...and the 2023 USC defense was one of the worst they'd faced, tons of missed tackles.
- DL coach Nua and ILB coach Odom were co-interim DCs for the final games against Oregon and UCLA...and gave up 74 combined points. 
- Tried to add talent through the transfer portal...but when SJSU moved the ball easily against USC in week 1, it was a red flag.
- Run defense got thrashed, bad tackling
- Surprise, surprise...poor discipline cost personal fouls.
- Transfers were a bunch of mercenaries trying to get their own stats, very undisciplined.
- USC ranked 110th nationally in yards per play allowed and 123rd in scoring defense.
- No shutdown corner. No shutdown DL. No game-changing LB. No defensive difference makers.
- OL never jelled...3 yards rushing against UCLA. WRs struggled to get open.
- Poor overall culture. Mismatched priorities. NIL a distraction.
- All the leaders in 2022 graduated. Leadership wasn't replaced.
- "You don't let Hollywood take over your program" said one coach.

https://theathletic.com/5142298/2023/12/...0gmail.com

[Mick]

I don't normally engage in schadenfreude (life is too short), but when USC lost five of its last six games to fall to the Holiday Bowl, I had to laugh. In this article, Pac-12 coaches (former Pac-12 coaches, I suppose I should say) opined as to USC's decline. In sum:

- Didn't sign an LB or DB during the 2020 recruiting cycle, and the 2021 recruits didn't live up to their rankings.
- Since-fired DC Alex Grinch doesn't have the answers and performances were flat against Utah in the title game loss. One coach said Grinch's former defenses were aggressive but sound...and the 2023 USC defense was one of the worst they'd faced, tons of missed tackles.
- DL coach Nua and ILB coach Odom were co-interim DCs for the final games against Oregon and UCLA...and gave up 74 combined points. 
- Tried to add talent through the transfer portal...but when SJSU moved the ball easily against USC in week 1, it was a red flag.
- Run defense got thrashed, bad tackling
- Surprise, surprise...poor discipline cost personal fouls.
- Transfers were a bunch of mercenaries trying to get their own stats, very undisciplined.
- USC ranked 110th nationally in yards per play allowed and 123rd in scoring defense.
- No shutdown corner. No shutdown DL. No game-changing LB. No defensive difference makers.
- OL never jelled...3 yards rushing against UCLA. WRs struggled to get open.
- Poor overall culture. Mismatched priorities. NIL a distraction.
- All the leaders in 2022 graduated. Leadership wasn't replaced.
- "You don't let Hollywood take over your program" said one coach.

https://theathletic.com/5142298/2023/12/...0gmail.com

[cctop]

I don't normally engage in schadenfreude (life is too short), but when USC lost five of its last six games to fall to the Holiday Bowl, I had to laugh. 

I disdain the USC football program and its fans as much as any other red-blooded American.

But the article's biggest knock against them is underperformance.

I'm 55 years old and their program has had only 5 losing seasons in my lifetime.

Honestly the Holiday Bowl is sounding pretty good right now.

[cctop]

I don't normally engage in schadenfreude (life is too short), but when USC lost five of its last six games to fall to the Holiday Bowl, I had to laugh. 

I disdain the USC football program and its fans as much as any other red-blooded American.

But the article's biggest knock against them is underperformance.

I'm 55 years old and their program has had only 5 losing seasons in my lifetime.

Honestly the Holiday Bowl is sounding pretty good right now.

[Mick]

I realize there's a fair amount of disdain on this board vis-a-vis the Mountain West Conference. In basketball, at least, the MWC is 5-0 against the Pac-12 this season, per the Mercury:

- MWC has 4 of the top 40 teams, Pac 12 has 3, WCC has 1
- Collective OOC winning percentages: MWC, 70.1%, Pac-12, 64.9%, WCC, 52%
- Record against the other two conferences: MWC, 19-5, WCC, 12-20, Pac-12, 6-12.

College MBB: Mountain West, not Pac-12, is West's top conference (mercurynews.com)

[Mick]

I realize there's a fair amount of disdain on this board vis-a-vis the Mountain West Conference. In basketball, at least, the MWC is 5-0 against the Pac-12 this season, per the Mercury:

- MWC has 4 of the top 40 teams, Pac 12 has 3, WCC has 1
- Collective OOC winning percentages: MWC, 70.1%, Pac-12, 64.9%, WCC, 52%
- Record against the other two conferences: MWC, 19-5, WCC, 12-20, Pac-12, 6-12.

College MBB: Mountain West, not Pac-12, is West's top conference (mercurynews.com)