04-27-2013, 04:43 PM
Can somebody explain to me how Toilolo got drafted when he has trouble with one of the basic aspects of his job (catching the ball), whereas Chase Thomas does not (sacking the QB)?
What happened to Chase?!?!
Can somebody explain to me how Toilolo got drafted when he has trouble with one of the basic aspects of his job (catching the ball), whereas Chase Thomas does not (sacking the QB)?
04-27-2013, 04:59 PM
If you look at SI.com for other outside linkebackers, Chase Thomas had a 7.20. Of those that got picked instead of him we have:
a 4.5, 5.7, 5.8, 1.0, 6.2, 4.5,5.2,5.4,4.9,5.4,6.9
He must have gotten a 0 on the Wunderlic!
a 4.5, 5.7, 5.8, 1.0, 6.2, 4.5,5.2,5.4,4.9,5.4,6.9
He must have gotten a 0 on the Wunderlic!
04-27-2013, 05:19 PM
Can't really explain it well, except that a lot of NFL Personnel folks must think his skill set doesn't translate to the pro game. Other notable names that were not drafted that surprise me a bit:
Joseph Fauria (TE, UCLA): measurables quite similar to Levine's, and I remember us having a helluva difficult time defending him the last couple of years.
Tyler Bray (QB, Tennessee): a bit of a statue in the backfield, but I thought the arm strength alone would get someone to draft him
Curtis McNeal (RB, USC): really small, but explosive. Nobody wants to try him out as a return specialist?Â
As always, there will be some very good free-agents that will make front offices cringe in the future. I think Thomas and Fauria, especially, are two guys who should choose as carefully as they can which offer they take (and I'd be surprised if both of them don't get at least a few teams trying to sign them to FA contracts in the next few days).
Joseph Fauria (TE, UCLA): measurables quite similar to Levine's, and I remember us having a helluva difficult time defending him the last couple of years.
Tyler Bray (QB, Tennessee): a bit of a statue in the backfield, but I thought the arm strength alone would get someone to draft him
Curtis McNeal (RB, USC): really small, but explosive. Nobody wants to try him out as a return specialist?Â
As always, there will be some very good free-agents that will make front offices cringe in the future. I think Thomas and Fauria, especially, are two guys who should choose as carefully as they can which offer they take (and I'd be surprised if both of them don't get at least a few teams trying to sign them to FA contracts in the next few days).
Can't really explain it well, except that a lot of NFL Personnel folks must think his skill set doesn't translate to the pro game. Other notable names that were not drafted that surprise me a bit:
Joseph Fauria (TE, UCLA): measurables quite similar to Levine's, and I remember us having a helluva difficult time defending him the last couple of years.
Tyler Bray (QB, Tennessee): a bit of a statue in the backfield, but I thought the arm strength alone would get someone to draft him
Curtis McNeal (RB, USC): really small, but explosive. Nobody wants to try him out as a return specialist?Â
As always, there will be some very good free-agents that will make front offices cringe in the future. I think Thomas and Fauria, especially, are two guys who should choose as carefully as they can which offer they take (and I'd be surprised if both of them don't get at least a few teams trying to sign them to FA contracts in the next few days).
Joseph Fauria (TE, UCLA): measurables quite similar to Levine's, and I remember us having a helluva difficult time defending him the last couple of years.
Tyler Bray (QB, Tennessee): a bit of a statue in the backfield, but I thought the arm strength alone would get someone to draft him
Curtis McNeal (RB, USC): really small, but explosive. Nobody wants to try him out as a return specialist?Â
As always, there will be some very good free-agents that will make front offices cringe in the future. I think Thomas and Fauria, especially, are two guys who should choose as carefully as they can which offer they take (and I'd be surprised if both of them don't get at least a few teams trying to sign them to FA contracts in the next few days).
04-27-2013, 05:37 PM
(This post was last modified: 04-27-2013, 05:43 PM by BigEasyCard.)
nola.com posters citing Twitter say that the Saints have signed Chase Thomas as a free agent.
Lots of favorable comments about this signing:
http://www.nola.com/saints/index.ssf/201...rt_m-rpt-2
Welcome to the Big Easy, Chase!
Lots of favorable comments about this signing:
http://www.nola.com/saints/index.ssf/201...rt_m-rpt-2
Welcome to the Big Easy, Chase!
(This post was last modified: 04-27-2013, 05:43 PM by BigEasyCard.)
nola.com posters citing Twitter say that the Saints have signed Chase Thomas as a free agent.
Lots of favorable comments about this signing:
http://www.nola.com/saints/index.ssf/201...rt_m-rpt-2
Welcome to the Big Easy, Chase!
Lots of favorable comments about this signing:
http://www.nola.com/saints/index.ssf/201...rt_m-rpt-2
Welcome to the Big Easy, Chase!
04-27-2013, 05:55 PM
What's galling is comparing Chase's production with Dion Jordan who went 3rd overall.
I wish Chase the best of luck. And will cheer for him wherever he ends up.
I wish Chase the best of luck. And will cheer for him wherever he ends up.
What's galling is comparing Chase's production with Dion Jordan who went 3rd overall.
I wish Chase the best of luck. And will cheer for him wherever he ends up.
I wish Chase the best of luck. And will cheer for him wherever he ends up.
pincemob
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04-27-2013, 07:37 PM
I don't think it was the Wonderlic. He is a very smart football player, as many NFL experts have noted. Mike Mayock remarked that not one time in all the film he saw was Chase out of position.
He's obviously not the next Aldon Smith or Terrell Suggs but NFL.com compared him to Connor Barwin, and I don't know that he couldn't be as good as Clay Matthews. Not the first Stanford guy to be overlooked and I expect him to have a good career.Â
He's obviously not the next Aldon Smith or Terrell Suggs but NFL.com compared him to Connor Barwin, and I don't know that he couldn't be as good as Clay Matthews. Not the first Stanford guy to be overlooked and I expect him to have a good career.Â
I don't think it was the Wonderlic. He is a very smart football player, as many NFL experts have noted. Mike Mayock remarked that not one time in all the film he saw was Chase out of position.
He's obviously not the next Aldon Smith or Terrell Suggs but NFL.com compared him to Connor Barwin, and I don't know that he couldn't be as good as Clay Matthews. Not the first Stanford guy to be overlooked and I expect him to have a good career.Â
He's obviously not the next Aldon Smith or Terrell Suggs but NFL.com compared him to Connor Barwin, and I don't know that he couldn't be as good as Clay Matthews. Not the first Stanford guy to be overlooked and I expect him to have a good career.Â
04-27-2013, 09:44 PM
I think he is better off going the UFA route than as a 7th round pick for a team that he might not fit.
At least he gets the chance to pick a team he might be a better fit for.
At least he gets the chance to pick a team he might be a better fit for.
04-28-2013, 03:24 AM
I'm surprised the Pats didn't pick him up--I thought they had a good scouting bunch. What the heck?
I hope to see one angry gorilla rampaging on the field next season.
I hope to see one angry gorilla rampaging on the field next season.
04-28-2013, 05:06 AM
(04-28-2013, 03:24 AM)fullmetal link Wrote:I'm surprised the Pats didn't pick him up--I thought they had a good scouting bunch. What the heck?
Their scouting is overrated. Tons of draft busts in recent years. I'm convinced Bon Jovi's biggest fan has a bias against Stanford players. Must have gotten rejected himself when he applied to college.
I have a love/hate relationship with the Pats. I started cheering for them when I was here for grad school (When you are a native Bengals fan, you have to find other teams to cheer for.) We did a class once on the NFL salary cap, and Bob Kraft's son came to the class. This was during the Bledsoe-Brady year. During the Q&A at the end, I asked him "What are you gonna do with Bledsoe?" He asked me "What do you think we should do?" Without skipping a beat, I replied "Trade him to the Bungles."
Can't lose with the Pats. Happy when they win. Laugh at the obnoxious Boston sports fans meltdown when they lose.
(04-28-2013, 03:24 AM)fullmetal link Wrote:I'm surprised the Pats didn't pick him up--I thought they had a good scouting bunch. What the heck?
Their scouting is overrated. Tons of draft busts in recent years. I'm convinced Bon Jovi's biggest fan has a bias against Stanford players. Must have gotten rejected himself when he applied to college.
I have a love/hate relationship with the Pats. I started cheering for them when I was here for grad school (When you are a native Bengals fan, you have to find other teams to cheer for.) We did a class once on the NFL salary cap, and Bob Kraft's son came to the class. This was during the Bledsoe-Brady year. During the Q&A at the end, I asked him "What are you gonna do with Bledsoe?" He asked me "What do you think we should do?" Without skipping a beat, I replied "Trade him to the Bungles."
Can't lose with the Pats. Happy when they win. Laugh at the obnoxious Boston sports fans meltdown when they lose.
04-28-2013, 05:11 AM
Is Chase the highest rated player without off the field issues to go undrafted?
Is Chase the highest rated player without off the field issues to go undrafted?
04-28-2013, 08:15 AM
Some guesses for the reasons Chase Thomas went undrafted:
Lack of size
After being under the impression Thomas was 6-4 and 250, he measured in at 6-3 237.Â
Not explosive, quick, or nimble enough
The combine and Stanford's Pro Day were unkind to Thomas. They exposed his lack of athleticism in a very sobering way.
Limited Senior Year Production
Thomas only had six sacks and 12 TFLs on the year. That's evidence that his lack of production is due to his lack of explosiveness, quickness, nimbleness, and size.
Scouts and GMs can overlook guys who don't show well in combine drills if they demonstrate they can produce on the field. Had Thomas registered say 10 sacks and had 20 TFLs, that might be overlooked.Â
I was stunned how after the combine Mike Mayock had Thomas rated as his #2 4-3 OLB. Just didn't make sense to me. What it said was Thomas isn't big enough to play 3-4 OLB in the NFL, but that Mayock still liked him as a football player. People paid to actually draft players for their teams disagreed, and concluded he just isn't an NFL athlete. That said, he's going to be given a chance to prove he can play at the next level. To me he is a good football player, but I question what his position is. If he could add 20 pounds, perhaps he could play 3-4 OLB, but under no circumstances do I see him as a starting LB in a 4-3 scheme because he just isn't fast enough.
Next year, Trent Murphy will be drafted, and probably within the first two days if he has a big Senior season. He was way better than Thomas as a Junior. At 6-6 and 260, he has NFL 3-4 OLB size, and his mobility is impressive.
Lack of size
After being under the impression Thomas was 6-4 and 250, he measured in at 6-3 237.Â
Not explosive, quick, or nimble enough
The combine and Stanford's Pro Day were unkind to Thomas. They exposed his lack of athleticism in a very sobering way.
Limited Senior Year Production
Thomas only had six sacks and 12 TFLs on the year. That's evidence that his lack of production is due to his lack of explosiveness, quickness, nimbleness, and size.
Scouts and GMs can overlook guys who don't show well in combine drills if they demonstrate they can produce on the field. Had Thomas registered say 10 sacks and had 20 TFLs, that might be overlooked.Â
I was stunned how after the combine Mike Mayock had Thomas rated as his #2 4-3 OLB. Just didn't make sense to me. What it said was Thomas isn't big enough to play 3-4 OLB in the NFL, but that Mayock still liked him as a football player. People paid to actually draft players for their teams disagreed, and concluded he just isn't an NFL athlete. That said, he's going to be given a chance to prove he can play at the next level. To me he is a good football player, but I question what his position is. If he could add 20 pounds, perhaps he could play 3-4 OLB, but under no circumstances do I see him as a starting LB in a 4-3 scheme because he just isn't fast enough.
Next year, Trent Murphy will be drafted, and probably within the first two days if he has a big Senior season. He was way better than Thomas as a Junior. At 6-6 and 260, he has NFL 3-4 OLB size, and his mobility is impressive.
Some guesses for the reasons Chase Thomas went undrafted:
Lack of size
After being under the impression Thomas was 6-4 and 250, he measured in at 6-3 237.Â
Not explosive, quick, or nimble enough
The combine and Stanford's Pro Day were unkind to Thomas. They exposed his lack of athleticism in a very sobering way.
Limited Senior Year Production
Thomas only had six sacks and 12 TFLs on the year. That's evidence that his lack of production is due to his lack of explosiveness, quickness, nimbleness, and size.
Scouts and GMs can overlook guys who don't show well in combine drills if they demonstrate they can produce on the field. Had Thomas registered say 10 sacks and had 20 TFLs, that might be overlooked.Â
I was stunned how after the combine Mike Mayock had Thomas rated as his #2 4-3 OLB. Just didn't make sense to me. What it said was Thomas isn't big enough to play 3-4 OLB in the NFL, but that Mayock still liked him as a football player. People paid to actually draft players for their teams disagreed, and concluded he just isn't an NFL athlete. That said, he's going to be given a chance to prove he can play at the next level. To me he is a good football player, but I question what his position is. If he could add 20 pounds, perhaps he could play 3-4 OLB, but under no circumstances do I see him as a starting LB in a 4-3 scheme because he just isn't fast enough.
Next year, Trent Murphy will be drafted, and probably within the first two days if he has a big Senior season. He was way better than Thomas as a Junior. At 6-6 and 260, he has NFL 3-4 OLB size, and his mobility is impressive.
Lack of size
After being under the impression Thomas was 6-4 and 250, he measured in at 6-3 237.Â
Not explosive, quick, or nimble enough
The combine and Stanford's Pro Day were unkind to Thomas. They exposed his lack of athleticism in a very sobering way.
Limited Senior Year Production
Thomas only had six sacks and 12 TFLs on the year. That's evidence that his lack of production is due to his lack of explosiveness, quickness, nimbleness, and size.
Scouts and GMs can overlook guys who don't show well in combine drills if they demonstrate they can produce on the field. Had Thomas registered say 10 sacks and had 20 TFLs, that might be overlooked.Â
I was stunned how after the combine Mike Mayock had Thomas rated as his #2 4-3 OLB. Just didn't make sense to me. What it said was Thomas isn't big enough to play 3-4 OLB in the NFL, but that Mayock still liked him as a football player. People paid to actually draft players for their teams disagreed, and concluded he just isn't an NFL athlete. That said, he's going to be given a chance to prove he can play at the next level. To me he is a good football player, but I question what his position is. If he could add 20 pounds, perhaps he could play 3-4 OLB, but under no circumstances do I see him as a starting LB in a 4-3 scheme because he just isn't fast enough.
Next year, Trent Murphy will be drafted, and probably within the first two days if he has a big Senior season. He was way better than Thomas as a Junior. At 6-6 and 260, he has NFL 3-4 OLB size, and his mobility is impressive.
04-28-2013, 08:40 AM
I believe this is also another example of how staying another year in college can hurt your draft stock.
Thomas put up better numbers his junior year 17.5 TFL, 8.5 sacks.
Watching (nearly) every game, I don't believe Thomas in any way regressed as a player. But, in the eyes of NFL scouts, he may have proven the limits of his "upside" in 2012.
Thomas put up better numbers his junior year 17.5 TFL, 8.5 sacks.
Watching (nearly) every game, I don't believe Thomas in any way regressed as a player. But, in the eyes of NFL scouts, he may have proven the limits of his "upside" in 2012.
I believe this is also another example of how staying another year in college can hurt your draft stock.
Thomas put up better numbers his junior year 17.5 TFL, 8.5 sacks.
Watching (nearly) every game, I don't believe Thomas in any way regressed as a player. But, in the eyes of NFL scouts, he may have proven the limits of his "upside" in 2012.
Thomas put up better numbers his junior year 17.5 TFL, 8.5 sacks.
Watching (nearly) every game, I don't believe Thomas in any way regressed as a player. But, in the eyes of NFL scouts, he may have proven the limits of his "upside" in 2012.
04-28-2013, 04:18 PM
(This post was last modified: 04-28-2013, 07:04 PM by Spiny_Norman.)
(04-28-2013, 08:40 AM)needle link Wrote:I believe this is also another example of how staying another year in college can hurt your draft stock.
Staying may have hurt Chase's status in the NFL draft, but he does have a Pac 12 championship ring and a Rose Bowl championship ring. So he's got that going for him which is nice.
"We have an unwritten rule around here not to do anything stupid."
-Casey Jacobsen, Feb 3, 2000
(This post was last modified: 04-28-2013, 07:04 PM by Spiny_Norman.)
(04-28-2013, 08:40 AM)needle link Wrote:I believe this is also another example of how staying another year in college can hurt your draft stock.
Staying may have hurt Chase's status in the NFL draft, but he does have a Pac 12 championship ring and a Rose Bowl championship ring. So he's got that going for him which is nice.
"We have an unwritten rule around here not to do anything stupid."
-Casey Jacobsen, Feb 3, 2000
04-28-2013, 05:01 PM
Chase spent a period of time training in Florida before the combine. I wonder if he lost a bunch of weight there in an effort to boost some of his measurables, esp. 40 and cone drill. Maybe the teams figured his measurables, as mediocre as they were, would only get worse once he packed on another 15 to 20 lbs.
Chase spent a period of time training in Florida before the combine. I wonder if he lost a bunch of weight there in an effort to boost some of his measurables, esp. 40 and cone drill. Maybe the teams figured his measurables, as mediocre as they were, would only get worse once he packed on another 15 to 20 lbs.
04-28-2013, 07:05 PM
He weighed 244 at the NFL combine so while he's not a brobdingnagian OLB he's big enough to be a serviceable backup if the talent is there.
04-29-2013, 02:11 PM
Can anyone tell me what the effects are of being hired as a free agent rather than being drafted?
Difference in salary? Or other contract effects?
Any material differences...
Difference in salary? Or other contract effects?
Any material differences...
Can anyone tell me what the effects are of being hired as a free agent rather than being drafted?
Difference in salary? Or other contract effects?
Any material differences...
Difference in salary? Or other contract effects?
Any material differences...
04-29-2013, 02:52 PM
(04-29-2013, 02:44 PM)garvin link Wrote:Once you actually get a contract, there is no difference. But it's much harder for undrafted free agents to get a fair look from pro teams. Just as college coaches spend most of their time on the guys to whom they've given scholarships, NFL and NBA coaches pay more attention to those in whom they've invested money. Some free agents do make teams, it's true. But not many.
I might be forgetting something, but last year didn't we have as many UDFAs make rosters as drafted players?
(04-29-2013, 02:44 PM)garvin link Wrote:Once you actually get a contract, there is no difference. But it's much harder for undrafted free agents to get a fair look from pro teams. Just as college coaches spend most of their time on the guys to whom they've given scholarships, NFL and NBA coaches pay more attention to those in whom they've invested money. Some free agents do make teams, it's true. But not many.
I might be forgetting something, but last year didn't we have as many UDFAs make rosters as drafted players?
04-29-2013, 03:06 PM
Free agents are much more likely to be drafted now that the draft is only seven rounds. When it was 11 rounds, teams were drafting their practice squads. The Jesse Sapolus were rare.
04-30-2013, 01:05 AM
Chase made one writer's list of 10 best UDFA signings. No-brainer there.
http://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2013/4/28/42...t-signings
Also, this article ranks him as the 85th best player overall.
http://www.sbnation.com/nfl-mock-draft/2...in/4040623
Quote:Chase Thomas, LB, New Orleans Saints
The stereotypical Stanford linebacker is strong and makes up for what he lacks in speed by being exceedingly smart. While that obviously isn't true of all Stanford linebackers, that fits Thomas perfectly. There are questions about whether he has the speed to cut it in the NFL, but he was a star for the Cardinals. He was a monster as a blitzer. Thomas is slightly undersized, but is still very strong and has every other tool you look for, which the Saints hope can mask his slower feet.
http://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2013/4/28/42...t-signings
Also, this article ranks him as the 85th best player overall.
http://www.sbnation.com/nfl-mock-draft/2...in/4040623
Chase made one writer's list of 10 best UDFA signings. No-brainer there.
http://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2013/4/28/42...t-signings
Also, this article ranks him as the 85th best player overall.
http://www.sbnation.com/nfl-mock-draft/2...in/4040623
Quote:Chase Thomas, LB, New Orleans Saints
The stereotypical Stanford linebacker is strong and makes up for what he lacks in speed by being exceedingly smart. While that obviously isn't true of all Stanford linebackers, that fits Thomas perfectly. There are questions about whether he has the speed to cut it in the NFL, but he was a star for the Cardinals. He was a monster as a blitzer. Thomas is slightly undersized, but is still very strong and has every other tool you look for, which the Saints hope can mask his slower feet.
http://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2013/4/28/42...t-signings
Also, this article ranks him as the 85th best player overall.
http://www.sbnation.com/nfl-mock-draft/2...in/4040623
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