[Genuine Realist]

I disagree. I think we need community transmission to be functionally zero or close before considering reopening. I dont think we can keep our ICUs 2/3 full of covid at a constant plateau. No cushion for an unexpected outbreak, and we wouldn't be able to get back to seeing and taking care of even semi urgent noncovid health matters.

I appreciate that that is the medically sound approach, but also that is a bit blinkered. Outside the realm of medical values is another universe of values, economic, societal, and so on, which are being damaged. At some point, the damage to the other values outweighs the basic medical calculus. At what point that is the big, unanswered - possibly unanswerable - question.

This is the reason why the present dismal state of political dialog concerns me. Forget the particular occupant of the White House for the moments. No matter how the balance is drawn, it is rhetorically possible to damn the decision, since the choice is between greater and lesser evils. Someone is going to get hurt no matter what - either scandalously high mortality rates, or scandalously high unemployment, the scandal being in the eye of the beholder. The media can be counted on to do maximum damage to any assumption of good faith. My trust is in the American people to rally through - certainly not in any political or media institution.

[Genuine Realist]

I disagree. I think we need community transmission to be functionally zero or close before considering reopening. I dont think we can keep our ICUs 2/3 full of covid at a constant plateau. No cushion for an unexpected outbreak, and we wouldn't be able to get back to seeing and taking care of even semi urgent noncovid health matters.

I appreciate that that is the medically sound approach, but also that is a bit blinkered. Outside the realm of medical values is another universe of values, economic, societal, and so on, which are being damaged. At some point, the damage to the other values outweighs the basic medical calculus. At what point that is the big, unanswered - possibly unanswerable - question.

This is the reason why the present dismal state of political dialog concerns me. Forget the particular occupant of the White House for the moments. No matter how the balance is drawn, it is rhetorically possible to damn the decision, since the choice is between greater and lesser evils. Someone is going to get hurt no matter what - either scandalously high mortality rates, or scandalously high unemployment, the scandal being in the eye of the beholder. The media can be counted on to do maximum damage to any assumption of good faith. My trust is in the American people to rally through - certainly not in any political or media institution.