[TheFarm07]

At the start of the 4th Williams made a brilliant basket-and-one, converting on her free throw, and followed it up on the next possession with a trey that was assisted by McPhee, and just like that we were ahead 63-49.  The rest of the way it seemed we were attempting to be quite deliberate on offense, trying to get deep into the shot clock each time.  This was not great for our stats and probably was premature.  C.al made treys, free throws, and jumpers and got the game down to 4 points with 17 seconds left but Williams and McPhee made just enough free throws to keep us ahead in a two possession game.

I don't get why we do this and it's not just a recent phenomenon. Even when we were still the clear favorite in the Pac-12, we would give up big leads. I remember one game against Ca.l when we were up by 30 and they still managed to claw back to within single digits, because we started playing conservatively, wasting clock and then throwing off a bad shot or turning the ball over when the shot clock ran out. That leads to bad habits and losing games when you shouldn't.

One bad call or bad decision could tie the game and then who knows what happens. We should play to finish opponents off. I know people don't like it when Geno keeps his starters in even in a blowout and wins by an insane scoreline, but we don't have to necessarily replicate that. If we are so concerned about the optics of that, I would be fine with our second team out there, but playing as it was like the first half of the game and playing like normal rather than being so concerned about running out the clock.

Especially with this team, which is struggling with their consistency on offense, I think it just messes them up at a time when they can ill afford to, esp. with the postseason coming up.

[TheFarm07]

At the start of the 4th Williams made a brilliant basket-and-one, converting on her free throw, and followed it up on the next possession with a trey that was assisted by McPhee, and just like that we were ahead 63-49.  The rest of the way it seemed we were attempting to be quite deliberate on offense, trying to get deep into the shot clock each time.  This was not great for our stats and probably was premature.  C.al made treys, free throws, and jumpers and got the game down to 4 points with 17 seconds left but Williams and McPhee made just enough free throws to keep us ahead in a two possession game.

I don't get why we do this and it's not just a recent phenomenon. Even when we were still the clear favorite in the Pac-12, we would give up big leads. I remember one game against Ca.l when we were up by 30 and they still managed to claw back to within single digits, because we started playing conservatively, wasting clock and then throwing off a bad shot or turning the ball over when the shot clock ran out. That leads to bad habits and losing games when you shouldn't.

One bad call or bad decision could tie the game and then who knows what happens. We should play to finish opponents off. I know people don't like it when Geno keeps his starters in even in a blowout and wins by an insane scoreline, but we don't have to necessarily replicate that. If we are so concerned about the optics of that, I would be fine with our second team out there, but playing as it was like the first half of the game and playing like normal rather than being so concerned about running out the clock.

Especially with this team, which is struggling with their consistency on offense, I think it just messes them up at a time when they can ill afford to, esp. with the postseason coming up.

[JJJ]

22-13 at the quarter, after having led by as much as 11.  Band got to chant 2x+4 twice, at 14-5 and 18-7.

I did not know that 2x+4 was a thing for Band (or for anyone else, for that matter). Would anyone care to enlighten me?  :-[

[JJJ]

22-13 at the quarter, after having led by as much as 11.  Band got to chant 2x+4 twice, at 14-5 and 18-7.

I did not know that 2x+4 was a thing for Band (or for anyone else, for that matter). Would anyone care to enlighten me?  :-[

[CompSci87]

[quote author=CompSci87 link=topic=18737.msg224054#msg224054 date=1518751535]
22-13 at the quarter, after having led by as much as 11.  Band got to chant 2x+4 twice, at 14-5 and 18-7.

I did not know that 2x+4 was a thing for Band (or for anyone else, for that matter). Would anyone care to enlighten me?  :-[
[/quote]
They like to taunt opponents with "2x + 4, where x is your score" whenever Stanford's score is twice the opponent's score, plus 4.

[CompSci87]

[quote author=CompSci87 link=topic=18737.msg224054#msg224054 date=1518751535]
22-13 at the quarter, after having led by as much as 11.  Band got to chant 2x+4 twice, at 14-5 and 18-7.

I did not know that 2x+4 was a thing for Band (or for anyone else, for that matter). Would anyone care to enlighten me?  :-[
[/quote]
They like to taunt opponents with "2x + 4, where x is your score" whenever Stanford's score is twice the opponent's score, plus 4.

[81alum]

After the nightmare of officiating we had on Sunday, perhaps we should take a moment to say that Penny Davis, Karin Lasuik, and Tiffany Bird seemed to do a reasonable job.  There were a few calls I disagreed with, but it was a relief to have the refs generally disappear into the game. 

[81alum]

After the nightmare of officiating we had on Sunday, perhaps we should take a moment to say that Penny Davis, Karin Lasuik, and Tiffany Bird seemed to do a reasonable job.  There were a few calls I disagreed with, but it was a relief to have the refs generally disappear into the game. 

[M T]

After the nightmare of officiating we had on Sunday, perhaps we should take a moment to say that Penny Davis, Karin Lasuik, and Tiffany Bird seemed to do a reasonable job.  There were a few calls I disagreed with, but it was a relief to have the refs generally disappear into the game.

I was going to sarcasticly say that they weren't doing their job as they didn't go to the monitor once.  But I do remember an official timeout.  On the TV they suggested it was to see how many fouls Brittany had (which was 0 at the time).  I can see them trying to make sure they called the foul on the right person, but I don't think they would stop play to get a count of the fouls on someone who wasn't close to 5.  I'll have to see if I can tell what happened in the video.

Yes, it is nice to have officials referee a game rather than dictate it.

[M T]

After the nightmare of officiating we had on Sunday, perhaps we should take a moment to say that Penny Davis, Karin Lasuik, and Tiffany Bird seemed to do a reasonable job.  There were a few calls I disagreed with, but it was a relief to have the refs generally disappear into the game.

I was going to sarcasticly say that they weren't doing their job as they didn't go to the monitor once.  But I do remember an official timeout.  On the TV they suggested it was to see how many fouls Brittany had (which was 0 at the time).  I can see them trying to make sure they called the foul on the right person, but I don't think they would stop play to get a count of the fouls on someone who wasn't close to 5.  I'll have to see if I can tell what happened in the video.

Yes, it is nice to have officials referee a game rather than dictate it.

[mbdude]

Smith crashed into Davidson in in 3rd qtr and fell to the floor. at the next timeout she went into the locker room for a few minutes. she sat for a while before returning in 4th so she missed quite a bit of time due to that.  Announcers didn't know or notice
After her quick start I also was hoping this would be her breakout game. Tara at halftime interview even said Alanna needs to stay out of foul trouble

[mbdude]

Smith crashed into Davidson in in 3rd qtr and fell to the floor. at the next timeout she went into the locker room for a few minutes. she sat for a while before returning in 4th so she missed quite a bit of time due to that.  Announcers didn't know or notice
After her quick start I also was hoping this would be her breakout game. Tara at halftime interview even said Alanna needs to stay out of foul trouble

[81alum]

Smith crashed into Davidson in in 3rd qtr and fell to the floor. at the next timeout she went into the locker room for a few minutes. she sat for a while before returning in 4th so she missed quite a bit of time due to that.  Announcers didn't know or notice
After her quick start I also was hoping this would be her breakout game. Tara at halftime interview even said Alanna needs to stay out of foul trouble

That might explain some stuff if she were shaken up.  She did have 2 fouls which cut her minutes in the first half so I understand why Tara said what she did.  But then I think Fingall was playing well enough that Tara did not feel the need to rush Smith back in even when her foul situation would have permitted it.  And if Smith was shaken, then it makes even more sense that she played just half the game.

[81alum]

Smith crashed into Davidson in in 3rd qtr and fell to the floor. at the next timeout she went into the locker room for a few minutes. she sat for a while before returning in 4th so she missed quite a bit of time due to that.  Announcers didn't know or notice
After her quick start I also was hoping this would be her breakout game. Tara at halftime interview even said Alanna needs to stay out of foul trouble

That might explain some stuff if she were shaken up.  She did have 2 fouls which cut her minutes in the first half so I understand why Tara said what she did.  But then I think Fingall was playing well enough that Tara did not feel the need to rush Smith back in even when her foul situation would have permitted it.  And if Smith was shaken, then it makes even more sense that she played just half the game.

[BobK]

One FG in 23 minutes for a Naismith finalist is defense MT.

😳😀👌

[BobK]

One FG in 23 minutes for a Naismith finalist is defense MT.

😳😀👌

[oldalum]

One way to partly counter Tara's defense against the best opponent is to replace that player with another. 

I thought the point of not letting the other team's best player beat you is making their other players have to beat you. They might do it, but it'll be harder for them to do than letting their star take advantage of 1 on 1 matchups. That replacement player off the bench is usually that team's 6th best player (or worse), making it easier to defend the remaining players left on the floor than when the best player is out there (and often helping our offense as well). Seems to me that the other team benching their star player is the ultimate success of Tara's defense. Now if the other team can make that work, more power to them, but it doesn't invalidate or weaken the defensive strategy because you don't know how much you would have lost by if you had let their star player do her thing.

[oldalum]

One way to partly counter Tara's defense against the best opponent is to replace that player with another. 

I thought the point of not letting the other team's best player beat you is making their other players have to beat you. They might do it, but it'll be harder for them to do than letting their star take advantage of 1 on 1 matchups. That replacement player off the bench is usually that team's 6th best player (or worse), making it easier to defend the remaining players left on the floor than when the best player is out there (and often helping our offense as well). Seems to me that the other team benching their star player is the ultimate success of Tara's defense. Now if the other team can make that work, more power to them, but it doesn't invalidate or weaken the defensive strategy because you don't know how much you would have lost by if you had let their star player do her thing.

[81alum]

One FG in 23 minutes for a Naismith finalist is defense MT.

😳😀👌

Yes, Bob, that is good, BUT:
In the Pac 12 our defense is excellent, allowing an average of 56 pts on only 35% shooting.

Last night we gave up 69 points on 41% shooting.  C.al scored 13 points more and shot 6% better than our average--and we have already played all the best offensive teams.

Keeping Anigwe down was good, but our overall defense was distinctly sub-par.  Tara's scouting report defense did what it was supposed to do.  Our players executed it the way they were supposed to.  Anigwe was denied.  But while the tactics worked the strategy failed.  C.al still scored way more than they should have, and turned it into a very tight game.

Put it another way--in Pac 12 games C.al is scoring on average 62 points per game--the second worse offense in the league.  Against Stanford, supposedly the best defense, their performance improved.  We can do better.

[81alum]

One FG in 23 minutes for a Naismith finalist is defense MT.

😳😀👌

Yes, Bob, that is good, BUT:
In the Pac 12 our defense is excellent, allowing an average of 56 pts on only 35% shooting.

Last night we gave up 69 points on 41% shooting.  C.al scored 13 points more and shot 6% better than our average--and we have already played all the best offensive teams.

Keeping Anigwe down was good, but our overall defense was distinctly sub-par.  Tara's scouting report defense did what it was supposed to do.  Our players executed it the way they were supposed to.  Anigwe was denied.  But while the tactics worked the strategy failed.  C.al still scored way more than they should have, and turned it into a very tight game.

Put it another way--in Pac 12 games C.al is scoring on average 62 points per game--the second worse offense in the league.  Against Stanford, supposedly the best defense, their performance improved.  We can do better.

[JJJ]

[quote author=JJJ link=topic=18737.msg224069#msg224069 date=1518777071]
[quote author=CompSci87 link=topic=18737.msg224054#msg224054 date=1518751535]
22-13 at the quarter, after having led by as much as 11.  Band got to chant 2x+4 twice, at 14-5 and 18-7.

I did not know that 2x+4 was a thing for Band (or for anyone else, for that matter). Would anyone care to enlighten me?  :-[
[/quote]
They like to taunt opponents with "2x + 4, where x is your score" whenever Stanford's score is twice the opponent's score, plus 4.
[/quote]
Clearly, it's been way too long since I've been to a game with Band in attendance... Thanks!

[JJJ]

[quote author=JJJ link=topic=18737.msg224069#msg224069 date=1518777071]
[quote author=CompSci87 link=topic=18737.msg224054#msg224054 date=1518751535]
22-13 at the quarter, after having led by as much as 11.  Band got to chant 2x+4 twice, at 14-5 and 18-7.

I did not know that 2x+4 was a thing for Band (or for anyone else, for that matter). Would anyone care to enlighten me?  :-[
[/quote]
They like to taunt opponents with "2x + 4, where x is your score" whenever Stanford's score is twice the opponent's score, plus 4.
[/quote]
Clearly, it's been way too long since I've been to a game with Band in attendance... Thanks!