03-22-2019, 09:55 AM
Reid Travis on why he left Stanford
03-22-2019, 03:48 PM
Getting a degree doesn't matter so much to me. Had Bill Gates gone to Stanford, and left without a degree, I would still "claim him" as a Stanford guy. So why would I treat athletes any differently? The degree isn't a magical passport--once conferred you immediately receive special knowledge and wisdom! Once you've gotten from Stanford what you think you need to succeed in the world, move on with confidence.
Getting a degree doesn't matter so much to me. Had Bill Gates gone to Stanford, and left without a degree, I would still "claim him" as a Stanford guy. So why would I treat athletes any differently? The degree isn't a magical passport--once conferred you immediately receive special knowledge and wisdom! Once you've gotten from Stanford what you think you need to succeed in the world, move on with confidence.
03-22-2019, 05:54 PM
(03-22-2019, 03:48 PM)FarmBoy Wrote: Getting a degree doesn't matter so much to me. Had Bill Gates gone to Stanford, and left without a degree, I would still "claim him" as a Stanford guy. So why would I treat athletes any differently? The degree isn't a magical passport--once conferred you immediately receive special knowledge and wisdom! Once you've gotten from Stanford what you think you need to succeed in the world, move on with confidence.
There's a bit of a difference (maybe), which is that Bill Gates wasn't recruited into Harvard for the possibility of him building the biggest software company in the world. Most of the athletes are specifically recruited for the sport they play in, so when athletes go pro without their degree, it has a bit more of a mercenary feel.
BC
(03-22-2019, 03:48 PM)FarmBoy Wrote: Getting a degree doesn't matter so much to me. Had Bill Gates gone to Stanford, and left without a degree, I would still "claim him" as a Stanford guy. So why would I treat athletes any differently? The degree isn't a magical passport--once conferred you immediately receive special knowledge and wisdom! Once you've gotten from Stanford what you think you need to succeed in the world, move on with confidence.
There's a bit of a difference (maybe), which is that Bill Gates wasn't recruited into Harvard for the possibility of him building the biggest software company in the world. Most of the athletes are specifically recruited for the sport they play in, so when athletes go pro without their degree, it has a bit more of a mercenary feel.
BC
03-22-2019, 11:49 PM
(03-21-2019, 09:12 AM)burger Wrote: As a basketball fan, I hope he does get drafted. But as a Stanford fan, I have mixed feelings. I would hate to see the "you have to leave Stanford to succeed" narrative get legs.
If you have the talent, it shouldn't matter. Todd Lichti, 15th pick in the first round. For that matter, Steve Nash was the 15th pick in the first round.
Audaces fortuna iuvat
(03-21-2019, 09:12 AM)burger Wrote: As a basketball fan, I hope he does get drafted. But as a Stanford fan, I have mixed feelings. I would hate to see the "you have to leave Stanford to succeed" narrative get legs.
If you have the talent, it shouldn't matter. Todd Lichti, 15th pick in the first round. For that matter, Steve Nash was the 15th pick in the first round.
Audaces fortuna iuvat
03-23-2019, 07:21 PM
(03-22-2019, 05:54 PM)BostonCard Wrote:(03-22-2019, 03:48 PM)FarmBoy Wrote: Getting a degree doesn't matter so much to me. Had Bill Gates gone to Stanford, and left without a degree, I would still "claim him" as a Stanford guy. So why would I treat athletes any differently? The degree isn't a magical passport--once conferred you immediately receive special knowledge and wisdom! Once you've gotten from Stanford what you think you need to succeed in the world, move on with confidence.
There's a bit of a difference (maybe), which is that Bill Gates wasn't recruited into Harvard for the possibility of him building the biggest software company in the world. Most of the athletes are specifically recruited for the sport they play in, so when athletes go pro without their degree, it has a bit more of a mercenary feel.
BC
You're right. Any student who is being recruited/flattered to attend a school, let alone given a financial incentive (scholarship) is going to be more mercenary than a student who has to go through the admissions office and pay full boat. I always take student athletes claims of loving their school with a grain of salt, even Stanford student athletes. But I don't see why that changes the equation in terms of considering someone a "Stanford guy". They may be mercenaries, but they're our mercenaries.
(03-22-2019, 05:54 PM)BostonCard Wrote:(03-22-2019, 03:48 PM)FarmBoy Wrote: Getting a degree doesn't matter so much to me. Had Bill Gates gone to Stanford, and left without a degree, I would still "claim him" as a Stanford guy. So why would I treat athletes any differently? The degree isn't a magical passport--once conferred you immediately receive special knowledge and wisdom! Once you've gotten from Stanford what you think you need to succeed in the world, move on with confidence.
There's a bit of a difference (maybe), which is that Bill Gates wasn't recruited into Harvard for the possibility of him building the biggest software company in the world. Most of the athletes are specifically recruited for the sport they play in, so when athletes go pro without their degree, it has a bit more of a mercenary feel.
BC
You're right. Any student who is being recruited/flattered to attend a school, let alone given a financial incentive (scholarship) is going to be more mercenary than a student who has to go through the admissions office and pay full boat. I always take student athletes claims of loving their school with a grain of salt, even Stanford student athletes. But I don't see why that changes the equation in terms of considering someone a "Stanford guy". They may be mercenaries, but they're our mercenaries.
03-23-2019, 10:00 PM
(This post was last modified: 03-23-2019, 10:00 PM by TreesAndBirds.)
Travis lead Kentucky in points (14) and rebounds (11) as they beat Wofford by 6.
(This post was last modified: 03-23-2019, 10:00 PM by TreesAndBirds.)
Travis lead Kentucky in points (14) and rebounds (11) as they beat Wofford by 6.
03-23-2019, 10:46 PM
(03-23-2019, 07:21 PM)FarmBoy Wrote:(03-22-2019, 05:54 PM)BostonCard Wrote:(03-22-2019, 03:48 PM)FarmBoy Wrote: Getting a degree doesn't matter so much to me. Had Bill Gates gone to Stanford, and left without a degree, I would still "claim him" as a Stanford guy. So why would I treat athletes any differently? The degree isn't a magical passport--once conferred you immediately receive special knowledge and wisdom! Once you've gotten from Stanford what you think you need to succeed in the world, move on with confidence.
There's a bit of a difference (maybe), which is that Bill Gates wasn't recruited into Harvard for the possibility of him building the biggest software company in the world. Most of the athletes are specifically recruited for the sport they play in, so when athletes go pro without their degree, it has a bit more of a mercenary feel.
BC
You're right. Any student who is being recruited/flattered to attend a school, let alone given a financial incentive (scholarship) is going to be more mercenary than a student who has to go through the admissions office and pay full boat. I always take student athletes claims of loving their school with a grain of salt, even Stanford student athletes. But I don't see why that changes the equation in terms of considering someone a "Stanford guy". They may be mercenaries, but they're our mercenaries.
There was an article a while back, either in the New Yorker or The Atlantic which held that recruited athletes actually gave back more to their schools than average students, among other items of interest.
Audaces fortuna iuvat
(03-23-2019, 07:21 PM)FarmBoy Wrote:(03-22-2019, 05:54 PM)BostonCard Wrote:(03-22-2019, 03:48 PM)FarmBoy Wrote: Getting a degree doesn't matter so much to me. Had Bill Gates gone to Stanford, and left without a degree, I would still "claim him" as a Stanford guy. So why would I treat athletes any differently? The degree isn't a magical passport--once conferred you immediately receive special knowledge and wisdom! Once you've gotten from Stanford what you think you need to succeed in the world, move on with confidence.
There's a bit of a difference (maybe), which is that Bill Gates wasn't recruited into Harvard for the possibility of him building the biggest software company in the world. Most of the athletes are specifically recruited for the sport they play in, so when athletes go pro without their degree, it has a bit more of a mercenary feel.
BC
You're right. Any student who is being recruited/flattered to attend a school, let alone given a financial incentive (scholarship) is going to be more mercenary than a student who has to go through the admissions office and pay full boat. I always take student athletes claims of loving their school with a grain of salt, even Stanford student athletes. But I don't see why that changes the equation in terms of considering someone a "Stanford guy". They may be mercenaries, but they're our mercenaries.
There was an article a while back, either in the New Yorker or The Atlantic which held that recruited athletes actually gave back more to their schools than average students, among other items of interest.
Audaces fortuna iuvat
03-24-2019, 05:01 AM
(This post was last modified: 03-24-2019, 05:01 AM by OutsiderFan.)
Travis actually was key to UK’s Wofford win, but they would have lost had the NCAA’s all-time 3pt FG maker made say 3/12 instead of 0/12 3pt FGs.
I was particularly struck how Travis made all his FTs down the stretch. He always missed big FTs for Stanford. More importantly, Stanford needed Travis to be its primary offensive option most of the time. Even with UK’s best player out, Travis is a role player who gets touches, but isn’t the primary or even secondary option when he’s on the floor most of the time. This role suits him.
I was particularly struck how Travis made all his FTs down the stretch. He always missed big FTs for Stanford. More importantly, Stanford needed Travis to be its primary offensive option most of the time. Even with UK’s best player out, Travis is a role player who gets touches, but isn’t the primary or even secondary option when he’s on the floor most of the time. This role suits him.
(This post was last modified: 03-24-2019, 05:01 AM by OutsiderFan.)
Travis actually was key to UK’s Wofford win, but they would have lost had the NCAA’s all-time 3pt FG maker made say 3/12 instead of 0/12 3pt FGs.
I was particularly struck how Travis made all his FTs down the stretch. He always missed big FTs for Stanford. More importantly, Stanford needed Travis to be its primary offensive option most of the time. Even with UK’s best player out, Travis is a role player who gets touches, but isn’t the primary or even secondary option when he’s on the floor most of the time. This role suits him.
I was particularly struck how Travis made all his FTs down the stretch. He always missed big FTs for Stanford. More importantly, Stanford needed Travis to be its primary offensive option most of the time. Even with UK’s best player out, Travis is a role player who gets touches, but isn’t the primary or even secondary option when he’s on the floor most of the time. This role suits him.
03-24-2019, 06:29 PM
for what it's worth, Johnny Dawkins' new team very nearly beat Zion Williamson and Duke
http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketb...on-barrett
http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketb...on-barrett
Cal delenda est
for what it's worth, Johnny Dawkins' new team very nearly beat Zion Williamson and Duke
http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketb...on-barrett
http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketb...on-barrett
Cal delenda est
03-24-2019, 06:32 PM
(03-24-2019, 06:29 PM)newguy Wrote: for what it's worth, Johnny Dawkins' new team very nearly beat Zion Williamson and Duke
http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketb...on-barrett
What it's worth to Stanford fans = $0.01. He did put together a good game plan though.
Actually, it may be worth quite a bit to Stanford fans if it results in Cal hiring him on, as is being suggested by some Bay Area sports writer...
(03-24-2019, 06:29 PM)newguy Wrote: for what it's worth, Johnny Dawkins' new team very nearly beat Zion Williamson and Duke
http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketb...on-barrett
What it's worth to Stanford fans = $0.01. He did put together a good game plan though.
Actually, it may be worth quite a bit to Stanford fans if it results in Cal hiring him on, as is being suggested by some Bay Area sports writer...
03-24-2019, 09:03 PM
03-25-2019, 06:59 AM
(03-21-2019, 09:13 AM)ColoradoTree Wrote: I can't fault his decision one bit. I'm glad he came to Stanford, and I'm not disappointed in him--I'm disappointed in our program that we weren't a more attractive option for him.
Same here, but I do think the article is a dig at Stanford and justifiably so. While I don't think the program can rise to the level of Kentucky's in terms of having a large amount of pre-NBA talent, I think if the program were at the level it was at before Dawkins he would have stayed. The gap was way too large for him to not look elsewhere.
He graduated. He finished his seasons here. I'll root for him.
(03-21-2019, 09:13 AM)ColoradoTree Wrote: I can't fault his decision one bit. I'm glad he came to Stanford, and I'm not disappointed in him--I'm disappointed in our program that we weren't a more attractive option for him.
Same here, but I do think the article is a dig at Stanford and justifiably so. While I don't think the program can rise to the level of Kentucky's in terms of having a large amount of pre-NBA talent, I think if the program were at the level it was at before Dawkins he would have stayed. The gap was way too large for him to not look elsewhere.
He graduated. He finished his seasons here. I'll root for him.
03-25-2019, 12:00 PM
(03-25-2019, 06:59 AM)winflop Wrote:(03-21-2019, 09:13 AM)ColoradoTree Wrote: I can't fault his decision one bit. I'm glad he came to Stanford, and I'm not disappointed in him--I'm disappointed in our program that we weren't a more attractive option for him.
Same here, but I do think the article is a dig at Stanford and justifiably so. While I don't think the program can rise to the level of Kentucky's in terms of having a large amount of pre-NBA talent, I think if the program were at the level it was at before Dawkins he would have stayed. The gap was way too large for him to not look elsewhere.
He graduated. He finished his seasons here. I'll root for him.
Last I checked, the program he left was coached by Haase, not Dawkins.
(03-25-2019, 06:59 AM)winflop Wrote:(03-21-2019, 09:13 AM)ColoradoTree Wrote: I can't fault his decision one bit. I'm glad he came to Stanford, and I'm not disappointed in him--I'm disappointed in our program that we weren't a more attractive option for him.
Same here, but I do think the article is a dig at Stanford and justifiably so. While I don't think the program can rise to the level of Kentucky's in terms of having a large amount of pre-NBA talent, I think if the program were at the level it was at before Dawkins he would have stayed. The gap was way too large for him to not look elsewhere.
He graduated. He finished his seasons here. I'll root for him.
Last I checked, the program he left was coached by Haase, not Dawkins.
03-25-2019, 12:23 PM
(03-25-2019, 12:00 PM)76lsjumb Wrote:(03-25-2019, 06:59 AM)winflop Wrote: Same here, but I do think the article is a dig at Stanford and justifiably so. While I don't think the program can rise to the level of Kentucky's in terms of having a large amount of pre-NBA talent, I think if the program were at the level it was at before Dawkins he would have stayed. The gap was way too large for him to not look elsewhere.
He graduated. He finished his seasons here. I'll root for him.
Last I checked, the program he left was coached by Haase, not Dawkins.
You missed the point. The program wasn't at pre-Dawkins level regardless of coach. Didn't help, of course, that Dawkins WASN'T the coach anymore.
(03-25-2019, 12:00 PM)76lsjumb Wrote:(03-25-2019, 06:59 AM)winflop Wrote: Same here, but I do think the article is a dig at Stanford and justifiably so. While I don't think the program can rise to the level of Kentucky's in terms of having a large amount of pre-NBA talent, I think if the program were at the level it was at before Dawkins he would have stayed. The gap was way too large for him to not look elsewhere.
He graduated. He finished his seasons here. I'll root for him.
Last I checked, the program he left was coached by Haase, not Dawkins.
You missed the point. The program wasn't at pre-Dawkins level regardless of coach. Didn't help, of course, that Dawkins WASN'T the coach anymore.
03-25-2019, 12:38 PM
(03-25-2019, 12:00 PM)76lsjumb Wrote:(03-25-2019, 06:59 AM)winflop Wrote:(03-21-2019, 09:13 AM)ColoradoTree Wrote: I can't fault his decision one bit. I'm glad he came to Stanford, and I'm not disappointed in him--I'm disappointed in our program that we weren't a more attractive option for him.
Same here, but I do think the article is a dig at Stanford and justifiably so. While I don't think the program can rise to the level of Kentucky's in terms of having a large amount of pre-NBA talent, I think if the program were at the level it was at before Dawkins he would have stayed. The gap was way too large for him to not look elsewhere.
He graduated. He finished his seasons here. I'll root for him.
Last I checked, the program he left was coached by Haase, not Dawkins.
Fully aware of that. I see little difference between the two in terms of program quality and in their ability to get a player of Travis' caliber to stay. I will be shocked if Okpala stays too.
(03-25-2019, 12:00 PM)76lsjumb Wrote:(03-25-2019, 06:59 AM)winflop Wrote:(03-21-2019, 09:13 AM)ColoradoTree Wrote: I can't fault his decision one bit. I'm glad he came to Stanford, and I'm not disappointed in him--I'm disappointed in our program that we weren't a more attractive option for him.
Same here, but I do think the article is a dig at Stanford and justifiably so. While I don't think the program can rise to the level of Kentucky's in terms of having a large amount of pre-NBA talent, I think if the program were at the level it was at before Dawkins he would have stayed. The gap was way too large for him to not look elsewhere.
He graduated. He finished his seasons here. I'll root for him.
Last I checked, the program he left was coached by Haase, not Dawkins.
Fully aware of that. I see little difference between the two in terms of program quality and in their ability to get a player of Travis' caliber to stay. I will be shocked if Okpala stays too.
03-25-2019, 03:52 PM
(This post was last modified: 03-25-2019, 04:49 PM by BostonCard.
Edit Reason: Fixed the quote
)
Quote:Fully aware of that. I see little difference between the two in terms of program quality and in their ability to get a player of Travis' caliber to stay. I will be shocked if Okpala stays too.
If Okpala is a first round pick, which mock drafts seem to indicate, I don't think you can argue he's leaving because the program isn't good enough. It's just the way of the world.
(This post was last modified: 03-25-2019, 04:49 PM by BostonCard.
Edit Reason: Fixed the quote
)
Quote:Fully aware of that. I see little difference between the two in terms of program quality and in their ability to get a player of Travis' caliber to stay. I will be shocked if Okpala stays too.
If Okpala is a first round pick, which mock drafts seem to indicate, I don't think you can argue he's leaving because the program isn't good enough. It's just the way of the world.
03-25-2019, 04:54 PM
(This post was last modified: 03-26-2019, 09:33 AM by BostonCard.)
(03-22-2019, 09:03 AM)ColoradoTree Wrote: Again, I don't begrudge Reid Travis anything. Good for him. But he went to another school, so he's necessarily not our guy and our guy alone anymore.
I'll go further and say that had I been in Travis' shoes (which is an odd thing for someone 5'11" and "basketball challenged" to say the least), I would have considered leaving. Unless there were a particular Stanford graduate degree I wanted to pursue or had a particular affinity for my coach or teammates or some other reason to stay, why not spend a year where I had a chance to play for a top-10 caliber team and have a near guaranteed shot at playing in the NCAA tournament and maybe improve my draft standing?
BC
(This post was last modified: 03-26-2019, 09:33 AM by BostonCard.)
(03-22-2019, 09:03 AM)ColoradoTree Wrote: Again, I don't begrudge Reid Travis anything. Good for him. But he went to another school, so he's necessarily not our guy and our guy alone anymore.
I'll go further and say that had I been in Travis' shoes (which is an odd thing for someone 5'11" and "basketball challenged" to say the least), I would have considered leaving. Unless there were a particular Stanford graduate degree I wanted to pursue or had a particular affinity for my coach or teammates or some other reason to stay, why not spend a year where I had a chance to play for a top-10 caliber team and have a near guaranteed shot at playing in the NCAA tournament and maybe improve my draft standing?
BC
03-26-2019, 12:18 PM
(03-25-2019, 04:54 PM)BostonCard Wrote:(03-22-2019, 09:03 AM)ColoradoTree Wrote: Again, I don't begrudge Reid Travis anything. Good for him. But he went to another school, so he's necessarily not our guy and our guy alone anymore.
I'll go further and say that had I been in Travis' shoes (which is an odd thing for someone 5'11" and "basketball challenged" to say the least), I would have considered leaving. Unless there were a particular Stanford graduate degree I wanted to pursue or had a particular affinity for my coach or teammates or some other reason to stay, why not spend a year where I had a chance to play for a top-10 caliber team and have a near guaranteed shot at playing in the NCAA tournament and maybe improve my draft standing?
BC
This is a great perspective. The guy spent 4 years on campus, was a leader for the team, got his degree, and wanted to further his career goals of playing professional ball in the best way available. This is a pragmatic decision that while it means he probably doesn't "bleed Cardinal red" (figuratively speaking), it's a decision that 90+% of Stanford students would probably make in the same situation.
(03-25-2019, 04:54 PM)BostonCard Wrote:(03-22-2019, 09:03 AM)ColoradoTree Wrote: Again, I don't begrudge Reid Travis anything. Good for him. But he went to another school, so he's necessarily not our guy and our guy alone anymore.
I'll go further and say that had I been in Travis' shoes (which is an odd thing for someone 5'11" and "basketball challenged" to say the least), I would have considered leaving. Unless there were a particular Stanford graduate degree I wanted to pursue or had a particular affinity for my coach or teammates or some other reason to stay, why not spend a year where I had a chance to play for a top-10 caliber team and have a near guaranteed shot at playing in the NCAA tournament and maybe improve my draft standing?
BC
This is a great perspective. The guy spent 4 years on campus, was a leader for the team, got his degree, and wanted to further his career goals of playing professional ball in the best way available. This is a pragmatic decision that while it means he probably doesn't "bleed Cardinal red" (figuratively speaking), it's a decision that 90+% of Stanford students would probably make in the same situation.
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