[needle]

  Using the above logic, that would just argue that acceleration forces would just be transmitted to the head faster, rather then having a bit of a crumple zone in a more loosely fitted helmet.

Did anyone watch the 49ers-Eagles game? After the helmet of a 49ers player came off, I believe it was Darryl Johnson (former Dallas Cowboys fullback, mostly in the '90s) who said that when he played, helmets were always worn to fit very snugly, but that is no longer true. I think he said something like the looser helmets allow for some helmet rotation without the force of a hit passing (more) directly to the player.

Personally, I worry more and more that a helmet-less player is going to get a headshot.

[needle]

  Using the above logic, that would just argue that acceleration forces would just be transmitted to the head faster, rather then having a bit of a crumple zone in a more loosely fitted helmet.

Did anyone watch the 49ers-Eagles game? After the helmet of a 49ers player came off, I believe it was Darryl Johnson (former Dallas Cowboys fullback, mostly in the '90s) who said that when he played, helmets were always worn to fit very snugly, but that is no longer true. I think he said something like the looser helmets allow for some helmet rotation without the force of a hit passing (more) directly to the player.

Personally, I worry more and more that a helmet-less player is going to get a headshot.

[82 Card]

AJAM just ran a fairly long piece on concussions in baseball. The web version is available at:
http://america.aljazeera.com/watch/shows...sions.html

[82 Card]

AJAM just ran a fairly long piece on concussions in baseball. The web version is available at:
http://america.aljazeera.com/watch/shows...sions.html

[Rally]

[quote author=ferrari link=topic=10762.msg100208#msg100208 date=1412218169]
I have a friend who played football for Columbia (might have been NYU, I forget) in the no helmut days. 

Is he your younger friend??

Looking around a bit it seems helmets, if not helmuts, were at least almost universally worn in college football in the 1930s.
I found toss-off phrases such as "Helmets were not mandatory until the 30's", but it's hard to gauge the accuracy of these comments.
http://www.pasttimesports.biz/history.html
Wikipedia says 1939 in a manner that sounds authoritive, but I cannot check their reference right now.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_...all_helmet

To push things, I'll do a rough estimate of your friend's age as 110 putting at 20 in 1924. Helmets were certainly around then but apparently significantly not-universal. 

Of course you may have been talking about the advent of plastic helmets, which seems to have been invented in 1940 and really come into use on the order of 1950. But that might let your friend only be in the 80s range, and where's the fun in that?
[/quote]

I Asked him about this.  He is 87 and amazingly fit.  He says he wore a "leather cap."  My mother is 92 and says he was a "hottie."  (I kinda question this story but Hey!) Sadly for Mom he's been married to the same woman for 63 years.  Oh well, I was hoping it could have worked out and then he would have adopted me.

[Rally]

[quote author=ferrari link=topic=10762.msg100208#msg100208 date=1412218169]
I have a friend who played football for Columbia (might have been NYU, I forget) in the no helmut days. 

Is he your younger friend??

Looking around a bit it seems helmets, if not helmuts, were at least almost universally worn in college football in the 1930s.
I found toss-off phrases such as "Helmets were not mandatory until the 30's", but it's hard to gauge the accuracy of these comments.
http://www.pasttimesports.biz/history.html
Wikipedia says 1939 in a manner that sounds authoritive, but I cannot check their reference right now.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_...all_helmet

To push things, I'll do a rough estimate of your friend's age as 110 putting at 20 in 1924. Helmets were certainly around then but apparently significantly not-universal. 

Of course you may have been talking about the advent of plastic helmets, which seems to have been invented in 1940 and really come into use on the order of 1950. But that might let your friend only be in the 80s range, and where's the fun in that?
[/quote]

I Asked him about this.  He is 87 and amazingly fit.  He says he wore a "leather cap."  My mother is 92 and says he was a "hottie."  (I kinda question this story but Hey!) Sadly for Mom he's been married to the same woman for 63 years.  Oh well, I was hoping it could have worked out and then he would have adopted me.

[Leftcoast]

Here's a Rose Bowl program circa 1935.  Sure looks like a leather helmet to me.



If Rose Bowl programs are any guide, the top teams switched to the "new" helmets in the 40's but I would guess the leather versions were still used elsewhere for some time.

[Leftcoast]

Here's a Rose Bowl program circa 1935.  Sure looks like a leather helmet to me.



If Rose Bowl programs are any guide, the top teams switched to the "new" helmets in the 40's but I would guess the leather versions were still used elsewhere for some time.

[81alum]

The wiki gods state that leather helmets were first used in the 1920s.  The plastic helmet was first marketed in 1938, but leather helmets continued to be used and improved until the use of advance polymers helped plastic helmets completely replace leather helmets by the 1950s.

The talk about leather helmets and concussions is interesting, though.  Leather apparently does as good a job as modern plastic in preventing concussions--but it does a much worse job of preventing skull fractures, according to this 2011 Time article.

But on the type of lower-impact hits to the head you typically see in college and high school games — the constant subconcussive blows that can also cause brain damage — leatherheads do a comparable, and sometimes better, job of reducing concussion risks than today’s helmets, according to Cleveland Clinic researchers.

How could a leatherhead possibly be more protective? One reason, Bartsch says, probably has to with the stiffness of today’s helmets. While these helmets are effective shields against catastrophic skull fractures, they don’t do as good a job absorbing energy from a lower impact hit. These hits might not break the skull, but they can cause the brain to shift a little bit within the skull. And such jiggling causes concussions.

Think about hitting your thumb with a hammer. If you put, say, a piece of a padded gym mat on your thumb, that padding will absorb the impact from the hammer, and dull the pain. Now, imagine putting a two-by-four on top of your thumb.

http://healthland.time.com/2011/11/07/in...ncussion/ 

It sounds to me like helmets need a drastic overhaul.  A solid plastic shell somewhere in the inside to prevent skull fractures, and energy absorbing padding on the outside to mitigate concussive blows.  I wonder about disposable helmets that look more like bike helmets that get replaced after each major hit.  Keeping the weight low to avoid neck whip.

Anyone know if there are prototypes of experimental helmets like this?

Edit:  I found this:

http://www.popsci.com/science/article/20...page=0%2C3

[81alum]

The wiki gods state that leather helmets were first used in the 1920s.  The plastic helmet was first marketed in 1938, but leather helmets continued to be used and improved until the use of advance polymers helped plastic helmets completely replace leather helmets by the 1950s.

The talk about leather helmets and concussions is interesting, though.  Leather apparently does as good a job as modern plastic in preventing concussions--but it does a much worse job of preventing skull fractures, according to this 2011 Time article.

But on the type of lower-impact hits to the head you typically see in college and high school games — the constant subconcussive blows that can also cause brain damage — leatherheads do a comparable, and sometimes better, job of reducing concussion risks than today’s helmets, according to Cleveland Clinic researchers.

How could a leatherhead possibly be more protective? One reason, Bartsch says, probably has to with the stiffness of today’s helmets. While these helmets are effective shields against catastrophic skull fractures, they don’t do as good a job absorbing energy from a lower impact hit. These hits might not break the skull, but they can cause the brain to shift a little bit within the skull. And such jiggling causes concussions.

Think about hitting your thumb with a hammer. If you put, say, a piece of a padded gym mat on your thumb, that padding will absorb the impact from the hammer, and dull the pain. Now, imagine putting a two-by-four on top of your thumb.

http://healthland.time.com/2011/11/07/in...ncussion/ 

It sounds to me like helmets need a drastic overhaul.  A solid plastic shell somewhere in the inside to prevent skull fractures, and energy absorbing padding on the outside to mitigate concussive blows.  I wonder about disposable helmets that look more like bike helmets that get replaced after each major hit.  Keeping the weight low to avoid neck whip.

Anyone know if there are prototypes of experimental helmets like this?

Edit:  I found this:

http://www.popsci.com/science/article/20...page=0%2C3