[Spiny_Norman]

Been there everyday.  Lots of interesting stories, but my observations.
1) USGA absolutely screwed the punch.  If the goal is promoting golf, they failed miserably.  How many potential golfer would watch this and think "Gee, that looks like fun". ?
2) Players bitched about the greens, but I didn't catch any comments about drives with 70-80 yd rollouts. 
3) Hike in and out.  God help you if you are not in hiking shape.  First day, I walked the entire course.  I'm guessing it was close to 10 miles from the time I got off the bus until I returned.  The course is built in an abandoned quarry, and I estimate it's 300-400 feet from top to bottom. Swtchbacks would be nice.  Saw a lot of overweight folks struggling to get around the course. 
4) Lots of bitching about the greens.  Personally, I'd like to see a course  that was so punishing for a less than perfect shot.
5) Not sure where you got the info about the stimp, but I heard the greens were running around 12.
6) Should have had more stadium seating and large video monitors.
7) USGA needs to revise it's camera policy.  I forgot to remove a small Canon from my fanny pack and had to check it, even though 40,000 cell phones with cameras and the ability to immediately upload pictures to social media went though security.

All in all, I'm glad I went for the entire week. Would I return to Chambers Bay? Not without significant changes to improve the fan experience..

BeegDawg - thanks so much for your report.  I have been to 15 US Opens and I was kind of excited when the USGA awarded the tournament to Chambers Bay.  I love the Seattle-Tacoma area.  Lots of things to do in addition to the golf.  Heat?  Won't be a problem.  Rain?  Hey it's just liquid sunshine.  The fans would not experience a gully washing, toad strangling type of storm that drenched us at Southern Hills, for example. 

But when I looked at the course, I began to question whether this would be a good fan experience.  When I attend a tournament, I want to see as much golf and as much golf course as I can.  That means following a group, then dropping back and following another group until I have had a chance to see the entire course.  It appeared that the gallery would be restricted to one side of the fairway on a number of holes.  That limits what you can see and creates bottlenecks.  In fact, I heard that there was no gallery at all (or severely limited) on 5 of the 18 holes.    The best views probably would be from a position in the stands.  I did not want to spend $125 per day to sit for 8-10 hours and watch golfers play the same shot, one after the other.  I think the USGA does deserve criticism for making this a bad fan experience.

But this was a very exciting tournament.  The course did yield low scores.  The highest daily scoring average was only 73.5 or 3.5 over par.  This happened on Friday when not coincidentally Chambers Bay played at 7695 yards.  The USGA shortened the course by 300 yards on Sunday and the scoring average was 71.3.  I would much rather see a winner at 5 under rather than 5 over as was the case recently at Oakmont and Winged Foot.  And Jordan Spieth became the 1st player EVER since 1926 to birdie the 72nd hole to win the US Open.

The golfers complained with plenty of justification about the greens.  Spieth won with 35 putts in the final round.  I don't have any historical numbers, but I cannot imagine anyone winning a major with 35 putts.  This was a result of the brobdingnagian greens, (players putted when they might have been chipping on a course with smaller greens) and the uneven putting surface.

I cannot wait for St Andrews in a month.

[Spiny_Norman]

Been there everyday.  Lots of interesting stories, but my observations.
1) USGA absolutely screwed the punch.  If the goal is promoting golf, they failed miserably.  How many potential golfer would watch this and think "Gee, that looks like fun". ?
2) Players bitched about the greens, but I didn't catch any comments about drives with 70-80 yd rollouts. 
3) Hike in and out.  God help you if you are not in hiking shape.  First day, I walked the entire course.  I'm guessing it was close to 10 miles from the time I got off the bus until I returned.  The course is built in an abandoned quarry, and I estimate it's 300-400 feet from top to bottom. Swtchbacks would be nice.  Saw a lot of overweight folks struggling to get around the course. 
4) Lots of bitching about the greens.  Personally, I'd like to see a course  that was so punishing for a less than perfect shot.
5) Not sure where you got the info about the stimp, but I heard the greens were running around 12.
6) Should have had more stadium seating and large video monitors.
7) USGA needs to revise it's camera policy.  I forgot to remove a small Canon from my fanny pack and had to check it, even though 40,000 cell phones with cameras and the ability to immediately upload pictures to social media went though security.

All in all, I'm glad I went for the entire week. Would I return to Chambers Bay? Not without significant changes to improve the fan experience..

BeegDawg - thanks so much for your report.  I have been to 15 US Opens and I was kind of excited when the USGA awarded the tournament to Chambers Bay.  I love the Seattle-Tacoma area.  Lots of things to do in addition to the golf.  Heat?  Won't be a problem.  Rain?  Hey it's just liquid sunshine.  The fans would not experience a gully washing, toad strangling type of storm that drenched us at Southern Hills, for example. 

But when I looked at the course, I began to question whether this would be a good fan experience.  When I attend a tournament, I want to see as much golf and as much golf course as I can.  That means following a group, then dropping back and following another group until I have had a chance to see the entire course.  It appeared that the gallery would be restricted to one side of the fairway on a number of holes.  That limits what you can see and creates bottlenecks.  In fact, I heard that there was no gallery at all (or severely limited) on 5 of the 18 holes.    The best views probably would be from a position in the stands.  I did not want to spend $125 per day to sit for 8-10 hours and watch golfers play the same shot, one after the other.  I think the USGA does deserve criticism for making this a bad fan experience.

But this was a very exciting tournament.  The course did yield low scores.  The highest daily scoring average was only 73.5 or 3.5 over par.  This happened on Friday when not coincidentally Chambers Bay played at 7695 yards.  The USGA shortened the course by 300 yards on Sunday and the scoring average was 71.3.  I would much rather see a winner at 5 under rather than 5 over as was the case recently at Oakmont and Winged Foot.  And Jordan Spieth became the 1st player EVER since 1926 to birdie the 72nd hole to win the US Open.

The golfers complained with plenty of justification about the greens.  Spieth won with 35 putts in the final round.  I don't have any historical numbers, but I cannot imagine anyone winning a major with 35 putts.  This was a result of the brobdingnagian greens, (players putted when they might have been chipping on a course with smaller greens) and the uneven putting surface.

I cannot wait for St Andrews in a month.

[SpokaneLee]

The USGA  can't defend these greens to fans, because we have hi def screens and have seen lots of close up putts over the years.  The putts were bounding far too much and rolling too seldom.  And there were of exceedingly large proportions differences in green speeds.  I'm not sure if that's because fescue and poa annua are grainier--are they?--but there were putts thatstopped and others that felw, and the players were having trouble figuring which to expect.

Hulk, the problem with an invasion of poa (basically a hard to control weed) on a course's green is that, during any day with full sun, the poa outgrows any of the other grasses. At Chambers, the entire course was planted with fescue. The poa then becomes just higher than whatever the standard grass is on the green. That makes the green uneven and bumpier if you have to go through one of these "poa blotches". And, the Seattle area has had a super warm late Spring (temperatures approaching what they get in mid July/August), and that made for very different conditions than they were expecting for this tournament. I am no agronomist but I think the greenskeepers, assumed to be the best, should have found a solution for the invasion of the poa over the last few years.

Read this article/remarks by Brandl Chamblee http://www.golfdigest.com/blogs/the-loop...re-an.html and his prescient remarks made on the morning of yesterday's round about a "4 foot putt". Arrrg, DJ's comebacker putt is normally a no-brainer for a pro golfer, even with some nerves possibly coming to the surface.

BTW, since I am in Washington State, and have played Chambers Bay, I didn't like it EVER. As a pretty stinky amateur golfer I don't like paying high prices to constantly be in gigantic traps and uneven hitting surfaces. There are two comparable links style courses in the state that could never host a pro golf tournament because of their remoteness (like the Bandon courses), but are great way friendlier tracks and always in nice shape: Palouse Ridge (in Pullman on the WSU campus) and Wine Valley (in Walla Walla). BTW, Palouse Ridge obviously is more golfer friendly if Maverick McNealy shot a 62 there in late April at 7250 yards.

[SpokaneLee]

The USGA  can't defend these greens to fans, because we have hi def screens and have seen lots of close up putts over the years.  The putts were bounding far too much and rolling too seldom.  And there were of exceedingly large proportions differences in green speeds.  I'm not sure if that's because fescue and poa annua are grainier--are they?--but there were putts thatstopped and others that felw, and the players were having trouble figuring which to expect.

Hulk, the problem with an invasion of poa (basically a hard to control weed) on a course's green is that, during any day with full sun, the poa outgrows any of the other grasses. At Chambers, the entire course was planted with fescue. The poa then becomes just higher than whatever the standard grass is on the green. That makes the green uneven and bumpier if you have to go through one of these "poa blotches". And, the Seattle area has had a super warm late Spring (temperatures approaching what they get in mid July/August), and that made for very different conditions than they were expecting for this tournament. I am no agronomist but I think the greenskeepers, assumed to be the best, should have found a solution for the invasion of the poa over the last few years.

Read this article/remarks by Brandl Chamblee http://www.golfdigest.com/blogs/the-loop...re-an.html and his prescient remarks made on the morning of yesterday's round about a "4 foot putt". Arrrg, DJ's comebacker putt is normally a no-brainer for a pro golfer, even with some nerves possibly coming to the surface.

BTW, since I am in Washington State, and have played Chambers Bay, I didn't like it EVER. As a pretty stinky amateur golfer I don't like paying high prices to constantly be in gigantic traps and uneven hitting surfaces. There are two comparable links style courses in the state that could never host a pro golf tournament because of their remoteness (like the Bandon courses), but are great way friendlier tracks and always in nice shape: Palouse Ridge (in Pullman on the WSU campus) and Wine Valley (in Walla Walla). BTW, Palouse Ridge obviously is more golfer friendly if Maverick McNealy shot a 62 there in late April at 7250 yards.

[Hulk01]

My son Will helped build Wine Valley and always said good things about it.  If it weren't so remote it would be a destination, as you know, but it's hard for a traveler to detour to Walla Walla and then plan Stop Two.  Pendleton for the Round Up?  Trying to find where Justice Douglas might have roomed at Whitman?  Bandon offers not just its courses but the tours up the coast. 

By the way, it looks like they've finally gotten clearance for the next Bandon course.  It's taken a lot of politcking but the guy knows politics. 

[Hulk01]

My son Will helped build Wine Valley and always said good things about it.  If it weren't so remote it would be a destination, as you know, but it's hard for a traveler to detour to Walla Walla and then plan Stop Two.  Pendleton for the Round Up?  Trying to find where Justice Douglas might have roomed at Whitman?  Bandon offers not just its courses but the tours up the coast. 

By the way, it looks like they've finally gotten clearance for the next Bandon course.  It's taken a lot of politcking but the guy knows politics. 

[Spiny_Norman]

By the way, it looks like they've finally gotten clearance for the next Bandon course.  It's taken a lot of politcking but the guy knows politics.

Hulk, who is on tap to design it?

[Spiny_Norman]

By the way, it looks like they've finally gotten clearance for the next Bandon course.  It's taken a lot of politcking but the guy knows politics.

Hulk, who is on tap to design it?

[Hulk01]

Gil Hanse will do the new Bandon Course. 

It's about 25 miles south of Bandon Dunes, and a fabulous piece of property.  I know it well because Will scouted it at least five years ago, when he was contemplating putting together a group to develop a course on the property. 

It looks like it could equal the or perhaps even better the sight lines of the two Dunes courses, and will be much cheaper to develop.  At Dunes, they had literal tons of gorse to deal with, and gorse usually wins.  Fortunately, a fire hit the property and made the task a little easier.  The new land has some great contours and natural grasses and is well suited to Hanse, who likes to preserve the landscape rather than plow it into something new--and, in the cases of guys like Trent Jones Jr. and Kidd--all too alien for many tastes.

And i like that they are letting a new architect bring his vision to Bandon.  Kidd, Doak, Urbina, Coore and Crenshaw all have gotten their shots.  This also makes Bandon unrivaled as a showcase for the work of golf's best architects. 

[Hulk01]

Gil Hanse will do the new Bandon Course. 

It's about 25 miles south of Bandon Dunes, and a fabulous piece of property.  I know it well because Will scouted it at least five years ago, when he was contemplating putting together a group to develop a course on the property. 

It looks like it could equal the or perhaps even better the sight lines of the two Dunes courses, and will be much cheaper to develop.  At Dunes, they had literal tons of gorse to deal with, and gorse usually wins.  Fortunately, a fire hit the property and made the task a little easier.  The new land has some great contours and natural grasses and is well suited to Hanse, who likes to preserve the landscape rather than plow it into something new--and, in the cases of guys like Trent Jones Jr. and Kidd--all too alien for many tastes.

And i like that they are letting a new architect bring his vision to Bandon.  Kidd, Doak, Urbina, Coore and Crenshaw all have gotten their shots.  This also makes Bandon unrivaled as a showcase for the work of golf's best architects. 

[slide]

thanks for the G2 on the new Bandon Dunes.  Hulk and I will continue to agree to disagree with the merits of (a)Bandon Trails, but not on the overall venue.


on the grasses at Chambers Bay, fescue actually shuts down a bit during the day as it gives up moisture, and as a consequence brown and actually putt faster.  bentgrass and poa react opposite -- they grow and the greens actually slow down during the day.  poa also grows up (i.e. broccoli) not laterally like bermuda grass. 

[slide]

thanks for the G2 on the new Bandon Dunes.  Hulk and I will continue to agree to disagree with the merits of (a)Bandon Trails, but not on the overall venue.


on the grasses at Chambers Bay, fescue actually shuts down a bit during the day as it gives up moisture, and as a consequence brown and actually putt faster.  bentgrass and poa react opposite -- they grow and the greens actually slow down during the day.  poa also grows up (i.e. broccoli) not laterally like bermuda grass. 

[CornFed]

Isn't Hanse the guy who designed the course for the upcoming Olympics in Rio.  He is a very interesting guy and it is exciting to think he will get an opportunity with the Bandon terrain.


Also, statistically speaking, I believe the PGA Tour stats count greens hit and number of putts in terms of the green proper.  If your ball is on the fringe, it is not a GIR and the stroke from there is not a putt.  I'm not sure, so maybe someone can correct my understanding.

[CornFed]

Isn't Hanse the guy who designed the course for the upcoming Olympics in Rio.  He is a very interesting guy and it is exciting to think he will get an opportunity with the Bandon terrain.


Also, statistically speaking, I believe the PGA Tour stats count greens hit and number of putts in terms of the green proper.  If your ball is on the fringe, it is not a GIR and the stroke from there is not a putt.  I'm not sure, so maybe someone can correct my understanding.

[winflop]

I'll be teeing it up at Pumpkin Ridge near Portland next month on a weekend wedding trip.  Not playing the private course where the 2003 US Women's Open was held, but from what I read the public course is almost as nice which makes it a good stop in a city with what looks to be mostly mediocre courses.

[winflop]

I'll be teeing it up at Pumpkin Ridge near Portland next month on a weekend wedding trip.  Not playing the private course where the 2003 US Women's Open was held, but from what I read the public course is almost as nice which makes it a good stop in a city with what looks to be mostly mediocre courses.

[SpokaneLee]

I'll be teeing it up at Pumpkin Ridge near Portland next month on a weekend wedding trip.  Not playing the private course where the 2003 US Women's Open was held, but from what I read the public course is almost as nice which makes it a good stop in a city with what looks to be mostly mediocre courses.

Yes, Ghost Creek is the public course and Witch Hollow is the private course. Last year, we were at Cannon Beach and secured four $35 rounds (with a cart) at a 3:30 tee time mid-week on Ghost Creek. With late sunsets that time of year we had no problem in finishing the round. Really loved the course. Very playable and in good shape. Look at GolfNow for rates like that.

Portland isn't all that mediocre, if you consider the public Heron Lakes complex (right in Portland) with two 18 holers. The Great Blue is the better course.

[SpokaneLee]

I'll be teeing it up at Pumpkin Ridge near Portland next month on a weekend wedding trip.  Not playing the private course where the 2003 US Women's Open was held, but from what I read the public course is almost as nice which makes it a good stop in a city with what looks to be mostly mediocre courses.

Yes, Ghost Creek is the public course and Witch Hollow is the private course. Last year, we were at Cannon Beach and secured four $35 rounds (with a cart) at a 3:30 tee time mid-week on Ghost Creek. With late sunsets that time of year we had no problem in finishing the round. Really loved the course. Very playable and in good shape. Look at GolfNow for rates like that.

Portland isn't all that mediocre, if you consider the public Heron Lakes complex (right in Portland) with two 18 holers. The Great Blue is the better course.

[winflop]

Thanks for the head's up on other courses I'll look into them.  Unfortunately we have a 6:30pm flight back on Sunday so we can't do twilight like we do at home.

[winflop]

Thanks for the head's up on other courses I'll look into them.  Unfortunately we have a 6:30pm flight back on Sunday so we can't do twilight like we do at home.

[Hulk01]

I'm partial to Trails because Golf Course Atlas referred to some of Will's work there as "works of art."

And because Will loves Bill Coore.  (He thinks "Coore and Crenshaw" is misleading.) 

I think Trails suffers from being the inland course of the four.  It's easy to crave a view of the ocean while you're there--to peak over your shoulder to see if you might somehow catch a view. 

It has the hole I like the least on the resort--the uphill hole on the back nine flanked by the pond.  But I love that wicked, downhill, reachable par four, the 1st and 18th, and the par threes, which I think are the best collection of the four courses.  And it has more holes I remember than the two Dunes courses.

At the same time, I'm not a near-scratch golfer like you, Slide, and it's possible that a skilled shotmaker who can dirve the ball over 270 sees the courses from a different vantage point.  As a test of a skilled golfer, Trails might be weakest of the four courses.  It certainly felt forgiving to me, and I scored at least three strokes better there.

[Hulk01]

I'm partial to Trails because Golf Course Atlas referred to some of Will's work there as "works of art."

And because Will loves Bill Coore.  (He thinks "Coore and Crenshaw" is misleading.) 

I think Trails suffers from being the inland course of the four.  It's easy to crave a view of the ocean while you're there--to peak over your shoulder to see if you might somehow catch a view. 

It has the hole I like the least on the resort--the uphill hole on the back nine flanked by the pond.  But I love that wicked, downhill, reachable par four, the 1st and 18th, and the par threes, which I think are the best collection of the four courses.  And it has more holes I remember than the two Dunes courses.

At the same time, I'm not a near-scratch golfer like you, Slide, and it's possible that a skilled shotmaker who can dirve the ball over 270 sees the courses from a different vantage point.  As a test of a skilled golfer, Trails might be weakest of the four courses.  It certainly felt forgiving to me, and I scored at least three strokes better there.

[Stymie]

I agree with you that Trails is best of the Bandons.

If your son worked on Wine Valley he'll know a good friend of mind, Norbert Painter aka Slag Bandoon.

Slainte

Stymie

[Stymie]

I agree with you that Trails is best of the Bandons.

If your son worked on Wine Valley he'll know a good friend of mind, Norbert Painter aka Slag Bandoon.

Slainte

Stymie

[slide]

#1 at Trails was very short.  driver was too much club.  I ended up playing mid-iron, then chip shot.


#11 was the pond hole.  optically you are pointed right, and play-wise you want to go left.


I may give it another shot, but I'd rather try Farm.  the links courses were good, but I didn't see them with much wind to defend them.  the Old Course at St. Andrews has few defenses without wind and/or elements.  I suspect Bandon is the same.

[slide]

#1 at Trails was very short.  driver was too much club.  I ended up playing mid-iron, then chip shot.


#11 was the pond hole.  optically you are pointed right, and play-wise you want to go left.


I may give it another shot, but I'd rather try Farm.  the links courses were good, but I didn't see them with much wind to defend them.  the Old Course at St. Andrews has few defenses without wind and/or elements.  I suspect Bandon is the same.

[Stymie]

Big hitter, the slider.  Gunga galunga... gunga, gunga-lagunga.

[Stymie]

Big hitter, the slider.  Gunga galunga... gunga, gunga-lagunga.

[slide]

no.  downwind and risk averse especially on first hole after a big night.

[slide]

no.  downwind and risk averse especially on first hole after a big night.

[Stymie]

All nights are big nights at Bandon, as there is nothing else to do at night there than drink and eat meat loaf.

[Stymie]

All nights are big nights at Bandon, as there is nothing else to do at night there than drink and eat meat loaf.

[slide]

All nights are big nights at Bandon, as there is nothing else to do at night there than drink and eat meat loaf.

exactly!

[slide]

All nights are big nights at Bandon, as there is nothing else to do at night there than drink and eat meat loaf.

exactly!

[CornFed]

And play poker!  :D

[CornFed]

And play poker!  :D

[Stymie]

Have they moved the Native American (aka Cardinal) poker/other gambling facility to Bandon since I was last there?

[Stymie]

Have they moved the Native American (aka Cardinal) poker/other gambling facility to Bandon since I was last there?