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Make them dig graves for patients who die of COVID-19.




By no means advocating this... but it is always interesting to read about other countries' ideas of justice.

BC
Meantime, in the US:




BC
Crazy that this is the same country that won two world wars. I feel like the addiction to fragility is out of control, on all sides. Never have I heard so many adults complain about things being "so unfair".

I am personally skeptical that mask wearing outside makes a whit of difference but am happy to do it to show courtesy and encourage people to also do it where it does count - inside.

But more to the point: this too will pass. Stay calm and carry on.
(09-14-2020, 06:10 PM)2006alum Wrote: [ -> ]Crazy that this is the same country that won two world wars. I feel like the addiction to fragility is out of control, on all sides. Never have I heard so many adults complain about things being "so unfair".

I am personally skeptical that mask wearing outside makes a whit of difference but am happy to do it to show courtesy and encourage people to also do it where it does count - inside.

But more to the point: this too will pass. Stay calm and carry on.

Agree with your sentiment completely.

(09-14-2020, 06:01 PM)BostonCard Wrote: [ -> ]Meantime, in the US:




BC



BC - couple hundred people in a town in Utah. Big blanking deal. We have 330,000,000 in this country. Picking out the wingnuts is like shooting fish in a barrel. Easy pickings. (After all, Utah is bound to have a higher percentage of anti government “libertarian” types. For historical and demographic reasons that we know but need not get into.)

How bout putting up a YouTube of the nightly crazies in Portland.......

My gawd we love to devour ourselves.
(09-14-2020, 06:24 PM)lex24 Wrote: [ -> ]How bout putting up a YouTube of the nightly crazies in Portland.......

Or the police shooting in Los Angeles.  No, not the kind of thing you're used to reading about; rather, the guy who walked up to a parked police car with two officers inside (a man and a woman) and opened fire.  ICYMI:

Oops, never mind.  That's too "political."
(09-14-2020, 06:24 PM)lex24 Wrote: [ -> ]BC - couple hundred people in a town in Utah. Big blanking deal. We have 330,000,000 in this country. Picking out the wingnuts is like shooting fish in a barrel. Easy pickings. (After all, Utah is bound to have a higher percentage of anti government “libertarian” types. For historical and demographic reasons that we know but need not get into.)

How bout putting up a YouTube of the nightly crazies in Portland.......

My gawd we love to devour ourselves.

I mean, were it a couple hundred people in Utah, that would be one thing, but this map shows that in large swaths of the country, if you were to randomly run into five people in the street, the chances that all five were wearing masks is pretty slim.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020...k-map.html

Plus I think there is an entire thread about Kerri Walsh's position on masks.

BC
(09-14-2020, 09:13 PM)BostonCard Wrote: [ -> ]
(09-14-2020, 06:24 PM)lex24 Wrote: [ -> ]BC - couple hundred people in a town in Utah. Big blanking deal. We have 330,000,000 in this country. Picking out the wingnuts is like shooting fish in a barrel. Easy pickings. (After all, Utah is bound to have a higher percentage of anti government “libertarian” types. For historical and demographic reasons that we know but need not get into.)

How bout putting up a YouTube of the nightly crazies in Portland.......

My gawd we love to devour ourselves.

I mean, were it a couple hundred people in Utah, that would be one thing, but this map shows that in large swaths of the country, if you were to randomly run into five people in the street, the chances that all five were wearing masks is pretty slim.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020...k-map.html

Plus I think there is an entire thread about Kerri Walsh's position on masks.

BC

There is.  And a ton more.  Masks are a symbol.  Unfortunately.  It’s not truly about the mask for those that won’t wear them. Unfortunately.  And it’s not like we haven’t covered this issue ad nauseum. The horse has been dead for a while and is beaten to a pulp.....

Not your “fault” BC. It just is what it is.
As I pointed out in the other thread, the study that was the topic of the Restaurant thread also indicated, at least on its face, that the personal use of masks was NOT a distinguishing characteristic of those in the control group versus those that got COVID-19.    Those in the control group reported somewhat more use of masks by others in the restaurants.  (and in bars/coffee shops, but those numbers are too small to mean much).

That's troubling to me as I can see (and hope) how personal use of masks could/should be helpful.  Perhaps the issue is that for the general public, masks and face coverings could be almost anything.  I really hope someone is doing further studies to better determine whether masks help reduce COVID-19 spread, and whether the kind of mask matters.   There definitely have been studies that showed masks helped in healthcare settings for other illnesses.  I expect wearing masks helps slow the spread of COVID-19, but I'd feel better if all the "whatever you can do to cover your face" masks are either shown to be effective or are not.
(09-14-2020, 08:15 PM)teejers1 Wrote: [ -> ]
(09-14-2020, 06:24 PM)lex24 Wrote: [ -> ]How bout putting up a YouTube of the nightly crazies in Portland.......

Or the police shooting in Los Angeles.  No, not the kind of thing you're used to reading about; rather, the guy who walked up to a parked police car with two officers inside (a man and a woman) and opened fire.  ICYMI:

Oops, never mind.  That's too "political."

What does that have to do with Covid-19? This is the Covid board. You could start a civil unrest board and then it will be fine.
(09-14-2020, 11:01 PM)akiddoc Wrote: [ -> ]
(09-14-2020, 08:15 PM)teejers1 Wrote: [ -> ]
(09-14-2020, 06:24 PM)lex24 Wrote: [ -> ]How bout putting up a YouTube of the nightly crazies in Portland.......

Or the police shooting in Los Angeles.  No, not the kind of thing you're used to reading about; rather, the guy who walked up to a parked police car with two officers inside (a man and a woman) and opened fire.  ICYMI:

Oops, never mind.  That's too "political."

What does that have to do with Covid-19? This is the Covid board. You could start a civil unrest board and then it will be fine.

It wouldn't fit there, as no one gives a $hit about it and has generated no unrest; however, your point is well-taken about it not being a Covid topic.  My mistake.
Many Americans are quick to assert that the US is #1, but many of these same people do not understand how systemic failures (health care, racism, poverty) and personal failures (lack of responsibility, anti-science bias) have converged to make the US response to COVID is one of the worst in the world. And most of these people have no interest in learning why, either.

The US may have to pay people to get vaccinated.

https://www.brookings.edu/opinions/want-...e-vaccine/
(09-15-2020, 12:05 AM)chrisk Wrote: [ -> ]Many Americans are quick to assert that the US is #1, but many of these same people do not understand how systemic failures (health care, racism, poverty) and personal failures (lack of responsibility, anti-science bias) have converged to make the US response to COVID is one of the worst in the world.  And most of these people have no interest in learning why, either.

The US may have to pay people to get vaccinated.

https://www.brookings.edu/opinions/want-...e-vaccine/

Americans talk a big game, but when push comes to shove you'll see more than that 65% get the vaccine voluntarily. The next step will be to make it mandatory to attend school. Just as California does now for most vaccines with no religious or personal exemptions. Many workplaces will do the same. I think that gets us to 80% getting the vaccine.
(09-14-2020, 08:15 PM)teejers1 Wrote: [ -> ]
(09-14-2020, 06:24 PM)lex24 Wrote: [ -> ]How bout putting up a YouTube of the nightly crazies in Portland.......

Or the police shooting in Los Angeles.  No, not the kind of thing you're used to reading about; rather, the guy who walked up to a parked police car with two officers inside (a man and a woman) and opened fire.  ICYMI:

Oops, never mind.  That's too "political."

Yawn.

(09-14-2020, 11:23 PM)teejers1 Wrote: [ -> ]
(09-14-2020, 11:01 PM)akiddoc Wrote: [ -> ]
(09-14-2020, 08:15 PM)teejers1 Wrote: [ -> ]
(09-14-2020, 06:24 PM)lex24 Wrote: [ -> ]How bout putting up a YouTube of the nightly crazies in Portland.......

Or the police shooting in Los Angeles.  No, not the kind of thing you're used to reading about; rather, the guy who walked up to a parked police car with two officers inside (a man and a woman) and opened fire.  ICYMI:

Oops, never mind.  That's too "political."

What does that have to do with Covid-19? This is the Covid board. You could start a civil unrest board and then it will be fine.

It wouldn't fit there, as no one gives a $hit about it and has generated no unrest; however, your point is well-taken about it not being a Covid topic.  My mistake.

Speaking of bubbles, how on earth could you think that no one cares?? Every major news outlet has been running it, calling the deputies heroes, and demanding people who protest police brutality "disavow" such acts against cops. They're even demanding that Black people apologize. It's like how every time any Muslim kills someone people expect the Muslim mom in Des Moines to apologize on behalf of over 1 billion people. Meanwhile, who is demanding that every cop or White person apologize for every act of police brutality? 

It's just silly.
(09-14-2020, 11:23 PM)teejers1 Wrote: [ -> ]It wouldn't fit there, as no one gives a $hit about it and has generated no unrest; however, your point is well-taken about it not being a Covid topic.  My mistake.

Admins made carveout to discuss COVID, but they have not made a similar carveout to discuss protests and riots. That's why one is fair game around here and the other isn't. On information and belief, there's a ton of folks on twitter who'd welcome you with open arms to debate police brutality and rioting all day and all night until everyone is blue in the face. But not here, thankfully.

(09-15-2020, 12:05 AM)chrisk Wrote: [ -> ]Many Americans are quick to assert that the US is #1, but many of these same people do not understand how systemic failures (health care, racism, poverty) and personal failures (lack of responsibility, anti-science bias) have converged to make the US response to COVID is one of the worst in the world.  And most of these people have no interest in learning why, either.
Some might call it a "herd mentality"?
(09-16-2020, 03:54 AM)JustAnotherFan Wrote: [ -> ]
(09-14-2020, 08:15 PM)teejers1 Wrote: [ -> ]
(09-14-2020, 06:24 PM)lex24 Wrote: [ -> ]How bout putting up a YouTube of the nightly crazies in Portland.......

Or the police shooting in Los Angeles.  No, not the kind of thing you're used to reading about; rather, the guy who walked up to a parked police car with two officers inside (a man and a woman) and opened fire.  ICYMI:

Oops, never mind.  That's too "political."

Yawn.

(09-14-2020, 11:23 PM)teejers1 Wrote: [ -> ]
(09-14-2020, 11:01 PM)akiddoc Wrote: [ -> ]
(09-14-2020, 08:15 PM)teejers1 Wrote: [ -> ]
(09-14-2020, 06:24 PM)lex24 Wrote: [ -> ]How bout putting up a YouTube of the nightly crazies in Portland.......

Or the police shooting in Los Angeles.  No, not the kind of thing you're used to reading about; rather, the guy who walked up to a parked police car with two officers inside (a man and a woman) and opened fire.  ICYMI:

Oops, never mind.  That's too "political."

What does that have to do with Covid-19? This is the Covid board. You could start a civil unrest board and then it will be fine.

It wouldn't fit there, as no one gives a $hit about it and has generated no unrest; however, your point is well-taken about it not being a Covid topic.  My mistake.

Speaking of bubbles, how on earth could you think that no one cares?? Every major news outlet has been running it, calling the deputies heroes, and demanding people who protest police brutality "disavow" such acts against cops. They're even demanding that Black people apologize. It's like how every time any Muslim kills someone people expect the Muslim mom in Des Moines to apologize on behalf of over 1 billion people. Meanwhile, who is demanding that every cop or White person apologize for every act of police brutality? 

It's just silly.

Well, it’s not beyond reason to ask those (of any race, creed, gender, religion, ethnicity etc) that are vocally protesting against cops (sometimes in the streets, sometimes in print etc) to disavow someone walking up to a police car and shooting two cops. Is it? I mean honestly, is it tough to say we abhor that type of heinous act.  And we also don’t abide those such as the man that gleefully filmed the event or those that (allegedly) gathered at the hospital yelling we hope they die. I don’t care what color they are. Wrong is wrong. Right?

 And of course it’s also right and just  to ask (demand) that police forces disavow those cops and their tactics/practices  that abuse their positions and commit heinous unspeakable acts of violence - such as the cops that murdered Floyd. And I think police associations all over the country have done just that. 

 As for asking all blacks to apologize - can you link an article advocating that? I certainly agree with you that it would be beyond absurd. It would be disgusting.  But I’d like to see the article that advances that notion. 

If your point is that we should look at these horrific events as individual events in which we blame the actors and not levy collective blame based on some racial, ethnic or other attribute (such as wearing a badge) I agree.  Wholeheartedly.
[cough cough] Terry [cough] Rule [cough cough]. Said so in as many words in the preceding post in this very thread...
(09-16-2020, 06:19 PM)2006alum Wrote: [ -> ][cough cough] Terry [cough] Rule [cough cough]. Said so in as many words in the preceding post in this very thread...

Promise to stop.  But it IS Covid related in the sense that Covid has contributed mightily to social unrest....
(09-16-2020, 07:45 PM)lex24 Wrote: [ -> ]
(09-16-2020, 06:19 PM)2006alum Wrote: [ -> ][cough cough] Terry [cough] Rule [cough cough]. Said so in as many words in the preceding post in this very thread...

Promise to stop.  But it IS Covid related in the sense that Covid has contributed mightily to social unrest....

And when Mick presciently predicted, throughout the early spring, that COVID lockdowns would lead to job losses, pent up emotions, and eventually to social unrest, no one invoked the Terry Rule. You and I both know we're well outside the four corners of the kinds of discussion this forum was designed to foster.
(09-16-2020, 05:59 PM)lex24 Wrote: [ -> ]
(09-16-2020, 03:54 AM)JustAnotherFan Wrote: [ -> ]
(09-14-2020, 08:15 PM)teejers1 Wrote: [ -> ]
(09-14-2020, 06:24 PM)lex24 Wrote: [ -> ]How bout putting up a YouTube of the nightly crazies in Portland.......

Or the police shooting in Los Angeles.  No, not the kind of thing you're used to reading about; rather, the guy who walked up to a parked police car with two officers inside (a man and a woman) and opened fire.  ICYMI:

Oops, never mind.  That's too "political."

Yawn.

(09-14-2020, 11:23 PM)teejers1 Wrote: [ -> ]
(09-14-2020, 11:01 PM)akiddoc Wrote: [ -> ]
(09-14-2020, 08:15 PM)teejers1 Wrote: [ -> ]Or the police shooting in Los Angeles.  No, not the kind of thing you're used to reading about; rather, the guy who walked up to a parked police car with two officers inside (a man and a woman) and opened fire.  ICYMI:

Oops, never mind.  That's too "political."

What does that have to do with Covid-19? This is the Covid board. You could start a civil unrest board and then it will be fine.

It wouldn't fit there, as no one gives a $hit about it and has generated no unrest; however, your point is well-taken about it not being a Covid topic.  My mistake.

Speaking of bubbles, how on earth could you think that no one cares?? Every major news outlet has been running it, calling the deputies heroes, and demanding people who protest police brutality "disavow" such acts against cops. They're even demanding that Black people apologize. It's like how every time any Muslim kills someone people expect the Muslim mom in Des Moines to apologize on behalf of over 1 billion people. Meanwhile, who is demanding that every cop or White person apologize for every act of police brutality? 

It's just silly.

Well, it’s not beyond reason to ask those (of any race, creed, gender, religion, ethnicity etc) that are vocally protesting against cops (sometimes in the streets, sometimes in print etc) to disavow someone walking up to a police car and shooting two cops. Is it? I mean honestly, is it tough to say we abhor that type of heinous act.  And we also don’t abide those such as the man that gleefully filmed the event or those that (allegedly) gathered at the hospital yelling we hope they die. I don’t care what color they are. Wrong is wrong. Right?

 And of course it’s also right and just  to ask (demand) that police forces disavow those cops and their tactics/practices  that abuse their positions and commit heinous unspeakable acts of violence - such as the cops that murdered  Floyd. And I think police associations all over the country have done just that. 

 As for asking all blacks to apologize - can you link an article advocating that? I certainly agree with you that it would be beyond absurd. It would be disgusting.  But I’d like to see the article that advances that notion. 

If your point is that we should look at these horrific events as individual events in which we blame the actors and not levy collective blame based on some racial, ethnic or other attribute (such as wearing a badge) I agree.  Wholeheartedly.

It is beyond absurd to expect people to disavow every act committed by a mentally ill person. The shooting of the deputies was done by an individual. It is not a systemic or institutional problem. 

Police have not disavowed police brutality. They've amplified it and laughed at protesters, when not firing "less lethal" rounds and pepper spray at them. George Floyd isn't the only person murdered by police on video this year.

Right wing twitter is all about demanding that Black people apologize and disavow any form of "violence" that happens at protests. Even when the protesters are a bunch of white anarchists in Portland. Do I have to produce a NYT article for it to be true?
(09-16-2020, 08:14 PM)2006alum Wrote: [ -> ]
(09-16-2020, 07:45 PM)lex24 Wrote: [ -> ]
(09-16-2020, 06:19 PM)2006alum Wrote: [ -> ][cough cough] Terry [cough] Rule [cough cough]. Said so in as many words in the preceding post in this very thread...

Promise to stop.  But it IS Covid related in the sense that Covid has contributed mightily to social unrest....

And when Mick presciently predicted, throughout the early spring, that COVID lockdowns would lead to job losses, pent up emotions, and eventually to social unrest, no one invoked the Terry Rule. You and I both know we're well outside the four corners of the kinds of discussion this forum was designed to foster.

Ok, Terry rule. I'm done.