06-06-2023, 09:51 PM
Ran across this on an unlikely site -- Swimswam.com. Curious what people on the Cardboard think.
https://swimswam.com/report-colorado-ari...or-big-12/
https://swimswam.com/report-colorado-ari...or-big-12/
Further implosion of the Pac-12
Ran across this on an unlikely site -- Swimswam.com. Curious what people on the Cardboard think.
https://swimswam.com/report-colorado-ari...or-big-12/
https://swimswam.com/report-colorado-ari...or-big-12/
06-06-2023, 10:32 PM
(This post was last modified: 06-06-2023, 10:50 PM by old spanish trail.)
It wouldn't surprise me at all. Pac 12 is a mess. However, I do find it curious that the exit wouldn't be announced until Pac 12 media rights were settled.
(This post was last modified: 06-06-2023, 10:50 PM by old spanish trail.)
It wouldn't surprise me at all. Pac 12 is a mess. However, I do find it curious that the exit wouldn't be announced until Pac 12 media rights were settled.
06-06-2023, 10:46 PM
I think I saw the initial rumor on Twitter from some rando sports personality. Maybe it's taken on a life of its own.
06-07-2023, 07:16 AM
(06-06-2023, 09:51 PM)DenverCard Wrote: Ran across this on an unlikely site -- Swimswam.com. Curious what people on the Cardboard think.
https://swimswam.com/report-colorado-ari...or-big-12/
When we used to pitch the Arizona postsecondary system, we had to pitch for the work of all three (Arizona, Arizona State, Northern Arizona). I wonder if Arizona can leave without Arizona State's approval?
Audaces fortuna iuvat
(06-06-2023, 09:51 PM)DenverCard Wrote: Ran across this on an unlikely site -- Swimswam.com. Curious what people on the Cardboard think.
https://swimswam.com/report-colorado-ari...or-big-12/
When we used to pitch the Arizona postsecondary system, we had to pitch for the work of all three (Arizona, Arizona State, Northern Arizona). I wonder if Arizona can leave without Arizona State's approval?
Audaces fortuna iuvat
Media rights environment has deteriated so rapidly in the last year that I can't imagine the Big 12 wants to reopen its deal to expand schools unless it's extra confident they'll more than offset, and I'm not entirely sure the Phoenix and Denver markets do that, especially since neither school is actually based in that market. I'm almost certain ESPN would salivate at the opportunity to reopen its Big 12 deal with a year's hindsight and changes to the media landscape.
Yormark is the right man for the job and savvy to always be on offense, but he may be a year too late to move mountains, but it will all depend on what the Pac-12 secures from Amazon/Apple/other streamers and/or NBC + ESPN. The irony is the lower that rights deal comes in, the more locked in everyone but the Big Ten and SEC are.
Yormark is the right man for the job and savvy to always be on offense, but he may be a year too late to move mountains, but it will all depend on what the Pac-12 secures from Amazon/Apple/other streamers and/or NBC + ESPN. The irony is the lower that rights deal comes in, the more locked in everyone but the Big Ten and SEC are.
Media rights environment has deteriated so rapidly in the last year that I can't imagine the Big 12 wants to reopen its deal to expand schools unless it's extra confident they'll more than offset, and I'm not entirely sure the Phoenix and Denver markets do that, especially since neither school is actually based in that market. I'm almost certain ESPN would salivate at the opportunity to reopen its Big 12 deal with a year's hindsight and changes to the media landscape.
Yormark is the right man for the job and savvy to always be on offense, but he may be a year too late to move mountains, but it will all depend on what the Pac-12 secures from Amazon/Apple/other streamers and/or NBC + ESPN. The irony is the lower that rights deal comes in, the more locked in everyone but the Big Ten and SEC are.
Yormark is the right man for the job and savvy to always be on offense, but he may be a year too late to move mountains, but it will all depend on what the Pac-12 secures from Amazon/Apple/other streamers and/or NBC + ESPN. The irony is the lower that rights deal comes in, the more locked in everyone but the Big Ten and SEC are.
06-07-2023, 09:32 AM
Something has to give and it has to give soon. For awhile, it's seemed likely, almost inevitable even, that SDSU was joining the PAC-12. Supposedly the holdup has been the PAC-12 media rights deal and the conference wanting to get that finalized before expanding (link). But the media rights negotiations have been dragging on for close to a year now with no end in sight. Complicating matters for the Aztecs, their buyout should they choose to leave the MWC doubles effective June 30 (link). If the Aztecs lose faith in the PAC-12, it would make sense that they'd make a stronger push to join the Big 12 ASAP even if it potentially means taking a smaller share of the Big 12 revenue pie.
SDSU isn't USC or UCLA, but they look more and more attractive as the conference nears total collapse.
SDSU isn't USC or UCLA, but they look more and more attractive as the conference nears total collapse.
Something has to give and it has to give soon. For awhile, it's seemed likely, almost inevitable even, that SDSU was joining the PAC-12. Supposedly the holdup has been the PAC-12 media rights deal and the conference wanting to get that finalized before expanding (link). But the media rights negotiations have been dragging on for close to a year now with no end in sight. Complicating matters for the Aztecs, their buyout should they choose to leave the MWC doubles effective June 30 (link). If the Aztecs lose faith in the PAC-12, it would make sense that they'd make a stronger push to join the Big 12 ASAP even if it potentially means taking a smaller share of the Big 12 revenue pie.
SDSU isn't USC or UCLA, but they look more and more attractive as the conference nears total collapse.
SDSU isn't USC or UCLA, but they look more and more attractive as the conference nears total collapse.
06-07-2023, 09:47 AM
(06-07-2023, 09:32 AM)StanfordMatt Wrote: For awhile, it's seemed likely, almost inevitable even, that SDSU was joining the PAC-12. Supposedly the holdup has been the PAC-12 media rights deal and the conference wanting to get that finalized before expanding (link).
How did the SDSU marketing department get SI to claim that article as their own?
I particularly liked this part,
Quote:Athletic director JD Wicker remembers walking through Times Square in 2017 ... seeing Voldemort billboards for Oregon’s Joey Harrington. At the time, Oregon was a similar type of West Coast brand ...
(06-07-2023, 09:32 AM)StanfordMatt Wrote: For awhile, it's seemed likely, almost inevitable even, that SDSU was joining the PAC-12. Supposedly the holdup has been the PAC-12 media rights deal and the conference wanting to get that finalized before expanding (link).
How did the SDSU marketing department get SI to claim that article as their own?
I particularly liked this part,
Quote:Athletic director JD Wicker remembers walking through Times Square in 2017 ... seeing Voldemort billboards for Oregon’s Joey Harrington. At the time, Oregon was a similar type of West Coast brand ...
(06-07-2023, 09:47 AM)CTcard Wrote:(06-07-2023, 09:32 AM)StanfordMatt Wrote: For awhile, it's seemed likely, almost inevitable even, that SDSU was joining the PAC-12. Supposedly the holdup has been the PAC-12 media rights deal and the conference wanting to get that finalized before expanding (link).
How did the SDSU marketing department get SI to claim that article as their own?
I particularly liked this part,
Quote:Athletic director JD Wicker remembers walking through Times Square in 2017 ... seeing Voldemort billboards for Oregon’s Joey Harrington. At the time, Oregon was a similar type of West Coast brand ...
Because this is a SDSU sub-blog of SI. SI and its team-specific sub-blogs are not credible. Please stop using them as "news."
(This post was last modified: 06-07-2023, 10:39 AM by SamuelMcF.)
(06-07-2023, 09:47 AM)CTcard Wrote:(06-07-2023, 09:32 AM)StanfordMatt Wrote: For awhile, it's seemed likely, almost inevitable even, that SDSU was joining the PAC-12. Supposedly the holdup has been the PAC-12 media rights deal and the conference wanting to get that finalized before expanding (link).
How did the SDSU marketing department get SI to claim that article as their own?
I particularly liked this part,
Quote:Athletic director JD Wicker remembers walking through Times Square in 2017 ... seeing Voldemort billboards for Oregon’s Joey Harrington. At the time, Oregon was a similar type of West Coast brand ...
Because this is a SDSU sub-blog of SI. SI and its team-specific sub-blogs are not credible. Please stop using them as "news."
06-07-2023, 10:47 AM
(This post was last modified: 06-07-2023, 10:51 AM by StanfordMatt.)
(06-07-2023, 10:38 AM)SamuelMcF Wrote:(06-07-2023, 09:47 AM)CTcard Wrote:(06-07-2023, 09:32 AM)StanfordMatt Wrote: For awhile, it's seemed likely, almost inevitable even, that SDSU was joining the PAC-12. Supposedly the holdup has been the PAC-12 media rights deal and the conference wanting to get that finalized before expanding (link).
How did the SDSU marketing department get SI to claim that article as their own?
I particularly liked this part,
Quote:Athletic director JD Wicker remembers walking through Times Square in 2017 ... seeing Voldemort billboards for Oregon’s Joey Harrington. At the time, Oregon was a similar type of West Coast brand ...
Because this is a SDSU sub-blog of SI. SI and its team-specific sub-blogs are not credible. Please stop using them as "news."
The author of the article I linked to is Richard Johnson. Richard is a national reporter for SI based in Gainesville, FL. It's not a SDSU sub-blog.
In any event, the purpose of the link wasn't to hype up SDSU. It was simply to provide a source corraborating my point that SDSU's potential invititation to join the PAC-12 was thought to be on hold until the new media rights deal was finalized.
(This post was last modified: 06-07-2023, 10:51 AM by StanfordMatt.)
(06-07-2023, 10:38 AM)SamuelMcF Wrote:(06-07-2023, 09:47 AM)CTcard Wrote:(06-07-2023, 09:32 AM)StanfordMatt Wrote: For awhile, it's seemed likely, almost inevitable even, that SDSU was joining the PAC-12. Supposedly the holdup has been the PAC-12 media rights deal and the conference wanting to get that finalized before expanding (link).
How did the SDSU marketing department get SI to claim that article as their own?
I particularly liked this part,
Quote:Athletic director JD Wicker remembers walking through Times Square in 2017 ... seeing Voldemort billboards for Oregon’s Joey Harrington. At the time, Oregon was a similar type of West Coast brand ...
Because this is a SDSU sub-blog of SI. SI and its team-specific sub-blogs are not credible. Please stop using them as "news."
The author of the article I linked to is Richard Johnson. Richard is a national reporter for SI based in Gainesville, FL. It's not a SDSU sub-blog.
In any event, the purpose of the link wasn't to hype up SDSU. It was simply to provide a source corraborating my point that SDSU's potential invititation to join the PAC-12 was thought to be on hold until the new media rights deal was finalized.
06-09-2023, 11:10 AM
Wazzu prez tells regents PAC media deal expected by end of the month: https://twitter.com/kiphillreporter/stat...3762081795
Wazzu prez tells regents PAC media deal expected by end of the month: https://twitter.com/kiphillreporter/stat...3762081795
06-30-2023, 03:29 PM
ESPN is reporting that San Diego State plans to remain in the Mountain West, at least in the short run.
https://www.espn.com/college-football/st...ource-says
https://www.espn.com/college-football/st...ource-says
Cal delenda est
ESPN is reporting that San Diego State plans to remain in the Mountain West, at least in the short run.
https://www.espn.com/college-football/st...ource-says
https://www.espn.com/college-football/st...ource-says
Cal delenda est
06-30-2023, 04:39 PM
Why do so many people keep saying that the Pac-12 (now back to 10) plans to expand.
How does a conference of 11 teams work better than 10? Adding SDSU looks like dilution to me.
How does a conference of 11 teams work better than 10? Adding SDSU looks like dilution to me.
06-30-2023, 04:56 PM
(06-30-2023, 04:39 PM)chrisk Wrote: Why do so many people keep saying that the Pac-12 (now back to 10) plans to expand.
How does a conference of 11 teams work better than 10? Adding SDSU looks like dilution to me.
The appeal of adding SDSU is the Southern California marketplace and the recruiting base.
(06-30-2023, 04:39 PM)chrisk Wrote: Why do so many people keep saying that the Pac-12 (now back to 10) plans to expand.
How does a conference of 11 teams work better than 10? Adding SDSU looks like dilution to me.
The appeal of adding SDSU is the Southern California marketplace and the recruiting base.
06-30-2023, 05:36 PM
(This post was last modified: 06-30-2023, 05:36 PM by Spiny_Norman.)
(06-30-2023, 04:39 PM)chrisk Wrote: Why do so many people keep saying that the Pac-12 (now back to 10) plans to expand.
How does a conference of 11 teams work better than 10? Adding SDSU looks like dilution to me.
The P12 minus USC and UCLA is worth significantly less to potential media partners. The P12 presidents and commissioner don't have a lot of bargaining leverage. The offers that have been rumored put the P12 above mid-majors but well behind all of the other Power 5. It's like watching galaxies accelerate away from the Milky Way at an accelerating rate.
The property will be more valuable to potential partners with greater reach. I am sure that the expansion discussion is driven by the desire to reach other major markets like San Diego, Orange County and LA (SDSU) and Dallas Metroplex (SMU) with the assumption that the added revenue is greater than the dilution factor. Even with those schools, the P12 will probably still be well behind the B10, SEC, ACC and Big 12.
"We have an unwritten rule around here not to do anything stupid."
-Casey Jacobsen, Feb 3, 2000
(This post was last modified: 06-30-2023, 05:36 PM by Spiny_Norman.)
(06-30-2023, 04:39 PM)chrisk Wrote: Why do so many people keep saying that the Pac-12 (now back to 10) plans to expand.
How does a conference of 11 teams work better than 10? Adding SDSU looks like dilution to me.
The P12 minus USC and UCLA is worth significantly less to potential media partners. The P12 presidents and commissioner don't have a lot of bargaining leverage. The offers that have been rumored put the P12 above mid-majors but well behind all of the other Power 5. It's like watching galaxies accelerate away from the Milky Way at an accelerating rate.
The property will be more valuable to potential partners with greater reach. I am sure that the expansion discussion is driven by the desire to reach other major markets like San Diego, Orange County and LA (SDSU) and Dallas Metroplex (SMU) with the assumption that the added revenue is greater than the dilution factor. Even with those schools, the P12 will probably still be well behind the B10, SEC, ACC and Big 12.
"We have an unwritten rule around here not to do anything stupid."
-Casey Jacobsen, Feb 3, 2000
06-30-2023, 05:40 PM
(06-30-2023, 05:36 PM)Spiny_Norman Wrote:(06-30-2023, 04:39 PM)chrisk Wrote: Why do so many people keep saying that the Pac-12 (now back to 10) plans to expand.
How does a conference of 11 teams work better than 10? Adding SDSU looks like dilution to me.
The P12 minus USC and UCLA is worth significantly less to potential media partners. The P12 presidents and commissioner don't have a lot of bargaining leverage. The offers that have been rumored put the P12 above mid-majors but well behind all of the other Power 5. It's like watching galaxies accelerate away from the Milky Way at an accelerating rate.
The property will be more valuable to potential partners with greater reach. I am sure that the expansion discussion is driven by the desire to reach other major markets like San Diego, Orange County and LA (SDSU) and Dallas Metroplex (SMU) with the assumption that the added revenue is greater than the dilution factor. Even with those schools, the P12 will probably still be well behind the B10, SEC, ACC and Big 12.
Hey, Spiny is that acceleration of acceleration the second or third derivative? Asking for a friend. (Economics has a long, rich tradition of using acceleration when we mean velocity.)
(06-30-2023, 05:36 PM)Spiny_Norman Wrote:(06-30-2023, 04:39 PM)chrisk Wrote: Why do so many people keep saying that the Pac-12 (now back to 10) plans to expand.
How does a conference of 11 teams work better than 10? Adding SDSU looks like dilution to me.
The P12 minus USC and UCLA is worth significantly less to potential media partners. The P12 presidents and commissioner don't have a lot of bargaining leverage. The offers that have been rumored put the P12 above mid-majors but well behind all of the other Power 5. It's like watching galaxies accelerate away from the Milky Way at an accelerating rate.
The property will be more valuable to potential partners with greater reach. I am sure that the expansion discussion is driven by the desire to reach other major markets like San Diego, Orange County and LA (SDSU) and Dallas Metroplex (SMU) with the assumption that the added revenue is greater than the dilution factor. Even with those schools, the P12 will probably still be well behind the B10, SEC, ACC and Big 12.
Hey, Spiny is that acceleration of acceleration the second or third derivative? Asking for a friend. (Economics has a long, rich tradition of using acceleration when we mean velocity.)
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06-30-2023, 05:55 PM
(06-30-2023, 03:29 PM)newguy Wrote: ESPN is reporting that San Diego State plans to remain in the Mountain West, at least in the short run.
https://www.espn.com/college-football/st...ource-says
If you read the article it looks like the PAC-12 media deal has been delayed and SDSU seems to be in a quandary. Mountain West conference is playing hard ball and they don't take kindly to a member school up and leaving.
(06-30-2023, 03:29 PM)newguy Wrote: ESPN is reporting that San Diego State plans to remain in the Mountain West, at least in the short run.
https://www.espn.com/college-football/st...ource-says
If you read the article it looks like the PAC-12 media deal has been delayed and SDSU seems to be in a quandary. Mountain West conference is playing hard ball and they don't take kindly to a member school up and leaving.
06-30-2023, 05:58 PM
(06-30-2023, 05:40 PM)TonyLima Wrote:(06-30-2023, 05:36 PM)Spiny_Norman Wrote:(06-30-2023, 04:39 PM)chrisk Wrote: Why do so many people keep saying that the Pac-12 (now back to 10) plans to expand.
How does a conference of 11 teams work better than 10? Adding SDSU looks like dilution to me.
The P12 minus USC and UCLA is worth significantly less to potential media partners. The P12 presidents and commissioner don't have a lot of bargaining leverage. The offers that have been rumored put the P12 above mid-majors but well behind all of the other Power 5. It's like watching galaxies accelerate away from the Milky Way at an accelerating rate.
The property will be more valuable to potential partners with greater reach. I am sure that the expansion discussion is driven by the desire to reach other major markets like San Diego, Orange County and LA (SDSU) and Dallas Metroplex (SMU) with the assumption that the added revenue is greater than the dilution factor. Even with those schools, the P12 will probably still be well behind the B10, SEC, ACC and Big 12.
Hey, Spiny is that acceleration of acceleration the second or third derivative? Asking for a friend. (Economics has a long, rich tradition of using acceleration when we mean velocity.)
I should know to be more precise for this audience. I think my intended meaning was "speeding away at an accelerating rate." Thanks for bringing me back to Physics 51.
"We have an unwritten rule around here not to do anything stupid."
-Casey Jacobsen, Feb 3, 2000
(06-30-2023, 05:40 PM)TonyLima Wrote:(06-30-2023, 05:36 PM)Spiny_Norman Wrote:(06-30-2023, 04:39 PM)chrisk Wrote: Why do so many people keep saying that the Pac-12 (now back to 10) plans to expand.
How does a conference of 11 teams work better than 10? Adding SDSU looks like dilution to me.
The P12 minus USC and UCLA is worth significantly less to potential media partners. The P12 presidents and commissioner don't have a lot of bargaining leverage. The offers that have been rumored put the P12 above mid-majors but well behind all of the other Power 5. It's like watching galaxies accelerate away from the Milky Way at an accelerating rate.
The property will be more valuable to potential partners with greater reach. I am sure that the expansion discussion is driven by the desire to reach other major markets like San Diego, Orange County and LA (SDSU) and Dallas Metroplex (SMU) with the assumption that the added revenue is greater than the dilution factor. Even with those schools, the P12 will probably still be well behind the B10, SEC, ACC and Big 12.
Hey, Spiny is that acceleration of acceleration the second or third derivative? Asking for a friend. (Economics has a long, rich tradition of using acceleration when we mean velocity.)
I should know to be more precise for this audience. I think my intended meaning was "speeding away at an accelerating rate." Thanks for bringing me back to Physics 51.
"We have an unwritten rule around here not to do anything stupid."
-Casey Jacobsen, Feb 3, 2000
06-30-2023, 07:31 PM
(This post was last modified: 06-30-2023, 07:33 PM by StanfordMatt.)
It will be very difficult for SDSU to leave the Mountain West after today as their buyout effectively doubles as of July 1. I have no idea if it would've made sense for the PAC-12 to add SDSU or not, but IF the PAC-12 was interested in doing so and let today's deadline pass, it would be yet another sign of ineptitude by the conference's power brokers.
Speaking of ineptitude, SDSU apparently contracted all of its legal work out to Legal Zoom. First, they sent notice to the MWC in mid-June (with typos) stating their intent to leave the conference only to come back a week later and say that that's not what the notice really meant. Clearly, SDSU was planning to receive a P5 invite, presumably from the PAC-12, and made a mess of the whole situation. MWC probably could have dropped the hammer and kicked SDSU out of the conference based on the notice, but its value to the conference means the MWC is unlikely to take such steps and the Aztecs will be saved from their own incompetence.
Speaking of ineptitude, SDSU apparently contracted all of its legal work out to Legal Zoom. First, they sent notice to the MWC in mid-June (with typos) stating their intent to leave the conference only to come back a week later and say that that's not what the notice really meant. Clearly, SDSU was planning to receive a P5 invite, presumably from the PAC-12, and made a mess of the whole situation. MWC probably could have dropped the hammer and kicked SDSU out of the conference based on the notice, but its value to the conference means the MWC is unlikely to take such steps and the Aztecs will be saved from their own incompetence.
(This post was last modified: 06-30-2023, 07:33 PM by StanfordMatt.)
It will be very difficult for SDSU to leave the Mountain West after today as their buyout effectively doubles as of July 1. I have no idea if it would've made sense for the PAC-12 to add SDSU or not, but IF the PAC-12 was interested in doing so and let today's deadline pass, it would be yet another sign of ineptitude by the conference's power brokers.
Speaking of ineptitude, SDSU apparently contracted all of its legal work out to Legal Zoom. First, they sent notice to the MWC in mid-June (with typos) stating their intent to leave the conference only to come back a week later and say that that's not what the notice really meant. Clearly, SDSU was planning to receive a P5 invite, presumably from the PAC-12, and made a mess of the whole situation. MWC probably could have dropped the hammer and kicked SDSU out of the conference based on the notice, but its value to the conference means the MWC is unlikely to take such steps and the Aztecs will be saved from their own incompetence.
Speaking of ineptitude, SDSU apparently contracted all of its legal work out to Legal Zoom. First, they sent notice to the MWC in mid-June (with typos) stating their intent to leave the conference only to come back a week later and say that that's not what the notice really meant. Clearly, SDSU was planning to receive a P5 invite, presumably from the PAC-12, and made a mess of the whole situation. MWC probably could have dropped the hammer and kicked SDSU out of the conference based on the notice, but its value to the conference means the MWC is unlikely to take such steps and the Aztecs will be saved from their own incompetence.
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