More conference realignment? - Printable Version
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More conference realignment? - BostonCard - 07-21-2021
Texas and Oklahoma are asking about joining the SEC.
https://www.al.com/alabamafootball/2021/07/texas-oklahoma-inquire-about-joining-sec-per-report.html
I think they realize that the big boy money for athletes will be in the SEC.
BC
RE: More conference realignment? - 82lsju - 07-21-2021
(07-21-2021, 02:52 PM)BostonCard Wrote: Texas and Oklahoma are asking about joining the SEC.
https://www.al.com/alabamafootball/2021/07/texas-oklahoma-inquire-about-joining-sec-per-report.html
I think they realize that the big boy money for athletes will be in the SEC.
BC
if it happens the Big 12 can become the Big 8 again.....
RE: More conference realignment? - TrumpCard - 07-21-2021
If Larry Scott had been able to close the deal with Texas and Oklahoma back in 2012, Stanford might have missed out on some Rose Bowl appearances (impossible to know how things would have turned out), but I can say with some confidence that the Pac-12 would not be the worst of the major conferences in football.
If Texas and Oklahoma now were to bolt for the SEC, what scraps would be available to join the Pac-12 and meet the Pac-12's academic and athletic standards?
RE: More conference realignment? - 82lsju - 07-21-2021
(07-21-2021, 03:42 PM)TrumpCard Wrote: If Larry Scott had been able to close the deal with Texas and Oklahoma back in 2012, Stanford might have missed out on some Rose Bowl appearances (impossible to know how things would have turned out), but I can say with some confidence that the Pac-12 would not be the worst of the major conferences in football.
If Texas and Oklahoma now were to bolt for the SEC, what scraps would be available to join the Pac-12 and meet the Pac-12's academic and athletic standards?
if this does happen it would seem to get the ball rolling to four sixteen team conferences
maybe the Big 10 picks up Iowa State and maybe TCU (or Oklahoma State) to get to 16 teams
Big 12 leftovers then
- Texas Tech
- TCU or Oklahoma State
- Baylor
- Kansas
- Kansas State
- West Virginia
Maybe the ACC takes West Virginia and ??? (ND?? or another of the Big 12 leftovers) to get to 16 teams
Pac 12 could then take four of (or what's leftover if the ACC takes one of these to get to 16 teams)
- Texas Tech
- TCU or Oklahoma State
- Baylor
- Kansas
- Kansas State
from a TV market perspective not a very appealing list of expansion candidates....
RE: More conference realignment? - Maple Leaf - 07-21-2021
(07-21-2021, 03:54 PM)82lsju Wrote:(07-21-2021, 03:42 PM)TrumpCard Wrote: If Larry Scott had been able to close the deal with Texas and Oklahoma back in 2012, Stanford might have missed out on some Rose Bowl appearances (impossible to know how things would have turned out), but I can say with some confidence that the Pac-12 would not be the worst of the major conferences in football.
If Texas and Oklahoma now were to bolt for the SEC, what scraps would be available to join the Pac-12 and meet the Pac-12's academic and athletic standards?
if this does happen it would seem to get the ball rolling to four sixteen team conferences
maybe the Big 10 picks up Iowa State and maybe TCU (or Oklahoma State) to get to 16 teams
Big 12 leftovers then
- Texas Tech
- TCU or Oklahoma State
- Baylor
- Kansas
- Kansas State
- West Virginia
Maybe the ACC takes West Virginia and ??? (ND?? or another of the Big 12 leftovers) to get to 16 teams
Pac 12 could then take four of (or what's leftover if the ACC takes one of these to get to 16 teams)
- Texas Tech
- TCU or Oklahoma State
- Baylor
- Kansas
- Kansas State
from a TV market perspective not a very appealing list of expansion candidates....
Stanford and others should go back to the Pacific Coast Conference pre-1959 when the conference was dissolved.
Name the ten schools the made up the Pacific Coast Conference.
RE: More conference realignment? - BobK - 07-21-2021
Idaho
Montana left early 50's or close.
RE: More conference realignment? - Spiny_Norman - 07-21-2021
I think we are seeing the first steps of the stratification of the FBS division, at least for football.
The revised SEC with OU and Texas, the Big 10 (with Ohio State dragging along the rest of the conference) and ACC (with Clemson and Notre Dame dragging along the rest of the conference) would be on one level. In effect, they already are.
The remaining Big 12 teams, the P12, Big East, AAC, Mountain West, etc. would be a level below.
P12 football is mostly not competitive right now with the SEC, B10 and ACC, either recruiting, on the field or as a TV draw. And the forces in college football are widening the gulf between the P12 and these conferences. I don't believe there is any way for the P12 to catch up. I think that OU and Texas see the same thing wrt the B12 vs. the SEC/B10/ACC.
RE: More conference realignment? - CTcard - 07-21-2021
(07-21-2021, 03:42 PM)TrumpCard Wrote: If Larry Scott had been able to close the deal with Texas and Oklahoma back in 2012, Stanford might have missed out on some Rose Bowl appearances (impossible to know how things would have turned out), but I can say with some confidence that the Pac-12 would not be the worst of the major conferences in football.
If Texas and Oklahoma now were to bolt for the SEC, what scraps would be available to join the Pac-12 and meet the Pac-12's academic and athletic standards?
You would have been very safe making that statement (the Pac 12 not being the worst of the major conferences in football), because it is already true without Oklahoma and Texas.
Of course in some one year that would be correct, but integrated over time the Pac 12's won-loss record against the other Power 5 conferences is second best. Here is a chart:
https://topdan.com/college-football-conference-records/index.html
Of course the details will change a little if you alter the time window.
Now, whether the Pac 12 is the worst conference in football revenue is another question. My memory is that the current situation is pretty much a top 2 (SEC, Big Ten) and a next 3 (Pac 12, Big 12, ACC), and how the bottom 3 align depends on the year.
If Oklahoma and Texas do go to the SEC, then the Big 12 will be a clearly inferior product to the Pac 12. In fact, as others note, it would seem quite possible it would cease to exist.
The benefit I would see is if the NCAA simply made the playoff the P-4 conference champs. Heck, then you could put 40 teams in the SEC and I wouldn't care.
RE: More conference realignment? - teejers1 - 07-21-2021
(07-21-2021, 05:02 PM)Spiny_Norman Wrote: I think we are seeing the first steps of the stratification of the FBS division, at least for football.
. . .
Could be. But with the direction it looks like college athletics is headed, I'm not sure I care anymore.
RE: More conference realignment? - TrumpCard - 07-21-2021
IMHO, the right move, if possible, is to offer Texas and Oklahoma a brobdingnagian financial bounty to join the Pac-12, and rename it the Frontier Conference or something like that. The current Pac-12 schools would lose out on money from revenue sports, but would be able to retain the eyeballs needed to be competitive with NIL income and in other ways that are key to the next generation of college sports. Voluntarily give up the revenue now to keep the eyeballs or involuntarily give it up later when no one still cares about watching Pac-12 teams play.
RE: More conference realignment? - 2006alum - 07-21-2021
(07-21-2021, 05:17 PM)teejers1 Wrote:+1. If Teej and I agree on something, we must be right, right?(07-21-2021, 05:02 PM)Spiny_Norman Wrote: I think we are seeing the first steps of the stratification of the FBS division, at least for football.
. . .
Could be. But with the direction it looks like college athletics is headed, I'm not sure I care anymore.
RE: More conference realignment? - Phogge - 07-21-2021
SD State, Sac State, Cal, Stanford, Reno, UNLV, Davis, NAU, Cal Poly, BYU. Play nine conference games, one travel beat down for mucho cash and two D2 schools. Perfect for schools that can’t or won’t get involved with the Bryce Young Era. Do a couple minor bowl tie-ins. Reduce ticket prices. Perhaps a package deal with a streaming service. No more 8pm kickoffs.
RE: More conference realignment? - needle - 07-21-2021
If the goal is maximizing TV revenue (and the Big 12 becomes the Little 8), the Pac should poach Baylor and TCU.
Baylor football somehow has become a brand. Combine them with TCU and you get the Dallas and Austin markets.
Texas Tech had a generational talent in Mahomes but their football program has only gotten worse since he left. Does not bode well for them.
Oklahoma State has a hard ceiling on its potential popularity, given that it will never truly rival OU.
There are options that would be more attractive to Pac fans, like BYU and Nebraska, but I don't think those schools would bring enough TV market value to justify what they would ask for in return. Not worth the headache.
RE: More conference realignment? - CowboyIndian - 07-22-2021
(07-21-2021, 10:12 PM)needle Wrote: If the goal is maximizing TV revenue (and the Big 12 becomes the Little 8), the Pac should poach Baylor and TCU.
Baylor football somehow has become a brand. Combine them with TCU and you get the Dallas and Austin markets.
Texas Tech had a generational talent in Mahomes but their football program has only gotten worse since he left. Does not bode well for them.
Oklahoma State has a hard ceiling on its potential popularity, given that it will never truly rival OU.
There are options that would be more attractive to Pac fans, like BYU and Nebraska, but I don't think those schools would bring enough TV market value to justify what they would ask for in return. Not worth the headache.
None of those schools would seem to match the old academic requirements of the Pac-12 as research universities but that may be dinosaur thinking these days.
RE: More conference realignment? - Giants - 07-22-2021
(07-21-2021, 07:54 PM)Phogge Wrote: SD State, Sac State, Cal, Stanford, Reno, UNLV, Davis, NAU, Cal Poly, BYU. Play nine conference games, one travel beat down for mucho cash and two D2 schools. Perfect for schools that can’t or won’t get involved with the Bryce Young Era. Do a couple minor bowl tie-ins. Reduce ticket prices. Perhaps a package deal with a streaming service. No more 8pm kickoffs.
Drop BYU and NAU and add San Jose and Fresno and you have a workable conference. Heck, let’s call it the Cal-Neva Conference.
RE: More conference realignment? - Softball Fan - 07-22-2021
I don't see how Texas and Oklahoma joining the conference will do much to help Stanford. Did Stanford football get better because Colorado and Utah were added into the PAC-12?
The only way Stanford gets better is internally through better recruiting. Texas and Oklahoma will add some revenue to the conference but they will also add one or two losses on to Stanford's record every year.
RE: More conference realignment? - JeffInCorvallis - 07-22-2021
(07-22-2021, 10:55 AM)Giants Wrote:(07-21-2021, 07:54 PM)Phogge Wrote: SD State, Sac State, Cal, Stanford, Reno, UNLV, Davis, NAU, Cal Poly, BYU. Play nine conference games, one travel beat down for mucho cash and two D2 schools. Perfect for schools that can’t or won’t get involved with the Bryce Young Era. Do a couple minor bowl tie-ins. Reduce ticket prices. Perhaps a package deal with a streaming service. No more 8pm kickoffs.
Drop BYU and NAU and add San Jose and Fresno and you have a workable conference. Heck, let’s call it the Cal-Neva Conference.
Hope everyone fully enjoyed the Pac-12 championship games, New Year's Day bowl games, and being in consideration for the college football playoff but consistently falling just short. I think the above is the likely future for Stanford football. Given the current trajectory of big-time college sports I am not opposed, but I will miss those days of watching us run over USC and Notre Dame and Iowa and Virginia Tech. I guess I already do.
RE: More conference realignment? - MBA85 - 07-22-2021
(07-22-2021, 10:18 AM)CowboyIndian Wrote:(07-21-2021, 10:12 PM)needle Wrote: If the goal is maximizing TV revenue (and the Big 12 becomes the Little 8), the Pac should poach Baylor and TCU.
Baylor football somehow has become a brand. Combine them with TCU and you get the Dallas and Austin markets.
Texas Tech had a generational talent in Mahomes but their football program has only gotten worse since he left. Does not bode well for them.
Oklahoma State has a hard ceiling on its potential popularity, given that it will never truly rival OU.
There are options that would be more attractive to Pac fans, like BYU and Nebraska, but I don't think those schools would bring enough TV market value to justify what they would ask for in return. Not worth the headache.
None of those schools would seem to match the old academic requirements of the Pac-12 as research universities but that may be dinosaur thinking these days.
How about Rice? Strong academics, a lot of alums who are also Stanford alums. Houston is the fourth largest city in the country, so a large market. Bloom and McCaffrey are set to turn football around. Strong baseball program which hit a rough patch is about to turn itself around under Cruz and
Bostic. Women's sports are strong and improving.
RE: More conference realignment? - BostonCard - 07-22-2021
https://www.espn.com/college-football/story/_/id/31865190/big-12-officials-meet-discuss-possible-departures-oklahoma-texas-sec
*awkward*
BC
RE: More conference realignment? - needle - 07-23-2021
I think Rice (and about a dozen other schools) would add the Central time zone window for games but not much in terms of TV market interest.
Not a lot of great options for the Pac.