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RE: 2023 Niners thread - Mick - 10-17-2023
To me, this was a classic "trap" game:
1) Highly emotional victory against the Dallas Cowboys, almost guaranteeing an emotional let down.
2) Cleveland had an extra week off to prepare. brobdingnagian advantage, Cleveland.
3) 49ers had to fly 2,500 miles, Cleveland home game. brobdingnagian advantage, Cleveland.
4) It was in the rain, a more natural occurrence in Cleveland than in Santa Clara. Purdy can play in the rain, BTW. Threw for 72 points against Louisiana-Lafayette in the rain. Threw for 35 points against Tampa Bay in the rain during the rain against Tom Brady. And just a guess, but I suspect Purdy threw in inclement weather at Iowa State more than once.
5) Worst of all is travel related jet lag. There have been studies that indicate that Eastern jet lag is particularly challenging on athlete bodies. I know we all remember the Texas drubbing of Stanford's football team in 1999 by a score of 69-17 during an early afternoon game...and then Texas traveled east the next year to Stanford for a night game, played at 10:15 p.m. body clock time at kickoff for the #5 rated Texas players, resulting in a 27-24 victory at Stanford -- one week after Stanford lost to San Jose State, 40-27. That's a 55 point turnaround in adjacent years, and Stanford had a better record in 1999 (8-4) versus 2000 (5-6).
The fact that the 49ers could have won on the last play was amazing to me.
RE: 2023 Niners thread - OutsiderFan - 10-17-2023
I can't believe the overreaction freakout to the Niners and Eagles losing one game, barely.
The Athletic put the Dolphins #1 in its power rankings, seemingly forgetting the 5-24 combined record of the opponents they have beaten, and the fact they got walloped by the only team they have played with a winning record, at now 4-2 Buffalo.
I would like to see Shanahan go to more 4 WR sets (even with Kittle as one of the WRs) and let Purdy "process" when teams are putting 8 in the box and having success stopping the run.
Even so, Shanahan had to be a little confused given the Niners basically ran the ball down the Browns' throats on the first drive with the same D that later stymied them. I mean if it worked the first drive, why change the approach, and if they continue stopping it...
The classic coaching dilemma. When do you change what you do that has worked before, when it isn't working in the here and now?
RE: 2023 Niners thread - Giants - 10-17-2023
OutsiderFan dateline='[url=tel:1697575532' Wrote: 1697575532[/url]']
I can't believe the overreaction freakout to the Niners and Eagles losing one game, barely.
The Athletic put the Dolphins #1 in its power rankings, seemingly forgetting the 5-24 combined record of the opponents they have beaten, and the fact they got walloped by the only team they have played with a winning record, at now 4-2 Buffalo.
I would like to see Shanahan go to more 4 WR sets (even with Kittle as one of the WRs) and let Purdy "process" when teams are putting 8 in the box and having success stopping the run.
Even so, Shanahan had to be a little confused given the Niners basically ran the ball down the Browns' throats on the first drive with the same D that later stymied them. I mean if it worked the first drive, why change the approach, and if they continue stopping it...
The classic coaching dilemma. When do you change what you do that has worked before, when it isn't working in the here and now?
Kinda like the overreactions written here regarding Purdy’s budding career and a prediction of an undefeated season after the previous game.
One game (good or bad) is not a portend of the future. It is one game played in a season of seventeen.
I would change absolutely nothing in reaction to the loss. I might change things depending on the health of particular players….
RE: 2023 Niners thread - OutsiderFan - 10-17-2023
(10-17-2023, 02:46 PM)Giants Wrote:OutsiderFan dateline='[url=tel:1697575532' Wrote: 1697575532[/url]']
I can't believe the overreaction freakout to the Niners and Eagles losing one game, barely.
The Athletic put the Dolphins #1 in its power rankings, seemingly forgetting the 5-24 combined record of the opponents they have beaten, and the fact they got walloped by the only team they have played with a winning record, at now 4-2 Buffalo.
I would like to see Shanahan go to more 4 WR sets (even with Kittle as one of the WRs) and let Purdy "process" when teams are putting 8 in the box and having success stopping the run.
Even so, Shanahan had to be a little confused given the Niners basically ran the ball down the Browns' throats on the first drive with the same D that later stymied them. I mean if it worked the first drive, why change the approach, and if they continue stopping it...
The classic coaching dilemma. When do you change what you do that has worked before, when it isn't working in the here and now?
Kinda like the overreactions written here regarding Purdy’s budding career and a prediction of an undefeated season after the previous game.
One game (good or bad) is not a portend of the future. It is one game played in a season of seventeen.
I would change absolutely nothing in reaction to the loss. I might change things depending on the health of particular players….
Nobody here predicted an undefeated season. I pointed out that Niners analyst Donte Whitner did and that I wouldn't go that far. My record projection before the season was 13-4, and I did have them losing the Browns game, though as it was kicked off, I didn't think they would lose, and an undefeated season was mathematically possible.
I'm haven't changed my opinion on FHOF Brock Purdy. I fully expect him to have a big game on Monday night. If he doesn't play well in that game, I will be surprised and perplexed. It will help to play a mediocre Vikings defense in a dome as he looks to atone for his worst game to date.
RE: 2023 Niners thread - Mick - 10-17-2023
Just an interesting postscript: Kyle Shanahan's teams are 1-9 against teams coached by Jim Schwartz. That stat goes back to 2008 when Shanahan was an offensive coordinator. Shanahan's offenses average just 15.7 ppg against Schwartz's defenses. They've only reached 20 points once.
RE: 2023 Niners thread - Giants - 10-17-2023
OutsiderFan dateline='[url=tel:1697580085' Wrote: 1697580085[/url]']
Giants dateline='[url=tel:1697579195' Wrote: 1697579195[/url]']
OutsiderFan dateline='[url=tel:1697575532' Wrote: 1697575532[/url]']
I can't believe the overreaction freakout to the Niners and Eagles losing one game, barely.
The Athletic put the Dolphins #1 in its power rankings, seemingly forgetting the 5-24 combined record of the opponents they have beaten, and the fact they got walloped by the only team they have played with a winning record, at now 4-2 Buffalo.
I would like to see Shanahan go to more 4 WR sets (even with Kittle as one of the WRs) and let Purdy "process" when teams are putting 8 in the box and having success stopping the run.
Even so, Shanahan had to be a little confused given the Niners basically ran the ball down the Browns' throats on the first drive with the same D that later stymied them. I mean if it worked the first drive, why change the approach, and if they continue stopping it...
The classic coaching dilemma. When do you change what you do that has worked before, when it isn't working in the here and now?
Kinda like the overreactions written here regarding Purdy’s budding career and a prediction of an undefeated season after the previous game.
One game (good or bad) is not a portend of the future. It is one game played in a season of seventeen.
I would change absolutely nothing in reaction to the loss. I might change things depending on the health of particular players….
Nobody here predicted an undefeated season. I pointed out that Niners analyst Donte Whitner did and that I wouldn't go that far. My record projection before the season was 13-4, and I did have them losing the Browns game, though as it was kicked off, I didn't think they would lose, and an undefeated season was mathematically possible.
I'm haven't changed my opinion on FHOF Brock Purdy. I fully expect him to have a big game on Monday night. If he doesn't play well in that game, I will be surprised and perplexed. It will help to play a mediocre Vikings defense in a dome as he looks to atone for his worst game to date.
I did not post that someone “here” predicted an undefeated season. I did post that a prediction of an undefeated season was posted here. I wouldn’t be surprised with anything Purdy does. He will have good games and bad games. He is still a young player learning the position.
RE: 2023 Niners thread - 81alum - 10-17-2023
(10-17-2023, 01:45 PM)OutsiderFan Wrote: I can't believe the overreaction freakout to the Niners and Eagles losing one game, barely.It is why teams actually play games, and championships are not determined by media or pollsters. There is a vague resemblance to politics here.
RE: 2023 Niners thread - OutsiderFan - 10-18-2023
Man on man, watching the Jonnydel All-22 analysis video of the Browns game was certainly instructive.
There were so many mistakes made by the offense in that game, it's like a season's worth in one. There was a run play where it was perfectly blocked minus George Kittle and Trent Williams being confused about who should have blocked a Safety, and neither did. No play illustrates the lack of focus that plagues the Niners against the Browns than this CMac run that should have gone for at least 20 yards, and went nowhere.
Another bad play was the fake screen to right, tunnel to left that Deebo would typically run, that Trent Williams also screwed up on, that bumped Ray Ray McCloud off his landmarks, and resulted in an incomplete pass, that had it been executed would have gone maybe for a TD because everyone else executed it so well.
Neither of these plays can be attributed to dominant Browns defense overpowering the Niners. Just painful to watch perfectly set up plays being bungled by your best players.
I'm not concerned even a little bit and believe the Niners are much more the team that trounced the Steelers and Cowboys than the one that came a missed FG away from beating the Browns in what I believe will be the Offenses's worst game of the season. It just sucks it came against the #1 D in NFL, because now we have to hear about how great they are, and not the litany of mistakes the Niners made to help the Browns win.
RE: 2023 Niners thread - lex24 - 10-19-2023
I expected the o line to struggle at times this year. I did not expect the defensive line to be average at best. 160 yards rushing against a team with a practice squad QB playing back up RBs is not good. The Niners have not pressured the QB without the aid of blitzes. Getting the d line to the level one expects when three of its starters are Armstead, Hargraave and Bosa is job 1.
Job 2 is McCaffreys usage. He’s averaging 22.3 touches a game with just under 4 catches. Last year 19.4 with 5 catches. That a difference of about 4 carries a game. I also think he’s running inside more.
Niners most indispensable offensive player, imo, is Williams. Fortunately he avoided a major injury. McCaffrey is second. They need him as healthy as a RB can be come playoff time. Monitoring his use is key. I’d like to see Mason/ Mitchell get a few more of those inside runs. CMac can be utilized a little more in passing game. More touches in space. A few less inside pounding touches.
Different challenge this week. Minn can’t run. They do throw it well. Niners should win this one.
RE: 2023 Niners thread - lex24 - 10-22-2023
Deebo out. Williams probably out. McCaffrey probably out. Time for defense to step up. Defense has been good. But not dominate. They will need to be dominant Monday.
RE: 2023 Niners thread - cardcrimson - 10-22-2023
(10-22-2023, 10:32 AM)lex24 Wrote: Deebo out. Williams probably out. McCaffrey probably out. Time for defense to step up. Defense has been good. But not dominate. They will need to be dominant Monday.
That's a big change from yesterday or Thursday when they were day to day. Guessing the powers that be feel good about the chances against the Vikings and don't want to risk anything this early in the season.
RE: 2023 Niners thread - lex24 - 10-22-2023
cardcrimson dateline='[url=tel:1697999385' Wrote: 1697999385[/url]']
lex24 dateline='[url=tel:1697995979' Wrote: 1697995979[/url]']
Deebo out. Williams probably out. McCaffrey probably out. Time for defense to step up. Defense has been good. But not dominate. They will need to be dominant Monday.
That's a big change from yesterday or Thursday when they were day to day. Guessing the powers that be feel good about the chances against the Vikings and don't want to risk anything this early in the season.
Deebo has a hairline fracture. Out a couple weeks. Williams listed as doubtful. That generally means out. McCaffrey still questionable. It would be foolish, imo, to play him.
RE: 2023 Niners thread - cardcrimson - 10-22-2023
(10-22-2023, 11:58 AM)lex24 Wrote:cardcrimson dateline='[url=tel:1697999385' Wrote: 1697999385[/url]']
lex24 dateline='[url=tel:1697995979' Wrote: 1697995979[/url]']
Deebo out. Williams probably out. McCaffrey probably out. Time for defense to step up. Defense has been good. But not dominate. They will need to be dominant Monday.
That's a big change from yesterday or Thursday when they were day to day. Guessing the powers that be feel good about the chances against the Vikings and don't want to risk anything this early in the season.
Deebo has a hairline fracture. Out a couple weeks. Williams listed as doubtful. That generally means out. McCaffrey still questionable. It would be foolish, imo, to play him.
Eeeesh. Bummer. And absolutely sit him out. . . .
RE: 2023 Niners thread - lex24 - 10-22-2023
cardcrimson dateline='[url=tel:1698002098' Wrote: 1698002098[/url]']
lex24 dateline='[url=tel:1698001124' Wrote: 1698001124[/url]']
cardcrimson dateline='[url=tel:1697999385' Wrote: 1697999385[/url]']
lex24 dateline='[url=tel:1697995979' Wrote: 1697995979[/url]']
Deebo out. Williams probably out. McCaffrey probably out. Time for defense to step up. Defense has been good. But not dominate. They will need to be dominant Monday.
That's a big change from yesterday or Thursday when they were day to day. Guessing the powers that be feel good about the chances against the Vikings and don't want to risk anything this early in the season.
Deebo has a hairline fracture. Out a couple weeks. Williams listed as doubtful. That generally means out. McCaffrey still questionable. It would be foolish, imo, to play him.
Eeeesh. Bummer. And absolutely sit him out. . . .
Indy, with Gardner Minshew shredded Cleveland’s vaunted defense. Gotta love the NFL.
RE: 2023 Niners thread - cardcrimson - 10-22-2023
(10-22-2023, 01:14 PM)lex24 Wrote:cardcrimson dateline='[url=tel:1698002098' Wrote: 1698002098[/url]']
lex24 dateline='[url=tel:1698001124' Wrote: 1698001124[/url]']
cardcrimson dateline='[url=tel:1697999385' Wrote: 1697999385[/url]']
lex24 dateline='[url=tel:1697995979' Wrote: 1697995979[/url]']
Deebo out. Williams probably out. McCaffrey probably out. Time for defense to step up. Defense has been good. But not dominate. They will need to be dominant Monday.
That's a big change from yesterday or Thursday when they were day to day. Guessing the powers that be feel good about the chances against the Vikings and don't want to risk anything this early in the season.
Deebo has a hairline fracture. Out a couple weeks. Williams listed as doubtful. That generally means out. McCaffrey still questionable. It would be foolish, imo, to play him.
Eeeesh. Bummer. And absolutely sit him out. . . .
Indy, with Gardner Minshew shredded Cleveland’s vaunted defense. Gotta love the NFL.
And then choked at the end. Pitty. Refs had a hand in it, as well. Seems like refs are more egregious than ever in taking over games. . . . .
RE: 2023 Niners thread - Mick - 10-22-2023
Jaylon Moore is subbing in as starter for Trent Williams, as he did in weeks #5 and #6 last year. Deebo's hairline fracture means he's out. Jauan Jennings, Ray-Ray and Ronnie Bell will have to pick up the slack.
Christian McCaffrey and Dre Greenlaw both had limited practices yesterday and are listed as "questionable." I suspect that Christian may try to play.
RE: 2023 Niners thread - OutsiderFan - 10-23-2023
If McCaffrey plays, it will be because the medical staff believes he is good to go. If he doesn't play it will be because he isn't. I don't see how unilaterally saying he shouldn't play is the right answer.
That said, soft tissue injuries are really tough to judge. Last year I strained a lat muscle. It never hurt unless I did a pull-up, and only when I pulled up past a certain point, just before full range of motion was reached. Since I like doing full pull-ups, I wanted to rehab it. Must have taken 6 weeks before I could do a full pull-up without pain.
But lliterally if I didn't pull with it past a certain point when injured, I felt no pain. I've no clue the specifics of CMac's situation, but I'd imagine he can only make it worse if he twists or stretches in a certain way, and it may be healed already too if it was as minor as David Lombardi reported.
The Vikings play a lot of close games, but the Niners really need to atone for a lousy performance last week, and dominate because they are the better team playing for a lot more. The Cleveland game in Indy showed me last week's loss in Cleveland was much more about the Niners playing poorly, early, injuries, missed FGs and atrocious refs than the Browns being particularly great. They are very lucky to not - and should be - be 2-4.
RE: 2023 Niners thread - Mick - 10-23-2023
Not surprised that the Niners lost. It was a classic trap game. Cleveland had an extra week to prepare, that is an enormous advantage. The game was played at 10 a.m. body clock time, an enormous advantage for Cleveland. The Niners had to travel 2,500 miles. It was raining. And the 49ers still had a chance to win on the last play.
The playing field's going to be a bit more level this time. Instead of 10 a.m. body clock time, kickoff is at 5:15 p.m. body clock time, which might work slightly against the Vikings, given the later kickoff. Especially in the second half. Both teams have had the same number of days to prepare. Both have a few injured starters.
49ers are between a 7 and an 8 point favorite, depending on the source. For the NFL, that's a substantial spread.
RE: 2023 Niners thread - French Rage - 10-23-2023
It's Kirk Cousins against a decent opponent, so that stat point is in our favor.
RE: 2023 Niners thread - Leftcoast - 10-23-2023
I watch the McCaffery news pretty closely since he's my 1st Round Draft in both of my Fantasy Leagues. The reports on him playing have been bullish the past two days with most folks thinking he plays but with a cap on # of plays and a quick hook if needed.
He's officially questionable with a game time (read 90 minutes prior to kick-off) decision to make it official but trending toward playing.