Outside Topic OT: Farhan’s moves today

Outside Topic OT: Farhan’s moves today - Printable Version

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RE: OT: Farhan’s moves today - Phogge - 03-29-2019

Trivia. Giants had a Cy Young pitcher in 1984. Who? No peekee Mick.

RE: OT: Farhan’s moves today - BobK - 03-29-2019

Guessing Steve Carlton

RE: OT: Farhan’s moves today - Phogge - 03-29-2019

Mark Davis.

Never thought I would see a poorer hitting team than the 1953 St. Louis Browns. Think the Giants are that team.

Yard sale!

Yikes! They moved to Baltimore in ‘54 and hit 52 homers. But they improved to seventh place (for the youngsters there were two 8 team leagues). No endless playoffs.

RE: OT: Farhan’s moves today - Mick - 03-29-2019

(03-29-2019, 10:40 AM)OutsiderFan Wrote: This outfield, with Derek Holland as #2 starter - it's like 1984 all over again. Oh wait, make that 2017.

This is a legendarily bad team. It wouldn't be good anyway, with the every-single-infielder-past-their-prime. Their pitching staff should finish in the top 1/3 of MLB just because of the park they play in, they'll finish around .500 in WHIP and ERA. The bench is late-additions and never-wases.

But the outfield. Ah the outfield. Dirges will be written about this outfield. Mothers will scare their recalcitrant children by threatening to make them watch this outfield. there has never been a liability in left like Tanner Joe, or an overmatched hitter like Reed.

110 losses. You heard it here first.

RE: OT: Farhan’s moves today - OutsiderFan - 03-30-2019

As I posted in another thread on this sorry state of affairs in San Francisco, the Giants can say they aren’t rebuilding all they want, but whether they like it or not, they are. They could have been proactive to address or reactive. They chose the latter.

The stupidly has already been baked in. They should have listened to the fan base two years ago, who was telling them they had to rebuild then. The only thing putting off rebuilding does is insure the rot goes deeper, takes longer to remove, which also extends how long there is no foundation to start building again.

They probably cost themselves at least one and possibly two major prospects by not trading Bumgarner two years ago. Maybe the Giants have Miguel Andujar at 3B and Machado is playing 3B for the Yankees now, had they done that. Posey too should have been dealt.

The fan base isn’t dumb. We saw the catastrophically bad farm system results in 2017. We saw the payroll obligations. It didn’t take a PhD in statistics to understand the situation.

RE: OT: Farhan’s moves today - Mick - 03-30-2019

(03-30-2019, 04:18 AM)OutsiderFan Wrote: As I posted in another thread on this sorry state of affairs in San Francisco, the Giants can say they aren’t rebuilding all they want, but whether they like it or not, they are. They could have been proactive to address or reactive. They chose the latter.

The stupidly has already been baked in. They should have listened to the fan base two years ago, who was telling them they had to rebuild then. The only thing putting off rebuilding does is insure the rot goes deeper, takes longer to remove, which also extends how long there is no foundation to start building again.

They probably cost themselves at least one and possibly two major prospects by not trading Bumgarner two years ago. Maybe the Giants have Miguel Andujar at 3B and Machado is playing 3B for the Yankees now, had they done that. Posey too should have been dealt.

The fan base isn’t dumb. We saw the catastrophically bad farm system results in 2017. We saw the payroll obligations. It didn’t take a PhD in statistics to understand the situation.

Two years ago, the Giants had just come off of an 87-75 season, pretty close to the records of the Giants teams in the '10, '12, '14 playoffs. We won the wild card game over the Mets. Lost to the eventual World Series winner, the Cubs. Giants were league average in runs scored, just under average in OPS. They topped the NL in fielding average. They were fourth in the league in WHIP and ERA. On the down side, they lacked a closer and Panik had a down year from injuries.

2017 started off with the fourth most wins in MLB in spring training. The wheels fell off quickly. The Giants were 11-23 by May 9, 38-63 on July 24 with a week to go to the trading deadline. They should have started the rebuild then. The writing was on the wall at that point.

RE: OT: Farhan’s moves today - OutsiderFan - 03-30-2019

I'm a multiple time internet software entrepreneur. I have started three companies myself and been involved in founding four. One was sold. One is a going concern now. One is on back burner. And one is my current startup focus. The first two were very niche, so I'm not Jerry Yang, Pierre Odimayer, or Mark Zuckerberg. The one I am working on now is something on that scale, but that's not the point I'm making here.

The point is no matter the size of your organization or its past achievements, you must be vigilant about staying ahead of competition. It requires a constant reinventing of what you do and how you do it. My favorite book ever is The Innovator's Dilemma because it teaches this lesson to those who don't naturally embrace a constant improvement mindset.

The Giants are a case example of how if you are slow to innovate, you will have your lunch eaten. I was exasperated by the Giants not going into re-build mode in 2017 and knew the longer they waited the worse it would be. I think they have actually found themselves in the worst case scenario they had in front of them in 2017. They decided they weren't going to re-build, but "re-tool" in 2018. This not only wasted half of 2017 and all of 2018 starting a new talent infusion into the system, it made 2018 and 2019 years to sink further to the bottom.

My feeling at the time was, if they told the fans or otherwise made clear to the fans there was a re-build in place, coming off 3 WS titles in the 2010s, the fans would have their back. But now, we are looking at the abyss, for certainly all of 2019, and probably 2020 at minimum. There is no reason to care. You can't even support the young and up and coming players, because there aren't any there.

McCovey Chronicles wrote a great story on the game last night. It said "no player currently on the Giants will be on the team when the Giants are a contending team again." Let that sink in. They are effectively an expansion team right now. Joey Bart and Heliot Ramos are literally the only players in the system who you can say will be on those teams. This is why I am far, far more interested in what Augusta, San Jose, and Richmond are doing this season than I am the San Francisco Giants.

RE: OT: Farhan’s moves today - Phogge - 03-30-2019

I advocated trading Posey two years ago but the geniuses around here thought it insanity.

Belt is my personal gripe. He has never learned that with two strikes you have to protect the plate. Too many times he has that smirk on walking back to the dugout as he has taken strike three on a pitch two inches off the corner.

RE: OT: Farhan’s moves today - Mick - 04-01-2019

(03-30-2019, 08:09 AM)Phogge Wrote: I advocated trading Posey two years ago but the geniuses around here thought it insanity.

Belt is my personal gripe. He has never learned that with two strikes you have to protect the plate. Too many times he has that smirk on walking back to the dugout as he has taken strike three on a pitch two inches off the corner.

We sure saw it two nights ago. We'll see it much more this season. At 1-3, the Giants are on track for the 1962 Mets' record of 40-120. Except that team scored 617 runs and had Frank Thomas hitting 34 home runs.

(03-30-2019, 07:18 AM)OutsiderFan Wrote: I'm a multiple time internet software entrepreneur. I have started three companies myself and been involved in founding four. One was sold. One is a going concern now. One is on back burner. And one is my current startup focus. The first two were very niche, so I'm not Jerry Yang, Pierre Odimayer, or Mark Zuckerberg. The one I am working on now is something on that scale, but that's not the point I'm making here.

The point is no matter the size of your organization or its past achievements, you must be vigilant about staying ahead of competition. It requires a constant reinventing of what you do and how you do it. My favorite book ever is The Innovator's Dilemma because it teaches this lesson to those who don't naturally embrace a constant improvement mindset.

The Giants are a case example of how if you are slow to innovate, you will have your lunch eaten. I was exasperated by the Giants not going into re-build mode in 2017 and knew the longer they waited the worse it would be. I think they have actually found themselves in the worst case scenario they had in front of them in 2017. They decided they weren't going to re-build, but "re-tool" in 2018. This not only wasted half of 2017 and all of 2018 starting a new talent infusion into the system, it made 2018 and 2019 years to sink further to the bottom.

My feeling at the time was, if they told the fans or otherwise made clear to the fans there was a re-build in place, coming off 3 WS titles in the 2010s, the fans would have their back. But now, we are looking at the abyss, for certainly all of 2019, and probably 2020 at minimum. There is no reason to care. You can't even support the young and up and coming players, because there aren't any there.

McCovey Chronicles wrote a great story on the game last night. It said "no player currently on the Giants will be on the team when the Giants are a contending team again." Let that sink in. They are effectively an expansion team right now. Joey Bart and Heliot Ramos are literally the only players in the system who you can say will be on those teams. This is why I am far, far more interested in what Augusta, San Jose, and Richmond are doing this season than I am the San Francisco Giants.

Great post. Reflects my feelings exactly.

Also in that category: the legal profession. Law firms run on a 19th century business model, essentially as a guild. That's changing...not very quickly, but it's changing.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/markcohen1/2017/07/03/goodbye-guild-laws-changing-culture/#6962a7a870e8

RE: OT: Farhan’s moves today - Phogge - 04-01-2019

Nothing in the paper but did Boch go to his San Diego home last night and basically say he’d stay there until Farhan actually found a way to obtain an actual major league outfielder?

RE: OT: Farhan’s moves today - Mick - 04-01-2019

(04-01-2019, 08:55 AM)Phogge Wrote: Nothing in the paper but did Boch go to his San Diego home last night and basically say he’d stay there until Farhan actually found a way to obtain an actual major league outfielder?

It has to be true. Collectively, Giants outfielders Conner Joe, Steven Duggar and Gerardo Parra have four hits and three walks in 36 plate appearances with 13 strikeouts. One run scored, one RBI. In four games. Ugh.

RE: OT: Farhan’s moves today - cardcrimson - 04-01-2019

(04-01-2019, 09:09 AM)Mick Wrote:
(04-01-2019, 08:55 AM)Phogge Wrote: Nothing in the paper but did Boch go to his San Diego home last night and basically say he’d stay there until Farhan actually found a way to obtain an actual major league outfielder?

It has to be true. Collectively, Giants outfielders Conner Joe, Steven Duggar and Gerardo Parra have four hits and three walks in 36 plate appearances with 13 strikeouts. One run scored, one RBI. In four games. Ugh.

Come on, the Padres have the best pitching staff in baseball so far this season. . . .

RE: OT: Farhan’s moves today - qwerty49 - 04-01-2019

In an attempt to make lemons into lemonade, I tried an experiment. For the SD series I decided to risk $20 by betting $5 against the Giants each game. I'm now $6 ahead but the odds are shortening drastically and for the last game I had to put up $5 to win $3.

The odds for the Dodgers series will be even worse, so I'm going to quit this experiment while ahead. (Even though I think the Giants will lose at least 90 games this year, at short odds the winning bets will probably be outweighed by the 65-70 games they win.)

So I'm gonna take that 6 bucks and try to get my 13-yr-old nephew onto the Stanford sailing team. I think the odds are better.

RE: OT: Farhan’s moves today - OutsiderFan - 04-02-2019

(04-01-2019, 12:51 PM)qwerty49 Wrote: In an attempt to make lemons into lemonade, I tried an experiment. For the SD series I decided to risk $20 by betting $5 against the Giants each game. I'm now $6 ahead but the odds are shortening drastically and for the last game I had to put up $5 to win $3.

The odds for the Dodgers series will be even worse, so I'm going to quit this experiment while ahead. (Even though I think the Giants will lose at least 90 games this year, at short odds the winning bets will probably be outweighed by the 65-70 games they win.)

So I'm gonna take that 6 bucks and try to get my 13-yr-old nephew onto the Stanford sailing team. I think the odds are better.

Now if you had just bet the Giants to beat the Dodgers on Monday... This is why they play the games, and I don't bet on them!

Giants just a game out of first place!

RE: OT: Farhan’s moves today - qwerty49 - 04-02-2019

Another blockbuster trade: Farhan gets CF Kevin Pillar, a 30-yr-old right handed version of Duggar with a lifetime .260 BA, from Toronto for Hanson, Law and a minor leaguer.

Pillar was 1 for 16 as of yesterday.

And they DFA’d Michael Reed, who started on Opening Day.

So now we have 2 light-hitting glove guys to platoon in CF. Heck they did it for half the price 40 years ago with Ken Henderson.

RE: OT: Farhan’s moves today - M T - 04-02-2019

(04-01-2019, 08:42 AM)Mick Wrote:
(03-30-2019, 08:09 AM)Phogge Wrote: I advocated trading Posey two years ago but the geniuses around here thought it insanity.

Belt is my personal gripe. He has never learned that with two strikes you have to protect the plate. Too many times he has that smirk on walking back to the dugout as he has taken strike three on a pitch two inches off the corner.

We sure saw it two nights ago. We'll see it much more this season. At 1-3, the Giants are on track for the 1962 Mets' record of 40-120. Except that team scored 617 runs and had Frank Thomas hitting 34 home runs.

As long as people are cherry-picking, how 'bout that Belt!
At this point, he's on track for 32 homers and 96 RBI.

RE: OT: Farhan’s moves today - BobK - 04-02-2019

Good one MT. Hey we are 2-3.

RE: OT: Farhan’s moves today - qwerty49 - 04-02-2019

(04-02-2019, 06:52 PM)BobK Wrote: Good one MT. Hey we are 2-3.

And depending on how you round it, that puts us on track for 64 or 65 wins, LOL.