New rankings are out. Stanford #207

New rankings are out. Stanford #207 - Printable Version

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RE: New rankings are out. Stanford #207 - 97fan - 11-09-2023

A personal anecdote that bears on this conversation, and particularly on the conservative hand-wringing about progressivism on campus:

My sister-in-law was, until a few years ago, a tenure-track humanities professor at a public university in a red state. (This school finished middle-of-the-pack, for whatever that's worth -- personally I think it's worth very little -- in the FIRE rankings.) She's also an outspoken feminist, and she made some political comments at an on-campus event, which attracted the attention of a Republican state legislator, who was then in contact with the university's administration about the comments. Suddenly my sister-in-law's tenure application was being viewed much more harshly by the administration. Ultimately she was denied tenure. And even though a university appeals board ruled that the administration's purported rationale for denying tenure was bogus, the university president overruled the appeals board and upheld the decision.

My sister-in-law sued and got a six-figure settlement, but that amounted to a only a small fraction of the financial damage she suffered. She was unable to find another job in her field; as those of you in academia know, it can be very hard to get a job elsewhere after being denied tenure. She's had to start over career-wise, after spending about 15 years, including grad school, in this field.

RE: New rankings are out. Stanford #207 - Mick - 11-09-2023

Is there a similar freedom of expression study funded from the opposite side of the aisle?

RE: New rankings are out. Stanford #207 - TrumpCard - 11-09-2023

I'm sorry that happened to your SIL. I hope that, in retrospect, she's able to look back and say she's happy that she ended up in the new field, even though she had to change careers for an unfair reason. My wife changed careers due to events outside her control -- though not in such an unfair context -- and she's much happier now than she would have been had she stayed with her first career track.

RE: New rankings are out. Stanford #207 - 97fan - 11-09-2023

Thanks! Very nice of you to say that. My sister-in-law is back in grad school, pursuing a second PhD (though she's not looking to return to academia after she finishes the degree). I hope that the career change turns out as well for her as it did for your wife.

(11-09-2023, 05:40 PM)TrumpCard Wrote: I'm sorry that happened to your SIL. I hope that, in retrospect, she's able to look back and say she's happy that she ended up in the new field, even though she had to change careers for an unfair reason. My wife changed careers due to events outside her control -- though not in such an unfair context -- and she's much happier now than she would have been had she stayed with her first career track.

RE: New rankings are out. Stanford #207 - needle - 11-09-2023

Mick dateline='[url=tel:1699576553' Wrote: 1699576553[/url]']
Is there a similar freedom of expression study funded from the opposite side of the aisle?

Sort of, from PEN America. FIRE is big about stating that campuses absolutely should not put a “chill” on free expression, so would not unequivocally embrace this statement from the PEN America report linked below:

Quote: Effective responses to hateful speech include counter-messaging, condemnations, direct support to targeted individuals and groups, dialogue, and education.

https://campusfreespeechguide.pen.org/pen-principles/

RE: New rankings are out. Stanford #207 - Mick - 11-10-2023

(11-09-2023, 06:49 PM)needle Wrote:
Mick dateline='[url=tel:1699576553' Wrote: 1699576553[/url]']
Is there a similar freedom of expression study funded from the opposite side of the aisle?

Sort of, from PEN America. FIRE is big about stating that campuses absolutely should not put a “chill” on free expression, so would not unequivocally embrace this statement from the PEN America report linked below:

Quote: Effective responses to hateful speech include counter-messaging, condemnations, direct support to targeted individuals and groups, dialogue, and education.

https://campusfreespeechguide.pen.org/pen-principles/

Interesting. Seems balanced. Thanks.

RE: New rankings are out. Stanford #207 - cctop - 11-10-2023

Former provost John Etchemendy wrote an interesting letter to the Daily relating the time that the Westboro Baptist Church came to campus:

https://stanforddaily.com/2023/11/08/from-the-community-what-stanford-has-lost/

"But something has been lost, at our university and in our society at large, something we desperately need to get back: the ability to disagree, to dispute, to debate, without questioning our opponents’ fundamental dignity and humanity."

RE: New rankings are out. Stanford #207 - cardcrimson - 11-10-2023

(11-10-2023, 09:08 PM)cctop Wrote: Former provost John Etchemendy wrote an interesting letter to the Daily relating the time that the Westboro Baptist Church came to campus:

https://stanforddaily.com/2023/11/08/from-the-community-what-stanford-has-lost/

"But something has been lost, at our university and in our society at large, something we desperately need to get back: the ability to disagree, to dispute, to debate, without questioning our opponents’ fundamental dignity and humanity."

Fabulous. Thanks for posting.

RE: New rankings are out. Stanford #207 - cardbored - 11-11-2023

(11-09-2023, 10:44 AM)82 Card Wrote: FIRE is not an unbiased observer. From the FIRE Wikipedia entry: "FIRE has received major funding from groups which primarily support conservative and libertarian causes, including the Bradley Foundation, Sarah Scaife Foundation, and the Charles Koch Institute."

The Lex Fridman Podcast has an excellent interview with FIRE co-founder Greg Lukianoff. Lukianoff makes persuasive arguments against campus speech restrictions and is an effective advocate for the importance of freedom of speech in society generally. I believe he is sincere when he says he is a progressive.

RE: New rankings are out. Stanford #207 - 82lsju - 11-11-2023

(11-10-2023, 10:26 PM)cardcrimson Wrote:
(11-10-2023, 09:08 PM)cctop Wrote: Former provost John Etchemendy wrote an interesting letter to the Daily relating the time that the Westboro Baptist Church came to campus:

https://stanforddaily.com/2023/11/08/from-the-community-what-stanford-has-lost/

"But something has been lost, at our university and in our society at large, something we desperately need to get back: the ability to disagree, to dispute, to debate, without questioning our opponents’ fundamental dignity and humanity."

Fabulous. Thanks for posting.

this part

Quote:without questioning our opponents’ fundamental dignity and humanity.

is missing in many interactions today....

RE: New rankings are out. Stanford #207 - dabigv13 - 11-11-2023

Interesting letter. Etch with perhaps a subtle jab at DEI.

RE: New rankings are out. Stanford #207 - martyup - 11-11-2023

Sorry folks, you'll have to take this interesting but clearly political discussion elsewhere. Stick to Stanford sports please.