Ouch - Printable Version
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RE: Ouch - gailtate - 06-04-2025
(06-04-2025, 01:20 PM)TrumpCard Wrote:(06-04-2025, 11:48 AM)BostonCard Wrote: I mean, it’s not like John Arillaga didn’t donate $300 million over the course of his lifetime to Stanford (largely Athletics). I suspect that had he still been alive, the conversation around Iriafen, Canady, and NIL might be very different. I never knew Arillaga, but I suspect he would have been all in on NIL.
Stanford has dozens of very wealthy alums, many of whom are very generous to the University. However, I don’t think any of them prioritize athletics to the extent that Arillaga did. That’s not arrogance, that’s just a difference in values and preferences. Many would prefer to endow buildings, a new school of sustainability, professorships or academic scholarships than athletics facilities, coaches, or NILs. It’s their money; how to give it away is their business. And while it would be fun to be talking about picking up a national title in Softball or having a competitive football team, I can’t honestly say that I would have preferred to see John and Ann Doerr direct their $1.1 billion donation towards the athletic department instead of the school of Sustainability that now bears their name (and again, not really my business what they want to give to anyways).
BC
I agree with BC's normative view. Taking it a step further, elite sports at Stanford brought value in earlier eras, but I don't see the value proposition continuing. IMHO, in the not too long term, Stanford is going to find that it will be better served to voluntarily withdraw from the arms race and focus more on bringing top students to the Farm.
RE: Ouch - chrisk - 06-04-2025
There are not many players coming out of high school who will qualify for large NIL payments. I’m sure Lifetime Cardinal can meet the competition except for the few at the top. The bigger challenge will be keeping the star performers at Stanford as upperclassmen, but that should be possible on a budget well less than the $20M Stanford will be disbursing in-house (no pun intended).
RE: Ouch - GK3 - 06-04-2025
(06-04-2025, 11:48 AM)BostonCard Wrote: I mean, it’s not like John Arillaga didn’t donate $300 million over the course of his lifetime to Stanford (largely Athletics). I suspect that had he still been alive, the conversation around Iriafen, Canady, and NIL might be very different. I never knew Arillaga, but I suspect he would have been all in on NIL.
Stanford has dozens of very wealthy alums, many of whom are very generous to the University. However, I don’t think any of them prioritize athletics to the extent that Arillaga did. That’s not arrogance, that’s just a difference in values and preferences. Many would prefer to endow buildings, a new school of sustainability, professorships or academic scholarships than athletics facilities, coaches, or NILs. It’s their money; how to give it away is their business. And while it would be fun to be talking about picking up a national title in Softball or having a competitive football team, I can’t honestly say that I would have preferred to see John and Ann Doerr direct their $1.1 billion donation towards the athletic department instead of the school of Sustainability that now bears their name (and again, not really my business what they want to give to anyways).
BC
John came to Stanford on a basketball scholarship and that scholarship and hard work got him a great education and he never seemed to stop repaying Stanford. He was a year ahead of me and I watched him play a of games in the old Pavilion. I think it will be a few more years before we know how bad the arms race will be.
This all started with a change in football and Tara winding down her career and clearly not in favor of the NIL program. We know have new coaches, a new GM and will have a new AD. To be successful they are going to have to have some NIL money, but they also have to believe they can live with the NIL and Portal problems and win games. I think both the Football and Basketball programs believe they can do just that.
We shall see how it all works out.
RE: Ouch - fullmetal - 06-04-2025
It hurts to know that, in this case, Stanford can attract and recruit a transcendental, championship athlete but not be able to retain her because of money. It's as close to a "pay her and win a championship; she's going to win one wherever she is next season" hypothetical as we'll probably ever see. I wonder what the softball boosters/insiders feel. I certainly didn't have the money or the donor history with softball to move their needle.
RE: Ouch - paloalto - 06-04-2025
Softball is somewhat unique in sports in that all you need is one very good pitcher to have a chance to win a world series. In football one very good quarterback would not be enough.
NIL is totally out of control in my favorite sport WVB. According to many posts on a VB message board Wisconsin payed a player over six figures last season and she sat on the bench. They will pay her six figures again this coming season because they don't want her to transfer to a competitor. Nebraska, Wisconsin, Texas, and some other schools are paying their best players several hundred thousand dollars per year in addition to the athletic scholarship.
Moving forward I'm not sure the Stanford name will be enough to keep Cardinal volleyball a powerhouse in the sport.
RE: Ouch - Card10Fan - 06-04-2025
(06-04-2025, 10:51 AM)BobK Wrote: Interesting as I know of three donations to WBB totaling $1.1M.
I have no clue right now of contributions to mbb and football so maybe that’s your point Mudhead which I respect. But never isn’t correct
Up until the last few years, all the WBB coaching positions were endowed. Now with two additional assistant coaching spots, I think we have two positions that are now not endowed. Those would require generous contributions to make happen.
I see Lifetime Cardinal is not accepting donations for WBB right now, just football and MBB. I’m wondering how those efforts are going and if the women’s fundraising effort was able to meet their 1.5mil goal for this upcoming season.
Stanford volleyball recruiting has remained strong thus far despite no collective for them at the moment. Time will tell.
RE: Ouch - GoodGrief - 06-05-2025
(06-04-2025, 06:54 PM)paloalto Wrote: Softball is somewhat unique in sports in that all you need is one very good pitcher to have a chance to win a world series. In football one very good quarterback would not be enough.Can you elaborate on that? I just find that very interesting. Does the closer distance to the plate simply allow a great pitcher to completely dominate and handcuff the batters in a way they can’t do in baseball? Are no-hitters much more common in softball?
RE: Ouch - Spike - 06-05-2025
I loved NiJaree during her stay at Stanford.
I totally respect why she transferred.
So why am rooting for Texas tonight?
Anybody else feel that way?
RE: Ouch - 82lsju - 06-05-2025
(06-05-2025, 09:50 AM)GoodGrief Wrote:(06-04-2025, 06:54 PM)paloalto Wrote: Softball is somewhat unique in sports in that all you need is one very good pitcher to have a chance to win a world series. In football one very good quarterback would not be enough.Can you elaborate on that? I just find that very interesting. Does the closer distance to the plate simply allow a great pitcher to completely dominate and handcuff the batters in a way they can’t do in baseball? Are no-hitters much more common in softball?
one softball pitcher can pretty much pitch almost every or even every game in the post season, Canady has pitched complete games in at least the last six TT games (I stopped looking further to see how long the current streak is)
RE: Ouch - fullmetal - 06-05-2025
(06-05-2025, 10:19 AM)Spike Wrote: I loved NiJaree during her stay at Stanford.
I totally respect why she transferred.
So why am rooting for Texas tonight?
Anybody else feel that way?
Yep. I want NiJaree to succeed. I'd love for her to come back, if softball can pony up the money. But Texas Tech has been buying players left and right, and I can't respect that strategy, even if it is clearly the most effective way to win championships. Maybe Texas has been doing the same, but it's not been at the expense of Stanford.
RE: Ouch - jonnyss - 06-05-2025
(06-04-2025, 11:48 AM)BostonCard Wrote: I mean, it’s not like John Arillaga didn’t donate $300 million over the course of his lifetime to Stanford (largely Athletics). I suspect that had he still been alive, the conversation around Iriafen, Canady, and NIL might be very different. I never knew Arillaga, but I suspect he would have been all in on NIL.
Stanford has dozens of very wealthy alums, many of whom are very generous to the University. However, I don’t think any of them prioritize athletics to the extent that Arillaga did. That’s not arrogance, that’s just a difference in values and preferences. Many would prefer to endow buildings, a new school of sustainability, professorships or academic scholarships than athletics facilities, coaches, or NILs. It’s their money; how to give it away is their business. And while it would be fun to be talking about picking up a national title in Softball or having a competitive football team, I can’t honestly say that I would have preferred to see John and Ann Doerr direct their $1.1 billion donation towards the athletic department instead of the school of Sustainability that now bears their name (and again, not really my business what they want to give to anyways).
BC
but aren't bricks and mortar more important than winning teams? (where are the emoji's when ya need em?)
RE: Ouch - Leftcoast - 06-05-2025
Very understandable, Spike and FullMetal.
Canady left Stanford and her teammates for cash ... and then there's Texas Tech.
Her motivation is understandable of course but I don't have to like it and my good will didn't transfer with her. She's now just a good player on a team I dislike. I appreciate her talent but I'm actively rooting AGAINST Texas Tech and their approach to building a sports program.
RE: Ouch - d4cohn - 06-05-2025
(06-04-2025, 06:54 PM)paloalto Wrote: Softball is somewhat unique in sports in that all you need is one very good pitcher to have a chance to win a world series. In football one very good quarterback would not be enough.
Well, unless that one generational pitcher loses Game 1 of the WCWS finals because she can't throw an intentional walk pitch out of the zone. :) I am stunned no one has brought up last night's ending (perhaps I missed in this or another thread). But Canady/TTU could very well have lost the national championship because Canady could not throw an intentional walk pitch properly and hit into a double play with the bases loaded with no outs in the Top of the 1st that resulted in 0 runs for Texas Tech in that half inning.
Sure, getting to the championship series is (slightly) better than the semifinals, but I think, at least for this year, it is becoming clear that the only benefit of the move was financial rather than softball (for Canady).
RE: Ouch - OCcardinal - 06-05-2025
NiJaree Canady pitching well in the tournament provides no new information. Everyone knew what she could do for a team when she was paid that $1M. Back when Canady accepted that offer, Marisa Ingemi wrote an article for the Chronicle with the headline
"NiJaree Canady’s transfer is a sign Stanford athletics could be in trouble"
in which she quoted someone who said
"I don’t think you can assume you’re going to keep doing well at a smaller sport or Olympic sport without considering NIL anymore."
Ingemi then concluded her article with the declaration:
"The loss of Canady gives pause to the idea of Stanford being able to compete in the expanding NIL market across women’s sports."
So, how is Stanford doing "across women's sports" since Canady left?
Women's Golf - has one of the best rosters in the history of college golf; the young team lost the national championship in match play by a stroke (match play is what it is) and they didn't lose anyone to the transfer portal; recently got commitments from Nikki Oh and Jude Lee, the #2 and #4-ranked players in the Class of 2026.
Women's Rowing - won NCAAs with the most points ever scored by the Cardinal, avenging last year's loss to Texas
Women's Water Polo - won NCAAs, which was significantly better than last year's second round loss to UCLA
Women's Tennis - lost in Sweet 16 vs the Elite 8 last year; has the #1 ranked 2025 recruiting class (up from #12 last season)
Women's Soccer - made it back to the college cup (though not the final) despite having a ton of key injuries; #7 ranked recruiting class coming in; star player Andrea Kitahata will return next year as a grad student (she had sat out a year after Katie's death), some are saying they are a leading national title contender for next season
Women's Swimming - finished 2nd at NCAAs (best finish since 2019)
Women's Cross Country - improved from 12th to 6th at NCAAs this year
Women's Indoor Track and Field - improved from 15th to 4th at NCAAs this year
Women's Outdoor Track and Field - TBD
Volleyball - lost in the regional final, same as last season; has the #3-ranked recruiting class coming in
Beach Volleyball - had a great season, including their first ever conference title, but lost in the Elite Eight (same as last season); they have reached an elite level and look like they will stay there
Women's Gymnastics - won the ACC tournament but didn't advance past regionals (tough seeding); an incoming freshman won a bronze in the Olympics and just won multiple medals at the European Championships
Women's Basketball - didn't make the NCAA tournament (which the Chronicle made sure to write several articles about); but looks like they have righted the ship - very limited transfer portal impact this year (only lost an expected grad transfer and a former transfer-in, neither regular starters); has the #3 recruiting class in the country for 2025 (the best all around class since 2018 - in a way it is the perfect class as it doesn't depend on top-3 type players that are most likely to be lured away by big NIL contracts in the future).
Softball - lost in a close battle in the regional final to Oregon (who made the final 6 in the CWS); has the #8 2025 recruiting class
Women's Lacrosse - the best lacrosse team in Stanford history, finished ranked at a program-high of 7th; looks very strong going forward
Sailing (non-NCAA) - won three national championships this season for the 1st time in its history; all sailors were female except for one of the sailors in the Open championship; Stanford's Vanessa Lahrkamp was the Quantum Women's College Sailor of the Year
Artistic Swimming (non-NCAA) - won its first NCAA championship since 2021
Fencing (non-NCAA) - a mixed gender team sport, but Stanford had its best team finish since 2014 (9th) and Arianna Cao was the women's foil national champion
Lightweight Rowing (non-NCAA) - finished 6th at national championships
Squash (non-NCAA) - won its conference and had the most wins since the 2017-18 season
Women's Rugby (Club) - won both the D1 and 7s national championships (the first time ever it's had that double)
So excuse me, SF Chronicle, if I don't give a sh*t how 1 former Stanford athlete has performed for her softball team this year.
RE: Ouch - paloalto - 06-05-2025
And that Chronicle article did not bring up the fact at least a dozen teams put in an offer and were outbid for Canady. Stanford probably does need more NIL to attract elite athletes but this extreme amount of money is not a good example to make the point.
T vs TT on ESPN at 5 PM PT today.
76lsjumb - 76lsjumb - 06-05-2025
(06-05-2025, 03:06 PM)OCcardinal Wrote: NiJaree Canady pitching well in the tournament provides no new information. Everyone knew what she could do for a team when she was paid that $1M. Back when Canady accepted that offer, Marisa Ingemi wrote an article for the Chronicle with the headline
"NiJaree Canady’s transfer is a sign Stanford athletics could be in trouble"
in which she quoted someone who said
"I don’t think you can assume you’re going to keep doing well at a smaller sport or Olympic sport without considering NIL anymore."
Ingemi then concluded her article with the declaration:
"The loss of Canady gives pause to the idea of Stanford being able to compete in the expanding NIL market across women’s sports."
So, how is Stanford doing "across women's sports" since Canady left?
Women's Golf - has one of the best rosters in the history of college golf; the young team lost the national championship in match play by a stroke (match play is what it is) and they didn't lose anyone to the transfer portal; recently got commitments from Nikki Oh and Jude Lee, the #2 and #4-ranked players in the Class of 2026.
Women's Rowing - won NCAAs with the most points ever scored by the Cardinal, avenging last year's loss to Texas
Women's Water Polo - won NCAAs, which was significantly better than last year's second round loss to UCLA
Women's Tennis - lost in Sweet 16 vs the Elite 8 last year; has the #1 ranked 2025 recruiting class (up from #12 last season)
Women's Soccer - made it back to the college cup (though not the final) despite having a ton of key injuries; #7 ranked recruiting class coming in; star player Andrea Kitahata will return next year as a grad student (she had sat out a year after Katie's death), some are saying they are a leading national title contender for next season
Women's Swimming - finished 2nd at NCAAs (best finish since 2019)
Women's Cross Country - improved from 12th to 6th at NCAAs this year
Women's Indoor Track and Field - improved from 15th to 4th at NCAAs this year
Women's Outdoor Track and Field - TBD
Volleyball - lost in the regional final, same as last season; has the #3-ranked recruiting class coming in
Beach Volleyball - had a great season, including their first ever conference title, but lost in the Elite Eight (same as last season); they have reached an elite level and look like they will stay there
Women's Gymnastics - won the ACC tournament but didn't advance past regionals (tough seeding); an incoming freshman won a bronze in the Olympics and just won multiple medals at the European Championships
Women's Basketball - didn't make the NCAA tournament (which the Chronicle made sure to write several articles about); but looks like they have righted the ship - very limited transfer portal impact this year (only lost an expected grad transfer and a former transfer-in, neither regular starters); has the #3 recruiting class in the country for 2025 (the best all around class since 2018 - in a way it is the perfect class as it doesn't depend on top-3 type players that are most likely to be lured away by big NIL contracts in the future).
Softball - lost in a close battle in the regional final to Oregon (who made the final 6 in the CWS); has the #8 2025 recruiting class
Women's Lacrosse - the best lacrosse team in Stanford history, finished ranked at a program-high of 7th; looks very strong going forward
Sailing (non-NCAA) - won three national championships this season for the 1st time in its history; all sailors were female except for one of the sailors in the Open championship; Stanford's Vanessa Lahrkamp was the Quantum Women's College Sailor of the Year
Artistic Swimming (non-NCAA) - won its first NCAA championship since 2021
Fencing (non-NCAA) - a mixed gender team sport, but Stanford had its best team finish since 2014 (9th) and Arianna Cao was the women's foil national champion
Lightweight Rowing (non-NCAA) - finished 6th at national championships
Squash (non-NCAA) - won its conference and had the most wins since the 2017-18 season
Women's Rugby (Club) - won both the D1 and 7s national championships (the first time ever it's had that double)
So excuse me, SF Chronicle, if I don't give a sh*t how 1 former Stanford athlete has performed for her softball team this year.
Wow. If you looked up “mic drop” in a dictionary, this post would have to be pretty close to the top of the list of examples.
I knew letting my SF Chron subscription expire a ways back was a good move then. Still is.
RE: Ouch - cardfan77 - 06-05-2025
(06-05-2025, 10:19 AM)Spike Wrote: I loved NiJaree during her stay at Stanford.
I totally respect why she transferred.
So why am rooting for Texas tonight?
Anybody else feel that way?
Phew, glad to know I’m not the only one. Nothing against Canady but I rooting against TT from the beginning
RE: Ouch - Mudhead - 06-05-2025
(06-05-2025, 12:58 PM)Leftcoast Wrote: Very understandable, Spike and FullMetal.
Canady left Stanford and her teammates for cash ... and then there's Texas Tech.
Her motivation is understandable of course but I don't have to like it and my good will didn't transfer with her. She's now just a good player on a team I dislike. I appreciate her talent but I'm actively rooting AGAINST Texas Tech and their approach to building a sports program.
You had better root against both teams then. Texas didn’t pay a million for
Canady because they didn’t think they needed her. But that’s the school that taught Texas Tech how to build a program.
RE: Ouch - paloalto - 06-05-2025
https://x.com/TJAltimore/status/1930302584092258562
RE: Ouch - Mick - 06-05-2025
(06-05-2025, 12:58 PM)Leftcoast Wrote: Very understandable, Spike and FullMetal.
Canady left Stanford and her teammates for cash ... and then there's Texas Tech.
Her motivation is understandable of course but I don't have to like it and my good will didn't transfer with her. She's now just a good player on a team I dislike. I appreciate her talent but I'm actively rooting AGAINST Texas Tech and their approach to building a sports program.
Part of me wonders what her Texas Tech teammates think. I know about envy on sports teams. Would that make them more or less willing to transfer? They have four other pitchers, will any of them transfer? Lauren Allred is their second best player, what was her NIL deal?