Outside Topic Giants/Niners 2022 thread - Printable Version
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RE: Giants/Niners 2022 thread - Mick - 03-16-2022
(03-16-2022, 01:13 PM)Giants Wrote:(03-16-2022, 07:42 AM)DC 86 Wrote: In MLB free agent news, Giants target Seyou Suzuki is signing with the Cubs. Also, Kyle Schwarber signing with the Phillies.
Does this mean Bryant is coming back? Another FA? Or will SF go with who is currently onboard? What do you think, DC?
I don't think the Giants like the durability / permanence of Bryant's swing. He's 6'5", with a long swing and he just turned 30. I think they think it will be difficult to extend its effectiveness as time goes on. Had a terrible 2020, (.644 OPS), rebounded for Chicago in 2021 (.861 OPS), then retreated as a Giant in 2021 post-trade (.761 OPS). A .761 OPS is very pedestrian, and even though he hit .835 OPS at home, that's down nearly 100 points from his career stats at Oracle.
Supposedly, the Rockies will likely get him. I imagine people think he'd probably hit 40 HRs in Coors field, strike out a lot, have a resurrected OPS. But his career OPS at Coors Field is .757. He doesn't hit well there.
Jimmy Garoppolo facts:
FACT: The 49ers restructured three major contracts and now are under the 2022 NFL salary cap.
Rumor: The only team left with interest in Garoppolo is Indianapolis.
FACT: Six teams need quarterbacks. New Orleans, Carolina, Cleveland and Atlanta are considering Deshaun Watson. Indianapolis and Seattle also need QBs. And Garoppolo had a relationship with the former Patriots executive running things for the Texans (Nick Caserio).
Rumor: Cleveland wants "an adult" at QB. Clubhouse cancer Baker Mayfield experiment is over. Jimmy Garoppolo experiment about to begin?
FACT: NFL Networks' Jim Trotter thinks there are scenarios where Watson could end up in SF. I don't see it, but who knows?
[Tweet]https://twitter.com/JimTrotter_NFL/status/1504136908829429761[/tweet]
FACT: The 49ers don't need to make a decision today. They could keep Garoppolo on the roster through the summer before cutting him -- in which case there would be a total of about an $8.5 million cap hit. They extended Kittle and Warner in July, they'll probably do the same for Bosa and Deebo this July.
RE: Giants/Niners 2022 thread - DC 86 - 03-16-2022
(03-16-2022, 01:13 PM)Giants Wrote:(03-16-2022, 07:42 AM)DC 86 Wrote: In MLB free agent news, Giants target Seyou Suzuki is signing with the Cubs. Also, Kyle Schwarber signing with the Phillies.
Does this mean Bryant is coming back? Another FA? Or will SF go with who is currently onboard? What do you think, DC?
I think SF/Zaifi has made it pretty clear that they are wary of committing to long term contracts and/or overpaying in the free agent market. However, they are opportunistic, e.g. getting involved with Bryce Harper when it appeared that his market might not develop.
There are six free agents remaining worth discussing: Freddie Freeman, Kris Bryant, Carlos Correa, Trevor Story, Nick Castellanos, Michael Conforto.
Freeman: presumably not a consideration for multiple reasons.
Conforto: fits the Giants acquisition profile the best, but they don't need yet another left handed hitter.
Castellanos: fits the Giants needs the best, by far. Question is whether Zaidi will overpay since that is the nature of the "Winner's Curse" which defines free agency.
Bryant: clearly SF doesn't have interest and a lot of other teams do.
Story: for a wealthy team like the Giants there's an argument for trying to sign the man to play third base (and possibly return to shortstop at some point) coming off a down year, which may mean an expensive (but not gigantic, as would have been the case a year ago) contract.
Correa: only if his market collapses AND they he was interested in a one year/very high AAV contract AND they he was willing to play third base. Seems extremely unlikely but technically a non-zero possibility.
So I think Castellanos is the most likely candidate for a long term contract and given how thin the Giants lineup is at the moment it probably behooves Zaidi to bite the bullet and overpay the man.
Story is an interesting case, he would almost certainly demand an opt-out and the contract would still be large (especially relative to his play last year) but he's a good fit and a wealthy team like the Giants should be looking into this possibility.
Beyond those two any signings will be along the lines of Tommy Phan; given Zaidi's track record they will be smart signings but not earth shattering.
RE: Giants/Niners 2022 thread - BobK - 03-16-2022
Bryant to the Rockies 7 years $182M
RE: Giants/Niners 2022 thread - BobK - 03-16-2022
The grandson of the former owner of the Old Pro on El Camino is coming home
Joc Pederson to the Giants
https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/p/pederjo01.shtml
RE: Giants/Niners 2022 thread - Giants - 03-16-2022
(03-16-2022, 04:40 PM)BobK Wrote: The grandson of the former owner of the Old Pro on El Camino is coming home
Joc Pederson to the Giants
https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/p/pederjo01.shtml
Still looking for a right-handed bat - I would take Castellanos in a heartbeat. He would be an ideal DH.
(thanks DC for your summary of available options)
RE: Giants/Niners 2022 thread - DC 86 - 03-16-2022
(03-16-2022, 05:56 PM)Giants Wrote:(03-16-2022, 04:40 PM)BobK Wrote: The grandson of the former owner of the Old Pro on El Camino is coming home
Joc Pederson to the Giants
https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/p/pederjo01.shtml
Still looking for a right-handed bat - I would take Castellanos in a heartbeat. He would be an ideal DH.
(thanks DC for your summary of available options)
Thanks. To be clear, I'm not necessarily expecting SF to sign someone to a significant contract but if the numbers come down - and they haven't found someone to meet their price yet - I think Castellanos (and to a lesser extent Story) could be in play. For that matter even Conforto could be in play if he was willing to attempt to reset his value on a short term contract. The problem with Castellanos and Conforto is they both have draft pick compensation attached so the deal probably really needs to make sense for SF for it to happen.
Meanwhile the Dodgers sign Freddie Freeman as expected.
lex24 - lex24 - 03-16-2022
(03-16-2022, 09:41 PM)DC 86 Wrote:(03-16-2022, 05:56 PM)Giants Wrote:(03-16-2022, 04:40 PM)BobK Wrote: The grandson of the former owner of the Old Pro on El Camino is coming home
Joc Pederson to the Giants
https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/p/pederjo01.shtml
Still looking for a right-handed bat - I would take Castellanos in a heartbeat. He would be an ideal DH.
(thanks DC for your summary of available options)
Thanks. To be clear, I'm not necessarily expecting SF to sign someone to a significant contract but if the numbers come down - and they haven't found someone to meet their price yet - I think Castellanos (and to a lesser extent Story) could be in play. For that matter even Conforto could be in play if he was willing to attempt to reset his value on a short term contract. The problem with Castellanos and Conforto is they both have draft pick compensation attached so the deal probably really needs to make sense for SF for it to happen.
Meanwhile the Dodgers sign Freddie Freeman as expected.
Yep. Giants sign minnows. Dodgers sign whales.
RE: lex24 - cardcrimson - 03-16-2022
(03-16-2022, 09:57 PM)lex24 Wrote:(03-16-2022, 09:41 PM)DC 86 Wrote:(03-16-2022, 05:56 PM)Giants Wrote:(03-16-2022, 04:40 PM)BobK Wrote: The grandson of the former owner of the Old Pro on El Camino is coming home
Joc Pederson to the Giants
https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/p/pederjo01.shtml
Still looking for a right-handed bat - I would take Castellanos in a heartbeat. He would be an ideal DH.
(thanks DC for your summary of available options)
Thanks. To be clear, I'm not necessarily expecting SF to sign someone to a significant contract but if the numbers come down - and they haven't found someone to meet their price yet - I think Castellanos (and to a lesser extent Story) could be in play. For that matter even Conforto could be in play if he was willing to attempt to reset his value on a short term contract. The problem with Castellanos and Conforto is they both have draft pick compensation attached so the deal probably really needs to make sense for SF for it to happen.
Meanwhile the Dodgers sign Freddie Freeman as expected.
Yep. Giants sign minnows. Dodgers sign whales.
Isn't that what most said last year?
lex24 - lex24 - 03-17-2022
(03-16-2022, 09:59 PM)cardcrimson Wrote:(03-16-2022, 09:57 PM)lex24 Wrote:(03-16-2022, 09:41 PM)DC 86 Wrote:(03-16-2022, 05:56 PM)Giants Wrote:(03-16-2022, 04:40 PM)BobK Wrote: The grandson of the former owner of the Old Pro on El Camino is coming home
Joc Pederson to the Giants
https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/p/pederjo01.shtml
Still looking for a right-handed bat - I would take Castellanos in a heartbeat. He would be an ideal DH.
(thanks DC for your summary of available options)
Thanks. To be clear, I'm not necessarily expecting SF to sign someone to a significant contract but if the numbers come down - and they haven't found someone to meet their price yet - I think Castellanos (and to a lesser extent Story) could be in play. For that matter even Conforto could be in play if he was willing to attempt to reset his value on a short term contract. The problem with Castellanos and Conforto is they both have draft pick compensation attached so the deal probably really needs to make sense for SF for it to happen.
Meanwhile the Dodgers sign Freddie Freeman as expected.
Yep. Giants sign minnows. Dodgers sign whales.
Isn't that what most said last year?
Amazing year. Not sustainable. If Giants continue to pretend they are a mid market team, they won’t compete consistently against Dodgers. I don’t care how good your “process” is. Or your coaching. Talent differential is too much. Dodger payroll now around $270,000,000. Giants around $135,000,000.
RE: Giants/Niners 2022 thread - Phogge - 03-17-2022
I love it when the little kid kicks ass on the bully. Happened in grammar school and once memorably at SI. The minnows had the whale on the plank in the very final inning of Game Five.
If healthy Rodon is a whale.
Farhan is treading water until the young guns are ready. And it’s not two or three guys. It’s an army down on the farms.
RE: Giants/Niners 2022 thread - DC 86 - 03-17-2022
(03-17-2022, 08:19 AM)Phogge Wrote: I love it when the little kid kicks ass on the bully. Happened in grammar school and once memorably at SI. The minnows had the whale on the plank in the very final inning of Game Five.
If healthy Rodon is a whale.
Farhan is treading water until the young guns are ready. And it’s not two or three guys. It’s an army down on the farms.
Dodgers have an army too, and three of the four established prospect sites (Baseball America, The Athletic, ESPN) rank LA's army superior to SF's. The exception is Baseball Prospectus, which ranks SF #2, but the other three sites have SF at #9, #11 and #17 while ranking LA at #1, #8 and #8.
Of course these public rankings are an inexact science and vary heavily year-to-year based on callups, drafts, international signings etc. so you are free to ignore these third party analyses; they are far from dispositive and frequently flawed.
But I would posit that a major market team with wealthy owners should never be "treading water" and operating well below the CBT threshold.
SF ranks fifth in franchise value according to Forbes and fourth in revenue in the most recent Statista figures. They own their own stadium. It's fine for the Royals to tread water, but teams in the Giants' financial class should never adopt a strategy of treading water.
P.S. RIP Ralph Terry, threw the final pitch in two very dramatic World Series game sevens, one loss and one win. Were any of you guys at the Stick that day for McCovey's famous line drive out?
RE: Giants/Niners 2022 thread - Phogge - 03-17-2022
Worked last year guys. 107 wins. LOL.
RE: Giants/Niners 2022 thread - gailtate - 03-17-2022
There are far and away worse outlooks. You could be A's fans.
RE: Giants/Niners 2022 thread - Phogge - 03-17-2022
(03-17-2022, 12:04 PM)gailtate Wrote: There are far and away worse outlooks. You could be A's fans.
Or Stanford fans.
RE: Giants/Niners 2022 thread - gailtate - 03-17-2022
(03-17-2022, 12:46 PM)Phogge Wrote:(03-17-2022, 12:04 PM)gailtate Wrote: There are far and away worse outlooks. You could be A's fans.
Or Stanford fans.
Goes without saying.
lex24 - lex24 - 03-18-2022
(03-17-2022, 11:01 AM)DC 86 Wrote:(03-17-2022, 08:19 AM)Phogge Wrote: I love it when the little kid kicks ass on the bully. Happened in grammar school and once memorably at SI. The minnows had the whale on the plank in the very final inning of Game Five.
If healthy Rodon is a whale.
Farhan is treading water until the young guns are ready. And it’s not two or three guys. It’s an army down on the farms.
Dodgers have an army too, and three of the four established prospect sites (Baseball America, The Athletic, ESPN) rank LA's army superior to SF's. The exception is Baseball Prospectus, which ranks SF #2, but the other three sites have SF at #9, #11 and #17 while ranking LA at #1, #8 and #8.
Of course these public rankings are an inexact science and vary heavily year-to-year based on callups, drafts, international signings etc. so you are free to ignore these third party analyses; they are far from dispositive and frequently flawed.
But I would posit that a major market team with wealthy owners should never be "treading water" and operating well below the CBT threshold.
SF ranks fifth in franchise value according to Forbes and fourth in revenue in the most recent Statista figures. They own their own stadium. It's fine for the Royals to tread water, but teams in the Giants' financial class should never adopt a strategy of treading water.
P.S. RIP Ralph Terry, threw the final pitch in two very dramatic World Series game sevens, one loss and one win. Were any of you guys at the Stick that day for McCovey's famous line drive out?
Bingo. Giants have plenty of money to sign a major FA. Or 2. But they whiffed. You can build the farm system and sign whales. Dodgers do it. Giants ownership has signaled that they are not willing to compete financially. And, last year notwithstanding, that will translate to the field.
Assuming no last minute big FA bat, 79-83.
RE: lex24 - Mick - 03-18-2022
(03-18-2022, 08:08 AM)lex24 Wrote: Bingo. Giants have plenty of money to sign a major FA. Or 2. But they whiffed. You can build the farm system and sign whales. Dodgers do it. Giants ownership has signaled that they are not willing to compete financially. And, last year notwithstanding, that will translate to the field.
Assuming no last minute big FA bat, 79-83.
That is strange, isn't it? The Giants are loaded, financially speaking. They could have signed some big names. I actually understand why they didn't want Bryant or Gausman, but they missed on others and have a tiny payroll. The tax threshold is $230 mms., and the Giants have $66 million in space available. What gives?
RE: Giants/Niners 2022 thread - BobK - 03-18-2022
Well Farham is quoted in either the chronicle or Mercury today saying our existing Right hand bats are underrated.
Really??
RE: Giants/Niners 2022 thread - Giants - 03-18-2022
SF is reportedly in the mix for Trevor Story. Let’s hope Zaidi’s recent comments were a smoke screen. I am in the group that believes a right-handed bat is needed to offset the loss of Posey.
RE: Giants/Niners 2022 thread - DC 86 - 03-18-2022
(03-18-2022, 11:52 AM)Giants Wrote: SF is reportedly in the mix for Trevor Story. Let’s hope Zaidi’s recent comments were a smoke screen. I am in the group that believes a right-handed bat is needed to offset the loss of Posey.
I think SF is potentially in on anyone, but on their own terms. Rodon is a good example, high AAV but very short term commitment. If Story's market doesn't develop and he can be signed at what is perceived to be a bargain then I bet Zaidi strikes, in the scenario I mentioned in a previous post. But it's also possible that every remaining free agent will be an overpay and that SF will pass and fill out the roster with second or third tier value plays.
I still believe Castellanos and Story are the most likely signings since they fill the need of a strong right handed bat, but I would be shocked if SF stretched to sign either one or committed to a Bryant-length contract. The fact that they are still free agents at this stage is obviously promising for the Giants since unsigned players are presumably beginning to feel the pressure to find a team somewhere and are reducing their demands.
P.S. not sure where this belongs: but I believe Phogge has praised USF's MBB coach (Todd Golden) and he was hired to coach Florida today.