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RE: OT: 2022 Niners thread - Mick - 12-05-2022
(12-05-2022, 08:55 AM)OutsiderFan Wrote: If the Niners were unable to move the ball with Purdy, and he turned the ball over too much, they would have lost and the idea they can't make the playoffs with him would have a lot of merit.
Given Purdy was playing in the first quarter of a game with the Niners behind, and they won the game 33-17, I'd argue Purdy already proved the Niners can get to the playoffs with him as QB.
The Niners aren't a team that needs a QB to carry them. They just need someone who can move the chains, get first downs, and complete passes to open receivers. This is what Garoppolo was doing, and it isn't a significantly high bar for a QB playing in the NFL. This is what Purdy did when thrust into playing against the Dolphins. Can he continue doing this? I don't know. But he proved he could do it one time, so he should get some benefit of the doubt as a result.
Well...Garoppolo has the 6th highest rating on www.nfl.com/stats, right behind Joe Burrow. It's at least a little bit of a high bar...
RE: OT: 2022 Niners thread - gocard14 - 12-05-2022
I definitely feel this thread is underrating Jimmy G. Most stats have him as a top 10 Qb this year in efficiency based metrics and even number 4 in EPA/play.
Subjectively he has been quick on the release, accurate, especially in the middle of the field avoiding most big mistakes. We get tons of YAC with our athletes, but a brobdingnagian part of that is him getting the ball out in rhythm and accurately.
Brock definitely didn’t have the timing/release of Jimmy in limited action. He does add more as a scrambler and off schedule guy, though this can be good/bad (see when he spun directly into a sack where he could have sat in the pocket). He also just seems to have “it” as a gamer, where he’ll hang in there and make some good things happen, which is sometimes an underrated trait.
RE: OT: 2022 Niners thread - Mick - 12-05-2022
(12-05-2022, 10:51 AM)gocard14 Wrote: I definitely feel this thread is underrating Jimmy G. Most stats have him as a top 10 Qb this year in efficiency based metrics and even number 4 in EPA/play.
Subjectively he has been quick on the release, accurate, especially in the middle of the field avoiding most big mistakes. We get tons of YAC with our athletes, but a of immense proportions part of that is him getting the ball out in rhythm and accurately.
Brock definitely didn’t have the timing/release of Jimmy in limited action. He does add more as a scrambler and off schedule guy, though this can be good/bad (see when he spun directly into a sack where he could have sat in the pocket). He also just seems to have “it” as a gamer, where he’ll hang in there and make some good things happen, which is sometimes an underrated trait.
It'd be interesting to see how good Brock is after the rest of the regular season games -- assuming he stays healthy. They have the following teams left (with team points allowed rating in parens and leaguewide sacks rating):
1 TB (#2, #7)
2 Sea (#27, #12)
3 Wash (#13, #9)
4 LV (#23, #26)
5 Ariz (#30, #23)
In other words, next week will be a difficult test against Tampa Bay, but three of the remaining five are pretty terrible at defense and one is average at best. Still, the next three teams are in the top half in the league in sacks.
RE: OT: 2022 Niners thread - cardcrimson - 12-05-2022
(12-05-2022, 10:43 AM)Mick Wrote:(12-05-2022, 08:55 AM)OutsiderFan Wrote: This is what Garoppolo was doing, and it isn't a significantly high bar for a QB playing in the NFL.
Well...Garoppolo has the 6th highest rating on www.nfl.com/stats, right behind Joe Burrow. It's at least a little bit of a high bar...
Come on Mick, why bring facts to a discussion?
RE: OT: 2022 Niners thread - lex24 - 12-05-2022
Brock went to work Sunday expecting a nice quiet day. Got thrown in and performed well. Woke up this morning as No 1 QB on an SB contender. Slightly different. Hopefully he can handle it. It ain’t gonna be easy.
RE: OT: 2022 Niners thread - OutsiderFan - 12-06-2022
Interesting listening to Booger McFarland talk about Shaun King in 1999 as an analog to Brock Purdy in 2022, on MNF broadcast last night.
The Bucs had the #1 Defense in the NFL that year and had Trent Dilfer as their QB, kind of a similar game manager QB as Garoppolo. Then with 5 weeks to go in season, Dilfer broke his clavicle and Rookie Shaun King who was a star at Tulane, played the final 5 games, as the Bucs went 4-1, and made it to the NFC Championship Game, where they lost, in part because of this...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m24r9JiKV14
You know who else was on that Bucs team? John Lynch.
So, there is a non-zero chance Lynch is telling the whole Niners organization about that 1999 Bucs team that really should have gone to the Super Bowl were it not for that absurd incomplete pass call in the NFC Championship game.
And, if you remember, nobody gave the Patriots a chance to beat the Rams in the Super Bowl that year. But Tom Brady, who was playing in his first and only threw for 147 yards in the game, helped take down those Rams who were considered what the Chiefs are these days.
I'm not going to claim the Niners are winning the Super Bowl with Brock Purdy, but I am going to say that with the #1 Defense and the weapons on offense surrounding Purdy, that it is possible for the Niners to be a legit contender.
RE: OT: 2022 Niners thread - cardcrimson - 12-06-2022
(12-06-2022, 07:52 AM)OutsiderFan Wrote: The Bucs had the #1 Defense in the NFL that year and had Trent Dilfer as their QB, kind of a similar game manager QB as Garoppolo.
We all know your love for Trey and disdain for Jimmy, but please. A game manager like Dilfer?
Garoppolo's career rating is 99.6. Dilfer's 70.2.
Completion percentage, Garoppolo 67.6%; Dilfer 55.5%.
In the season you reference, Dilfer: 59.8%, 11 TDs, 11 Ints, 75.8 rating. This season for Jimmy? 67.2%, 16 TDs, 4 Ints, 103.0 rating.
Dilfer was ranked 20th in rating, and 22 in yards per attempt. Jimmy is ranked 6th in rating, and 6th in yards per attempt.
Garoppolo is a hell of a lot more than a game manager, no matter how many times you claim that's all he is.
RE: OT: 2022 Niners thread - French Rage - 12-06-2022
Bucs wouldn't have made it to the NFC CCG that year if the Skins hadn't botched the FG snap, though, so it can go both ways.
RE: OT: 2022 Niners thread - lex24 - 12-06-2022
(12-06-2022, 10:03 AM)cardcrimson Wrote:(12-06-2022, 07:52 AM)OutsiderFan Wrote: The Bucs had the #1 Defense in the NFL that year and had Trent Dilfer as their QB, kind of a similar game manager QB as Garoppolo.
We all know your love for Trey and disdain for Jimmy, but please. A game manager like Dilfer?
Garoppolo's career rating is 99.6. Dilfer's 70.2.
Completion percentage, Garoppolo 67.6%; Dilfer 55.5%.
In the season you reference, Dilfer: 59.8%, 11 TDs, 11 Ints, 75.8 rating. This season for Jimmy? 67.2%, 16 TDs, 4 Ints, 103.0 rating.
Dilfer was ranked 20th in rating, and 22 in yards per attempt. Jimmy is ranked 6th in rating, and 6th in yards per attempt.
Garoppolo is a hell of a lot more than a game manager, no matter how many times you claim that's all he is.
JG is primarily a game manager. But I don’t see that as a knock. Plus, he was playing, by my eyes, the best football of his life.
There is going to be a big drop off. How big is anyones guess. What I do know is i’ve seen before a second team unknown QB come off the bench cold come in and play well. And that turned out to be his highlight. I’m hoping that’s not the case here. But it wouldn’t surprise me. Which is why I’d see about Fitzpatrick/Newton’s interest. And If they are interested, I pad have them come in for a workout immediately.
Sunday is going to be very interesting. Purdy on one side Brady on the other. Little bit of a difference there. Fortunately 49ers have a much better team. I hope they spend the day partying in the backfield. Seeing Brady on the ground about 10 times would be very nice.
RE: OT: 2022 Niners thread - Phogge - 12-06-2022
Thinking ahead who is going to be around next year? There apparently has been Jimmy/Niners talk already in the building. How has that changed with the injury? How will Purdy’s play affect it? How will the coming monster Bosa contract affect the roster? Can they find a run stuffing DT with Kinlaw flaming out again? Going to be interesting.
RE: OT: 2022 Niners thread - cardcrimson - 12-06-2022
(12-06-2022, 10:37 AM)lex24 Wrote:(12-06-2022, 10:03 AM)cardcrimson Wrote:(12-06-2022, 07:52 AM)OutsiderFan Wrote: The Bucs had the #1 Defense in the NFL that year and had Trent Dilfer as their QB, kind of a similar game manager QB as Garoppolo.
We all know your love for Trey and disdain for Jimmy, but please. A game manager like Dilfer?
Garoppolo's career rating is 99.6. Dilfer's 70.2.
Completion percentage, Garoppolo 67.6%; Dilfer 55.5%.
In the season you reference, Dilfer: 59.8%, 11 TDs, 11 Ints, 75.8 rating. This season for Jimmy? 67.2%, 16 TDs, 4 Ints, 103.0 rating.
Dilfer was ranked 20th in rating, and 22 in yards per attempt. Jimmy is ranked 6th in rating, and 6th in yards per attempt.
Garoppolo is a hell of a lot more than a game manager, no matter how many times you claim that's all he is.
JG is primarily a game manager. But I don’t see that as a knock. Plus, he was playing, by my eyes, the best football of his life.
There is going to be a big drop off. How big is anyones guess. What I do know is i’ve seen before a second team unknown QB come off the bench cold come in and play well. And that turned out to be his highlight. I’m hoping that’s not the case here. But it wouldn’t surprise me. Which is why I’d see about Fitzpatrick/Newton’s interest. And If they are interested, I pad have them come in for a workout immediately.
Sunday is going to be very interesting. Purdy on one side Brady on the other. Little bit of a difference there. Fortunately 49ers have a much better team. I hope they spend the day partying in the backfield. Seeing Brady on the ground about 10 times would be very nice.
A la Dilfer? Come on, Lex. How can you be sixth in yards per attempt and be a game manager? It's not all YAC, either.
RE: OT: 2022 Niners thread - Giants - 12-06-2022
(12-06-2022, 10:57 AM)Phogge Wrote: Thinking ahead who is going to be around next year? There apparently has been Jimmy/Niners talk already in the building. How has that changed with the injury? How will Purdy’s play affect it? How will the coming monster Bosa contract affect the roster? Can they find a run stuffing DT with Kinlaw flaming out again? Going to be interesting.
Lance/Purdy at QB. ———— (fill in the blank) will be a cap casualty due to Bosa’s upcoming big deal. Find a DT in the draft….
RE: OT: 2022 Niners thread - lex24 - 12-06-2022
(12-06-2022, 11:41 AM)cardcrimson Wrote:(12-06-2022, 10:37 AM)lex24 Wrote:(12-06-2022, 10:03 AM)cardcrimson Wrote:(12-06-2022, 07:52 AM)OutsiderFan Wrote: The Bucs had the #1 Defense in the NFL that year and had Trent Dilfer as their QB, kind of a similar game manager QB as Garoppolo.
We all know your love for Trey and disdain for Jimmy, but please. A game manager like Dilfer?
Garoppolo's career rating is 99.6. Dilfer's 70.2.
Completion percentage, Garoppolo 67.6%; Dilfer 55.5%.
In the season you reference, Dilfer: 59.8%, 11 TDs, 11 Ints, 75.8 rating. This season for Jimmy? 67.2%, 16 TDs, 4 Ints, 103.0 rating.
Dilfer was ranked 20th in rating, and 22 in yards per attempt. Jimmy is ranked 6th in rating, and 6th in yards per attempt.
Garoppolo is a hell of a lot more than a game manager, no matter how many times you claim that's all he is.
JG is primarily a game manager. But I don’t see that as a knock. Plus, he was playing, by my eyes, the best football of his life.
There is going to be a big drop off. How big is anyones guess. What I do know is i’ve seen before a second team unknown QB come off the bench cold come in and play well. And that turned out to be his highlight. I’m hoping that’s not the case here. But it wouldn’t surprise me. Which is why I’d see about Fitzpatrick/Newton’s interest. And If they are interested, I pad have them come in for a workout immediately.
Sunday is going to be very interesting. Purdy on one side Brady on the other. Little bit of a difference there. Fortunately 49ers have a much better team. I hope they spend the day partying in the backfield. Seeing Brady on the ground about 10 times would be very nice.
A la Dilfer? Come on, Lex. How can you be sixth in yards per attempt and be a game manager? It's not all YAC, either.
Did I compare him to Dilfer? No. I’ve also set forth in another post that I don’t consider a “game manager” to be a negative. In fact it’s the first job of a quarterback. JG does it very well. He obviously is not a Josh Allen, Mahomes type who’s gonna make big plays with his feet, big plays once things break down etc. So, what. He runs this offense very well. And as I indicated, he was playing the best football of his life. So I don’t quite understand what I’ve indicated that you consider a negative?
As for YAC, it absolutely is the key element of the 49ers passing game. That is an indisputable fact. They live on it. But in order to run up a lot of YAC yards the quarterback needs to be able to hit the receiver in stride. JG is good at that -especially on passes between the numbers. It is a massive element of the Niner passing game. And I really don’t know if Purdy has that ability.
I think the injury is devastating to the 49ers and kills any chance they have of doing anything in the playoffs. If they even get there at this point.
(12-06-2022, 01:21 PM)Giants Wrote:(12-06-2022, 10:57 AM)Phogge Wrote: Thinking ahead who is going to be around next year? There apparently has been Jimmy/Niners talk already in the building. How has that changed with the injury? How will Purdy’s play affect it? How will the coming monster Bosa contract affect the roster? Can they find a run stuffing DT with Kinlaw flaming out again? Going to be interesting.
Lance/Purdy at QB. ———— (fill in the blank) will be a cap casualty due to Bosa’s upcoming big deal. Find a DT in the draft….
One of the sad things about this is it will cost JG a hell of a lot of money.
RE: OT: 2022 Niners thread - cardcrimson - 12-06-2022
(12-06-2022, 01:36 PM)lex24 Wrote: Did I compare him to Dilfer? No. I’ve also set forth in another post that I don’t consider a “game manager” to be a negative. In fact it’s the first job of a quarterback. JG does it very well.
No you didn't, and I understand your distinction and your definition. OF said Garappolo was a game manager, like Dilfer when he was with the Bucs (and I assume with the Ravens). Jimmy G is nothing like Dilfer, and if Dilfer's the epitome of a game manager, he's not that, either.
RE: OT: 2022 Niners thread - Giants - 12-06-2022
(12-06-2022, 01:36 PM)lex24 Wrote:(12-06-2022, 11:41 AM)cardcrimson Wrote:(12-06-2022, 10:37 AM)lex24 Wrote:(12-06-2022, 10:03 AM)cardcrimson Wrote:(12-06-2022, 07:52 AM)OutsiderFan Wrote: The Bucs had the #1 Defense in the NFL that year and had Trent Dilfer as their QB, kind of a similar game manager QB as Garoppolo.
We all know your love for Trey and disdain for Jimmy, but please. A game manager like Dilfer?
Garoppolo's career rating is 99.6. Dilfer's 70.2.
Completion percentage, Garoppolo 67.6%; Dilfer 55.5%.
In the season you reference, Dilfer: 59.8%, 11 TDs, 11 Ints, 75.8 rating. This season for Jimmy? 67.2%, 16 TDs, 4 Ints, 103.0 rating.
Dilfer was ranked 20th in rating, and 22 in yards per attempt. Jimmy is ranked 6th in rating, and 6th in yards per attempt.
Garoppolo is a hell of a lot more than a game manager, no matter how many times you claim that's all he is.
JG is primarily a game manager. But I don’t see that as a knock. Plus, he was playing, by my eyes, the best football of his life.
There is going to be a big drop off. How big is anyones guess. What I do know is i’ve seen before a second team unknown QB come off the bench cold come in and play well. And that turned out to be his highlight. I’m hoping that’s not the case here. But it wouldn’t surprise me. Which is why I’d see about Fitzpatrick/Newton’s interest. And If they are interested, I pad have them come in for a workout immediately.
Sunday is going to be very interesting. Purdy on one side Brady on the other. Little bit of a difference there. Fortunately 49ers have a much better team. I hope they spend the day partying in the backfield. Seeing Brady on the ground about 10 times would be very nice.
A la Dilfer? Come on, Lex. How can you be sixth in yards per attempt and be a game manager? It's not all YAC, either.
Did I compare him to Dilfer? No. I’ve also set forth in another post that I don’t consider a “game manager” to be a negative. In fact it’s the first job of a quarterback. JG does it very well. He obviously is not a Josh Allen, Mahomes type who’s gonna make big plays with his feet, big plays once things break down etc. So, what. He runs this offense very well. And as I indicated, he was playing the best football of his life. So I don’t quite understand what I’ve indicated that you consider a negative?
As for YAC, it absolutely is the key element of the 49ers passing game. That is an indisputable fact. They live on it. But in order to run up a lot of YAC yards the quarterback needs to be able to hit the receiver in stride. JG is good at that -especially on passes between the numbers. It is a massive element of the Niner passing game. And I really don’t know if Purdy has that ability.
I think the injury is devastating to the 49ers and kills any chance they have of doing anything in the playoffs. If they even get there at this point.
(12-06-2022, 01:21 PM)Giants Wrote:(12-06-2022, 10:57 AM)Phogge Wrote: Thinking ahead who is going to be around next year? There apparently has been Jimmy/Niners talk already in the building. How has that changed with the injury? How will Purdy’s play affect it? How will the coming monster Bosa contract affect the roster? Can they find a run stuffing DT with Kinlaw flaming out again? Going to be interesting.
Lance/Purdy at QB. ———— (fill in the blank) will be a cap casualty due to Bosa’s upcoming big deal. Find a DT in the draft….
One of the sad things about this is it will cost JG a hell of a lot of money.
Well, maybe not. Good news for Garappolo - surgery is not necessary. He could return in 7-8 weeks (in time for the Super Bowl and perhaps the Conference Championship game).
RE: OT: 2022 Niners thread - lex24 - 12-06-2022
(12-06-2022, 03:30 PM)Giants Wrote:(12-06-2022, 01:36 PM)lex24 Wrote:(12-06-2022, 11:41 AM)cardcrimson Wrote:(12-06-2022, 10:37 AM)lex24 Wrote:(12-06-2022, 10:03 AM)cardcrimson Wrote: We all know your love for Trey and disdain for Jimmy, but please. A game manager like Dilfer?
Garoppolo's career rating is 99.6. Dilfer's 70.2.
Completion percentage, Garoppolo 67.6%; Dilfer 55.5%.
In the season you reference, Dilfer: 59.8%, 11 TDs, 11 Ints, 75.8 rating. This season for Jimmy? 67.2%, 16 TDs, 4 Ints, 103.0 rating.
Dilfer was ranked 20th in rating, and 22 in yards per attempt. Jimmy is ranked 6th in rating, and 6th in yards per attempt.
Garoppolo is a hell of a lot more than a game manager, no matter how many times you claim that's all he is.
JG is primarily a game manager. But I don’t see that as a knock. Plus, he was playing, by my eyes, the best football of his life.
There is going to be a big drop off. How big is anyones guess. What I do know is i’ve seen before a second team unknown QB come off the bench cold come in and play well. And that turned out to be his highlight. I’m hoping that’s not the case here. But it wouldn’t surprise me. Which is why I’d see about Fitzpatrick/Newton’s interest. And If they are interested, I pad have them come in for a workout immediately.
Sunday is going to be very interesting. Purdy on one side Brady on the other. Little bit of a difference there. Fortunately 49ers have a much better team. I hope they spend the day partying in the backfield. Seeing Brady on the ground about 10 times would be very nice.
A la Dilfer? Come on, Lex. How can you be sixth in yards per attempt and be a game manager? It's not all YAC, either.
Did I compare him to Dilfer? No. I’ve also set forth in another post that I don’t consider a “game manager” to be a negative. In fact it’s the first job of a quarterback. JG does it very well. He obviously is not a Josh Allen, Mahomes type who’s gonna make big plays with his feet, big plays once things break down etc. So, what. He runs this offense very well. And as I indicated, he was playing the best football of his life. So I don’t quite understand what I’ve indicated that you consider a negative?
As for YAC, it absolutely is the key element of the 49ers passing game. That is an indisputable fact. They live on it. But in order to run up a lot of YAC yards the quarterback needs to be able to hit the receiver in stride. JG is good at that -especially on passes between the numbers. It is a massive element of the Niner passing game. And I really don’t know if Purdy has that ability.
I think the injury is devastating to the 49ers and kills any chance they have of doing anything in the playoffs. If they even get there at this point.
(12-06-2022, 01:21 PM)Giants Wrote:(12-06-2022, 10:57 AM)Phogge Wrote: Thinking ahead who is going to be around next year? There apparently has been Jimmy/Niners talk already in the building. How has that changed with the injury? How will Purdy’s play affect it? How will the coming monster Bosa contract affect the roster? Can they find a run stuffing DT with Kinlaw flaming out again? Going to be interesting.
Lance/Purdy at QB. ———— (fill in the blank) will be a cap casualty due to Bosa’s upcoming big deal. Find a DT in the draft….
One of the sad things about this is it will cost JG a hell of a lot of money.
Well, maybe not. Good news for Garappolo - surgery is not necessary. He could return in 7-8 weeks (in time for the Super Bowl and perhaps the Conference Championship game).
Beat me to it. He also does not have the dreaded Lisfrank injury. Something I’d never heard of till recently.
Now Giants - give me soon good news on Judge…. :).
RE: OT: 2022 Niners thread - Phogge - 12-07-2022
Giants... don’t think they will get a good DL interior with their first pick (third round). Need a FA who wants to be coached by Kocurek.
RE: OT: 2022 Niners thread - Giants - 12-07-2022
D.J. Jones was a 6th rounder. Unfortunately, he priced himself out of San Francisco.
Quite frankly, I am hoping for more fifth round magic….
RE: OT: 2022 Niners thread - OutsiderFan - 12-07-2022
Don't forget the Niners have Kalia Davis waiting in the wings, a 6th rd pick in 2022 sitting out recovering from ACL. He has exceptional movement skills for a DT, having moved from ILB to DT.
The NFL graded 6-1 302 Davis at 6.13 as a pre-draft prospect. The NFL graded 6-1 319 DJ Jones at 6.20 as a pre-draft prospect.
Davis is on the Reserve/non-football injury list and I believe could join the Niners this season if need be, but they would have to feel good enough about him that they think he could be ready to play after a 3 week practice window opens for him. Teams get to move two players from NFI list to active roster during season. This is separate from injured reserve activations.
On a related note, David Lombardi reported that he expects the Niners to open practice window for Javon Kinlaw today, which means he should come off IR soon.
RE: OT: 2022 Niners thread - Phogge - 12-07-2022
Kinlaw will come off IR, be in for three series and then suffer another injury. Probably a "core."
Giants, if you have seen a DL this college season that the Niners may have missed let them know. Not many sixth rounders like Jones around. Maybe a third rounder? Maybe one of those overachievers at Oregon State.