WBB 2023-2024 Season - Printable Version
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RE: WBB 2023-2024 Season - Goose - 12-11-2023
(12-11-2023, 10:13 AM)81alum Wrote: Those of you who are alums may understand how stressful it is for MANY freshmen at Stanford. I remember Fred giving us a pep talk at orientation to combat the "imposter syndrome." For those of us who did not come from elite high schools, it is overwhelming to go from being the biggest fish in a little pond to being a minnow in an ocean of talent. And that is true even before one starts the conversation about athletics.I agree with what you say here. However, IMO alums also need to keep in mind that times have changed, possibly greatly if you are not a "recent" graduate. The Stanford you knew is gone. Today's Stanford has a much more invasive set of regulations and social "interventions" than the one I attended ever imagined. Quite a few people don't like that. Many of them stay anyway because they really want a Stanford degree. If you have alternatives and the Stanford degree is a "nice to have", not a "must have", you can leave. Elite athletes now have alternatives they didn't have previously.
It takes time to adjust, particularly for kids who are more child-like and less adult-like at that age. People mature at different rates and there are some who are just not ready for everything Stanford has to offer, and in fact feel overwhelmed by it.
I have no insight into the particular stories of Betts and Nivar, but it is understandable that a sports-board would interpret their actions solely in terms of their basketball experiences and opportunities. But that might not be the case. Or it might only be partly the case.
The good news is that the vast majority of Stanford freshmen DO adjust and wind up having the best four years of their lives. But not all.
So do "regular" students. Information (some of it true, some not) about other schools is more easily obtained. You aren't restricted to first person accounts from people you know. The internet can give you an idea of what other universities are like. Back "in the day" you didn't really know much about other alternatives. Now, you can find out a lot before deciding to transfer. Obviously, for many students things like scholarships and parental expectations may be a roadblock to transferring, but to those not so constrained, it is easier than ever.
On a somewhat humorous note, I had an acquaintance who transferred from Cal Tech to Stanford after freshman year. He said he did it because he wanted to go to a school that was "less intense and where people could have some fun while going to school" :-). He was an engineer however, and at that time engineers were somewhat "second class citizens" at Cal Tech (probably still are). Imagine somebody transferring to Stanford to "have fun". I doubt that happens today.
RE: WBB 2023-2024 Season - BostonCard - 12-11-2023
You are describing a global phenomenon, though Stanford appears to have a particularly bad case of it, but generally speaking, universities everywhere have imposed more restrictions on what students can do. Some of it is positive, some of it is heavy-handed, and some of it is window dressing only.
Despite all the changes in the environment you've described, Stanford's outbound transfer rate remains very low. In the last common data set (https://ucomm.stanford.edu/wp-content/uploads/sites/15/2023/03/CDS_2022-2023_v3.pdf) there were 47 inbound transfers. Because Stanford keeps inbound transfers roughly equal to outbound transfers, that means that there were probably about 50 outbound transfers out of 8049 undergraduates. In other words, of the ~1600 or so freshmen admitted in any given year, about 3% will transfer to another institution. If you exclude athletes, it is probably lower.
BC
RE: WBB 2023-2024 Season - joemontes - 12-11-2023
Bottom line, I am just very happy for BETTS. She is now the centerpiece of the #2 team in the nation.
Barring any further season-ending injuries to their main players, I predict that UCLA will finally be
a Final Four team this year.
And when all is said and done, that 2022 class of #1 BETTS, #2 RICE, #19 JACQUEZ, #22 JONES and
#49 IWUALA will most likely leave Westwood with 3 Final Fours and perhaps an NCAA championship,
with the help of Europeans BESSOIR, DUGALIC and SONTAG plus their incoming 2024 Class
consisting of #14 DUDLEY (teammate of RICE in HS), #24 CAIN and #27 SOCKA-NGUEMEN
(another teammate of RICE in HS), and of course their 2025 recruit #3 Sienna BETTS,
younger sister of Lauren BETTS.
On the other hand, I just hope Stanford can continue to be a Top 25 team after this season.
RE: WBB 2023-2024 Season - Spiny_Norman - 12-11-2023
(12-10-2023, 05:51 PM)WBB fan Wrote: I'm not sure whether these thoughts belong here or in the recruiting thread, but I'm going for here. Watching how Betts seems to be blooming at UCLA, I find myself wondering if that could have an impact on Stanford recruiting, possible recruits saying to themselves, well, she's doing really, really well at UCLA, but didn't see that the previous year at Stanford. Was it something out of kilter at Stanford? Something better for her at UCLA, and would I also feel the same way? Maybe I don't want to go to Stanford because of whatever it was -- don't know what the problem was, but it was something, etc.
I'm not suggesting that such thinking would be right. There are many reasons, most of which we aren't privy to, that explain the difference in Betts' between the two years. But I do think that this is a possible line of thinking for at least some possible recruits.
I don't know if recruits may think of such things, but opposing coaches certainly will offer suggestions about Stanford to recruits. On the other side of the ledger, Stanford is likely to have its 3rd consecutive top 6 WNBA draft pick in 2024 (and 4th consecutive year with a 1st round pick). The team must be doing something right for those players.
RE: WBB 2023-2024 Season - mbdude - 12-13-2023
No.5 Texas at Arizona on Pac 12 tonight (12/13)
RE: WBB 2023-2024 Season - joemontes - 12-13-2023
(12-13-2023, 08:29 AM)mbdude Wrote: No.5 Texas at Arizona on Pac 12 tonight (12/13)This is not going to be pretty for the home team....
RE: WBB 2023-2024 Season - M T - 12-13-2023
(12-11-2023, 08:46 PM)joemontes Wrote: On the other hand, I just hope Stanford can continue to be a Top 25 team after this season.
I'm sure all Stanford fans feel more confidence than you do.
RE: WBB 2023-2024 Season - acerep - 12-13-2023
I've posted my interview with Jeanette Pohlen under Richter Reports on the Fast Break Club site, www.stanfordfbc.org. Since I just posted it as of this writing, the teaser hasn't been updated, but if you click on it, you'll see the story.
RE: WBB 2023-2024 Season - M T - 12-13-2023
(12-11-2023, 04:26 PM)BostonCard Wrote: Because Stanford keeps inbound transfers roughly equal to outbound transfers, that means that there were probably about 50 outbound transfers out of 8049 undergraduates. In other words, of the ~1600 or so freshmen admitted in any given year, about 3% will transfer to another institution. If you exclude athletes, it is probably lower.
Actually, 57 transfers were accepted, with 47 enrolling. The data also shows first-year retention rate, that 1.7% of those first enrolled at Stanford in Fall 2021 were no longer enrolled in Fall 2022 (i.e., transferred out or dropped out).
Openings for transfers could, in theory, come from transfers out, drop outs, potentially for those that take sabbaticals (religious, peace corps, ...), or die. (Deaths, religious sabbaticals, & etc, exclude the individual from the statistics.)
So, the actual number of transfers in may be higher than the number of transfers to other schools.
What about drop-outs? People who leave school to start companies, raise a family, take care of aging parents, prepare for the Olympics or any of the other good, or not-so-good, reasons. Looking at the link you provided, I see that for the 1738 that entered in Fall 2016 and not excluded, only 85 had not received a degree (from any school, not just Stanford) in 6 years. (The Fall 2015 Cohort graduation data has incorrect totals for lines C, G, and H. I calculated 95.5% had degrees within 6 years (i.e., 76 had not received a degree).)
A back of the envelope guesstimate on insufficient data is that 1% of those enrolled as freshmen drop out per year on average, while 1.7% are not at Stanford after the first year. Or roughly 0.7% (probably indistinguishable from 1%) transfer out and 1% drop out per year.
Since Caltech was mentioned, I looked for their Common Data Set info. I found a summary, and data for 2020-2021. Note that first-year retention rate took a big hit with COVID, but bounced back very high the next year. FYI, Caltech's 2014-freshmen 6-year graduation rate probably should not be directly compared with Stanford's 2016-freshman rate due to COVID, but it was 91.6% (Caltech has a class size of roughly 200, so each individual is a 0.5% factor in that number.)
I guess my brother would have been one of the freshmen who didn't graduate in 6 years, as he skipped his senior year (not at either of these schools) of college to go to medical school.
B.C., thanks for calling an acorn an acorn.
RE: WBB 2023-2024 Season - BostonCard - 12-13-2023
I think your calculations are more or less correct. I found the national center for education statistics data for Stanford here:
https://nces.ed.gov/collegenavigator/?q=Stanford&s=all&id=243744#outcome
Undergraduate transfer-in enrollment was 46 in 2022.
The retention rate (ie, "the percentage of first-time students who are seeking bachelor's degrees who return to the institution to continue their studies the following fall.for first-time students", presumably excluding those who received a degree) is 98%, so with a total non-graduating undergraduate enrollment of about 6000, ~120 or so don't come back the subsequent year.
The overall graduation rate was 95% for those who started in 2016. The transfer out rate is listed as 0% (I assumed rounded down from <0.049%), though down below, it notes that of the full-time, first-time degree-seeking students who entered in 2014/15, 97% received their bachelor's degree, and 1% enrolled in a different institution. That comes out to 20, maybe 30 if you round down, students who transferred out. Any way you count it, there were not a lot of transfers.
BC
RE: WBB 2023-2024 Season - mbdude - 12-13-2023
Ucla's Emily Bessoir out for season torn Acl
RE: WBB 2023-2024 Season - 81alum - 12-13-2023
(12-13-2023, 08:39 PM)mbdude Wrote: Ucla's Emily Bessoir out for season torn AclTerrible terrible. UCLA has had way more than its normal share of injuries, it seems. Dugalic was out last year, correct? Now it is Bessoir's turn. Ugh.
The stat sheet shows she has only played in one game this year, so is this an old injury?
RE: WBB 2023-2024 Season - TheFarm07 - 12-14-2023
(12-13-2023, 11:09 PM)81alum Wrote:(12-13-2023, 08:39 PM)mbdude Wrote: Ucla's Emily Bessoir out for season torn AclTerrible terrible. UCLA has had way more than its normal share of injuries, it seems. Dugalic was out last year, correct? Now it is Bessoir's turn. Ugh.
The stat sheet shows she has only played in one game this year, so is this an old injury?
Bessoir re-injured the same ACL that prevented her from playing two seasons ago, while playing for Germany during the EuroBasket Qualifiers:
https://www.ksl.com/article/50818716/no-2-ucla-loses-emily-bessoir-for-rest-of-season-after-she-injured-knee-playing-for-germany
RE: WBB 2023-2024 Season - OCcardinal - 12-14-2023
(12-13-2023, 08:39 PM)mbdude Wrote: Ucla's Emily Bessoir out for season torn AclBessoir is 6-4 and played more average minutes than Brink last season (with a higher offensive rating). She had 61 three pointers last year including two in UCLA's 4-point win against Stanford in the Pac 12 tournament last season. UCLA's effective field goal percentage and assist percentage were both at season highs in the one game she played this year (she played 23 minutes in the season-opener against Purdue). This would seem to be a blow to them, but of course they've done pretty well so far without her.
RE: WBB 2023-2024 Season - 2006alum - 12-14-2023
(12-14-2023, 09:26 AM)OCcardinal Wrote:Terrible news. She can't catch a break! Her game reminds me a lot of our own alum Alanna Smith, where her presence on the floor just automatically opens up spacing because she can shoot from outside but also take it to the hoop, and is fairly fast for a 6'4" forward. Though Smith was (and is) a much better defender.(12-13-2023, 08:39 PM)mbdude Wrote: Ucla's Emily Bessoir out for season torn AclBessoir is 6-4 and played more average minutes than Brink last season (with a higher offensive rating). She had 61 three pointers last year including two in UCLA's 4-point win against Stanford in the Pac 12 tournament last season. UCLA's effective field goal percentage and assist percentage were both at season highs in the one game she played this year (she played 23 minutes in the season-opener against Purdue). This would seem to be a blow to them, but of course they've done pretty well so far without her.
RE: WBB 2023-2024 Season - WBB fan - 12-16-2023
UNLV just lost to Seton Hall, 84-54. Does anyone have any idea WTF happened? Some key player(s) missing? or ???
RE: WBB 2023-2024 Season - 81alum - 12-16-2023
(12-16-2023, 02:29 PM)WBB fan Wrote: UNLV just lost to Seton Hall, 84-54. Does anyone have any idea WTF happened? Some key player(s) missing? or ???Just reading the article:
1) Desi Rae Young, who leads UNLV and averages 19 points, made only 2 shots.
2) Alyssa Brown led UNLV but fouled out.
3) UNLV missed its first 11 shots and never really recovered.
This seems to have been UNLV's Gonzaga.
RE: WBB 2023-2024 Season - WBB fan - 12-16-2023
(12-16-2023, 04:39 PM)81alum Wrote:(12-16-2023, 02:29 PM)WBB fan Wrote: UNLV just lost to Seton Hall, 84-54. Does anyone have any idea WTF happened? Some key player(s) missing? or ???Just reading the article:
1) Desi Rae Young, who leads UNLV and averages 19 points, made only 2 shots.
2) Alyssa Brown led UNLV but fouled out.
3) UNLV missed its first 11 shots and never really recovered.
This seems to have been UNLV's Gonzaga.
Thanks. I hope they recover and are quickly back on track.
RE: WBB 2023-2024 Season - chrisk - 12-16-2023
South Carolina demolished the Presbyterian Pale Hose 99-29 today. Seven players scored in double digits.
Average margin of victory for the Gamecocks is 43 points with margins ranging up to 82 points.
RE: WBB 2023-2024 Season - mbdude - 12-17-2023
AZ vs ASU on pac12 4pm today (12/17)