WBB: Stanford 87 -- Hawaii 40 - Printable Version
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RE: WBB: Stanford vs. Hawaii, Game Thread - SkiBum80 - 11-08-2023
Our forwards did great, Iriafen better than great
But Our true guards (outside of Jump and Bosgana) were sloppy, and didn’t score or dish out assists much
They will need to play much better to win against Indiana who will be much tougher than Hawaii
Here’s my grouping of true guards (point or combo)
Lepolo, Clardy, Papadaki, Green, Harriel
Tonight they were
0-13 w no points
2 assists to 4 TO’s and 7 fouls
This will not get it done vs top teams
RE: WBB: Stanford 87 -- Hawaii 40 - fullmetal - 11-08-2023
Yiiiiiikes. (re: guard play)
RE: WBB: Stanford 87 -- Hawaii 40 - BobK - 11-08-2023
I assume people posting weren’t at the gabe so Missed this
Brink holding her back on the sideline. Came back in but could have had a bit of a problem. Kiki after the last media timeout I say now she’s fine but helped to the locker room with two almost carrying her. She came back after a bit walking fine and after the game walking fine but what a scare
Love the offense loved kiki, Bosgana and Nunu inside. I love taking the ball to the hoop. Yes that means fewer assists which seems important to some.
RE: WBB: Stanford 87 -- Hawaii 40 - bl82 - 11-08-2023
Speaking of guard play, nobody mentioned that Cam led us with 5 assists. I saw a 6th that was not counted. Good all-around game from her. Everything except those bunnies...
RE: WBB: Stanford 87 -- Hawaii 40 - TonyLima - 11-08-2023
(11-08-2023, 10:27 PM)BobK Wrote: I assume people posting weren’t at the gabe so Missed this
Brink holding her back on the sideline. Came back in but could have had a bit of a problem. Kiki after the last media timeout I say now she’s fine but helped to the locker room with two almost carrying her. She came back after a bit walking fine and after the game walking fine but what a scare
Love the offense loved kiki, Bosgana and Nunu inside. I love taking the ball to the hoop. Yes that means fewer assists which seems important to some.
Somebody get Cam to a good non-bone-crunching chiropracter. I know a guy, but he’s in Novato.
RE: WBB: Stanford 87 -- Hawaii 40 - M T - 11-08-2023
Has there ever been a time when the worst FT% on the team was 89% ???
Impressive, ladies!
What is less impressive is how much grumbling there has been in this thread.
Lots of quick, team play. No hero ball except some I saw late in the game, when it was nothing but subs.
It seems the refs are in early season form as well. Why did Demetre get FTs at 2:09 left in the 3rd? And, shortly after, the HI offense caused the ball to go up into the hoop.
I don’t know about others, but I’m happy with not risking Brink too much. (Early season for the scorer too as Brink had more than 2 blocks!)
RE: WBB: Stanford 87 -- Hawaii 40 - 81alum - 11-08-2023
I'm so sad to have missed the game and what a bummer about the unreliable live feed. Still if anybody captured anything I'd love to see it.
Seeing the stat sheet after-the-fact bowled me over. We wound up doing considerably better against them than last year, even though they kept the core of their players and we lost our two leading scorers (Prechtel and Jones) from that game.
Iriafen is is truly impressive on the stat sheet. Sunday will tell us a whole lot more.
I'll say it again: Agara is our best in-traffic player since the days of Carrington and McPhee. I'll be interested to see how she got her points. Were most of them on drives? She got a lot of free throws so it looks like she took it through traffic to the basket a lot. We have desperately needed a player who could do that. This bodes well....
Nobody here has mentioned rebounding. But we had a 60:18 rebounding advantage. I am not sure if I have EVER seen that kind of rebounding dominance by Stanford or anybody else. What were we doing? At the start of the season I was very worried about who would start to replace Jones's rebounding, and it is now obvious: Iriafen. But Bosgana, Brink, and Demetre had 8 each indicating that team rebounding was truly superb and spread around.
Ogden did not miss a shot, but fouled out. Great offense and having trouble adjusting to defense? Were her fouls all legit?
We would have expected our bigs to be considerably better than the Hawaii bigs. But Hawaii has had good, speedy guards and it seems as if they shut down Lepolo and Clardy. The point guard stat line does look pretty bleak, with no points and more turnovers than assists. Did they do something positive that you could only see if you were watching? Did they break a Hawaii press and stand up to Hawaii pressure, or was the Hawaii defense fairly straightforward but they still had mediocre stats?
RE: WBB: Stanford 87 -- Hawaii 40 - TonyLima - 11-08-2023
(11-08-2023, 11:11 PM)81alum Wrote: I'm so sad to have missed the game and what a bummer about the unreliable live feed. Still if anybody captured anything I'd love to see it.
Seeing the stat sheet after-the-fact bowled me over. We wound up doing considerably better against them than last year, even though they kept the core of their players and we lost our two leading scorers (Prechtel and Jones) from that game.
Iriafen is is truly impressive on the stat sheet. Sunday will tell us a whole lot more.
I'll say it again: Agara is our best in-traffic player since the days of Carrington and McPhee. I'll be interested to see how she got her points. Were most of them on drives? She got a lot of free throws so it looks like she took it through traffic to the basket a lot. We have desperately needed a player who could do that. This bodes well....
Nobody here has mentioned rebounding. But we had a 60:18 rebounding advantage. I am not sure if I have EVER seen that kind of rebounding dominance by Stanford or anybody else. What were we doing? At the start of the season I was very worried about who would start to replace Jones's rebounding, and it is now obvious: Iriafen. But Bosgana, Brink, and Demetre had 8 each indicating that team rebounding was truly superb and spread around.
Ogden did not miss a shot, but fouled out. Great offense and having trouble adjusting to defense? Were her fouls all legit?
We would have expected our bigs to be considerably better than the Hawaii bigs. But Hawaii has had good, speedy guards and it seems as if they shut down Lepolo and Clardy. The point guard stat line does look pretty bleak, with no points and more turnovers than assists. Did they do something positive that you could only see if you were watching? Did they break a Hawaii press and stand up to Hawaii pressure, or was the Hawaii defense fairly straightforward but they still had mediocre stats?
Got about 3/4 of the game on video here. Should have it posted on Youtube mid-afternoon Thursday.
RE: WBB: Stanford 87 -- Hawaii 40 - 81alum - 11-08-2023
(11-08-2023, 11:16 PM)TonyLima Wrote: .I'd say "bless you" if I were religious, so I will just say "thank you thank you thank you thank you...."
Got about 3/4 of the game on video here. Should have it posted on Youtube mid-afternoon Thursday.
RE: WBB: Stanford 87 -- Hawaii 40 - BosCard - 11-08-2023
I’m
81alum dateline='[url=tel:1699510268' Wrote: 1699510268[/url]']
I'm so sad to have missed the game and what a bummer about the unreliable live feed. Still if anybody captured anything I'd love to see it.
Seeing the stat sheet after-the-fact bowled me over. We wound up doing considerably better against them than last year, even though they kept the core of their players and we lost our two leading scorers (Prechtel and Jones) from that game.
Iriafen is is truly impressive on the stat sheet. Sunday will tell us a whole lot more.
I'll say it again: Agara is our best in-traffic player since the days of Carrington and McPhee. I'll be interested to see how she got her points. Were most of them on drives? She got a lot of free throws so it looks like she took it through traffic to the basket a lot. We have desperately needed a player who could do that. This bodes well....
Nobody here has mentioned rebounding. But we had a 60:18 rebounding advantage. I am not sure if I have EVER seen that kind of rebounding dominance by Stanford or anybody else. What were we doing? At the start of the season I was very worried about who would start to replace Jones's rebounding, and it is now obvious: Iriafen. But Bosgana, Brink, and Demetre had 8 each indicating that team rebounding was truly superb and spread around.
Ogden did not miss a shot, but fouled out. Great offense and having trouble adjusting to defense? Were her fouls all legit?
We would have expected our bigs to be considerably better than the Hawaii bigs. But Hawaii has had good, speedy guards and it seems as if they shut down Lepolo and Clardy. The point guard stat line does look pretty bleak, with no points and more turnovers than assists. Did they do something positive that you could only see if you were watching? Did they break a Hawaii press and stand up to Hawaii pressure, or was the Hawaii defense fairly straightforward but they still had mediocre stats?
Yes Agara scored a lot off drives and just finishing strong around the hoop however she had a nice soft floater as well. If she can continue to do that against better defenses, she will be a game changer this year. She started the second half at the wing with Brink/Iriafen at the 4/5.
RE: WBB: Stanford 87 -- Hawaii 40 - CompSci87 - 11-08-2023
The guards did their job today, which was 90% passing it into the post. All the posts and wings dominated and there was rarely occasion to kick it back out. Or when there was, passing it inside again was usually the right play.
Agara was super impressive as a freshman. Lots of moves, effective fakes, ball handling, dribble drives, decisive, confident. Not sure she'll always hit such a high free throw percentage; many of them bounced off the rim and then rattled in. She drew a lot of fouls, so I hope the FT percentage does stay high. She played both 3 and 4 at different times.
Jump was excellent, not just hitting 3s when open, but driving and hitting floaters, getting putbacks, etc.
Ogden's fouls were all ticky tack stuff. Two hands on the offensive player, reaching in, bumping a bit too much while trying to stay with the offensive player. Her main fault was failing to adjust to the officiating and to her own foul count. In games later this season the same things will frequently go unnoticed.
RE: WBB: Stanford 87 -- Hawaii 40 - StanFanFam13 - 11-09-2023
I love cheering on this team but admittedly have much less sophisticated technical understanding of the game than many posters here, so please forgive any mischaracterizations of what I observed at the game:
Yes, Agara was a skilled driver. No typical freshman hesitation in taking it to the basket. Did a good job of getting herself open, but also unafraid to go through traffic. There were a couple of instances, though, where traffic was so heavy that it seemed like a smarter play might have been to pass the ball back out, yet she plowed through. Sometimes, she still got a trip to the free throw line out of it. Other times, the result was just a bad shot that didn't go in.
Re rebounding: Kiki was particularly impressive and dogged, and the team as a whole did quite well (as the stat sheet shows). That said, it really didn't look to me like Hawaii was going too hard for the ball. After watching Colorado scrap for every rebound against LSU, it was downright startling to see their players be so passive. Perhaps it was part of their strategy? In any case, I hope we keep up our rebounding intensity, but I doubt we'll see those kinds of numbers against other teams in the Pac-12.
I honestly did not track that Clardy didn't score tonight and came away with a broadly positive impression of her as a ball handler, a relatively quick mover, and a player who showed a lot of initiative. If I'm remembering correctly, she had a couple of nice-looking steals and overall seemed to be hustling. I'm hopeful that we'll see her develop nicely over the season. Ogden, too. The fouls were admittedly not great (some legit, but there was at least one that I didn't really see). But she's speedy, shot a nice three, and didn't wilt when things weren't going her way.
Echoing the earlier observation about Cam: her back was clearly bothering her in the second quarter, and she briefly went back to the locker room after signaling to be taken out. Those of us at the Dominican exhibition game saw her take an early blow to the face, and she later posted an instagram story of her with a black eye. She's already getting beat up, and the season is just beginning. I'm all for letting her recharge on the bench as long as we can. The season is long, and we're going to need her!
RE: WBB: Stanford 87 -- Hawaii 40 - M T - 11-09-2023
(11-08-2023, 11:11 PM)81alum Wrote: Nobody here has mentioned rebounding. But we had a 60:18 rebounding advantage. I am not sure if I have EVER seen that kind of rebounding dominance by Stanford or anybody else. What were we doing? At the start of the season I was very worried about who would start to replace Jones's rebounding, and it is now obvious: Iriafen. But Bosgana, Brink, and Demetre had 8 each indicating that team rebounding was truly superb and spread around.
It really helps to get 43 out of 47 rebounds at their end (91.5%). Getting 17 of 31 at our end (54.8%) is darn good too.
Hawaii was outmatched by every player, so they missed many contested shots. We almost always had the better rebounding position simply from guarding them, not from rushing to the basket to rebound (or leaving players open to get in position for a rebound). I hope I'm wrong but I don't think the rebounding disparity will translate to great numbers against a good team. If we play this tight a defense against any team, we'll probably have good rebounding numbers.
Given the interior offensive advantage we showed, I'm not concerned about the relatively few 3s we took for most of the game. Hawaii did use a player on Jump to minimize her 3s, but she converted in other ways.
It really seems that Tara and her coaches asked where could the 2022-2023 team have done better, and they and the players made that happen. Faster ball movement, great FT shooting, strong defense, stronger rebounding, stronger interior play. We'll see if those still look as good against better teams. Oh yea, I noticed we got the ball into the front court faster.
RE: WBB: Stanford 87 -- Hawaii 40 - JTM - 11-09-2023
The offense looked better than last years’ poor ‘flow’ system. Lots more cutting and passing, especially to the posts. Therefore less outside 3’s attempted since this was successful. Looked more like the Princeton offense. And as others have pointed out, Kiki was impressive as was the FT shooting.
RE: WBB: Stanford 87 -- Hawaii 40 - mbdude - 11-09-2023
a few (4) highlights from espn
Hawai'i 40-87 Stanford (Nov 8, 2023) Video Highlights - ESPN
RE: WBB: Stanford 87 -- Hawaii 40 - BobK - 11-09-2023
I really liked Clardy Very quick and poised. Nunu was a revelation for sure
As to assists watch the NBA a pass three dribbles a score that’s an assist. In college it’s not so the guards wings did their job
RE: WBB: Stanford 87 -- Hawaii 40 - SkiBum80 - 11-09-2023
Some disclaimers:
I was not at game (am on east coast now)
The live feed didn't have the whole game
I missed some more part of the broadcast from some few brief of my own interruptions.
Given that, I have 2 summarized observations:
1. Great game against Hawaii
2. Our guards will need play better vs upcoming tougher teams for us to continue to win
By and large our bigs (and wings) were good to fantastic.
So our guards ended up bringing the ball up the court and often just feeding a not particularly open big
However, the guards did not often move the ball enough to disrupt the defense
The big being fed was usually not already open for a good shot, otherwise our guards woulda had the assists
Our bigs were covered, but they were playing great one on one and taking it to their overmatched opponent
Our bigs created their own open shots without help from our guards.
Or our bigs (and wings like Hannah) made a good assist to another big or wing.
Not a lot of great penetration from our guards and when done was sometimes wild and failed
This is reflected in the box score where our guards didn't shoot well and didn't penetrate well and didn't assist well.
The game success was mainly our bigs just putting wicked one on one moves on their overmatched players, or good pass off to other big/wing.
That's fine, great, for playing vs Hawaii.
But for Indiana, and later Utah, UCLA, Colorado, etc. our bigs can't have as much expectation to just power one on one thru their frontcourt.
To win we'll need much better play from our guards to set up the plays, get the defense off balance, and get a good shot look from an open teammate.
RE: WBB: Stanford 87 -- Hawaii 40 - WBB fan - 11-09-2023
For me, this game was first, Kiki, Kiki, Kiki. And then later, NuNu, NuNu. If those two play was they did last night, I'm very optimistic. I agree with those who say the guards did their job -- if others are scoring and in position, they pgs are not responsible for scoring. They should be passing and make it possible for others to score. Re Brooke, once again, inconsistent. Some good, some just not paying attention and energy. And finally, since no one has commented on this, Cam continues her perfect FT streak. She ended last season with 48 in a row and has now started this season with four more from last night. That's now a streak of 52.
RE: WBB: Stanford 87 -- Hawaii 40 - BosCard - 11-09-2023
I agree with the folks who aren't so worried about our guard play. Yes it would be great if Lepolo morphed into Caitlin Clark and suddenly became this brobdingnagian threat to score or pass on drives. But that isn't where our advantage is. Our advantage is having bigs (Brink, Iriafen and now Agara) who can do that vs their defender. I think the team is just playing to its strengths which is primarily having our bigs initiate penetration because they will either score, get fouled or pass to an open teammate.
RE: WBB: Stanford 87 -- Hawaii 40 - OCcardinal - 11-09-2023
Since 156 of the 200 minutes Hawaii played last night were played by the same players we faced in last year's game, I thought it might be interesting to compare stats:
Stat 2023 game/2022 game
Points scored 87/68
Points allowed 40/39
OReb 17/14
DReb 43/30
Asst 14/13
TO 12/14
PF 21/16
FG% 48.5% (32-66)/40% (24-60)
3PT% 23.5% (4-17)/31.8% (7-22)
FT% 95% (19-20)/81.3% (13-16)
Blocks 6/5
Steals 7/7
OppFG% 22.4% (13-58)/26.1% (12-46)
Opp3Pt 23.5% (4-17)/20% (4-20)
Don't have these analytics from 2022, but still interesting:
Stanford's Best Efficiency Ratings
Kiki 31
Nunu 22
Brooke 19
Elena 17
Brink 16
Jump 13
Stanford's Best Defensive Ratings (lower=better)
Brink 23.7
Nunu 38.3
Elena 48.3
Demetre 50.7
Iriafen 63.2
Clardy 72.2
All the above are good. Nunu and Brink are off the charts.