New MBB coach? - Printable Version

New MBB coach? - Printable Version

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RE: New MBB coach? - teejers1 - 02-26-2022

(02-26-2022, 09:46 AM)BobK Wrote: Clearly Harbaugh was still recruiting for Stanford while coaching the 49ers. Clearly
Geesh

Bob and Lex (and a few others here): the Last of the Shawpologists.
Maybe you guys can make a movie . . .

No one has answered CMac directly, that's okay . . . none of us knows for sure.

How about a more general question (which might be answerable):  do you think Whale Recruiting is at the level is was/has been when Stanford was a great team? I'm not a recruitnik, but according to gurus on TOS, Stanford is not recruiting the whales like it used to. Gee, wonder why that is . . .

[BTW, is Stanford as an institutional draw during Shaw's tenure greater or lesser than for his predecessors?].

RE: New MBB coach? - DC 86 - 02-26-2022

(02-26-2022, 11:24 PM)teejers1 Wrote: No one has answered CMac directly, that's okay . . . none of us knows for sure.

How about a more general question (which might be answerable): do you think Whale Recruiting is at the level is was/has been when Stanford was a great team? I'm not a recruitnik, but according to gurus on TOS, Stanford is not recruiting the whales like it used to. Gee, wonder why that is . . .

It's a hypothetical question so there's no definitive answer, but as I posted earlier McCaffrey was ranked #91 nationally and this year we signed the #66 national recruit, so your hypothesis that McCaffrey or similar players wouldn't sign now is questionable.

Re Whales, Stanford has never consistently recruited at that level, there are roughly 30-35 five-stars per season so the stars need to align perfectly in terms of interest, admissions, etc. for Stanford to sign that caliber of player. Very few schools sign these whales on a consistent basis.

In the last 20 classes Stanford has signed a grand total of five whales: Foster Sarell, Walker Little, Davis Mills, Kyle Murphy, Andrus Peat. So Stanford signing one (or none) in any given year doesn't really tell us much. This year's #18 class nationally (#1 on the conference) tells us that Stanford is currently competitive on the recruiting front.

RE: New MBB coach? - 2006alum - 02-27-2022

(02-26-2022, 11:14 PM)jacket3ree Wrote: Yes, please.

I didn't know or care that Stanford played Cal tonight. I found out via text from JT Jr: "If they don't fire Haase, I'm mailing my sweat stained Jacobsen jersey back to whomever runs that **** show of an AD."

I'll pay attention to hoops when the school does.

To borrow a page (chapter?) from Marty's book:
[Image: twisted-sister-were-not-gonna-take-it.gif]

RE: New MBB coach? - lex24 - 02-27-2022

(02-26-2022, 11:24 PM)teejers1 Wrote:
(02-26-2022, 09:46 AM)BobK Wrote: Clearly Harbaugh was still recruiting for Stanford while coaching the 49ers. Clearly
Geesh

Bob and Lex (and a few others here): the Last of the Shawpologists.
Maybe you guys can make a movie . . .

No one has answered CMac directly, that's okay . . . none of us knows for sure.

How about a more general question (which might be answerable):  do you think Whale Recruiting is at the level is was/has been when Stanford was a great team? I'm not a recruitnik, but according to gurus on TOS, Stanford is not recruiting the whales like it used to. Gee, wonder why that is . . .

[BTW, is Stanford as an institutional draw during Shaw's tenure greater or lesser than for his predecessors?].

I don’t have to “apologize “ for what Shaw has accomplished. His record speaks for itself. If 2022 mirrors 2023, than maybe you get your wish.

RE: New MBB coach? - JohnR34231 - 02-27-2022

(02-27-2022, 08:39 AM)lex24 Wrote:
(02-26-2022, 11:24 PM)teejers1 Wrote:
(02-26-2022, 09:46 AM)BobK Wrote: Clearly Harbaugh was still recruiting for Stanford while coaching the 49ers. Clearly
Geesh

Bob and Lex (and a few others here): the Last of the Shawpologists.
Maybe you guys can make a movie . . .

No one has answered CMac directly, that's okay . . . none of us knows for sure.

How about a more general question (which might be answerable):  do you think Whale Recruiting is at the level is was/has been when Stanford was a great team? I'm not a recruitnik, but according to gurus on TOS, Stanford is not recruiting the whales like it used to. Gee, wonder why that is . . .

[BTW, is Stanford as an institutional draw during Shaw's tenure greater or lesser than for his predecessors?].

I don’t have to “apologize “ for what Shaw has accomplished. His record speaks for itself.   If 2022 mirrors 2023, than maybe you get your wish.

Yeah if the 2022 and 2023 records resemble 2021 and 2019 I think Stanford will be forced to make a change.
Then the Shaw boo-birds will have someone else to complain about,

RE: New MBB coach? - lex24 - 02-27-2022

(02-27-2022, 09:00 AM)JohnR34231 Wrote:
(02-27-2022, 08:39 AM)lex24 Wrote:
(02-26-2022, 11:24 PM)teejers1 Wrote:
(02-26-2022, 09:46 AM)BobK Wrote: Clearly Harbaugh was still recruiting for Stanford while coaching the 49ers. Clearly
Geesh

Bob and Lex (and a few others here): the Last of the Shawpologists.
Maybe you guys can make a movie . . .

No one has answered CMac directly, that's okay . . . none of us knows for sure.

How about a more general question (which might be answerable):  do you think Whale Recruiting is at the level is was/has been when Stanford was a great team? I'm not a recruitnik, but according to gurus on TOS, Stanford is not recruiting the whales like it used to. Gee, wonder why that is . . .

[BTW, is Stanford as an institutional draw during Shaw's tenure greater or lesser than for his predecessors?].

I don’t have to “apologize “ for what Shaw has accomplished. His record speaks for itself.   If 2022 mirrors 2023, than maybe you get your wish.

Yeah if the 2022 and 2023 records resemble 2021 and 2019 I think Stanford will be forced to make a change.
Then the Shaw boo-birds will have someone else to complain about,

I actually meant 22 mirroring 21. But I suspect you are right that he gets a couple years to turn this around.

RE: New MBB coach? - JohnR34231 - 02-27-2022

(02-27-2022, 09:07 AM)lex24 Wrote:
(02-27-2022, 09:00 AM)JohnR34231 Wrote:
(02-27-2022, 08:39 AM)lex24 Wrote:
(02-26-2022, 11:24 PM)teejers1 Wrote:
(02-26-2022, 09:46 AM)BobK Wrote: Clearly Harbaugh was still recruiting for Stanford while coaching the 49ers. Clearly
Geesh

Bob and Lex (and a few others here): the Last of the Shawpologists.
Maybe you guys can make a movie . . .

No one has answered CMac directly, that's okay . . . none of us knows for sure.

How about a more general question (which might be answerable):  do you think Whale Recruiting is at the level is was/has been when Stanford was a great team? I'm not a recruitnik, but according to gurus on TOS, Stanford is not recruiting the whales like it used to. Gee, wonder why that is . . .

[BTW, is Stanford as an institutional draw during Shaw's tenure greater or lesser than for his predecessors?].

I don’t have to “apologize “ for what Shaw has accomplished. His record speaks for itself.   If 2022 mirrors 2023, than maybe you get your wish.

Yeah if the 2022 and 2023 records resemble 2021 and 2019 I think Stanford will be forced to make a change.
Then the Shaw boo-birds will have someone else to complain about,

I actually meant 22 mirroring 21. But I suspect you are right that he gets a couple years to turn this around.

I think he is going to have to show at least a little bit of promise in 2022 that the program is starting to head in the right direction. If 2022 is another 3-9 (or worse) with multiple blowout losses I think he has to go.

RE: New MBB coach? - Hurlburt88 - 02-27-2022

I am at the point where Muir needs to go to have someone stronger who can push programs in the right direction--coaching changes or not. And I will start responding when that everytime I get asked for a donation.

RE: New MBB coach? - FarmTeam - 02-28-2022

(02-27-2022, 10:28 AM)Hurlburt88 Wrote: I am at the point where Muir needs to go to have someone stronger who can push programs in the right direction--coaching changes or not. And I will start responding when that everytime I get asked for a donation.

As a season ticket holder, I just got the email asking what I wanted to do about the $500 I'm out for the no-attendance games in January due to covid. Of course Stanford wants us to contribute the money to the athletic department or apply to next year's tickets. Not a chance. I'm taking my money back. Had there been a conditional option of "contribute the $500 to help defray the cost of Haase being fired," I would have opted for that! I guess I could send that (snarky) message in my response, but seems like just a waste of time and words for the Stanford ticket person who has to deal with it.

I'm genuinely on the fence about re-upping for next year's season tickets. I love basketball, support the players (of course), and enjoy going to the games. So maybe I will cave in the end. But Haase needs to be fired and voting with my feet seems to be the only thing I can do to influence that even just a bit. At some point I'll probably send that message and an email to Muir, but I don't have any illusions that that will accomplish anything. If I get fired up, maybe I'll even send an email to MTL while I'm at it calling for Muir's head...but again that will just be venting.

RE: New MBB coach? - winflop - 02-28-2022

(02-28-2022, 05:12 PM)FarmTeam Wrote:
(02-27-2022, 10:28 AM)Hurlburt88 Wrote: I am at the point where Muir needs to go to have someone stronger who can push programs in the right direction--coaching changes or not. And I will start responding when that everytime I get asked for a donation.

As a season ticket holder, I just got the email asking what I wanted to do about the $500 I'm out for the no-attendance games in January due to covid. Of course Stanford wants us to contribute the money to the athletic department or apply to next year's tickets. Not a chance. I'm taking my money back. Had there been a conditional option of "contribute the $500 to help defray the cost of Haase being fired," I would have opted for that! I guess I could send that (snarky) message in my response, but seems like just a waste of time and words for the Stanford ticket person who has to deal with it.

I'm genuinely on the fence about re-upping for next year's season tickets. I love basketball, support the players (of course), and enjoy going to the games. So maybe I will cave in the end. But Haase needs to be fired and voting with my feet seems to be the only thing I can do to influence that even just a bit. At some point I'll probably send that message and an email to Muir, but I don't have any illusions that that will accomplish anything. If I get fired up, maybe I'll even send an email to MTL while I'm at it calling for Muir's head...but again that will just be venting.

I voted with my feet after the 2011-12 season. Muir called me and I told him I wouldn't accept FREE tickets until there was a new head coach.

I'm in the same place now, but with a lot less leverage since I don't have season tickets any more and I stopped donating to the Athletic Department until Muir is gone.

RE: New MBB coach? - Phogge - 02-28-2022

For the pro Shaw crowd and especially the few around here who actually wore the uni what does Shaw need to do in 2022 and 2023 to remain at Stanford?

For the pro Haase crowd what does he have to do to reach 2025 as head coach?

Consider yourselves the AD who has to answer to the executives at Stanford and to an alumni who believe that Stanford is the best little place on Earth?

RE: New MBB coach? - GK3 - 03-01-2022

(02-28-2022, 07:32 PM)Phogge Wrote: For the pro Shaw crowd and especially the few around here who actually wore the uni what does Shaw need to do in 2022 and 2023 to remain at Stanford?

For the pro Haase crowd what does he have to do to reach 2025 as head coach?

Consider yourselves the AD who has to answer to the executives at Stanford and to an alumni who believe that Stanford is the best little place on Earth?

Muir is just the yes man for the administration. He isn't going somewhere unless some very serious money people start making lots of noise. I have been a Haase supporter until this year which has been the same as every other year. No improvement. Now whether anything happens is doubtful. More likely a change than not, but hardly certain. There has to be a change at the very top of the Stanford Administration for any serious changes to occur.

RE: New MBB coach? - JohnR34231 - 03-01-2022

(02-28-2022, 07:32 PM)Phogge Wrote: For the pro Shaw crowd and especially the few around here who actually wore the uni what does Shaw need to do in 2022 and 2023 to remain at Stanford?

For the pro Haase crowd what does he have to do to reach 2025 as head coach?

Consider yourselves the AD who has to answer to the executives at Stanford and to an alumni who believe that Stanford is the best little place on Earth?

My guess would be that the University would like to avoid having to fire Shaw because they think he is a good representative of the program. He "gets" Stanford and is an alum. So if he can show some kind of improvement in 2022 and 2023 (say to 5-7 or 6-6) he stays. Two more 3-9/4-8 type years and I think they won't have much choice but to find someone new.
Haase who knows. Mediocre basketball has become the norm at Stanford and coaches usually don't get fired if they can achieve the norm. So anyone's guess how long he stays.

lex24 - lex24 - 03-01-2022

(02-27-2022, 09:16 AM)JohnR34231 Wrote:
(02-27-2022, 09:07 AM)lex24 Wrote:
(02-27-2022, 09:00 AM)JohnR34231 Wrote:
(02-27-2022, 08:39 AM)lex24 Wrote:
(02-26-2022, 11:24 PM)teejers1 Wrote: Bob and Lex (and a few others here): the Last of the Shawpologists.
Maybe you guys can make a movie . . .

No one has answered CMac directly, that's okay . . . none of us knows for sure.

How about a more general question (which might be answerable):  do you think Whale Recruiting is at the level is was/has been when Stanford was a great team? I'm not a recruitnik, but according to gurus on TOS, Stanford is not recruiting the whales like it used to. Gee, wonder why that is . . .

[BTW, is Stanford as an institutional draw during Shaw's tenure greater or lesser than for his predecessors?].

I don’t have to “apologize “ for what Shaw has accomplished. His record speaks for itself.   If 2022 mirrors 2023, than maybe you get your wish.

Yeah if the 2022 and 2023 records resemble 2021 and 2019 I think Stanford will be forced to make a change.
Then the Shaw boo-birds will have someone else to complain about,

I actually meant 22 mirroring 21. But I suspect you are right that he gets a couple years to turn this around.

I think he is going to have to show at least a little bit of promise in 2022 that the program is starting to head in the right direction. If 2022 is another 3-9 (or worse) with multiple blowout losses I think he has to go.

That’s about right.

RE: New MBB coach? - BillBradley - 03-01-2022

re: football recruiting for Shaw...isn't the admissions dept a big factor in football recruiting at Stanford? From what I know, the athlete acceptance standards aren't set in stone and change from time to time depending on various other factors. I do know it's a big deal for basketball. Although the $10M the Warriors paid him was the main reason he left, Montgomery did speak of recruiting/admissions as a major issue at the time. His departing recruiting class, while the team went 30-2 and was #1 in the country that year, was Tim Morris, Peter Prowitt, and Taj Finger. The recruiting class the year before was Fred Washington, Evan Moore, and Mark Bradford. Back to back classes that were quite the step down from previous years. The "recruiting follows success" logic certainly didn't hold true in those years.

I don't really know the answer, so I wonder what the football admissions landscape was like during the Harbaugh and early Shaw years compared to the last 4 years. I think it's safe to say that building football and basketball dynasties aren't really at the top of the list for the Stanford administration.

RE: New MBB coach? - BobK - 03-01-2022

Admissions for Football changed dramatically from the evil Mamlet to the arrival of Dean Shaw in Admissions and Bowlsby as AD.
Monty left for two reasons, money good for him and Admissions.
Moore and Bradford were on FB scholarship.

RE: New MBB coach? - teejers1 - 03-01-2022

(03-01-2022, 10:30 AM)BillBradley Wrote: re: football recruiting for Shaw...isn't the admissions dept a big factor in football recruiting at Stanford? From what I know, the athlete acceptance standards aren't set in stone and change from time to time depending on various other factors. I do know it's a big deal for basketball. Although the $10M the Warriors paid him was the main reason he left, Montgomery did speak of recruiting/admissions as a major issue at the time. His departing recruiting class, while the team went 30-2 and was #1 in the country that year, was Tim Morris, Peter Prowitt, and Taj Finger. The recruiting class the year before was Fred Washington, Evan Moore, and Mark Bradford. Back to back classes that were quite the step down from previous years. The "recruiting follows success" logic certainly didn't hold true in those years.

I don't really know the answer, so I wonder what the football admissions landscape was like during the Harbaugh and early Shaw years compared to the last 4 years. I think it's safe to say that building football and basketball dynasties aren't really at the top of the list for the Stanford administration.

I am unaware of any accusations (or even rumblings) that the football admissions landscape (or the hoops admissions landscape, for that matter) have changed to detriment of ability to recruit players to Stanford. The tectonic shift from Mamlet was well known, and even documents by the late, great Steve Durrett who, iirc, had what became know as "The Durrett Scale" showing combo of GPA and scores that was generally needed to gain admissions to Stanford. The bar raised noticeably with Mamlet, iirc, which is one of the big reasons Monty got frustrated and left.

Keep in mind, all this happened before Stanford bit the bullet and allowed its coaches (specifically the football coach) to show up on the annual Form 990. My sense is once this barrier crossed, the university has not clamped down on major sports admissions. [What's the point of paying Big Dollars for a coach and then hamstringing ability to win?]. Doesn't mean a clamp down won't occur . . . but I don't think we've seen it in last 15 years.

RE: New MBB coach? - FarmTeam - 03-06-2022

What do we actually know about Haase's contract, if anything? There's no publicly-available information and I haven't been active long enough on this board to know if there's information out there or at least rumored based on those who might be somehow in-the-know. Do we think he has another year on his contract? Two years? Was Muir dumb enough to extend his contract at some point? (Well, don't answer that first part, of course Muir is dumb enough but did he?)

I'm not naive about financial implications and Muir's ego in having hired him, but it's unfathomable to me that Haase would keep his job after 6 seasons with no tourney appearances, annual late-season collapses, a sub-.500 Pac-12 record, and barely above .500 record overall.

RE: New MBB coach? - BobK - 03-06-2022

We can be pretty sure Hasse didn’t get a 6 year contract to come to Stanford so yes probably extended
Does that Matter? Sure hope not

RE: New MBB coach? - old spanish trail - 03-06-2022

(03-06-2022, 03:58 PM)BobK Wrote: We can be pretty sure Hasse didn’t get a 6 year contract to come to Stanford so yes probably extended
Does that Matter? Sure hope not

It was. and it matters, unfortunately.