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Why schedule Notre Dame? - Printable Version

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Why schedule Notre Dame? - CardinalSagehen - 08-15-2018

The question is moot because the Irish are already on our schedule through 2024.  But looking at this season's schedule, the game sure stands out as a major pothole on the road to the CFP, which is already a difficult road.

Pros for the game (in no particular order):
1) Our record - we've had the upper hand at 9-2 since 2009.  It's a high-quality non-conference win when we win.
2) Head-to-head recruiting.
3) Legacy / tradition.
4) Pac-12 is weak these days so we need opportunities to show our valor.
5) Money.  (Often forgotten at a place like Stanford, but still makes the world go round.)
6) Always fun to watch.
7) Guaranteed to get us on national TV.

Cons:
1) Consistently difficult opponent with top-tier talent.
2) Committee demonstrably weighs Losses more than Strength of Record.  Two losses for a Pac-12 team = no playoff.
3) Kept us out of BCS Championship in 2012.  Oh, by the way, Kulabafi SCORED!
4) We already play 9 conference games, including SC and now Chip Kelly every year.
5) Very long road trip, right in the middle of our conference schedule.
6) Greater risk of injuries to the first-team vs. scheduling a softer opponent.

The fan in me wants this game.  I will never forget being on the field after the 2015 game with my son - that atmosphere was electric.  But the only rational conclusion is that this game hurts our chances of ever going to the CFP, right?!

RE: Why schedule Notre Dame? - Trevmiesterj - 08-15-2018

Quote:But the only rational conclusion is that this game hurts our chances of ever going to the CFP, right?!

Glass half full?  I always have seen this game as a chance to showcase Stanford on the national stage, which, win or lose, should only be seen as a positive.

And the Legends Trophy is a gorgeous trophy with a deep enough history that cements my vote for carrying on the tradition.

RE: Why schedule Notre Dame? - BigEasyCard - 08-15-2018

Good points both pro and con.  For me it's much more about games with moments like these:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RzCzj3fdET0

I'll bet I'm not the only one on here who remembers the final drive with the entire stadium chanting "Toby, Toby, Toby".

Or how about Owen Marecic's back to back touchdowns on offense and defense?

Or Conrad Ukropina's last second field goal to win 38-36?

I may not live to see the Cardinal win a national championship, but I'll always have memories like these.

Geaux Cardinal!

RE: Why schedule Notre Dame? - 82lsju - 08-15-2018

(08-15-2018, 06:29 PM)BigEasyCard Wrote:  Good points both pro and con.  For me it's much more about games with moments like these:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RzCzj3fdET0

I'll bet I'm not the only one on here who remembers the final drive with the entire stadium chanting "Toby, Toby, Toby".

Or how about Owen Marecic's back to back touchdowns on offense and defense?

Or Conrad Ukropina's last second field goal to win 38-36?

I may not live to see the Cardinal win a national championship, but I'll always have memories like these.

Geaux Cardinal!

or the 1992 game, and yes I was there

http://articles.latimes.com/1992-10-04/sports/sp-907_1_notre-dame

and yes, I think we should drop ND and pick up home and away games with different Power 5 teams

RE: Why schedule Notre Dame? - CTcard - 08-15-2018

(08-15-2018, 04:52 PM)CardinalSagehen Wrote:  ... Two losses for a Pac-12 team = no playoff.

So far, two losses for any team at all = no playoff.

RE: Why schedule Notre Dame? - Snorlax94 - 08-16-2018

Now having subscribed to season tickets for a few years and observing stadium attendance and ticket prices, I see more how #5) Money can dominate, and I say this not as a bad thing, but just as a realistic thing.

First, you'll notice how much the ticket prices vary each game, and the after-market prices have even greater disparities. Even though tickets for the San Diego State game might command, say, $40 and a USC ticket might command $120, even that is misleading. The SD State game is the "educator appreciation day" where a teacher in the Bay Area can get 4 tickets free. And not only are UC Davis tickets less expensive, that game is"family day" where kids can come free with the purchase of an adult ticket. And even with all of these promotions, the stadium is still pretty empty for those games, with the accompanying loss of revenues in concessions and parking, and TV viewership.

So imagine the ND game charging 3x per ticket, selling pretty much the 50,000 seats at those higher prices, and games like UC Davis selling with a face-value one third of a Notre Dame or USC, with a largely empty stadium, even when giving away many thousands of tickets. On top of that, way more people watch the Notre Dame game on TV. And even after all that, when you play FCS teams, you lose either way -- either you gotta pay them like $500k to come to your home, or you have to travel to their smaller and less-attended stadium.

Notre Dame has a brobdingnagian stadium and charges incredible sums to sit there (their mandatory donations dwarf ours), and just imagine splitting the revenues from that game and getting TV revenues from that. In turn, they want a marquee matchup with one of the best-known universities in the world. That generates interest.

In terms of continuing traditions, well-known schools benefit from rivalries with other well-known schools. Think of the old Michigan-Notre Dame series. 

On top of that, I think schools that try to do things the right way (student athletes who graduate, no recruiting scandals, sportsmanship) want to play other schools with similar values. I think that's one of the reasons programs want to play each other when there's a relationship, like a mutual interest in a Stanford-Vanderbilt game.


In addition to all of this, I've heard Stanford loses season ticket holders in even-numbered years because the lack of marquee games, and I imagine having Notre Dame and USC at home on alternating years kind of saves them. Without one of them on alternating years, I could see a LOT of season ticket holders dropping.

It's kind of frustrating, because Stanford out fundraises all other universities in the world for its general fund, and the SEC gets away with murder playing only 8 conference games and 7 home games a year, but in athletics, Stanford couldn't afford to replace Notre Dame with a homestand against the Citadel or UMass Minutemen. But they may soon move an FCS game from the front of the season to late in the season, so that is at least something. hooray

RE: Why schedule Notre Dame? - TinderForMidgets - 08-16-2018

Honestly, I'm favor of scheduling Notre Dame. I don't think we are going to vying for national championships constantly and so Notre Dame is our shot at relevancy.

RE: Why schedule Notre Dame? - Phogge - 08-16-2018

Anybody besides Bobbbbbb who remembers Steve Thurlow taking pitchouts from Dick Berg and throwing downfield against the Domers in 1963?

RE: Why schedule Notre Dame? - Redrum - 08-16-2018

"These Irish. Why must they fight?"

Touchy, humorless bastards.

RE: Why schedule Notre Dame? - CTcard - 08-16-2018

(08-16-2018, 06:35 AM)Phogge Wrote:  Anybody besides Bobbbbbb who remembers Steve Thurlow taking pitchouts from Dick Berg and throwing downfield against the Domers in 1963?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ufCRcTGHM10&list=PLV9jLkcD9Par--cGJvCKNW2CrTwUpHh_T&index=8

RE: Why schedule Notre Dame? - BigEasyCard - 08-16-2018

Great stuff.  Thanks.

Geaux Cardinal!

RE: Why schedule Notre Dame? - ChicagoCard - 08-16-2018

John Ralston's first season.

RE: Why schedule Notre Dame? - Goose - 08-16-2018

One reason to keep ND on the schedule is that the alternative of scheduling "Other Power 5" schools has not gone too well in the past. Most other schools are looking to schedule somebody they can beat during their "non-conference" games. Stanford is double trouble on that score because of late we have been pretty good, but don't have the reputation as a "football power". There is too much risk and not enough reward to schedule Stanford. Stanford OTOH needs to attract fans and overcome the perception the PAC-12 is a "weak" conference (in many people's eyes). Playing Indiana won't do that. So, despite the risks, ND is a good fit for us.

RE: Why schedule Notre Dame? - rudruff - 08-16-2018

(08-16-2018, 05:41 PM)Goose Wrote:  One reason to keep ND on the schedule is that the alternative of scheduling "Other Power 5" schools has not gone too well in the past. Most other schools are looking to schedule somebody they can beat during their "non-conference" games. Stanford is double trouble on that score because of late we have been pretty good, but don't have the reputation as a "football power". There is too much risk and not enough reward to schedule Stanford. Stanford OTOH needs to attract fans and overcome the perception the PAC-12 is a "weak" conference (in many people's eyes). Playing Indiana won't do that. So, despite the risks, ND is a good fit for us.

We are 7-2 against them the last 9 years. Reason enough.

RE: Why schedule Notre Dame? - pefloresjr - 08-16-2018

ND is always overrated based on their history and national fan base.  Over time, we get extra credit and credibility from beating them and don't lose as much in terms of ranking when we lose.  It is a fun rivalry and variety wouldn't be better than playing ND in my book.  

Cheers,
Pete F.

RE: Why schedule Notre Dame? - BobK - 08-16-2018

Great game great video.     Thurlow and Ragsdale both came as QBs.

RE: Why schedule Notre Dame? - 82lsju - 08-16-2018

(08-16-2018, 06:48 PM)pefloresjr Wrote:  ND is always overrated based on their history and national fan base.  Over time, we get extra credit and credibility from beating them and don't lose as much in terms of ranking when we lose.  It is a fun rivalry and variety wouldn't be better than playing ND in my book.  

Cheers,
Pete F.

variety would be way better, this from someone who made trips to South Bend in 1988, 1990, and 1992 (so my personal attendance record in South Bend is 2-1!!!) and is highly unlikely to make another trip there......

RE: Why schedule Notre Dame? - CardinalSagehen - 08-16-2018

BREAKING NEWS - the Irish will be sporting this truly calamitous, pinstriped football uniform for their game at Yankee Stadium this season. 

[tweet]https://twitter.com/NDFootball/status/1030139097715798017/photo/1?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1030139097715798017&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.cbssports.com%2Fcollege-football%2Fnews%2Flook-notre-dame-unveils-new-york-yankees-inspired-uniforms-for-shamrock-series-game%2F[/tweet]

RE: Why schedule Notre Dame? - 2 for 2028 - 08-16-2018

(08-16-2018, 06:12 PM)rudruff Wrote:  
(08-16-2018, 05:41 PM)Goose Wrote:  One reason to keep ND on the schedule is that the alternative of scheduling "Other Power 5" schools has not gone too well in the past. Most other schools are looking to schedule somebody they can beat during their "non-conference" games. Stanford is double trouble on that score because of late we have been pretty good, but don't have the reputation as a "football power". There is too much risk and not enough reward to schedule Stanford. Stanford OTOH needs to attract fans and overcome the perception the PAC-12 is a "weak" conference (in many people's eyes). Playing Indiana won't do that. So, despite the risks, ND is a good fit for us.

We are 7-2 against them the last 9 years. Reason enough.

Ahem. 7-1 last 9 years.

RE: Why schedule Notre Dame? - rudruff - 08-16-2018

(08-16-2018, 09:29 PM)2 for 2018 Wrote:  
(08-16-2018, 06:12 PM)rudruff Wrote:  
(08-16-2018, 05:41 PM)Goose Wrote:  One reason to keep ND on the schedule is that the alternative of scheduling "Other Power 5" schools has not gone too well in the past. Most other schools are looking to schedule somebody they can beat during their "non-conference" games. Stanford is double trouble on that score because of late we have been pretty good, but don't have the reputation as a "football power". There is too much risk and not enough reward to schedule Stanford. Stanford OTOH needs to attract fans and overcome the perception the PAC-12 is a "weak" conference (in many people's eyes). Playing Indiana won't do that. So, despite the risks, ND is a good fit for us.

We are 7-2 against them the last 9 years. Reason enough.

Ahem. 7-1 last 9 years.

Good catch. I forgot that Taylor was across the line.