Mark Cuban's study of re-opening safety compliance - Printable Version
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Mark Cuban's study of re-opening safety compliance - burger - 05-08-2020
Mark Cuban (owner of my Dallas Mavericks) hired researchers to collect data on how well businesses reopening in Dallas were complying with recommended health protocols. The results were...discouraging.
Quote:Overall – 96% of businesses were non-compliant across all mandatory protocols and all locations. The extent of non-compliance is dramatic with ~1/3 of all locations being <50% compliant across mandatory protocols as established by the Governor’s office.
...
On average, ~60% of mandatory protocols were followed and ~54% of all suggested protocols were followed. In aggregate – locations followed ~58% of all mandatory + suggested protocols.
It's a quick read if you're interested: https://blogmaverick.com/2020/05/07/i-hired-a-team-of-secret-shoppers-to-find-out-how-businesses-were-opening-in-dallas-its-not-good/
I think this is going to be a problem everywhere. There are still plenty of people who don't take the virus seriously.
RE: Mark Cuban's study of re-opening safety compliance - OutsiderFan - 05-08-2020
I just talked with a friend outside St. Louis today. He told me it's shocking how many people don't take the virus seriously. Most of the them have been strung up on propaganda, saying it's a hoax, that the government is trying to take our freedoms away, etc.
He said even some of his colleagues he thought to be reasonable, fact-oriented people, have shocked him with their inability to grasp the situation. Many of them are now talking about how the death numbers are lower than they really are because hospitals are getting paid to report Covid-19 deaths. Just unhinged lunacy.
This is in fact the EXACT OPPOSITE of reality. Hospitals are losing money by not doing elective surgeries. They lose money on and have ZERO incentive to report "extra" Covid-19 deaths. If they really wanted to start making money, they would downplay Covid-19 deaths to justify doing elective surgeries that make them money. Thankfully medical professionals are some of the last ones unwilling to sacrifice principle for money. In our rapidly devolving society.
RE: Mark Cuban's study of re-opening safety compliance - dabigv13 - 05-08-2020
(05-08-2020, 10:54 AM)OutsiderFan Wrote: Thankfully medical professionals are some of the last ones unwilling to sacrifice principle for money. In our rapidly devolving society.
Sadly there are many bad apples in medicine too. I hope/think less than many other professions, but humans are greedy animals. In this setting, I think there are some bad actors selling unproven therapies and tests to a scared populace. Having hoaxsters and frauds running our federal response certainly enables this.
The rest of your post is spot on.
RE: Mark Cuban's study of re-opening safety compliance - BostonCard - 05-08-2020
Yeah, there are, sadly, lots of unscrupulous doctors out there. Some of them just stretch the rules (for example, up-coding diagnoses to get better reimbursement), many offer unneeded services (often linked to diagnostic modalities that they also own), a few engage in outright fraud.
BC
RE: Mark Cuban's study of re-opening safety compliance - burger - 05-08-2020
(05-08-2020, 11:27 AM)dabigv13 Wrote: Sadly there are many bad apples in medicine too. I hope/think less than many other professions, but humans are greedy animals. In this setting, I think there are some bad actors selling unproven therapies and tests to a scared populace. Having hoaxsters and frauds running our federal response certainly enables this.You didn't name any names, but Dr. Oz's lawyers are already preparing to file suit against you for defamation.
The rest of your post is spot on.
RE: Mark Cuban's study of re-opening safety compliance - magnus - 05-08-2020
Excluding the bad apples, just like what we are seeing in america with a range of beliefs, doctors have a range of beliefs too. Some are as cautious as many on this board are, but some also don't really think too much of the virus.
There are probably more and more people (businesses and doctors included) that are getting desensitized to all the horrors of this virus and are just starting to accept the "inevitable".
RE: Mark Cuban's study of re-opening safety compliance - Snorlax94 - 05-08-2020
First, hats off to Mark Cuban. Many tycoons are just hiding, or trying to sway and misinform for their financial gain. Nice to see Cuban researching, then sharing information even if it may be detrimental to the Dallas Mavericks playing soon.
Second, this finding doesn't surprise me at all: it's exactly what I've been seeing.
Generally, I've found larger, well-financed companies implementing smarter guidelines. Costco offers senior hours, they require masks, they reduce the # of people indoors, they have people inside constantly telling people to space and how to space (even educating some people to be less clueless and oblivious), they increase cleaning times, they provide sneeze guards for cashiers and receipt inspectors, and they wipe down carts.
Similarly, at my local Panda Express, I can order and pay online. No customers go inside, they've shifted a POS system outside to take orders (for anyone who didn't order online) and they've moved the actual pick up of food to the opposite end of the building, near the exit, also outdoors. No customers can enter the building. Everyone is wearing masks.
Then I go to my local pizza joint (with 3 locations). No one is wearing a mask. I can order by phone, but I have to pay when I get there. To get my pizza, I've got to wait in the lobby for 10 minutes. The cashier isn't wearing gloves. The pizza makers are in close proximity to each other because the kitchen is like a narrow hallway. The only HVAC is an overhead fan blowing the down onto the cashier and me. No windows or doors are open as far as I can see. This will be my last visit to this place.
This is also where it would've been nice to have more guidance from the CDC, and I'd like to see states and counties step it up both in terms of education and in terms of enforcement.
I imagine a great many of these smaller restaurants are well-intentioned but they don't have the staff and expertise to digest a pile of medical papers and to translate that into a list of concrete steps they can take to protect their employees and customers, and they wouldn't know what's high risk and what small steps they could take (open doors and windows, wear masks, probably turn off the overhead fan, try to move the cashier outdoors or to the entryway). It's also not as easy for them to suddenly have sneeze guards installed.
In some instances, I see counties and states taking leadership to help businesses be safer, but I'd like to see a lot more. I imagine the disparities are even greater in manufacturing and food processing.
RE: Mark Cuban's study of re-opening safety compliance - burger - 05-08-2020
(05-08-2020, 04:37 PM)Snorlax94 Wrote: Generally, I've found larger, well-financed companies implementing smarter guidelines. Costco offers senior hours, they require masks, they reduce the # of people indoors, they have people inside constantly telling people to space and how to space (even educating some people to be less clueless and oblivious), they increase cleaning times, they provide sneeze guards for cashiers and receipt inspectors, and they wipe down carts.
Similarly, at my local Panda Express, I can order and pay online. No customers go inside, they've shifted a POS system outside to take orders (for anyone who didn't order online) and they've moved the actual pick up of food to the opposite end of the building, near the exit, also outdoors. No customers can enter the building. Everyone is wearing masks.
Then I go to my local pizza joint (with 3 locations). No one is wearing a mask. I can order by phone, but I have to pay when I get there. To get my pizza, I've got to wait in the lobby for 10 minutes. The cashier isn't wearing gloves. The pizza makers are in close proximity to each other because the kitchen is like a narrow hallway. The only HVAC is an overhead fan blowing the down onto the cashier and me. No windows or doors are open as far as I can see. This will be my last visit to this place.
This is also where it would've been nice to have more guidance from the CDC, and I'd like to see states and counties step it up both in terms of education and in terms of enforcement.
I imagine a great many of these smaller restaurants are well-intentioned but they don't have the staff and expertise to digest a pile of medical papers and to translate that into a list of concrete steps they can take to protect their employees and customers, and they wouldn't know what's high risk and what small steps they could take (open doors and windows, wear masks, probably turn off the overhead fan, try to move the cashier outdoors or to the entryway). It's also not as easy for them to suddenly have sneeze guards installed.
In some instances, I see counties and states taking leadership to help businesses be safer, but I'd like to see a lot more. I imagine the disparities are even greater in manufacturing and food processing.
Some big companies like Costco and Trader Joe's are doing a good job. Some big companies are not--I haven't been lately, but I hear that Lowe's is awful. Our small, local nursery nearby is doing a good job. So it's not just a big vs. small company thing.
Once things open up in CA, I'd love to see a study like Cuban's done by the state government, with the results made public. Companies that are risking the health of their employees should be publicly shamed. And people should be able to see which companies are doing a good or bad job. I'd much rather spend my money at a store that is looking after its employees than one that doesn't give a crap about their health. If there was a list of companies not following good practices, I would stop shopping there immediately. We've sworn off Amazon until they start treating their employees better (we were infrequent Amazon users anyway, so no big deal). I wish there was a scorecard so I could know that we're not risking anyone employees' health more than necessary when we do takeout, etc.
RE: Mark Cuban's study of re-opening safety compliance - 82 Card - 05-08-2020
(05-08-2020, 10:54 AM)OutsiderFan Wrote: I just talked with a friend outside St. Louis today. He told me it's shocking how many people don't take the virus seriously. Most of the them have been strung up on propaganda, saying it's a hoax, that the government is trying to take our freedoms away, etc.
The report I got from outside St. Louis is that almost no one is wearing masks and that most of the businesses can't be bothered to enforce the rules. This includes major brands like Target and Lowe's. The managers could not be bothered to make their own employees wear masks correctly or to ask customers to wear masks. Only one grocery store was taking things seriously with strict enforcement of masks and spacing all the way around, hand washing at portable station before entering the store, etc. If you have a store in your area that is doing their best to do it right, you should try to bring your business there.
RE: Mark Cuban's study of re-opening safety compliance - oldalum - 05-08-2020
(05-08-2020, 12:17 PM)BostonCard Wrote: Some of them just stretch the rules (for example, up-coding diagnoses to get better reimbursement)I think you're being too kind. Definition of fraud is: "wrongful or criminal deception intended to result in financial or personal gain. ""Upcoding" services or diagnoses means falsifying the service or diagnosis billed in exchange for more money. Which is particularly clear when false information is entered into the medical record to justify it. Just because it is done under the genteel banner of medicine doesn't prevent it from being fraud. (to be clear, I'm not talking about choosing between two legitimate codes or diagnoses and picking the higher-reimbursed one.)
RE: Mark Cuban's study of re-opening safety compliance - stupac2 - 05-08-2020
(05-08-2020, 04:37 PM)Snorlax94 Wrote: First, hats off to Mark Cuban. Many tycoons are just hiding, or trying to sway and misinform for their financial gain. Nice to see Cuban researching, then sharing information even if it may be detrimental to the Dallas Mavericks playing soon.
Second, this finding doesn't surprise me at all: it's exactly what I've been seeing.
Generally, I've found larger, well-financed companies implementing smarter guidelines. Costco offers senior hours, they require masks, they reduce the # of people indoors, they have people inside constantly telling people to space and how to space (even educating some people to be less clueless and oblivious), they increase cleaning times, they provide sneeze guards for cashiers and receipt inspectors, and they wipe down carts.
Similarly, at my local Panda Express, I can order and pay online. No customers go inside, they've shifted a POS system outside to take orders (for anyone who didn't order online) and they've moved the actual pick up of food to the opposite end of the building, near the exit, also outdoors. No customers can enter the building. Everyone is wearing masks.
Then I go to my local pizza joint (with 3 locations). No one is wearing a mask. I can order by phone, but I have to pay when I get there. To get my pizza, I've got to wait in the lobby for 10 minutes. The cashier isn't wearing gloves. The pizza makers are in close proximity to each other because the kitchen is like a narrow hallway. The only HVAC is an overhead fan blowing the down onto the cashier and me. No windows or doors are open as far as I can see. This will be my last visit to this place.
This is also where it would've been nice to have more guidance from the CDC, and I'd like to see states and counties step it up both in terms of education and in terms of enforcement.
I imagine a great many of these smaller restaurants are well-intentioned but they don't have the staff and expertise to digest a pile of medical papers and to translate that into a list of concrete steps they can take to protect their employees and customers, and they wouldn't know what's high risk and what small steps they could take (open doors and windows, wear masks, probably turn off the overhead fan, try to move the cashier outdoors or to the entryway). It's also not as easy for them to suddenly have sneeze guards installed.
In some instances, I see counties and states taking leadership to help businesses be safer, but I'd like to see a lot more. I imagine the disparities are even greater in manufacturing and food processing.
I've seen pretty much universal attempts at implementing good practices here, with the obvious caveat that I haven't been out much. There's a spectrum for sure, and I'm pretty disappointed in my most-local grocery store (to the point where we just order from Whole Foods), but even they have had employees in masks and put up plexiglass. There's a different grocery store up a big hill has a fantastic plan that they're implementing well, I wish they were less annoying for me to get to. As it is we're mostly just ordering from WF now that that's easy.
RE: Mark Cuban's study of re-opening safety compliance - Hurlburt88 - 05-09-2020
I am seeing pretty good practices in the Twin Cities of Minnesota, but up North there are a bunch of bars that are quietly staying open and are unfortunately full. Several cases in our neighborhood now including the nurse across the street and her daughter . . . so getting more real by the day.
RE: Mark Cuban's study of re-opening safety compliance - 2006alum - 05-09-2020
This may have been posted previously since the original draft was posted in late March, but there's an interesting paper by two Fed Reserve Board members and an MIT SOM professor, Pandemics Depress the Economy, Public Health Interventions Do Not: Evidence from the 1918 Flu, that finds that after the 1918 pandemic, the cities that had intervened earlier and more aggressively with non-pharmaceutical interventions like sheltering in place and closing businesses rebounded economically no worse than did those that were less aggressive with their NPIs. And if anything, it seems that the cities with more aggressive NPIs rebounded better economically in the year after.
Yet more evidence that the lives vs. economy dichotomy some keep trying to push is false.
RE: Mark Cuban's study of re-opening safety compliance - fullmetal - 05-09-2020
Cuban is on top of this because he owns a basketball franchise in a league that is also on top of this (and the sooner the league reopens, the sooner Cuban's franchise can go back to making money).
Cynicism aside, I think it'd be great for him to take a more visible leadership role in promoting the public health response, especially in light of these grassroots hoaxsters and grifters whose material has suddenly flooded my social media platforms.
The DFW metro area is not entirely concerned with this pandemic if the number of visible, undistanced social gatherings is any indicator. Many of the deaths have been in nursing homes, and the number of covid cases is not (yet) stressing the hospital system. DFW might be lucky, or by the small world paradigm, it might be set up as an infertile place for the virus to spread.
In any case, Gov. Abbott has decreed that sheltering recommendations statewide be lifted subject to distancing and reduced customer occupation, and apparently life is slowly heading back to normal now.
I posted a recent (within the last week) news story in the other thread about the South Korean man who visited three nightclubs last weekend in Seoul. There are now 27 confirmed cases of transmission from that man, and authorities are scrambling to trace contacts for 1500+ more nightclub visitors. Much of the identity contact information collected by the nightclubs (collected by order for contact tracing) has proven inaccurate. I can only imagine how terrible a similar situation would be in the US.
RE: Mark Cuban's study of re-opening safety compliance - Farm93 - 05-09-2020
(05-08-2020, 05:08 PM)burger Wrote: I wish there was a scorecard so I could know that we're not risking anyone employees' health more than necessary when we do takeout, etc.
Some areas have those letter grades for restaurants. I wouldn't mind seeing those for every service related business.
No need to give everyone "A" grades here. If a company has employees OR customers without masks, then ding them. If checkout lines too close or without worker protections, then ding them.
Importantly, if a business is open that shouldn't be opened. Given them a nice "F" placard and give them a court date too. A local town could elect to stay open, but the "F" placard would be theirs to post for at least the next 12 months. That might hurt business once those in compliance open up and get "A" or "B" placards.
RE: Mark Cuban's study of re-opening safety compliance - Snorlax94 - 05-09-2020
(05-09-2020, 11:54 AM)fullmetal Wrote: I posted a recent (within the last week) news story in the other thread about the South Korean man who visited three nightclubs last weekend in Seoul. There are now 27 confirmed cases of transmission from that man, and authorities are scrambling to trace contacts for 1500+ more nightclub visitors. Much of the identity contact information collected by the nightclubs (collected by order for contact tracing) has proven inaccurate. I can only imagine how terrible a similar situation would be in the US.The situation with the Korean nightclubs is exacerbated by the fact that they were gay clubs. While not legally discriminated against, there are additional privacy concerns about “outing” people, and this may have also contributed to people using false contact information. Fears of discrimination can hamper contact tracing.
Despite that, last I saw they had contacted almost half of all potential contacts. It’ll be interesting to see if, with incredibly easy-to-access testing, everyone who was at those clubs will seek out testing and self-quarantine until then. If they can contain this flare-up, it also gives more hope to countries watching, as this was close to a worst-case scenario.
The fact that one person went to 3 clubs in one weekend and exposed so many people also makes me wish there was some way we could limit the amount people go out, but I feel frustrated thinking how impossible it’d be to implement anywhere and moreso in the US. Maybe we can get to the point where people can dine outside a few times a week, but if the same people dine in lunch, then go shopping, then dine in dinner, then watch a movie, then go to the gym every day, they are not only more likely to get infected, they are more likely to spread it to many people, like the patient 1 in Italy, who was an “incredibly” active and social person. Just another reason to avoid “touristy” spots for the next year or so.