Politics Covid and this Board - Printable Version
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Politics Covid and this Board - lex24 - 06-22-2020
I am all for the concept of having no politics on this board. I come here generally to escape. But I’m gonna be honest here – I think the no politics rule is unevenly applied By my reading people can say things that are political as long as they are considered to take a progressive slant. They can’t go too far with it but they can make some comments and they get by with it. As soon as somebody tries to suggest (and I’ve seen it done rarely on this board - and always respectfully) that there may be other opinions worthy of at least expressing and thinking about (gosh imagine that) or even that things may be slightly more nuanced then the progressive take, it gets shut down.
So I’m asking this - if you’re going to shut things down for politics do it immediately. As soon as somebody brings up a political statement of any stipe shut it down. Otherwise allow it if it’s respectful.
RE: Politics Covid and this Board - 2006alum - 06-22-2020
Speaking only for myself, I tend to respond primarily to invitations from users. If I'm the first one to think things are veering off track, I will usually post a reminder in the relevant thread. In the case of the one I closed earlier today, multiple users flagged it.
And remember: no one is being warned or banned - the thread is just being shut down.
But when we start talking about White Supremacy and how many KKK members there are in the U.S., we definitely, definitely have veered off track from anything plausibly related to COVID-19....
RE: Politics Covid and this Board - lex24 - 06-22-2020
(06-22-2020, 06:09 PM)2006alum Wrote: Speaking only for myself, I tend to respond primarily to invitations from users. If I'm the first one to think things are veering off track, I will usually post a reminder in the relevant thread. In the case of the one I closed earlier today, multiple users flagged it.
And remember: no one is being warned or banned - the thread is just being shut down.
But when we start talking about White Supremacy and how many KKK members there are in the U.S., we definitely, definitely have veered off track from anything plausibly related to COVID-19....
I appreciate that’s its difficult.
RE: Politics Covid and this Board - 76lsjumb - 06-22-2020
(06-22-2020, 06:23 PM)lex24 Wrote:(06-22-2020, 06:09 PM)2006alum Wrote: Speaking only for myself, I tend to respond primarily to invitations from users. If I'm the first one to think things are veering off track, I will usually post a reminder in the relevant thread. In the case of the one I closed earlier today, multiple users flagged it.
And remember: no one is being warned or banned - the thread is just being shut down.
But when we start talking about White Supremacy and how many KKK members there are in the U.S., we definitely, definitely have veered off track from anything plausibly related to COVID-19....
I appreciate that’s its difficult.
Actually, I'm not sure it's all that difficult. Blaming Trump for every bad thing that has ever happened, is happening, or will happen relating to the pandemic isn't political, it's ... science! Conversely, suggesting that some cause other than Trump might possibly factor into any bad thing that has happened, is happening, or will happen Relating to the pandemic is simply political, and manifestly anti-scientific.
Seems pretty clear...
(Sorry... I left out a few words in the original post. Now it relates to COVID-19...)
RE: Politics Covid and this Board - chrisk - 06-22-2020
(06-22-2020, 11:21 PM)76lsjumb Wrote:(06-22-2020, 06:23 PM)lex24 Wrote:(06-22-2020, 06:09 PM)2006alum Wrote: Speaking only for myself, I tend to respond primarily to invitations from users. If I'm the first one to think things are veering off track, I will usually post a reminder in the relevant thread. In the case of the one I closed earlier today, multiple users flagged it.
And remember: no one is being warned or banned - the thread is just being shut down.
But when we start talking about White Supremacy and how many KKK members there are in the U.S., we definitely, definitely have veered off track from anything plausibly related to COVID-19....
I appreciate that’s its difficult.
Actually, I'm not sure it's all that difficult. Blaming Trump for every bad thing that has ever happened, is happening, or will happen isn't political, it's ... science! Conversely, suggesting that some cause other than Trump might possibly factor into any bad thing that has happened, is happening, or will happen is simply political, and manifestly anti-scientific.
Seems pretty clear...
The problem is that Trump has "politicized" aspects of his job that traditionally have called for appeals for bipartisanship. That has been absent recently.
RE: Politics Covid and this Board - BostonCard - 06-22-2020
(06-22-2020, 11:39 PM)chrisk Wrote: The problem is that Trump has "politicized" aspects of his job that traditionally have called for appeals for bipartisanship. That has been absent recently.
This (and the message before it) might be a good example of a thread turning political. It's easy for all of us to get sucked into the back and forth, so I am not trying to pick on these particular posts, but they are about Trump and not COVID-19.
The hardest ones to moderate are the ones at the intersection of Trump and COVID-19. It seems hard to evaluate the performance of the government's response to COVID-19 without (especially if it is negative), without referring to the person on whose desk the buck is ostensibly supposed to stop.
BC
RE: Politics Covid and this Board - 76lsjumb - 06-23-2020
(06-22-2020, 11:47 PM)BostonCard Wrote:(06-22-2020, 11:39 PM)chrisk Wrote: The problem is that Trump has "politicized" aspects of his job that traditionally have called for appeals for bipartisanship. That has been absent recently.
This (and the message before it) might be a good example of a thread turning political. It's easy for all of us to get sucked into the back and forth, so I am not trying to pick on these particular posts, but they are about Trump and not COVID-19.
The hardest ones to moderate are the ones at the intersection of Trump and COVID-19. It seems hard to evaluate the performance of the government's response to COVID-19 without (especially if it is negative), without referring to the person on whose desk the buck is ostensibly supposed to stop.
BC
Fixed it...
RE: Politics Covid and this Board - OutsiderFan - 06-23-2020
Ian Bremmer's conclusion holds a lot of water.
Countries that made Covid-19 a political game are failing miserably. Countries that didn't inject politics are doing fantastic.
My 10,000,000 post didn't even touch on politics. It was simply a question about how people feel about the virus and how it impacts us and our perspective on things. Yet, somehow I'm reading "KKK" and "Hispanics in the LAPD?" in that thread? WTF? Just shameful that my thread got locked.
I usually would check back in, to keep the thread I created on track somehow, but yesterday was a hectic day that precluded me from doing so. I was just blown away - not in a good way - when I saw last night that the mods closed the thread.
Maybe I'll try again when we've actually hit 10,000,000 cases.
As for this thread topic, the fact of the matter is every f*cking thing in our lives has been politicized by a very small group of people. I won't just blame one, because it takes more than one person to do it. It makes discussion of anything without politics virtually impossible.
RE: Politics Covid and this Board - 2006alum - 06-23-2020
OF, you're welcome to start a new thread, even with the same title, and carry on with the conversation that you had originally sought. But closing a problematic thread keeps people from being tempted to respond with "one last comment" and keep the problematic ball rolling. As you say, KKK etc. was extraneous to the topic you started.
Stepping outside of my mod shoes for a minute, I will confess that I am somewhat surprised to find that thread closures are found to be so troubling - on other boards I'm on with a no-politics rule, the mods are *much* more aggressive than around here, as they not only close threads, but also put the posters on time out if they don't behave. And their definition of "politics" is sometimes much broader than ours. Nevertheless, I fully recognize as a poster that the mods are volunteering their time, that the admins are volunteering both their time and money, and that it is accordingly their forum that I'm invited to contribute to provided I follow their rules. So my view? "There's no crying in (forums about college) baseball."
Stepping back into my mod shoes, all we're asking is to keep things at least vaguely related to COVID-19, and yes, that may inevitably be political. It's when it ceases to be about COVID-19, and becomes only political, that it becomes a problem. And we really don't want to single anyone out with warnings, so we've collectively decided that relative aggression with thread closure is preferable to trying to single out individual posters or play whack-a-mole. If that occasionally requires restarting a new thread, so be it, and you are more than invited to do so where you see fit. :)
Bygones.
RE: Politics Covid and this Board - OutsiderFan - 06-23-2020
(06-23-2020, 07:31 AM)2006alum Wrote: OF, you're welcome to start a new thread, even with the same title, and carry on with the conversation that you had originally sought. But closing a problematic thread keeps people from being tempted to respond with "one last comment" and keep the problematic ball rolling. As you say, KKK etc. was extraneous to the topic you started.
Stepping outside of my mod shoes for a minute, I will confess that I am somewhat surprised to find that thread closures are found to be so troubling - on other boards I'm on with a no-politics rule, the mods are *much* more aggressive than around here, as they not only close threads, but also put the posters on time out if they don't behave. And their definition of "politics" is sometimes much broader than ours. Nevertheless, I fully recognize as a poster that the mods are volunteering their time, that the admins are volunteering both their time and money, and that it is accordingly their forum that I'm invited to contribute to provided I follow their rules. So my view? "There's no crying in (forums about college) baseball."
Stepping back into my mod shoes, all we're asking is to keep things at least vaguely related to COVID-19, and yes, that may inevitably be political. It's when it ceases to be about COVID-19, and becomes only political, that it becomes a problem. And we really don't want to single anyone out with warnings, so we've collectively decided that relative aggression with thread closure is preferable to trying to single out individual posters or play whack-a-mole. If that occasionally requires restarting a new thread, so be it, and you are more than invited to do so where you see fit. :)
Bygones.
To be clear, 2006, I'm not against locking threads. Just completely dismayed that particular one was. Thanks for welcoming me to try again! :)
lex24 - lex24 - 06-23-2020
(06-23-2020, 07:06 AM)OutsiderFan Wrote: Ian Bremmer's conclusion holds a lot of water.
Countries that made Covid-19 a political game are failing miserably. Countries that didn't inject politics are doing fantastic.
My 10,000,000 post didn't even touch on politics. It was simply a question about how people feel about the virus and how it impacts us and our perspective on things. Yet, somehow I'm reading "KKK" and "Hispanics in the LAPD?" in that thread? WTF? Just shameful that my thread got locked.
I usually would check back in, to keep the thread I created on track somehow, but yesterday was a hectic day that precluded me from doing so. I was just blown away - not in a good way - when I saw last night that the mods closed the thread.
Maybe I'll try again when we've actually hit 10,000,000 cases.
As for this thread topic, the fact of the matter is every f*cking thing in our lives has been politicized by a very small group of people. I won't just blame one, because it takes more than one person to do it. It makes discussion of anything without politics virtually impossible.
Actually the thread turned political when someone injected the possibility of a coup. But thanks for proving my point.
RE: Politics Covid and this Board - ChicagoCard - 06-23-2020
(06-22-2020, 05:58 PM)lex24 Wrote: I am all for the concept of having no politics on this board. I come here generally to escape. But I’m gonna be honest here – I think the no politics rule is unevenly applied By my reading people can say things that are political as long as they are considered to take a progressive slant. They can’t go too far with it but they can make some comments and they get by with it. As soon as somebody tries to suggest (and I’ve seen it done rarely on this board - and always respectfully) that there may be other opinions worthy of at least expressing and thinking about (gosh imagine that) or even that things may be slightly more nuanced then the progressive take, it gets shut down.
So well put and spot on.
RE: Politics Covid and this Board - 2006alum - 06-23-2020
(06-23-2020, 09:21 AM)ChicagoCard Wrote:(06-22-2020, 05:58 PM)lex24 Wrote: I am all for the concept of having no politics on this board. I come here generally to escape. But I’m gonna be honest here – I think the no politics rule is unevenly applied By my reading people can say things that are political as long as they are considered to take a progressive slant. They can’t go too far with it but they can make some comments and they get by with it. As soon as somebody tries to suggest (and I’ve seen it done rarely on this board - and always respectfully) that there may be other opinions worthy of at least expressing and thinking about (gosh imagine that) or even that things may be slightly more nuanced then the progressive take, it gets shut down.
So well put and spot on.
And I will say it again - if you see a thread that you feel is going political and has no ties to COVID-19, please feel free to speak up. We generally don't shut anything down until we get complaints, so if you see something, say something.
From my vantage point, Monday morning quarterbacking about moderation is about as satisfying as it is about football. =P
RE: Politics Covid and this Board - M T - 06-23-2020
(06-22-2020, 11:47 PM)BostonCard Wrote: This (and the message before it) might be a good example of a thread turning political. It's easy for all of us to get sucked into the back and forth, so I am not trying to pick on these particular posts, but they are about Trump and not COVID-19.
A few days ago, I made a post that seemed pretty normal to me. There was someone that replied with a few paragraphs all about an unrelated politicized topic, which IMO had absolutely nothing to do with my post. I started a reply "WTH?" but I decided it wasn't worth it and it just gives the person another chance to reply. In the past I've sent people PMs when I thought they might realize the next morning their post was over the top, but that never worked. Instead I just ignored it. That worked: No one responded and the detour died.
There are one or more posters whose posts have repeatedly made my experience in the COVID board unpleasant. I took the (IMO) drastic step of having their posts not shown to me (User CP > Misc > Buddy/Ignore list). I hate to do that, but my blood pressure dropped and reading the board left me irritated less often.
RE: Politics Covid and this Board - oregontim - 06-23-2020
My thanks to moderators for a good job in a really tough place to draw lines. I believe actual events, the subject matter itself, make it exceptionally hard to separate the political from the rest. When people look back on these times, and particularly 2020 and the pandemic in the US, one of the first things to come out will be how exceptionally political this all became.
RE: Politics Covid and this Board - Farm93 - 06-23-2020
Originally the COVID section was an "Emergency" site apparently. I suspect that emergency designation may no longer be applicable.
At the time lots of disturbing news about COVID was bubbling up from different places and there were events relevant to this board. It was very convenient to come to one area and get updates on events directly impacting Stanford.
Social distancing at Stanford venues
Stanford holding remote finals
The Pac-12 holding Pac-12 hoops without fans
NCAA stopping all sports
Stanford announcing a virtual Spring Quarter
All of those rather unprecedented steps directly impacting Stanford student-athletes happened in a span of 2 weeks. Behind all of them was an emerging pandemic, an emergency. How that pandemic was handled impacted the outlook for all of those Stanford related items and many other things.
I had no idea that POTUS45 would work diligently to imply that those that believe in fighting COVID with PPE, testing and tracing would be seen as enemies of POTUS45 himself. However, as President Trump has laid the groundwork so consistently for 100+ days it now is impossible to talk about COVID mitigation without implying something about POTUS45. Now in the USA every option or choice on COVID is oddly binary with one position clearly pro-Trump and the other anti-Trump.
That's too bad, but hard to imagine COVID will become less politicized as we march closer to November. I would advocate treating COVID as political and banning it. EXCEPT I really expect that in the next 30 days COVID will directly impact NCAA sports for the 2020-2021 academic year making it more relevant to Stanford Athletics than any other item in slow June-July period.
Tough call
RE: Politics Covid and this Board - Genuine Realist - 06-24-2020
(06-23-2020, 11:24 AM)Farm93 Wrote: Originally the COVID section was an "Emergency" site apparently. I suspect that emergency designation may no longer be applicable.I'd be in favor of banning any mention of Trump or his opposition.
At the time lots of disturbing news about COVID was bubbling up from different places and there were events relevant to this board. It was very convenient to come to one area and get updates on events directly impacting Stanford.
Social distancing at Stanford venues
Stanford holding remote finals
The Pac-12 holding Pac-12 hoops without fans
NCAA stopping all sports
Stanford announcing a virtual Spring Quarter
All of those rather unprecedented steps directly impacting Stanford student-athletes happened in a span of 2 weeks. Behind all of them was an emerging pandemic, an emergency. How that pandemic was handled impacted the outlook for all of those Stanford related items and many other things.
I had no idea that POTUS45 would work diligently to imply that those that believe in fighting COVID with PPE, testing and tracing would be seen as enemies of POTUS45 himself. However, as President Trump has laid the groundwork so consistently for 100+ days it now is impossible to talk about COVID mitigation without implying something about POTUS45. Now in the USA every option or choice on COVID is oddly binary with one position clearly pro-Trump and the other anti-Trump.
That's too bad, but hard to imagine COVID will become less politicized as we march closer to November. I would advocate treating COVID as political and banning it. EXCEPT I really expect that in the next 30 days COVID will directly impact NCAA sports for the 2020-2021 academic year making it more relevant to Stanford Athletics than any other item in slow June-July period.
Tough call
This may not be readily apparent, but my consistent viewpoint is that it is way, way too early to write history about these extraordinary times, which means it is way, way too early to make judgments of any kind. I recognize this leads to some absolut5ion - at this time - which is a result some don't like. But I think it is the practical reality, in a time when hard facts are hard to come by and reporting nearly always distorted by passionate partisanship.
Thus, there was a common assumption that he virus originated from China alone in the early months. It's now apparent that some of the clusters in NYC were of European origin.
The lockdown, which I supported and complied with, may have been massive overkill - or not. Maybe the truth is in between - required for a time, while clinical data was gathered, but extended for too long. Or not. Maybe we should have gone to practical social distancing measures much earlier - or not.
Masks were derided for a time, and now are seen to be the best practical method of preventing spread. How transmissable the virus is on covites is still up in the air. The CDC guidelines at present mention it only as a secondary method and use probablistic language. Who knows?
In terms of blame game, who knew what when is still completely up in the air. (The journalisitic accounts are one and all flawed by agendaism - real journalism has disappeared, I hope temporarily) - a good reason not to play it.
I'd like to see the discussion stick to clinical facts and leave invidious judgments to one side.
Reading the Board daily, I am impressed with how lttle