[BostonCard]

Outsider, are you equating Haase following Dawkins to Shaw following Harbaugh? If not, please clarify.

Not really. I'm saying some people are pointing to Tinkle's record - after taking over worst program in conference - to take away from his accomplishments this season. If you are going to do that, then you can't credit David Shaw for what he did after taking over Harbaugh's Stanford program.  

Personally, I think Tinkle's record doesn't reflect his ability, like Kyle Shanahan's doesn't. They are both a little too early to judge. Shaw is a little more difficult to assess because his 2015 and 2017 seasons were 5 and 7 years after Harbaugh, and those were upper echelon performances.

Not to go down rabbit hole, but my belief is David Shaw is a great program leader who is too loyal to coaches and not willing to make himself uncomfortable to enable growth.

First, Haase didn’t exactly inherit a ton from Dawkins.  There were some decent players, but he didn’t inherit a NCAA tournament team in waiting, so the comparison is not that off base.

Second, how many years does Shaw have to win before Harbaugh stops getting credit for what he left behind.  It’s been 11 years people, and even after an entire roster turnover from what Harbaugh left, Shaw went to three bowl games in four years (and this year had a winning record but declined a bowl). Is Shaw going to get us to three Rose bowls in five years again?  Probably not. But at this point, it should be clear that he can win without inherited players from Harbaugh.  At some point this trope is over-played.

BC

[BostonCard]

Outsider, are you equating Haase following Dawkins to Shaw following Harbaugh? If not, please clarify.

Not really. I'm saying some people are pointing to Tinkle's record - after taking over worst program in conference - to take away from his accomplishments this season. If you are going to do that, then you can't credit David Shaw for what he did after taking over Harbaugh's Stanford program.  

Personally, I think Tinkle's record doesn't reflect his ability, like Kyle Shanahan's doesn't. They are both a little too early to judge. Shaw is a little more difficult to assess because his 2015 and 2017 seasons were 5 and 7 years after Harbaugh, and those were upper echelon performances.

Not to go down rabbit hole, but my belief is David Shaw is a great program leader who is too loyal to coaches and not willing to make himself uncomfortable to enable growth.

First, Haase didn’t exactly inherit a ton from Dawkins.  There were some decent players, but he didn’t inherit a NCAA tournament team in waiting, so the comparison is not that off base.

Second, how many years does Shaw have to win before Harbaugh stops getting credit for what he left behind.  It’s been 11 years people, and even after an entire roster turnover from what Harbaugh left, Shaw went to three bowl games in four years (and this year had a winning record but declined a bowl). Is Shaw going to get us to three Rose bowls in five years again?  Probably not. But at this point, it should be clear that he can win without inherited players from Harbaugh.  At some point this trope is over-played.

BC