05-14-2018, 09:18 AM
http://results.golfstat.com/public/leade...&tid=15140
The low five teams advance to the championships.
The low five teams advance to the championships.
NCAA Men's Golf Regional
05-14-2018, 11:43 AM
Hulk, your comment on the women's regional that sometimes a lesser team gets hot and has a great 9 holes before falling back to the pack may prove apt on the men's side today. Unranked Iowa State isn't quite done with its first 9 holes of the Pacific Regional in Stockton, and is -12 so far. Interested to see how they play going forward.
(Oh, and Stanford is currently tied for second with Alabama at -3.)
(Oh, and Stanford is currently tied for second with Alabama at -3.)
05-14-2018, 01:44 PM
(05-14-2018, 11:43 AM)ColoradoTree Wrote: Hulk, your comment on the women's regional that sometimes a lesser team gets hot and has a great 9 holes before falling back to the pack may prove apt on the men's side today. Unranked Iowa State isn't quite done with its first 9 holes of the Pacific Regional in Stockton, and is -12 so far. Interested to see how they play going forward.
(Oh, and Stanford is currently tied for second with Alabama at -3.)
The golf team rankings are off. Iowa State finished fourth in a terrific Big 12. Right now, four Big 12 teams lead their regional, two are in second place, and a seventh team is in fourth. Iowa State isn't likely to come back to the field.
The results seem close to form today. LSU and Cal are the only conspicuous losers on the day, but there are over 140 holes left.
05-14-2018, 02:05 PM
(05-14-2018, 01:44 PM)Hulk01 Wrote:(05-14-2018, 11:43 AM)ColoradoTree Wrote: Hulk, your comment on the women's regional that sometimes a lesser team gets hot and has a great 9 holes before falling back to the pack may prove apt on the men's side today. Unranked Iowa State isn't quite done with its first 9 holes of the Pacific Regional in Stockton, and is -12 so far. Interested to see how they play going forward.
(Oh, and Stanford is currently tied for second with Alabama at -3.)
The golf team rankings are off. Iowa State finished fourth in a terrific Big 12. Right now, four Big 12 teams lead their regional, two are in second place, and a seventh team is in fourth. Iowa State isn't likely to come back to the field.
The results seem close to form today. LSU and Cal are the only conspicuous losers on the day, but there are over 140 holes left.
How can the rankings miss the quality of a team by so much? (Honest question--I know zero about golf rankings.)
so we end the day in 5th, two shots behind #4 TCU and four shots ahead of #6 Oregon
Eric
"the older we get the better we were"
05-14-2018, 03:44 PM
GolfStat compiles the rankings that the NCAA uses to seed these events.
They're as reliable as these kind of systems can be, but this particular case of Iowa State seems odd. I checked their schedule and they play in a lot of weak events. So their sample of matches against good teams may be so small that just a couple poor performances could destroy their ranking.
The one very good event in which they played was the Big 12 championship leading into this event. They finished fourth, ahead of Baylor and Kansas (each is second in its regional) and TCU (4th in its regional). And it finished not far behind Oklahoma State, Texas, and Oklahoma, all of whom are leading their regionals after round one. So I don't assume they're weaker than at least 50 teams playing this week. And I don't assume we're the better team and are likely to beat them.
They're as reliable as these kind of systems can be, but this particular case of Iowa State seems odd. I checked their schedule and they play in a lot of weak events. So their sample of matches against good teams may be so small that just a couple poor performances could destroy their ranking.
The one very good event in which they played was the Big 12 championship leading into this event. They finished fourth, ahead of Baylor and Kansas (each is second in its regional) and TCU (4th in its regional). And it finished not far behind Oklahoma State, Texas, and Oklahoma, all of whom are leading their regionals after round one. So I don't assume they're weaker than at least 50 teams playing this week. And I don't assume we're the better team and are likely to beat them.
05-14-2018, 03:49 PM
(This post was last modified: 05-14-2018, 03:50 PM by Spiny_Norman.)
Spanos Park is playing easier compared to some others among the 6 regional courses through 1 round. Average strokes above par:
Raleigh - 0.43
Kississimme - 0.65
Stockton (Spanos Park) - 0.83
College Station - 2.29
Norman - 2.96
Columbus - 4.39
The course is giving up good scores so you still could see a lot of movement from a team like LSU which has 5 players who can go low. Stockton is probably the most competitive regional with perhaps 8 teams capable of claiming the 5 spots.
Stanford got strong play today from Wu (-5, tied for the overall lead) and Swegle (-2). They have been the steadiest, best players for Stanford all year. They need better help from the other 3, especially Huang. He is a senior and this is his 4th time in the regionals. He won the regionals as a sophomore so he is capable.
Raleigh - 0.43
Kississimme - 0.65
Stockton (Spanos Park) - 0.83
College Station - 2.29
Norman - 2.96
Columbus - 4.39
The course is giving up good scores so you still could see a lot of movement from a team like LSU which has 5 players who can go low. Stockton is probably the most competitive regional with perhaps 8 teams capable of claiming the 5 spots.
Stanford got strong play today from Wu (-5, tied for the overall lead) and Swegle (-2). They have been the steadiest, best players for Stanford all year. They need better help from the other 3, especially Huang. He is a senior and this is his 4th time in the regionals. He won the regionals as a sophomore so he is capable.
"We have an unwritten rule around here not to do anything stupid."
-Casey Jacobsen, Feb 3, 2000
05-15-2018, 04:44 AM
the scouting report was a birdie fest at Spanos if the wind laid down. it looks like a PubLinks type track on-line.
05-15-2018, 05:02 AM
(05-15-2018, 04:44 AM)slide Wrote: the scouting report was a birdie fest at Spanos if the wind laid down. it looks like a PubLinks type track on-line.
Coach Ray damned the course with faint praise in describing it for the preview. Said scores could go very low unless the wind comes up. Translate: Not a challenging course.
(05-15-2018, 05:02 AM)Hulk01 Wrote:(05-15-2018, 04:44 AM)slide Wrote: the scouting report was a birdie fest at Spanos if the wind laid down. it looks like a PubLinks type track on-line.
Coach Ray damned the course with faint praise in describing it for the preview. Said scores could go very low unless the wind comes up. Translate: Not a challenging course.
Argh. Rather than incurring the wrath of the woofing gods, let's let our play speak for us. We're currently one shot from being on the wrong side of the cut line, and one over for the day, so I'm not sure we're in the position to be calling the course easy...
Coach Ray damned the course with faint praise in describing it for the preview. Said scores could go very low unless the wind comes up. Translate: Not a challenging course.
[/quote]
Argh. Rather than incurring the wrath of the woofing gods, let's let our play speak for us. We're currently one shot from being on the wrong side of the cut line, and one over for the day, so I'm not sure we're in the position to be calling the course easy...
[/quote]
I'm not confident our play will speak for itself, easy course or not. We've been a game team this year, but we're just not very talented--maybe our least talented team since Conrad arrived.
Watch for LSU. And Oregon, especially if Xiong starts one of his runs.
[/quote]
Argh. Rather than incurring the wrath of the woofing gods, let's let our play speak for us. We're currently one shot from being on the wrong side of the cut line, and one over for the day, so I'm not sure we're in the position to be calling the course easy...
[/quote]
I'm not confident our play will speak for itself, easy course or not. We've been a game team this year, but we're just not very talented--maybe our least talented team since Conrad arrived.
Watch for LSU. And Oregon, especially if Xiong starts one of his runs.
05-15-2018, 11:17 AM
on the front side now. looks like 17 is the hole with serious teeth at Spanos. Swegle tripled it. I hope the team heats up on the front side.
05-15-2018, 11:47 AM
17 is a long par 4 with a lake running the length of the hole on the right. Anyone making par on that hole is gaining at least half a shot on the field.
Remember that scores we see online are unofficial until the round is over. Some of the scores may be in error, but won't get corrected until scorecards are signed and submitted for official posting.
Brandon Wu is leading the tournament and carrying Stanford right now. He needs help from his teammates.
Hulk, Stanford seems to have dropped a bit the last few years, masked by the ascendance of Maverick McNealy. This coincides with Philip Rowe leaving for UNLV which advanced to match play last year and is likely to be in the hunt again this year. Do you think this is just coincidental?
Remember that scores we see online are unofficial until the round is over. Some of the scores may be in error, but won't get corrected until scorecards are signed and submitted for official posting.
Brandon Wu is leading the tournament and carrying Stanford right now. He needs help from his teammates.
Hulk, Stanford seems to have dropped a bit the last few years, masked by the ascendance of Maverick McNealy. This coincides with Philip Rowe leaving for UNLV which advanced to match play last year and is likely to be in the hunt again this year. Do you think this is just coincidental?
"We have an unwritten rule around here not to do anything stupid."
-Casey Jacobsen, Feb 3, 2000
05-15-2018, 11:57 AM
Our issue isn't with how well the players on this year are coached, but how talented they were to begin with.
We haven't recruited a mega class since Maverick's. And MM was not the expected star of that class; Jim Liu and Virat Badhwar, consider two of the top five junior players in the world, were. Mav flourished, of course, but Liu gave up the sport not long after he arrived at Stanford, and Badhwar didn't improve.
Since then, the only big star we've recruited is Karl Vilips. And he doesn't arrive until 2020.
The contrast with the women's team is startling. We have former elite recruits Andrea Lee, Albane Valenzuela and Mika Liu on board, and #1 Rachel Heck committed for 2020.
Is Stanford more appealing to elite female players than elite males? Maybe slide has an expert opinion?
We haven't recruited a mega class since Maverick's. And MM was not the expected star of that class; Jim Liu and Virat Badhwar, consider two of the top five junior players in the world, were. Mav flourished, of course, but Liu gave up the sport not long after he arrived at Stanford, and Badhwar didn't improve.
Since then, the only big star we've recruited is Karl Vilips. And he doesn't arrive until 2020.
The contrast with the women's team is startling. We have former elite recruits Andrea Lee, Albane Valenzuela and Mika Liu on board, and #1 Rachel Heck committed for 2020.
Is Stanford more appealing to elite female players than elite males? Maybe slide has an expert opinion?
05-15-2018, 12:15 PM
Cardinal now in 5th at -8, and five strokes ahead of Oregon.
Geaux Cardinal!
Geaux Cardinal!
05-15-2018, 12:22 PM
(05-15-2018, 12:15 PM)BigEasyCard Wrote: Cardinal now in 5th at -8, and five strokes ahead of Oregon.
Geaux Cardinal!
Make that 4th and -10 now! Two strokes back of 3rd-place Iowa State, two ahead of TCU in 5th, and now seven ahead of Oregon. We're now closer to the lead (Alabama at -15) than we are to the wrong side of the cutline.
Following this regional is way less stressful than the women's regional, probably because my expectations for the men's team are a bit lower than for the women's team, so I can just sit back and enjoy their success.
Wu is now at -11 for the tournament, and has a 3-shot lead.
05-15-2018, 12:31 PM
imo, Coaches Ray and Jamison work recruiting just as hard as Coaches Ray and Rowe did (and may be a tad smarter given experience level and reputation). I think Ray has been able to attract top tier talent throughout his time as head coach, but team wise success often depends a little on identifying and developing guys as he did with Maverick or a Dodge Kemmer. then have grinders in between. Ray's pool to recruit is much much smaller than say Bratton at Oklahoma State. Bratton won't have academic hurdles to worry about and he has the Karsten Creek showcase. Stanford GC just doesn't compare (practice facilities are more comparable).
from the little I know, future at top looks bright on recruiting front.
on comparison with women's golf, I think the top talent pool for Ray is smaller than for Walker. may be similar to the difference in top talent pool (academics and athletics) as it is for Vanderveer and Haase.
Rowe is doing well at UNLV. I caught up with him last fall.
from the little I know, future at top looks bright on recruiting front.
on comparison with women's golf, I think the top talent pool for Ray is smaller than for Walker. may be similar to the difference in top talent pool (academics and athletics) as it is for Vanderveer and Haase.
Rowe is doing well at UNLV. I caught up with him last fall.
05-15-2018, 12:48 PM
I wasn't implying that Conrad doesn't recruit hard, or well enough.
Sounds like we have two good guys coming in, but they sound like solid third or fourth types. Perhaps not.
Oklahoma State has tradition (Bob Tway, Rickie Fowler) and a course (Karsten Creek) that's a great draw and shows well, as Slide points out. But while I like its designer Tom Fazio personally, I don't appreciate his courses other than as lovely photo opportunities.
Then again, very few college teams have excellent courses that boast the school's recruiting draw. Yale's is highly regarded and Stanford's is among the best, and I like Eugene CC (Ducks) and hear good things by Ohio State's course.
And does UCLA practice out of Riviera? Slide?
And maybe Slide has some information on the work on the Stanford course. Is it a mere tweaking and cleaning up, or are they making bigger changes that may make it better? I liked it, but my sign of a good course is one that I can play once and remember at least two holes. Stanford's doesn't pass that test.
Sounds like we have two good guys coming in, but they sound like solid third or fourth types. Perhaps not.
Oklahoma State has tradition (Bob Tway, Rickie Fowler) and a course (Karsten Creek) that's a great draw and shows well, as Slide points out. But while I like its designer Tom Fazio personally, I don't appreciate his courses other than as lovely photo opportunities.
Then again, very few college teams have excellent courses that boast the school's recruiting draw. Yale's is highly regarded and Stanford's is among the best, and I like Eugene CC (Ducks) and hear good things by Ohio State's course.
And does UCLA practice out of Riviera? Slide?
And maybe Slide has some information on the work on the Stanford course. Is it a mere tweaking and cleaning up, or are they making bigger changes that may make it better? I liked it, but my sign of a good course is one that I can play once and remember at least two holes. Stanford's doesn't pass that test.
05-15-2018, 01:20 PM
on college courses, Karsten and Scarlet Course at tOSU would be up at the top imo. Karsten from the back just presents a difficult test. it slopes at 152 (Stanford from the back may be 130 or 132).
Stanford was great in its day, but changes to 3, 4 and 5 have taken the course down a notch or two and then technology has made it a shortish course. it still has some great holes -- I like 6, 12 and 18. 12 from the very back may be one of the hardest par-4s I've ever played. still an asset but in a facility race the practice facility will be a bigger sell (and it is a very nice one).
on current work, bunkers and may be some greens being reworked but I've not really asked about details.
Stanford could build a great new course on the clubhouse side of the road. given demands for golf in the area, I am sure it would be a money maker and a better recruiting asset for the school.
on some of the other questions. I recall UCLA having access at Bel-Air and Brentwood; USC more at Riviera and LACC. memory is dim though.
on other campus course, Yale (nice old school course; 9 green is a great piece of work), UGA has a good course and Williams is under-rated as well.
Stanford was great in its day, but changes to 3, 4 and 5 have taken the course down a notch or two and then technology has made it a shortish course. it still has some great holes -- I like 6, 12 and 18. 12 from the very back may be one of the hardest par-4s I've ever played. still an asset but in a facility race the practice facility will be a bigger sell (and it is a very nice one).
on current work, bunkers and may be some greens being reworked but I've not really asked about details.
Stanford could build a great new course on the clubhouse side of the road. given demands for golf in the area, I am sure it would be a money maker and a better recruiting asset for the school.
on some of the other questions. I recall UCLA having access at Bel-Air and Brentwood; USC more at Riviera and LACC. memory is dim though.
on other campus course, Yale (nice old school course; 9 green is a great piece of work), UGA has a good course and Williams is under-rated as well.
Coach Ray has a national championship, and a run of three straight Pac-12 championships from 2014-2016, which was previously unprecedented in program history. Although we have finished 20th or below at the NCAA Championships since a semifinal appearance in 2014, the team has advanced from regionals in four consecutive years, and is in solid position to make it five in a row. Perhaps recruiting has been more challenging, but that is still a great run of success, both recently and overall, particularly when we didn't place better than 10th in regionals in 8 consecutive years from 1997-2004, prior to Coach Ray's arrival.
Also, we have won a national title more recently than Oklahoma State, so it is not like Ok State has been cleaning up national titles recently, despite their obvious program history (which we also have too).
Also, we have won a national title more recently than Oklahoma State, so it is not like Ok State has been cleaning up national titles recently, despite their obvious program history (which we also have too).
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