[washingtonismoney]

Take a gander at Shaw's and Ed McCaffrey's quotes in this article: http://mmqb.si.com/mmqb/2015/12/14/andy-...eek-14-nfl

[washingtonismoney]

Take a gander at Shaw's and Ed McCaffrey's quotes in this article: http://mmqb.si.com/mmqb/2015/12/14/andy-...eek-14-nfl

[washingtonismoney]

On a separate subject, here's Shaw on the NFL:

I think you can probably scratch highly respected Stanford coach David Shaw off the short list of NFL head-coaching candidates in the next month. As he told me Saturday at the Voldemort festivities: “I know a lot of guys in the NFL. I know guys at almost every franchise in the NFL, and I can tell you, even the ones who are winning, nobody is having as much fun at his job as I am having at my job.” The NFL’s committee on head-coaching prospects, which has its next meeting Wednesday, will still put Shaw on the list, but will inform inquiring teams (and not every team with an opening seeks advice from this NFL committee of head-coaching authorities, which includes Bill Polian and Tony Dungy) that Shaw is very unlikely to leave Stanford.

[washingtonismoney]

On a separate subject, here's Shaw on the NFL:

I think you can probably scratch highly respected Stanford coach David Shaw off the short list of NFL head-coaching candidates in the next month. As he told me Saturday at the Voldemort festivities: “I know a lot of guys in the NFL. I know guys at almost every franchise in the NFL, and I can tell you, even the ones who are winning, nobody is having as much fun at his job as I am having at my job.” The NFL’s committee on head-coaching prospects, which has its next meeting Wednesday, will still put Shaw on the list, but will inform inquiring teams (and not every team with an opening seeks advice from this NFL committee of head-coaching authorities, which includes Bill Polian and Tony Dungy) that Shaw is very unlikely to leave Stanford.

[Rally]

Take a gander at Shaw's and Ed McCaffrey's quotes in this article: http://mmqb.si.com/mmqb/2015/12/14/andy-...eek-14-nfl

Selfishly, I vote with Shaw.

[Rally]

Take a gander at Shaw's and Ed McCaffrey's quotes in this article: http://mmqb.si.com/mmqb/2015/12/14/andy-...eek-14-nfl

Selfishly, I vote with Shaw.

[dabigv13]

Sounds like CMAC is gone after next year....hard to be surprised about that

[dabigv13]

Sounds like CMAC is gone after next year....hard to be surprised about that

[terry]

Sounds like CMAC is gone after next year....hard to be surprised about that

Not sure I would draw that conclusion from those comments.

[terry]

Sounds like CMAC is gone after next year....hard to be surprised about that

Not sure I would draw that conclusion from those comments.

[stupac2]

[quote author=dabigv link=topic=14056.msg148103#msg148103 date=1450111947]
Sounds like CMAC is gone after next year....hard to be surprised about that

Not sure I would draw that conclusion from those comments.
[/quote]

It's hard to know what Christian wants, and it probably depends a lot on how next year goes.

[stupac2]

[quote author=dabigv link=topic=14056.msg148103#msg148103 date=1450111947]
Sounds like CMAC is gone after next year....hard to be surprised about that

Not sure I would draw that conclusion from those comments.
[/quote]

It's hard to know what Christian wants, and it probably depends a lot on how next year goes.

[CornFed]

[quote author=dabigv link=topic=14056.msg148103#msg148103 date=1450111947]
Sounds like CMAC is gone after next year....hard to be surprised about that

Not sure I would draw that conclusion from those comments.
[/quote]

I agree, terry.  Christian's father seems to be open to early entry and, in fact, seems to imply that if an athlete can get taken in the first two rounds, they should go.  But Christian's coach makes a pretty strong argument from a "state-of-mind" perspective that I suspect Ed McCaffrey will take into account.  That may mitigate against leaving early.

dabigv will be right, I presume, if the father advises unreservedly in favor of entering the draft early, but it isn't clear to me that that will be the case; especially given the familiarity between David Shaw and Ed McCaffrey.  I'm kind of assuming there is probably an unusually high level of trust that Lisa and Ed have with Shaw's input.

[CornFed]

[quote author=dabigv link=topic=14056.msg148103#msg148103 date=1450111947]
Sounds like CMAC is gone after next year....hard to be surprised about that

Not sure I would draw that conclusion from those comments.
[/quote]

I agree, terry.  Christian's father seems to be open to early entry and, in fact, seems to imply that if an athlete can get taken in the first two rounds, they should go.  But Christian's coach makes a pretty strong argument from a "state-of-mind" perspective that I suspect Ed McCaffrey will take into account.  That may mitigate against leaving early.

dabigv will be right, I presume, if the father advises unreservedly in favor of entering the draft early, but it isn't clear to me that that will be the case; especially given the familiarity between David Shaw and Ed McCaffrey.  I'm kind of assuming there is probably an unusually high level of trust that Lisa and Ed have with Shaw's input.

[StanfordMatt]

Two observations:

1) Being the politician that he is, Shaw doesn't directly answer the question. Whether a player should have the option of going pro earlier is a very different question from whether he is likely to succeed if given that option. One could presume that Shaw doesn't think players should have that option based on his comments but that's not what he says.

2) Ed played in the NFL for many years at a very high level. Shaw didn't.

[StanfordMatt]

Two observations:

1) Being the politician that he is, Shaw doesn't directly answer the question. Whether a player should have the option of going pro earlier is a very different question from whether he is likely to succeed if given that option. One could presume that Shaw doesn't think players should have that option based on his comments but that's not what he says.

2) Ed played in the NFL for many years at a very high level. Shaw didn't.

[Langdude]

I would also like to note that there is no certainty that Christian will be taken very high in the draft for the same reasons that he did not win the H.eisman. There have been amazing college players - ones that won the highest awards - that were drafted very late or not at all.

-m.

[Langdude]

I would also like to note that there is no certainty that Christian will be taken very high in the draft for the same reasons that he did not win the H.eisman. There have been amazing college players - ones that won the highest awards - that were drafted very late or not at all.

-m.

[BostonCard]

The problem for #wildcaff is that running backs tend not to get drafted in the first round (Even the very best of them).  Then there is also a question of how well his skillset will translate to the NFL.  In college, he is fast and strong but he's not elite in either; in the pro's I'd imagine he might be average speed and below average strength.  His vision and patience is elite, but pro defenses are more disciplined than college, so many of the holes he finds will never develop in the pros unless he is runninh behind a very good OL.  His versatility will help, of course, but would he be an every down back?

Right now McCaffrey projects as a third down back.  He can block well in clear passing downs, would be a danger catching the ball out of the backfield, and might surprise teams if he ran when they were expecting a run.  At best I see him as a Reggie Bush/Darren Sproles kind of back. Both have had productive careers in the NFL, and I think each has been to a pro bowl, but neither bas set the league on fire.

BC

[BostonCard]

The problem for #wildcaff is that running backs tend not to get drafted in the first round (Even the very best of them).  Then there is also a question of how well his skillset will translate to the NFL.  In college, he is fast and strong but he's not elite in either; in the pro's I'd imagine he might be average speed and below average strength.  His vision and patience is elite, but pro defenses are more disciplined than college, so many of the holes he finds will never develop in the pros unless he is runninh behind a very good OL.  His versatility will help, of course, but would he be an every down back?

Right now McCaffrey projects as a third down back.  He can block well in clear passing downs, would be a danger catching the ball out of the backfield, and might surprise teams if he ran when they were expecting a run.  At best I see him as a Reggie Bush/Darren Sproles kind of back. Both have had productive careers in the NFL, and I think each has been to a pro bowl, but neither bas set the league on fire.

BC

[rudruff]

I think McCaffrey goes to the slot at the next level. Spread the defense out and if you like your chances running you shift him back into the backfield.

[rudruff]

I think McCaffrey goes to the slot at the next level. Spread the defense out and if you like your chances running you shift him back into the backfield.

[dabigv13]

He could also be a pretty dangerous slot receiver and KR/PR, like early days Wes Welker but more dangerous.

Sure he could stay, but if his parents (who you would think would advocate for the value of a Stanford education) think he could be ready for the NFL already, we've already lost the first battle. Perhaps Ed is aware of the limited playing career, and the possibility of finishing the degree at a later time strikes him as a doable proposition.

Even if CMAC weren't a round 1 draft pick, another year is unlikely to change that. He already had the best season of any college player. And he's getting a LOT of usage. For RBs more than anybody, that matters. If he projects as a mid round pick next year, I think he should go if the NFL is his biggest goal.

[dabigv13]

He could also be a pretty dangerous slot receiver and KR/PR, like early days Wes Welker but more dangerous.

Sure he could stay, but if his parents (who you would think would advocate for the value of a Stanford education) think he could be ready for the NFL already, we've already lost the first battle. Perhaps Ed is aware of the limited playing career, and the possibility of finishing the degree at a later time strikes him as a doable proposition.

Even if CMAC weren't a round 1 draft pick, another year is unlikely to change that. He already had the best season of any college player. And he's getting a LOT of usage. For RBs more than anybody, that matters. If he projects as a mid round pick next year, I think he should go if the NFL is his biggest goal.

[stupac2]

I think McCaffrey goes to the slot at the next level. Spread the defense out and if you like your chances running you shift him back into the backfield.

Right, he looks like Julian Edelman to me, but with a chance to be better. That's a valuable player, but probably not someone that gets drafted before the 3rd.

[stupac2]

I think McCaffrey goes to the slot at the next level. Spread the defense out and if you like your chances running you shift him back into the backfield.

Right, he looks like Julian Edelman to me, but with a chance to be better. That's a valuable player, but probably not someone that gets drafted before the 3rd.

[MustardtheBallCarrier]

[quote author=rudruff link=topic=14056.msg148135#msg148135 date=1450122390]
I think McCaffrey goes to the slot at the next level. Spread the defense out and if you like your chances running you shift him back into the backfield.

Right, he looks like Julian Edelman to me, but with a chance to be better. That's a valuable player, but probably not someone that gets drafted before the 3rd.
[/quote]

Agreed.  For all his success running the ball this season, McCaffrey's greatest strength is as a receiver.  That said, I think he will play more than slot in the NFL.  I think he will also line up in the backfield to try to get matched up against LBs in coverage, where he can do real damage.  I see him as a Shane Vereen-type player. 

[MustardtheBallCarrier]

[quote author=rudruff link=topic=14056.msg148135#msg148135 date=1450122390]
I think McCaffrey goes to the slot at the next level. Spread the defense out and if you like your chances running you shift him back into the backfield.

Right, he looks like Julian Edelman to me, but with a chance to be better. That's a valuable player, but probably not someone that gets drafted before the 3rd.
[/quote]

Agreed.  For all his success running the ball this season, McCaffrey's greatest strength is as a receiver.  That said, I think he will play more than slot in the NFL.  I think he will also line up in the backfield to try to get matched up against LBs in coverage, where he can do real damage.  I see him as a Shane Vereen-type player. 

[stupac2]

Agreed.  For all his success running the ball this season, McCaffrey's greatest strength is as a receiver.  That said, I think he will play more than slot in the NFL.  I think he will also line up in the backfield to try to get matched up against LBs in coverage, where he can do real damage.  I see him as a Shane Vereen-type player.

I think he has a much higher ceiling than Vereen, but then again I didn't watch Vereen as closely in college as I did in the pros.

[stupac2]

Agreed.  For all his success running the ball this season, McCaffrey's greatest strength is as a receiver.  That said, I think he will play more than slot in the NFL.  I think he will also line up in the backfield to try to get matched up against LBs in coverage, where he can do real damage.  I see him as a Shane Vereen-type player.

I think he has a much higher ceiling than Vereen, but then again I didn't watch Vereen as closely in college as I did in the pros.

[BostonCard]

I have little doubt that a player of McCaffrey's caliber will find his way onto an NFL team.  Although his greatest asset (versatility) doesn't count for as much in the NFL, one could see him drafted in the mid-rounds by teams with the knowledge that they'd be able to get him on the field as a returner and either in the slot or as a sometimes running back.  Ironically, the player I see him most like is Ty Montgomery.  They have similar size (6'0") and though Montgomery has about 5-10 lbs on McCaffrey, by the time hie is drafted they could be very similar in that regard.  They also shared a lot of versatility, with Montgomery at wideout, returning kicks, and occasionally running the Wildcat. In college, McCaffrey is a running back first, receiver second, but in the pros I could see them having a similar role. Ty was a third round pick, which sounds about right for McCaffrey, despite the latter's much greater college production.  The biggest similarity was that they were both playmakers and guys you wanted to see have the ball.

The relevance of this is Ed McCaffrey's comment that, "I would encourage players who know that they are going to be drafted in the first or second round to leave early and take advantage of that opportunity."  I'm no draft expert, but I just don't see McCaffrey getting drafted in the first or second round.  Running backs as a general rule don't, unless they are unique.  And slot receivers as a rule don't (the two that were brought up earlier in the thread, Welker was an undrafted free agent and Edelman was a seventh round pick; by the way, both those guys are a couple inches shorter than McCaffrey; as I said, I think Ty Montgomery, who was drafted in the third round, is probably a closer match).

BC

[BostonCard]

I have little doubt that a player of McCaffrey's caliber will find his way onto an NFL team.  Although his greatest asset (versatility) doesn't count for as much in the NFL, one could see him drafted in the mid-rounds by teams with the knowledge that they'd be able to get him on the field as a returner and either in the slot or as a sometimes running back.  Ironically, the player I see him most like is Ty Montgomery.  They have similar size (6'0") and though Montgomery has about 5-10 lbs on McCaffrey, by the time hie is drafted they could be very similar in that regard.  They also shared a lot of versatility, with Montgomery at wideout, returning kicks, and occasionally running the Wildcat. In college, McCaffrey is a running back first, receiver second, but in the pros I could see them having a similar role. Ty was a third round pick, which sounds about right for McCaffrey, despite the latter's much greater college production.  The biggest similarity was that they were both playmakers and guys you wanted to see have the ball.

The relevance of this is Ed McCaffrey's comment that, "I would encourage players who know that they are going to be drafted in the first or second round to leave early and take advantage of that opportunity."  I'm no draft expert, but I just don't see McCaffrey getting drafted in the first or second round.  Running backs as a general rule don't, unless they are unique.  And slot receivers as a rule don't (the two that were brought up earlier in the thread, Welker was an undrafted free agent and Edelman was a seventh round pick; by the way, both those guys are a couple inches shorter than McCaffrey; as I said, I think Ty Montgomery, who was drafted in the third round, is probably a closer match).

BC

[CornFed]

McCaffrey is a better athlete than Ty so, given that the latter went in the third round, it is probably very possible that the former will be able to see a significant chance to get chosen in the second.

Obviously, we are a long way away from those possibilities.  I would venture to guess the strongest influence will come from Ed, and the next year or two need to play out in order for him to assess draft possibilities.  They're probably not spending much time on it these days.

[CornFed]

McCaffrey is a better athlete than Ty so, given that the latter went in the third round, it is probably very possible that the former will be able to see a significant chance to get chosen in the second.

Obviously, we are a long way away from those possibilities.  I would venture to guess the strongest influence will come from Ed, and the next year or two need to play out in order for him to assess draft possibilities.  They're probably not spending much time on it these days.

[MustardtheBallCarrier]

I have little doubt that a player of McCaffrey's caliber will find his way onto an NFL team.  Although his greatest asset (versatility) doesn't count for as much in the NFL, one could see him drafted in the mid-rounds by teams with the knowledge that they'd be able to get him on the field as a returner and either in the slot or as a sometimes running back.  Ironically, the player I see him most like is Ty Montgomery.  They have similar size (6'0") and though Montgomery has about 5-10 lbs on McCaffrey, by the time hie is drafted they could be very similar in that regard.  They also shared a lot of versatility, with Montgomery at wideout, returning kicks, and occasionally running the Wildcat. In college, McCaffrey is a running back first, receiver second, but in the pros I could see them having a similar role. Ty was a third round pick, which sounds about right for McCaffrey, despite the latter's much greater college production.  The biggest similarity was that they were both playmakers and guys you wanted to see have the ball.

The relevance of this is Ed McCaffrey's comment that, "I would encourage players who know that they are going to be drafted in the first or second round to leave early and take advantage of that opportunity."  I'm no draft expert, but I just don't see McCaffrey getting drafted in the first or second round.  Running backs as a general rule don't, unless they are unique.  And slot receivers as a rule don't (the two that were brought up earlier in the thread, Welker was an undrafted free agent and Edelman was a seventh round pick; by the way, both those guys are a couple inches shorter than McCaffrey; as I said, I think Ty Montgomery, who was drafted in the third round, is probably a closer match).

BC

Interesting comparison.  Agree with you on the kick returning ability and versatility, but otherwise I see them almost as opposites, ironically.  Ty was a WR who couldn't run routes to get open or catch the ball reliably*, and, as it turned out from the combine, isn't all that fast (relatively speaking).  His greatest attribute was actually his strength and power.  Others on this board have made the same point and I totally agree, that Ty was actually much better suited to be our RB last year.  Ty was such a tough, physical runner as a WR.  The question about McCaffrey coming into this year (and for his future as an NFL RB) is/was his strength and power (he of course proved this season he has enough to succeed running between the tackles at the college level).  I suspect that falling out of bed his senior year of HS, McCaffrey was a more developed pass-catcher than Ty, which is where I think McCaffrey's NFL future is.  Full disclosure: my head exploded when I heard Ty went in the third round (at least what was left of it after Jordan Richards was taken in the second round). 

*I was watching the SF-GB game earlier this season.  First offensive play of the game for GB, Rodgers bootlegs hard to the right and on the dead run while evading a defender flicks his wrist to send a laser deep down field to Ty.  One of those throws that only Rodgers can make.  I swear you could hear it on TV hit Ty's hands and drop. 

[MustardtheBallCarrier]

I have little doubt that a player of McCaffrey's caliber will find his way onto an NFL team.  Although his greatest asset (versatility) doesn't count for as much in the NFL, one could see him drafted in the mid-rounds by teams with the knowledge that they'd be able to get him on the field as a returner and either in the slot or as a sometimes running back.  Ironically, the player I see him most like is Ty Montgomery.  They have similar size (6'0") and though Montgomery has about 5-10 lbs on McCaffrey, by the time hie is drafted they could be very similar in that regard.  They also shared a lot of versatility, with Montgomery at wideout, returning kicks, and occasionally running the Wildcat. In college, McCaffrey is a running back first, receiver second, but in the pros I could see them having a similar role. Ty was a third round pick, which sounds about right for McCaffrey, despite the latter's much greater college production.  The biggest similarity was that they were both playmakers and guys you wanted to see have the ball.

The relevance of this is Ed McCaffrey's comment that, "I would encourage players who know that they are going to be drafted in the first or second round to leave early and take advantage of that opportunity."  I'm no draft expert, but I just don't see McCaffrey getting drafted in the first or second round.  Running backs as a general rule don't, unless they are unique.  And slot receivers as a rule don't (the two that were brought up earlier in the thread, Welker was an undrafted free agent and Edelman was a seventh round pick; by the way, both those guys are a couple inches shorter than McCaffrey; as I said, I think Ty Montgomery, who was drafted in the third round, is probably a closer match).

BC

Interesting comparison.  Agree with you on the kick returning ability and versatility, but otherwise I see them almost as opposites, ironically.  Ty was a WR who couldn't run routes to get open or catch the ball reliably*, and, as it turned out from the combine, isn't all that fast (relatively speaking).  His greatest attribute was actually his strength and power.  Others on this board have made the same point and I totally agree, that Ty was actually much better suited to be our RB last year.  Ty was such a tough, physical runner as a WR.  The question about McCaffrey coming into this year (and for his future as an NFL RB) is/was his strength and power (he of course proved this season he has enough to succeed running between the tackles at the college level).  I suspect that falling out of bed his senior year of HS, McCaffrey was a more developed pass-catcher than Ty, which is where I think McCaffrey's NFL future is.  Full disclosure: my head exploded when I heard Ty went in the third round (at least what was left of it after Jordan Richards was taken in the second round). 

*I was watching the SF-GB game earlier this season.  First offensive play of the game for GB, Rodgers bootlegs hard to the right and on the dead run while evading a defender flicks his wrist to send a laser deep down field to Ty.  One of those throws that only Rodgers can make.  I swear you could hear it on TV hit Ty's hands and drop.