WBB: Stanford 63 -- Oregon State 60 - Printable Version
+- The CardBoard (https://thecardboard.org/board)
+-- Forum: C-House! (https://thecardboard.org/board/forum-4.html)
+--- Forum: The CardBoard (https://thecardboard.org/board/forum-5.html)
+--- Thread: WBB: Stanford 63 -- Oregon State 60 (/thread-23991.html)
+- The CardBoard (https://thecardboard.org/board)
+-- Forum: C-House! (https://thecardboard.org/board/forum-4.html)
+--- Forum: The CardBoard (https://thecardboard.org/board/forum-5.html)
+--- Thread: WBB: Stanford 63 -- Oregon State 60 (/thread-23991.html)
RE: WBB: Stanford vs. Oregon State Friday 8pm - Softball Fan - 01-27-2023
OSU got royally screwed by the refs.
RE: WBB: Stanford 63 -- Oregon State 60 - TonyLima - 01-27-2023
I’m too old for this.
(01-27-2023, 11:01 PM)paloalto Wrote: OSU got royally screwed by the refs.
Gotta explain that.
RE: WBB: Stanford vs. Oregon State Friday 8pm - MV72018 - 01-27-2023
(01-27-2023, 10:16 PM)mbdude Wrote: Cam carrying us every game isn't going to cut it. That "new offense" taking a while to show up
Talk about a euphemism.....
(01-27-2023, 10:19 PM)mbdude Wrote: So to start 2nd half 1 perimeter shooter on floor
Contact Tara and ask her what's the strategy behind that brilliant move. She'd blow smoke and say nothing.`
RE: WBB: Stanford 63 -- Oregon State 60 - 81alum - 01-28-2023
Once again, we are carried more by our defense than our offense. The first quarter certainly did not look like it would turn out that way. But Rueck was smart enough to continue with the Arizona/Cal/UCLA/USC defense--putting the best perimeter player on Jump, packing the paint, and daring us to take jump shots by people not named Jump.
It almost worked for them, especially since we shot only 4/16 from three point range. Jump was only 1/7 from three point range, which played right into their strategy. We are setting a lot of perimeter screens for her, and she moves laterally around them and shoots, but she usually misses left if she if moving left. Her shot is much more reliable when she catches and shoots, and so we have not found an effective way to get her truly open.
I am astonished the Brink was 7/17 field goals, but she made some mid range jumpers and also managed to squeeze through the paint from time to time. For the game, though, we had a meager 20 points in the paint, which illustrates how packed it was in there. Oregon State has the size and bulk to make it difficult to maneuver. She did accumulate a lot of fouls, so thank goodness our free throw shooting has improved.
I'm not sure what the other posters were seeing in Jones, but she made lots of mid range jumpers from the free throw line. That was encouraging and vital for our success.
Oregon State did pay a price for its strategy, given that we earned 18 free throws and they managed only 2. Was that bad officiating? I think it was more a result of the style of defense that Oregon State was playing. Perhaps the most controversial foul, though, was Von Oelhoffen's fifth when she tried to steal the ball from Jones and may have gotten more than ball. I'll be eager to see a replay. It would have been a massive momentum shift.
While our offense often looked somewhat stagnant, our defense was pretty good after the first quarter. Emma-Nnopu has the primary assignment of slowing down Von Oelhoffen and she was mostly successful in doing so--keeping her to 3/14 shooting. That was the game.
Bendu Yeany and Timea Gardiner were most of the OSU offense, and we were not especially effective in guarding either of them. We did better against Beers.
Steals and rebounds were fairly similar. As others have noted, OSU took us out of our game plan and depressed the passing lanes.
RE: WBB: Stanford 63 -- Oregon State 60 - old spanish trail - 01-28-2023
(01-27-2023, 11:02 PM)TonyLima Wrote: I’m too old for this.
(01-27-2023, 11:01 PM)paloalto Wrote: OSU got royally screwed by the refs.
Gotta explain that.
Probably referring to important play in fourth when ball went off Fran and Stanford awarded the ball. But there were calls the other way. I thought we had benefit of calls in 4th qtr but evened out by earlier. Thought the refs were ok.
RE: WBB: Stanford 63 -- Oregon State 60 - chimera - 01-28-2023
I was at the game and spent much of it confused. I was confused about the line-up, why we played without two bigs for the most part, when that is our strength and could have countered OSU's strength inside more. I was confused as to why we so often had only one perimeter player out there who had the green light when OSU was totally packing the paint. I was confused at the subbing, at how many 2 minutes and done subs we used and at how little bench scoring we got. I was confused because so often we got a rebound, rushed it up court like we wanted to play fast but then passed to a wing, often Emma-Nnopu, who was as wide open as could be, and instead of shooting or attacking we just ran offense, which plays to OSU's strengths as a defensive team (they play better half court scouting report D than scrambling D off a fast break). I was confused at how Lepolo was considered so indispensable she hardly came out but this game she mostly sat (still not 100%? Then why did she play?). I was confused at why Betts and/or Prechtel did not get more run, given the style of play and the size of the other team inside. I was confused about more but I guess that is enough confusion for one game.
I was also sad because we still can't shoot from outside, we had 5 assists all game, which is crazy low, the defense couldn't stop them early so they made it a tight game, and mostly because I sense the coaches do not have a good handle on things, that they are still struggling to figure out how to use the bench, even what sort of offense will work best with this team. I do not sense the team coming together and improving as the team usually starts to do about now. OSU played pretty well and is better than earlier this season because they have Gardiner back, but still and all, we should be better by more than we showed this game.
I am losing hope that the shooting will come around or that the bench, which we touted as so good and so deep, will provide the scoring lift you need or the consistency you need. We just seem to be making games harder than they could be or should be. Five assists is all you need to know against a pretty non-aggressive, low pressure defense. The game was frustrating, not because the team was bad like against USC but because aside from shooting not so well, they weren't that bad, and the game was still so close. Are we really that much better than the bulk of the conference? Sure doesn't look that way. If we are not, well, most of the teams we are struggling to beat won't be making much noise in the NCAAs...
RE: WBB: Stanford 63 -- Oregon State 60 - treetop11 - 01-28-2023
(01-28-2023, 12:01 AM)81alum Wrote: Once again, we are carried more by our defense than our offense. The first quarter certainly did not look like it would turn out that way. But Rueck was smart enough to continue with the Arizona/Cal/UCLA/USC defense--putting the best perimeter player on Jump, packing the paint, and daring us to take jump shots by people not named Jump.
It almost worked for them, especially since we shot only 4/16 from three point range. Jump was only 1/7 from three point range, which played right into their strategy. We are setting a lot of perimeter screens for her, and she moves laterally around them and shoots, but she usually misses left if she if moving left. Her shot is much more reliable when she catches and shoots, and so we have not found an effective way to get her truly open.
I am astonished the Brink was 7/17 field goals, but she made some mid range jumpers and also managed to squeeze through the paint from time to time. For the game, though, we had a meager 20 points in the paint, which illustrates how packed it was in there. Oregon State has the size and bulk to make it difficult to maneuver. She did accumulate a lot of fouls, so thank goodness our free throw shooting has improved.
I'm not sure what the other posters were seeing in Jones, but she made lots of
Oregon State did pay a price for its strategy, given that we earned 18 free throws and they managed only 2. Was that bad officiating? I think it was more a result of the style of defense that Oregon State was playing. Perhaps the most controversial foul, though, was Von Oelhoffen's fifth when she tried to steal the ball from Jones and may have gotten more than ball. I'll be eager to see a replay. It would have been a massive momentum shift.
While our offense often looked somewhat stagnant, our defense was pretty good after the first quarter. Emma-Nnopu has the primary assignment of slowing down Von Oilhoffen and she was mostly successful in doing so--keeping her to 3/14 shooting. That was the game.
Bendu Yeany and Timea Gardiner were most of the OSU offense, and we were not especially effective in guarding either of them.
Steals and rebounds were fairly similar. As others have noted, OSU took us out of our game plan and depressed the passing lanes.
81alum, you did an excellent scouting job pregame very much on target.
Would have liked to have seen us speed up the game and pressure them more with our D especially in 2nd half when we knew we had no foul trouble. We just got killed with their packing it in and our poor 3 pt shooting. Majority of game, we only had one reall outside shooter, Jump, in the game. Really frustrating seeing Jones, Brink, Agnes, Iriafen, and Fran left unguarded anywhere near the perimeter. Either they don't shoot or when they do, they miss badly. I thought when Hannah opened the game with the mid range basket she was going to have a hot night, but the opposite, whe was cold. It seems like when she is blanketed by a defender and our O is not going well, when she gets any kind of an opening, she presses, rushes fer shot, and shoots off balance. I think she tries hard to jump start the O, but it causes her to take shots out of sync. Haley's mid shots were quite good. Agnes did make two key threes though.
OSU definitely got screwed on that play with Fran which clearly was off Fran. But refs could have called even more fouls on beavers. They got away with a lot. Last foul on TVO was right call as she hacked Haley's arm. TVO colplained about ther 4th foul, but that was an even more obvious hack. Apparently the kid thinks it's ok to smack an oppoenent's arm.
I was surprised that Betts and Ashten didn't play more.
I'm beginning to think that we need to counter the packing in tactic by opponents by encouragin anyone on the perimeter to take them, but make sure we have good rebounders in place to grab O boards and make putbacks ot draw fouls on missed shots. I would put Jones at the 4 with Brink and have Jump, Lepolo, and Agnes outside and let them jack if they can't get it into the post or drive. But part of our issue is we are movint the ball well and quickly or moving, screening, and cutting as well as we did earlier this season, probably because our players still haven't figured out and comfortable going against the packed in D with Jum covered tightly.
RE: WBB: Stanford 63 -- Oregon State 60 - treetop11 - 01-28-2023
(01-28-2023, 12:21 AM)chimera Wrote: I was at the game and spent much of it confused. I was confused about the line-up, why we played without two bigs for the most part, when that is our strength and could have countered OSU's strength inside more. I was confused as to why we so often had only one perimeter player out there who had the green light when OSU was totally packing the paint. I was confused at the subbing, at how many 2 minutes and done subs we used and at how little bench scoring we got. I was confused because so often we got a rebound, rushed it up court like we wanted to play fast but then passed to a wing, often Emma-Nnopu, who was as wide open as could be, and instead of shooting or attacking we just ran offense, which plays to OSU's strengths as a defensive team (they play better half court scouting report D than scrambling D off a fast break). I was confused at how Lepolo was considered so indispensable she hardly came out but this game she mostly sat (still not 100%? Then why did she play?). I was confused at why Betts and/or Prechtel did not get more run, given the style of play and the size of the other team inside. I was confused about more but I guess that is enough confusion for one game.
I was also sad because we still can't shoot from outside, we had 5 assists all game, which is crazy low, the defense couldn't stop them early so they made it a tight game, and mostly because I sense the coaches do not have a good handle on things, that they are still struggling to figure out how to use the bench, even what sort of offense will work best with this team. I do not sense the team coming together and improving as the team usually starts to do about now. OSU played pretty well and is better than earlier this season because they have Gardiner back, but still and all, we should be better by more than we showed this game.
I am losing hope that the shooting will come around or that the bench, which we touted as so good and so deep, will provide the scoring lift you need or the consistency you need. We just seem to be making games harder than they could be or should be. Five assists is all you need to know against a pretty non-aggressive, low pressure defense. The game was frustrating, not because the team was bad like against USC but because aside from shooting not so well, they weren't that bad, and the game was still so close. Are we really that much better than the bulk of the conference? Sure doesn't look that way. If we are not, well, most of the teams we are struggling to beat won't be making much noise in the NCAAs...
I share your confusion. A while back, Tara said that they were still trying to figure out who to play and who to play with whom. Evidently it's still a mystery. Basically, we have two AA star players, an all conference player, and a bunch of really good players with various degrees of potential and abilities. It seems that Tara not having found a clear cut lineup and rotation has opted to try to get matchups, try to find combinations that work, and get everybody some minutes. It's only partly working.
Problem falls on recruiting and balancing the roster. We are heavy on bigs, but light on guards and wings in terms of top level performance. Lepolo is excellent, but we really could use Nivar, Harriel, Bosgana, and Demetre to step up big time. All four can handle the ball and capable of hitting threes. They just need to do so. Of course, their PT has been limited so it's tougher for them to get in the groove.
RE: WBB: Stanford 63 -- Oregon State 60 - CompSci87 - 01-28-2023
One little bit of comedy I noticed. After von Oelhoffen got her fifth foul and stood around a long time acting incredulous that the refs didn't believe she got all ball, Haley went to the line and started rubbing her arm like it hurt where van Oelhoffen whacked her on it.
RE: WBB: Stanford 63 -- Oregon State 60 - Softball Fan - 01-28-2023
I'm asking myself if Tara is playing Betts and Ashten to keep them engaged with the team. Or does she see something at a specific time in the game where their skillset would help the team at that specific juncture in the game? Not questioning the brief playing time. Just trying to understand what Tara sees in the flow of the game I'm missing.
Next year if Betts is a starter the OSU games with Betts versus Mitrovic should get publicity.
RE: WBB: Stanford 63 -- Oregon State 60 - PVTree - 01-28-2023
Gardiner is a terrific player. She had an outstanding game. She and TVO will make a great tandem. I see OSU making a run in the second half of conference play and making the dance.
RE: WBB: Stanford 63 -- Oregon State 60 - qwerty49 - 01-28-2023
Very strange rotations tonight. I get it when Tara yanks Cam after 2 fouls, but Demetre is, um, more expendable. In a game where everyone is cold from outside, why not keep her in for her shooting until she fouls out? There's plenty of time to go back into the "turtle D" rotation if we can get a decent lead.
Does Agnes not have the green light or is she just reluctant to shoot? IIRC she was 2/3 but passed up at least 3 or 4 wide open opportunities.
The announcers were full of praise for Fran doing the little things that don't show up on stat sheets.
For awhile there everything OSU threw up there rattled in. But we definitely got a couple of homer calls at the end. Oh well, better to be lucky than to lose.
RE: WBB: Stanford 63 -- Oregon State 60 - 81alum - 01-28-2023
(01-28-2023, 12:21 AM)chimera Wrote: I was at the game and spent much of it confused. I was confused about the line-up, why we played without two bigs for the most part, when that is our strength and could have countered OSU's strength inside more. I was confused as to why we so often had only one perimeter player out there who had the green light when OSU was totally packing the paint. I was confused at the subbing, at how many 2 minutes and done subs we used and at how little bench scoring we got. I was confused because so often we got a rebound, rushed it up court like we wanted to play fast but then passed to a wing, often Emma-Nnopu, who was as wide open as could be, and instead of shooting or attacking we just ran offense, which plays to OSU's strengths as a defensive team (they play better half court scouting report D than scrambling D off a fast break). I was confused at how Lepolo was considered so indispensable she hardly came out but this game she mostly sat (still not 100%? Then why did she play?). I was confused at why Betts and/or Prechtel did not get more run, given the style of play and the size of the other team inside. I was confused about more but I guess that is enough confusion for one game.What an excellent summary of reasons for concern. I particularly wondered why it was that Emma-Nnopu, who was 2/3 from three point range, would not take a transition 3 point shot even when left open.
I was also sad because we still can't shoot from outside, we had 5 assists all game, which is crazy low, the defense couldn't stop them early so they made it a tight game, and mostly because I sense the coaches do not have a good handle on things, that they are still struggling to figure out how to use the bench, even what sort of offense will work best with this team. I do not sense the team coming together and improving as the team usually starts to do about now. OSU played pretty well and is better than earlier this season because they have Gardiner back, but still and all, we should be better by more than we showed this game.
I am losing hope that the shooting will come around or that the bench, which we touted as so good and so deep, will provide the scoring lift you need or the consistency you need. We just seem to be making games harder than they could be or should be. Five assists is all you need to know against a pretty non-aggressive, low pressure defense. The game was frustrating, not because the team was bad like against USC but because aside from shooting not so well, they weren't that bad, and the game was still so close. Are we really that much better than the bulk of the conference? Sure doesn't look that way. If we are not, well, most of the teams we are struggling to beat won't be making much noise in the NCAAs...
Two tidbits from the chalk talk--Kate acknowledges that we have not been shooting well lately, and also acknowledged that we are working on our offensive rotation. But as you note, this is WAY too late in the year for the coaches still to be uncertain about our offense, particularly when they have two all Americans to anchor it. Taking Iriafen out allowed them to put Brink at the 5 and Jones at the 4--their natural positions. But who goes everywhere else?
The nub of the problem is this: Iriafen, Betts, and Belibi seem to only be effective at the 5. If they could more reliably make jumpshots (and Iriafen and Betts have sporadically shown this promise) then they could play alongside Brink without diminishing Brink's offense. But having Brink play the high post while a second big plays the low post has not worked out so well--it not only pushes Brink out to the 4 it pushes Jones to the 3.
Or, to put it very simply, our strength is inside, and so opponents pack the paint and take that away. This discombobulates the offense since we thus far do not have very many strong outside threats. Take Jump away too, or if Jump has an off night, and we are looking at potential defeat or a very tight game.
Usually at this time of year the team is substantially improved and getting better. That is the Tara way of things, the normal result of her terrific teaching over the season. I've not seen improvement since the turn of the new year. It feels unusual, and I am concerned. There is not much time left, and we have 6 very difficult road games coming up soon.
(01-28-2023, 12:04 AM)old spanish trail Wrote: Probably referring to important play in fourth when ball went off Fran and Stanford awarded the ball.I was pretty close to where the ball rolled out of bounds. I haven't see a replay, but at the time I thought the ball had rolled over the line just before Belibi touched it. However, I do not know who deflected it in the first place....was that also Belibi?
The most optimistic take on this game was that we just beat a very underrated team that is catching on fire with very recent addition of #6 overall recruit Gardner, and who had a hot shooting night, while we had a tepid shooting night. And still we won.
The most pessimistic take is that we struggled to beat a mediocre 11-9 team at home while the coaches are still experimenting, hoping to find something that works more consistently on offense, and not succeeding. And we barely won.
Highlights:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QtRqKwMzgxI
Press Conference:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2PrT1oai8B0
RE: WBB: Stanford 63 -- Oregon State 60 - 81alum - 01-28-2023
Very interesting press conference. Tara does not seem nearly as concerned as we Cardboarders seem. The usual stuff about how winning close games prepares you for the tournament, how well prepared Rueck always has his teams, etc. Interesting quote "we need our players to do what the team needs them to do, not what they want to do." I think this came after she praised Belibi's defense and also praised that she did not try to do too much offensively.
Also of note was her praise for Demetre's offense, but noting that she needs "to get her defense going." She noted that Jump had an off night, and that we have a lot of good shooters who need to step up, citing Demetre, Bosgana, Nivar, and Lepolo as being able to "help us more" with their shots. "They are great shooters."
"Cam and Haley put the team on their backs and that is what we needed them to do." She noted that "no one can stop Cam" and that they continued to go to her and she continued to score when doubled and even triple teamed. As a result, she did lose 5 turnovers (out of a total of 8 by the team) but Tara noted that she didn't mind since that was just part of taking the ball inside against the double and triple teams.
Noted that Lepolo is at 100% but that Tara now has confidence in Nivar and it is a good thing to have two alternatives, they both can be more rested for Sunday.
With regard to the way Oregon State defended us, "We are going to see a lot of the same stuff we saw tonight, and I thought people responded well."
My analysis: Tara is well aware that every single team is going to play this defense against us because it works pretty well. Rather than change our identity and try to defeat this defense by becoming predominantly a mid range jump shooting team, we are going to go strength-on-strength and try to help Brink score inside at the 5, low on the blocks, regardless of how they try to defend her. This is reminiscent of Chiney or Nneka in the old triangle. When adopting this strategy, however, a lot depends on how the officials call it and how well Brink shoots free throws, since she is going to get fouled a lot when shooting against double and triple teams. Fortunately for us, we have killed our opponents from the free throw line the last couple of games.
RE: WBB: Stanford 63 -- Oregon State 60 - Hieronymus - 01-28-2023
(01-28-2023, 02:20 AM)qwerty49 Wrote: Very strange rotations tonight. I get it when Tara yanks Cam after 2 fouls, but Demetre is, um, more expendable. In a game where everyone is cold from outside, why not keep her in for her shooting until she fouls out? There's plenty of time to go back into the "turtle D" rotation if we can get a decent lead.
Does Agnes not have the green light or is she just reluctant to shoot? IIRC she was 2/3 but passed up at least 3 or 4 wide open opportunities.
The announcers were full of praise for Fran doing the little things that don't show up on stat sheets.
For awhile there everything OSU threw up there rattled in. But we definitely got a couple of homer calls at the end. Oh well, better to be lucky than to lose.
Demetre right now is a statue on defense. You saw it in the second half where she came in, missed a 3 and got taken off the dribble at the other end immediately or almost immediately . Unfortunately I rate her as unplayable against most good teams right now as a result. Not sure it’s fixable over time either. Or you need to play zone when she is in.
RE: WBB: Stanford 63 -- Oregon State 60 - chimera - 01-28-2023
(01-28-2023, 07:42 AM)81alum Wrote: Very interesting press conference. Tara does not seem nearly as concerned as we Cardboarders seem. The usual stuff about how winning close games prepares you for the tournament, how well prepared Rueck always has his teams, etc. Interesting quote "we need our players to do what the team needs them to do, not what they want to do." I think this came after she praised Belibi's defense and also praised that she did not try to do too much offensively.
Also of note was her praise for Demetre's offense, but noting that she needs "to get her defense going." She noted that Jump had an off night, and that we have a lot of good shooters who need to step up, citing Demetre, Bosgana, Nivar, and Lepolo as being able to "help us more" with their shots. "They are great shooters."
"Cam and Haley put the team on their backs and that is what we needed them to do." She noted that "no one can stop Cam" and that they continued to go to her and she continued to score when doubled and even triple teamed. As a result, she did lose 5 turnovers (out of a total of 8 by the team) but Tara noted that she didn't mind since that was just part of taking the ball inside against the double and triple teams.
Noted that Lepolo is at 100% but that Tara now has confidence in Nivar and it is a good thing to have two alternatives, they both can be more rested for Sunday.
With regard to the way Oregon State defended us, "We are going to see a lot of the same stuff we saw tonight, and I thought people responded well."
My analysis: Tara is well aware that every single team is going to play this defense against us because it works pretty well. Rather than change our identity and try to defeat this defense by becoming predominantly a mid range jump shooting team, we are going to go strength-on-strength and try to help Brink score inside at the 5, low on the blocks, regardless of how they try to defend her. This is reminiscent of Chiney or Nneka in the old triangle. When adopting this strategy, however, a lot depends on how the officials call it and how well Brink shoots free throws, since she is going to get fouled a lot when shooting against double and triple teams. Fortunately for us, we have killed our opponents from the free throw line the last couple of games.
Tara definitely doesn't seem concerned. She did say we need others besides Jump to hit threes. But she also praised Belibi for not doing too much on offense and it sure feels to me like players besides Jump are a bit reluctant to shoot open threes unless the shot clock is winding down. She also said she was good with giving the ball to Brink even if she is double teamed or even triple teamed and for Brink to shoot against that, which is a good way to get Brink beaten up over time, and tells the shooters not to shoot, just toss the ball inside even if three defenders are hanging out waiting. If we have good shooters we surely need to find them shots. The way things are going does not look like the way to win championships to me. Can't win these days without a robust three point game, which we do not have. At this point in the season you are what your stats say you are, and we are not a good three point shooting team.
RE: WBB: Stanford 63 -- Oregon State 60 - jonnyss - 01-28-2023
(01-28-2023, 12:04 AM)old spanish trail Wrote:(01-27-2023, 11:02 PM)TonyLima Wrote: I’m too old for this.
(01-27-2023, 11:01 PM)paloalto Wrote: OSU got royally screwed by the refs.
Gotta explain that.
Probably referring to important play in fourth when ball went off Fran and Stanford awarded the ball. But there were calls the other way. I thought we had benefit of calls in 4th qtr but evened out by earlier. Thought the refs were ok.
fran smacks the ball. fran runs to chase it but gets there after it goes out of bounds. looks to be off stanford.
however, in between, bendu yeaney touches the ball with her fingertips as it goes by. on replay you can see the spin of the ball change with her touch. certainly a close call though.
***********
to me that was cam's best game ever - or at least up there - as she was going against a defense designed to stop her. on offense: double teamed by brobdingnagian defenders yet repeatedly making the shot or getting fouled. quickness: she made raegan beers look like a statue. strength: the osu fans, kindly linked above, commented that osu posts would push cam around. nope. slender cam played like beefy alissa pili. defense: 6 blocks - count 'em, folks! and only 2 fouls. wow!
p.s. i did not write "of immense proportions". i wrote a short word that starts with h and rhymes with centrifuge. the website algorithm apparently forbids that word and will not let me edit back to it. reminds me of r.o.u.s. - rodents of unusual size - in "the princess bride." ha!
RE: WBB: Stanford 63 -- Oregon State 60 - MV72018 - 01-28-2023
(01-28-2023, 09:45 AM)chimera Wrote:(01-28-2023, 07:42 AM)81alum Wrote: Very interesting press conference. Tara does not seem nearly as concerned as we Cardboarders seem. The usual stuff about how winning close games prepares you for the tournament, how well prepared Rueck always has his teams, etc. Interesting quote "we need our players to do what the team needs them to do, not what they want to do." I think this came after she praised Belibi's defense and also praised that she did not try to do too much offensively.
Also of note was her praise for Demetre's offense, but noting that she needs "to get her defense going." She noted that Jump had an off night, and that we have a lot of good shooters who need to step up, citing Demetre, Bosgana, Nivar, and Lepolo as being able to "help us more" with their shots. "They are great shooters."
"Cam and Haley put the team on their backs and that is what we needed them to do." She noted that "no one can stop Cam" and that they continued to go to her and she continued to score when doubled and even triple teamed. As a result, she did lose 5 turnovers (out of a total of 8 by the team) but Tara noted that she didn't mind since that was just part of taking the ball inside against the double and triple teams.
Noted that Lepolo is at 100% but that Tara now has confidence in Nivar and it is a good thing to have two alternatives, they both can be more rested for Sunday.
With regard to the way Oregon State defended us, "We are going to see a lot of the same stuff we saw tonight, and I thought people responded well."
My analysis: Tara is well aware that every single team is going to play this defense against us because it works pretty well. Rather than change our identity and try to defeat this defense by becoming predominantly a mid range jump shooting team, we are going to go strength-on-strength and try to help Brink score inside at the 5, low on the blocks, regardless of how they try to defend her. This is reminiscent of Chiney or Nneka in the old triangle. When adopting this strategy, however, a lot depends on how the officials call it and how well Brink shoots free throws, since she is going to get fouled a lot when shooting against double and triple teams. Fortunately for us, we have killed our opponents from the free throw line the last couple of games.
Tara definitely doesn't seem concerned. She did say we need others besides Jump to hit threes. But she also praised Belibi for not doing too much on offense and it sure feels to me like players besides Jump are a bit reluctant to shoot open threes unless the shot clock is winding down. She also said she was good with giving the ball to Brink even if she is double teamed or even triple teamed and for Brink to shoot against that, which is a good way to get Brink beaten up over time, and tells the shooters not to shoot, just toss the ball inside even if three defenders are hanging out waiting. If we have good shooters we surely need to find them shots. The way things are going does not look like the way to win championships to me. Can't win these days without a robust three point game, which we do not have. At this point in the season you are what your stats say you are, and we are not a good three point shooting team.
Maybe Tara SHOULD deep six her denial of problems and her rose-colored-glasses belief that the players you listed are "great shooters." THEY AREN'T. If Tara doesn't wake up and take the obvious problems we're having on O seriously, we are headed for an early, embarrassing exit from the Big Dance.
RE: WBB: Stanford 63 -- Oregon State 60 - WBB fan - 01-28-2023
(01-28-2023, 10:28 AM)jonnyss Wrote:(01-28-2023, 12:04 AM)old spanish trail Wrote:(01-27-2023, 11:02 PM)TonyLima Wrote: I’m too old for this.
(01-27-2023, 11:01 PM)paloalto Wrote: OSU got royally screwed by the refs.
Gotta explain that.
Probably referring to important play in fourth when ball went off Fran and Stanford awarded the ball. But there were calls the other way. I thought we had benefit of calls in 4th qtr but evened out by earlier. Thought the refs were ok.
fran smacks the ball. fran runs to chase it but gets there after it goes out of bounds. looks to be off stanford.
however, in between, bendu yeaney touches the ball with her fingertips as it goes by. on replay you can see the spin of the ball change with her touch. certainly a close call though.
***********
to me that was cam's best game ever - or at least up there - as she was going against a defense designed to stop her. on offense: double teamed by of immense proportions defenders yet repeatedly making the shot or getting fouled. quickness: she made raegan beers look like a statue. strength: the osu fans, kindly linked above, commented that osu posts would push cam around. nope. slender cam played like beefy alissa pili. defense: 6 blocks - count 'em, folks! and only 2 fouls. wow!
p.s. i did not write "of immense proportions". i wrote a short word that starts with h and rhymes with centrifuge. the website algorithm apparently forbids that word and will not let me edit back to it. reminds me of r.o.u.s. - rodents of unusual size - in "the princess bride." ha!
Agree re Cam. And note that she played 36 minutes. That's got to be a new high for her. I'll bet she's really bruised from this one.
RE: WBB: Stanford 63 -- Oregon State 60 - 81alum - 01-28-2023
Brink does seem to excel at the 5. I think her best games are on the low block. And Tara has made a decision to keep her there--and basically make the first offensive option always Brink.
This has a pretty negative corollary for Iriafen, Belibi, and Betts, who can only play at the five. But Brink playing at the four makes her not as good, and it bumps Jones to the 3 where she is also not as good offensively.
With those two in and the rest of our stable of bigs sitting, it puts a lot of emphasis on our younger guards. They are not our strength offensively, given all the offensive guards we have missed in recruiting the last few years. But they seem to be there primarily for their defense, except Jump. Makes it easier for the opponents to pack the paint.
My question is why not more Prechtel, perhaps at the 3 on offense and switching to the 5 or 4 on defense? She is the one big who has good range with her shot and she should be able to complement Brink and Jones well, in a way that Betts, Belibi, and Iriafen cannot (yet). If we play her at the three, the other team will have to bring a big out to the perimeter to guard her, and that will open more space for Brink and Jones to maneuver inside--so long as Prectel can take and make some threes. Has her three point shooting gone so cold in practice that Tara is afraid to use her more? Or is there something I am missing? Perhaps there are not that many teams who have the kind of player she can defend well--although she did a very creditable job on Aliyah Boston, and it seems to me she could have taken Beers on.
Offense:
5 Brink
4 Jones
3 Prechtel
2 Jump
1 Lepolo
Defense:
5 Prechtel
4 Brink
3 Jones
2 Jump
1 Lepolo