11-07-2022, 10:38 PM
Our invented Point guard was darn good. 11 assists no turnovers great defense
WBB: Stanford 86 -- San Diego State 48
11-07-2022, 10:58 PM
(11-07-2022, 10:06 PM)qwerty49 Wrote:(11-07-2022, 09:27 PM)Hoops9092 Wrote:(11-07-2022, 09:13 PM)Card10Fan Wrote:(11-07-2022, 08:57 PM)BosCard Wrote:(11-07-2022, 08:46 PM)Jskass Wrote: Brooke's got great shooting but Bosgana showing quickness too and better body control.
Nivar is very athletic. Quick, strong and good body control to finish her layup after the steal.
If Nivar continues to show the offensive skill set she's shown so far, she will take minutes from Agnes. Nivar looks like our 2nd best perimeter defender after Agnes but with better overall offensive skills.
I was just thinking this. That Agnes' starting spot may be Indya's by the end of the year with this kind of offense (I also think Agnes plays D a little upright, however would agree she is our top defender on the permitter). I also could see Tara electing to put Lepolo at the 1 and move Haley back to the wing to get more offensive production out of her.
You can tell by Tara's body language that she wants the team to run the offense, seems a little frustrated that we keep jacking up quick 3's (even though quite a few are going in!)
It's hard to tell a whole lot when SDSU was not really that good, and they were certainly undersized, but I was impressed with both Nivar and Lepolo. They both play with some toughness we haven't had at times in the past. I also agree Agnes was not too impressive tonight and that someone else could eventually be starting in her place. Harriel did not seem very aggressive at all and there was one maddening moment when a loose ball seemed to float around her feet for way too long.
Betts is a work in process. Very slow out there. Let's hope for the best but based on this limited view I don't think we should stop recruiting bigs next year.
Good for Bosgana. This game played to her strengths and she showed she can make threes.
Sure, we scored 80+ points. But 2Q was a real drought for a while and the offense does need some work. Lots of new faces, and maybe that's the price of giving everyone a long look.
I believe Fran is recovering from injury, but is Ashten in the doghouse, or is Tara just giving the other posts a long look at this point in the season?
Ashten was the first big to sub in iirc, she was paired with Brink after Kiki picked up a foul. As in the past the early season is time for some experimentations with combinations of players.
(11-07-2022, 10:06 PM)qwerty49 Wrote:(11-07-2022, 09:27 PM)Hoops9092 Wrote:(11-07-2022, 09:13 PM)Card10Fan Wrote:(11-07-2022, 08:57 PM)BosCard Wrote:(11-07-2022, 08:46 PM)Jskass Wrote: Brooke's got great shooting but Bosgana showing quickness too and better body control.
Nivar is very athletic. Quick, strong and good body control to finish her layup after the steal.
If Nivar continues to show the offensive skill set she's shown so far, she will take minutes from Agnes. Nivar looks like our 2nd best perimeter defender after Agnes but with better overall offensive skills.
I was just thinking this. That Agnes' starting spot may be Indya's by the end of the year with this kind of offense (I also think Agnes plays D a little upright, however would agree she is our top defender on the permitter). I also could see Tara electing to put Lepolo at the 1 and move Haley back to the wing to get more offensive production out of her.
You can tell by Tara's body language that she wants the team to run the offense, seems a little frustrated that we keep jacking up quick 3's (even though quite a few are going in!)
It's hard to tell a whole lot when SDSU was not really that good, and they were certainly undersized, but I was impressed with both Nivar and Lepolo. They both play with some toughness we haven't had at times in the past. I also agree Agnes was not too impressive tonight and that someone else could eventually be starting in her place. Harriel did not seem very aggressive at all and there was one maddening moment when a loose ball seemed to float around her feet for way too long.
Betts is a work in process. Very slow out there. Let's hope for the best but based on this limited view I don't think we should stop recruiting bigs next year.
Good for Bosgana. This game played to her strengths and she showed she can make threes.
Sure, we scored 80+ points. But 2Q was a real drought for a while and the offense does need some work. Lots of new faces, and maybe that's the price of giving everyone a long look.
I believe Fran is recovering from injury, but is Ashten in the doghouse, or is Tara just giving the other posts a long look at this point in the season?
Ashten was the first big to sub in iirc, she was paired with Brink after Kiki picked up a foul. As in the past the early season is time for some experimentations with combinations of players.
11-07-2022, 11:01 PM
The game will be here when it finishes uploading. As usual, if you get the low-res version, wait a while for YouTube to finish processing the hi-res version.
I missed out the first couple of minutes because I forgot to start the capture when I meant to, but the score was still 0-0 when the video starts at 9:45 in the first quarter.
https://youtu.be/6jao8hHUJGo
I missed out the first couple of minutes because I forgot to start the capture when I meant to, but the score was still 0-0 when the video starts at 9:45 in the first quarter.
https://youtu.be/6jao8hHUJGo
The game will be here when it finishes uploading. As usual, if you get the low-res version, wait a while for YouTube to finish processing the hi-res version.
I missed out the first couple of minutes because I forgot to start the capture when I meant to, but the score was still 0-0 when the video starts at 9:45 in the first quarter.
https://youtu.be/6jao8hHUJGo
I missed out the first couple of minutes because I forgot to start the capture when I meant to, but the score was still 0-0 when the video starts at 9:45 in the first quarter.
https://youtu.be/6jao8hHUJGo
Overview:
Many have commented about the depth of the team. I think it may be the deepest I have ever seen here at Stanford, and that was evident tonight. All 15 of players were healthy enough to play and did play, with nearly all players at 20 minutes or less. 11 players scored, with 4 in double digits. The majority of our points were scored by our bench. Tara has a problem--how to decide on a rotation when there could be 11 or 12 potential starters. That is what these first few games are for. We will know for sure what Tara's thinking is on November 20. Consider these first 5 games as auditions for the main event.
As a team, we did not play perfectly, particularly the 2nd quarter, when our offense went stagnant for a stretch and SDSU began to hit a few shots. Our three point shooting at 37% was so-so. We got about 1/2 of our misses back with O-boards, which was nice to see, and we had only 10 turnovers for the game--turnovers were a frequent problem last year. Then again, SDSU did not really have the personnel to force turnovers. 26 of our made 32 baskets were assisted.
But what did we learn about the team, really? Since SDSU is not very serious competition, I think we need to look to individual performances to discover new information about how this team is developing.
Performances:
Let's go straight to Lepolo, who in her first recorded game in college recorded 11 assists to 0 turnovers, coming off the bench in only 20 minutes of play. Could you imagine a 22 assist to 0 turnover night? Within the realm of the possible. Her assists came in varied ways, including a pass 3/4 the length of the court to Bosgana for a layup, but also drive-and dishes in close. Some here criticized her lack of a willingness to be aggressive offensively--by which they mean taking her own shot. She did attempt 2 treys but missed them both, but she also attacked the basket for a successful layup, which set up drive-and-dish plays afterwords. Yes her offense needs to come along, but what a promising start in a first game.
Our top scorer was Iriafen, at 16 points in 15 minutes, and 7/8 from the field with 6 rebounds to boot. She is showing that she belongs in there as a starter. She got into some foul trouble, though, so we need to monitor that just as we have had to watch Brink for the same reason.
Bosgana is a revelation at 15 points, 6 rebounds, 3 treys in only 15 minutes. She is proving to be equally adept at shooting treys as she is at slashing--she looks like a much more mature and complete player than a year ago, and is beginning to look a little to me like a Hull.
Brink looked much better to me than in the open practice or the Vanguard game. She scored 13 and had 8 rebounds, but the eye popping stat for her were 6 blocks and only 1 personal foul. Very encouraging.
The other player with 13 points was Nivar, who had her best performance by far today. She was 3/5 from three point range, showed speed and quickness, grabbed 2 steals and looked like a complete shooting guard. Her defense looked reasonable to me, as the 2 steals also attest.
Demetre got 16 minutes and used them to good effect, going 3/6 and hitting a couple of treys. Her three point shots are shot from over her head--almost impossible to defend. They almost look like trick shots except they go in.
Jones was a little off tonight, going only 1/6, generating 5 assists to 1 turnover. She also got the most time at 23 minutes. Count me as among the skeptics about using her as a point guard.
Jump was only 1/3. However, I watched her defense closely tonight, and she has improved from a year ago.
Emma-Nnopu had 0 points on 0/4 shooting, so she was trying. So far she is the epitome of a defensive specialist but I think many of us expect to see Nivar, Bosgana, or others taking her time if she cannot get on track offensively.
Prechtel, Belibi, and Betts all had their moments. Betts needs to work on her cardio--there were times when she was very slow up and down the court. But she had a sweet jumper, which I saw her making well past the elbow. Prechtel did not score--inexplicably.
Conclusion:
A fabulous deep team that will be exceptionally fun to see develop.
Many have commented about the depth of the team. I think it may be the deepest I have ever seen here at Stanford, and that was evident tonight. All 15 of players were healthy enough to play and did play, with nearly all players at 20 minutes or less. 11 players scored, with 4 in double digits. The majority of our points were scored by our bench. Tara has a problem--how to decide on a rotation when there could be 11 or 12 potential starters. That is what these first few games are for. We will know for sure what Tara's thinking is on November 20. Consider these first 5 games as auditions for the main event.
As a team, we did not play perfectly, particularly the 2nd quarter, when our offense went stagnant for a stretch and SDSU began to hit a few shots. Our three point shooting at 37% was so-so. We got about 1/2 of our misses back with O-boards, which was nice to see, and we had only 10 turnovers for the game--turnovers were a frequent problem last year. Then again, SDSU did not really have the personnel to force turnovers. 26 of our made 32 baskets were assisted.
But what did we learn about the team, really? Since SDSU is not very serious competition, I think we need to look to individual performances to discover new information about how this team is developing.
Performances:
Let's go straight to Lepolo, who in her first recorded game in college recorded 11 assists to 0 turnovers, coming off the bench in only 20 minutes of play. Could you imagine a 22 assist to 0 turnover night? Within the realm of the possible. Her assists came in varied ways, including a pass 3/4 the length of the court to Bosgana for a layup, but also drive-and dishes in close. Some here criticized her lack of a willingness to be aggressive offensively--by which they mean taking her own shot. She did attempt 2 treys but missed them both, but she also attacked the basket for a successful layup, which set up drive-and-dish plays afterwords. Yes her offense needs to come along, but what a promising start in a first game.
Our top scorer was Iriafen, at 16 points in 15 minutes, and 7/8 from the field with 6 rebounds to boot. She is showing that she belongs in there as a starter. She got into some foul trouble, though, so we need to monitor that just as we have had to watch Brink for the same reason.
Bosgana is a revelation at 15 points, 6 rebounds, 3 treys in only 15 minutes. She is proving to be equally adept at shooting treys as she is at slashing--she looks like a much more mature and complete player than a year ago, and is beginning to look a little to me like a Hull.
Brink looked much better to me than in the open practice or the Vanguard game. She scored 13 and had 8 rebounds, but the eye popping stat for her were 6 blocks and only 1 personal foul. Very encouraging.
The other player with 13 points was Nivar, who had her best performance by far today. She was 3/5 from three point range, showed speed and quickness, grabbed 2 steals and looked like a complete shooting guard. Her defense looked reasonable to me, as the 2 steals also attest.
Demetre got 16 minutes and used them to good effect, going 3/6 and hitting a couple of treys. Her three point shots are shot from over her head--almost impossible to defend. They almost look like trick shots except they go in.
Jones was a little off tonight, going only 1/6, generating 5 assists to 1 turnover. She also got the most time at 23 minutes. Count me as among the skeptics about using her as a point guard.
Jump was only 1/3. However, I watched her defense closely tonight, and she has improved from a year ago.
Emma-Nnopu had 0 points on 0/4 shooting, so she was trying. So far she is the epitome of a defensive specialist but I think many of us expect to see Nivar, Bosgana, or others taking her time if she cannot get on track offensively.
Prechtel, Belibi, and Betts all had their moments. Betts needs to work on her cardio--there were times when she was very slow up and down the court. But she had a sweet jumper, which I saw her making well past the elbow. Prechtel did not score--inexplicably.
Conclusion:
A fabulous deep team that will be exceptionally fun to see develop.
Overview:
Many have commented about the depth of the team. I think it may be the deepest I have ever seen here at Stanford, and that was evident tonight. All 15 of players were healthy enough to play and did play, with nearly all players at 20 minutes or less. 11 players scored, with 4 in double digits. The majority of our points were scored by our bench. Tara has a problem--how to decide on a rotation when there could be 11 or 12 potential starters. That is what these first few games are for. We will know for sure what Tara's thinking is on November 20. Consider these first 5 games as auditions for the main event.
As a team, we did not play perfectly, particularly the 2nd quarter, when our offense went stagnant for a stretch and SDSU began to hit a few shots. Our three point shooting at 37% was so-so. We got about 1/2 of our misses back with O-boards, which was nice to see, and we had only 10 turnovers for the game--turnovers were a frequent problem last year. Then again, SDSU did not really have the personnel to force turnovers. 26 of our made 32 baskets were assisted.
But what did we learn about the team, really? Since SDSU is not very serious competition, I think we need to look to individual performances to discover new information about how this team is developing.
Performances:
Let's go straight to Lepolo, who in her first recorded game in college recorded 11 assists to 0 turnovers, coming off the bench in only 20 minutes of play. Could you imagine a 22 assist to 0 turnover night? Within the realm of the possible. Her assists came in varied ways, including a pass 3/4 the length of the court to Bosgana for a layup, but also drive-and dishes in close. Some here criticized her lack of a willingness to be aggressive offensively--by which they mean taking her own shot. She did attempt 2 treys but missed them both, but she also attacked the basket for a successful layup, which set up drive-and-dish plays afterwords. Yes her offense needs to come along, but what a promising start in a first game.
Our top scorer was Iriafen, at 16 points in 15 minutes, and 7/8 from the field with 6 rebounds to boot. She is showing that she belongs in there as a starter. She got into some foul trouble, though, so we need to monitor that just as we have had to watch Brink for the same reason.
Bosgana is a revelation at 15 points, 6 rebounds, 3 treys in only 15 minutes. She is proving to be equally adept at shooting treys as she is at slashing--she looks like a much more mature and complete player than a year ago, and is beginning to look a little to me like a Hull.
Brink looked much better to me than in the open practice or the Vanguard game. She scored 13 and had 8 rebounds, but the eye popping stat for her were 6 blocks and only 1 personal foul. Very encouraging.
The other player with 13 points was Nivar, who had her best performance by far today. She was 3/5 from three point range, showed speed and quickness, grabbed 2 steals and looked like a complete shooting guard. Her defense looked reasonable to me, as the 2 steals also attest.
Demetre got 16 minutes and used them to good effect, going 3/6 and hitting a couple of treys. Her three point shots are shot from over her head--almost impossible to defend. They almost look like trick shots except they go in.
Jones was a little off tonight, going only 1/6, generating 5 assists to 1 turnover. She also got the most time at 23 minutes. Count me as among the skeptics about using her as a point guard.
Jump was only 1/3. However, I watched her defense closely tonight, and she has improved from a year ago.
Emma-Nnopu had 0 points on 0/4 shooting, so she was trying. So far she is the epitome of a defensive specialist but I think many of us expect to see Nivar, Bosgana, or others taking her time if she cannot get on track offensively.
Prechtel, Belibi, and Betts all had their moments. Betts needs to work on her cardio--there were times when she was very slow up and down the court. But she had a sweet jumper, which I saw her making well past the elbow. Prechtel did not score--inexplicably.
Conclusion:
A fabulous deep team that will be exceptionally fun to see develop.
Many have commented about the depth of the team. I think it may be the deepest I have ever seen here at Stanford, and that was evident tonight. All 15 of players were healthy enough to play and did play, with nearly all players at 20 minutes or less. 11 players scored, with 4 in double digits. The majority of our points were scored by our bench. Tara has a problem--how to decide on a rotation when there could be 11 or 12 potential starters. That is what these first few games are for. We will know for sure what Tara's thinking is on November 20. Consider these first 5 games as auditions for the main event.
As a team, we did not play perfectly, particularly the 2nd quarter, when our offense went stagnant for a stretch and SDSU began to hit a few shots. Our three point shooting at 37% was so-so. We got about 1/2 of our misses back with O-boards, which was nice to see, and we had only 10 turnovers for the game--turnovers were a frequent problem last year. Then again, SDSU did not really have the personnel to force turnovers. 26 of our made 32 baskets were assisted.
But what did we learn about the team, really? Since SDSU is not very serious competition, I think we need to look to individual performances to discover new information about how this team is developing.
Performances:
Let's go straight to Lepolo, who in her first recorded game in college recorded 11 assists to 0 turnovers, coming off the bench in only 20 minutes of play. Could you imagine a 22 assist to 0 turnover night? Within the realm of the possible. Her assists came in varied ways, including a pass 3/4 the length of the court to Bosgana for a layup, but also drive-and dishes in close. Some here criticized her lack of a willingness to be aggressive offensively--by which they mean taking her own shot. She did attempt 2 treys but missed them both, but she also attacked the basket for a successful layup, which set up drive-and-dish plays afterwords. Yes her offense needs to come along, but what a promising start in a first game.
Our top scorer was Iriafen, at 16 points in 15 minutes, and 7/8 from the field with 6 rebounds to boot. She is showing that she belongs in there as a starter. She got into some foul trouble, though, so we need to monitor that just as we have had to watch Brink for the same reason.
Bosgana is a revelation at 15 points, 6 rebounds, 3 treys in only 15 minutes. She is proving to be equally adept at shooting treys as she is at slashing--she looks like a much more mature and complete player than a year ago, and is beginning to look a little to me like a Hull.
Brink looked much better to me than in the open practice or the Vanguard game. She scored 13 and had 8 rebounds, but the eye popping stat for her were 6 blocks and only 1 personal foul. Very encouraging.
The other player with 13 points was Nivar, who had her best performance by far today. She was 3/5 from three point range, showed speed and quickness, grabbed 2 steals and looked like a complete shooting guard. Her defense looked reasonable to me, as the 2 steals also attest.
Demetre got 16 minutes and used them to good effect, going 3/6 and hitting a couple of treys. Her three point shots are shot from over her head--almost impossible to defend. They almost look like trick shots except they go in.
Jones was a little off tonight, going only 1/6, generating 5 assists to 1 turnover. She also got the most time at 23 minutes. Count me as among the skeptics about using her as a point guard.
Jump was only 1/3. However, I watched her defense closely tonight, and she has improved from a year ago.
Emma-Nnopu had 0 points on 0/4 shooting, so she was trying. So far she is the epitome of a defensive specialist but I think many of us expect to see Nivar, Bosgana, or others taking her time if she cannot get on track offensively.
Prechtel, Belibi, and Betts all had their moments. Betts needs to work on her cardio--there were times when she was very slow up and down the court. But she had a sweet jumper, which I saw her making well past the elbow. Prechtel did not score--inexplicably.
Conclusion:
A fabulous deep team that will be exceptionally fun to see develop.
11-07-2022, 11:10 PM
I am just not a fan of the non-scoring point guards. You should all know how that ends against real competition without having to watch a rerun some 5 years later. Her passing was better this game (allowing players to set first), she got scored on pretty easily (7 points? but not as easily as Fran) and the 3s she took and missed were wide open. Looks like Marta to me. Deja vu
There is a hidden cost of having non-shooters on the floor. The first 7 minutes of the game, Stanford only scored 10 points. Can you imagine what Stanford would score if the current starting lineup is still the starting lineup when S.Carolina rolls through? After Agnes was pulled, it seemed Stanford was able to score 15 pts in the remaining 3 minutes? I think there is a similar hidden cost with Lepolo. Every good team plays scouting report defense. Tara didn’t invent it.
There is a hidden cost of having non-shooters on the floor. The first 7 minutes of the game, Stanford only scored 10 points. Can you imagine what Stanford would score if the current starting lineup is still the starting lineup when S.Carolina rolls through? After Agnes was pulled, it seemed Stanford was able to score 15 pts in the remaining 3 minutes? I think there is a similar hidden cost with Lepolo. Every good team plays scouting report defense. Tara didn’t invent it.
I am just not a fan of the non-scoring point guards. You should all know how that ends against real competition without having to watch a rerun some 5 years later. Her passing was better this game (allowing players to set first), she got scored on pretty easily (7 points? but not as easily as Fran) and the 3s she took and missed were wide open. Looks like Marta to me. Deja vu
There is a hidden cost of having non-shooters on the floor. The first 7 minutes of the game, Stanford only scored 10 points. Can you imagine what Stanford would score if the current starting lineup is still the starting lineup when S.Carolina rolls through? After Agnes was pulled, it seemed Stanford was able to score 15 pts in the remaining 3 minutes? I think there is a similar hidden cost with Lepolo. Every good team plays scouting report defense. Tara didn’t invent it.
There is a hidden cost of having non-shooters on the floor. The first 7 minutes of the game, Stanford only scored 10 points. Can you imagine what Stanford would score if the current starting lineup is still the starting lineup when S.Carolina rolls through? After Agnes was pulled, it seemed Stanford was able to score 15 pts in the remaining 3 minutes? I think there is a similar hidden cost with Lepolo. Every good team plays scouting report defense. Tara didn’t invent it.
11-07-2022, 11:21 PM
I do not understand why you are so sure Lepolo has no offense. First it was oh she will get picked on and "inverted." Now it is she is Marta. No, she is not Marta. A pass first point guard is just fine, as long as she takes her shots in the flow of the offense, which she is very capable of doing. I recall her hitting shots in the open practice just fine. Assists count for offense too. To me it is way more a positive that Lepolo did so well running the team. Eleven assists? Eleven assists! And her defense was not bad either. It is game 1 freshman season. Kinda seems to me like maybe we let them settle in a bit before we decide what they can and can't do?
I do not understand why you are so sure Lepolo has no offense. First it was oh she will get picked on and "inverted." Now it is she is Marta. No, she is not Marta. A pass first point guard is just fine, as long as she takes her shots in the flow of the offense, which she is very capable of doing. I recall her hitting shots in the open practice just fine. Assists count for offense too. To me it is way more a positive that Lepolo did so well running the team. Eleven assists? Eleven assists! And her defense was not bad either. It is game 1 freshman season. Kinda seems to me like maybe we let them settle in a bit before we decide what they can and can't do?
(11-07-2022, 06:14 PM)Card10Fan Wrote:(11-07-2022, 05:09 PM)chimera Wrote:(11-07-2022, 02:55 PM)Baez87 Wrote: For anyone who attends the games and is wondering if and when the pre-game Chalk Talks would resume this year: CHALK TALKS START WITH PAC-12 GAMES!
I wonder why they won't do them for non-conference. They used to do them before every game except exhibitions. Just one more way they seem not to care about hard core fans. Chalk talks are just an assistant coach spending 10 minutes answering questions, nothing too time consuming or difficult, no real preparation needed. But they can't be bothered until conference season? And wonder why attendance is not more... (I know very few of the fans who attend a game also go early for a chalk talk, but come on, having one is the minimum they can do for fans who care enough to attend them.). Yes, I am annoyed that the little we get as far as interaction with the program keeps getting less and less and less.
I'm annoyed too. Has anyone every emailed anyone within the WBB program about the concerns? Not that doing so would make any difference but would be curious if voicing frustration would actually elicit a response from anyone.
Pre-game tonight, I talked to someone (a good friend) who is on the Buck Cardinal Club Board about this -- this person is a big time WBB fan. Going to pass on our frustration and total discontent to the powers that.
(11-07-2022, 09:51 PM)BostonCard Wrote: Final Score: SDSU 48 - Stanford bench 48
None of Stanford's starters played more than 23 minutes. 15 players total played, 10 got at least 10 minutes. Four players got to double digit points; another three got 5 or more.
Leaders of the game:
Kiki Iriafen: 16 pts, 6 rebounds
Elena Bosgana: 15 pts, 6 rebounds
Cameron Brink: 13 pts, 8 rebounds, 3 assists
Talana Lepolo: 11 assists, 0 turnovers
BC
Add 6 blocks to Cam's stat line -- plus only 1 foul
(11-07-2022, 06:14 PM)Card10Fan Wrote:(11-07-2022, 05:09 PM)chimera Wrote:(11-07-2022, 02:55 PM)Baez87 Wrote: For anyone who attends the games and is wondering if and when the pre-game Chalk Talks would resume this year: CHALK TALKS START WITH PAC-12 GAMES!
I wonder why they won't do them for non-conference. They used to do them before every game except exhibitions. Just one more way they seem not to care about hard core fans. Chalk talks are just an assistant coach spending 10 minutes answering questions, nothing too time consuming or difficult, no real preparation needed. But they can't be bothered until conference season? And wonder why attendance is not more... (I know very few of the fans who attend a game also go early for a chalk talk, but come on, having one is the minimum they can do for fans who care enough to attend them.). Yes, I am annoyed that the little we get as far as interaction with the program keeps getting less and less and less.
I'm annoyed too. Has anyone every emailed anyone within the WBB program about the concerns? Not that doing so would make any difference but would be curious if voicing frustration would actually elicit a response from anyone.
Pre-game tonight, I talked to someone (a good friend) who is on the Buck Cardinal Club Board about this -- this person is a big time WBB fan. Going to pass on our frustration and total discontent to the powers that.
(11-07-2022, 09:51 PM)BostonCard Wrote: Final Score: SDSU 48 - Stanford bench 48
None of Stanford's starters played more than 23 minutes. 15 players total played, 10 got at least 10 minutes. Four players got to double digit points; another three got 5 or more.
Leaders of the game:
Kiki Iriafen: 16 pts, 6 rebounds
Elena Bosgana: 15 pts, 6 rebounds
Cameron Brink: 13 pts, 8 rebounds, 3 assists
Talana Lepolo: 11 assists, 0 turnovers
BC
Add 6 blocks to Cam's stat line -- plus only 1 foul
11-07-2022, 11:33 PM
Lepolo was inverted but in this game it was also just easy enough to shoot over her.
You are clearly a fan of pass [first] [only] guards. I am not. It’s a matter of preference. 11 assist against San Diego mostly in garbage time is inflated. Tara could have given more time to Jzaniya or someone else at point in garbage time to give them experience. I also know Haley’s offense is suffering because she has to waste so much energy bringing up the ball. Similarly, I don’t need to wait and see how the Haley as point guard 90% of the time plays out to know it’s a bad idea. It was a bad idea on paper when I read it this summer. But I also know there is a good chance Tara won’t make any changes (even with these early signs) until there is a scare or an actual loss.
You are clearly a fan of pass [first] [only] guards. I am not. It’s a matter of preference. 11 assist against San Diego mostly in garbage time is inflated. Tara could have given more time to Jzaniya or someone else at point in garbage time to give them experience. I also know Haley’s offense is suffering because she has to waste so much energy bringing up the ball. Similarly, I don’t need to wait and see how the Haley as point guard 90% of the time plays out to know it’s a bad idea. It was a bad idea on paper when I read it this summer. But I also know there is a good chance Tara won’t make any changes (even with these early signs) until there is a scare or an actual loss.
Lepolo was inverted but in this game it was also just easy enough to shoot over her.
You are clearly a fan of pass [first] [only] guards. I am not. It’s a matter of preference. 11 assist against San Diego mostly in garbage time is inflated. Tara could have given more time to Jzaniya or someone else at point in garbage time to give them experience. I also know Haley’s offense is suffering because she has to waste so much energy bringing up the ball. Similarly, I don’t need to wait and see how the Haley as point guard 90% of the time plays out to know it’s a bad idea. It was a bad idea on paper when I read it this summer. But I also know there is a good chance Tara won’t make any changes (even with these early signs) until there is a scare or an actual loss.
You are clearly a fan of pass [first] [only] guards. I am not. It’s a matter of preference. 11 assist against San Diego mostly in garbage time is inflated. Tara could have given more time to Jzaniya or someone else at point in garbage time to give them experience. I also know Haley’s offense is suffering because she has to waste so much energy bringing up the ball. Similarly, I don’t need to wait and see how the Haley as point guard 90% of the time plays out to know it’s a bad idea. It was a bad idea on paper when I read it this summer. But I also know there is a good chance Tara won’t make any changes (even with these early signs) until there is a scare or an actual loss.
I was thrilled with our young players. I know SDSU is not a very good team, but they are relatively experienced. Nivar played very well and I agree with those who think she may end up getting a lot of time as the 2 guard/defensive pest that Emma-Nnopu is playing. She is very fast, very quick, quick hands, and a nice shot. She ran the point well when she played there too. Impressive debut.
Bosgana looks so much improved. We have now two games, albeit against poor competition, where she has played well in all facets of the game. She looks so loose and lanky but she does defend reasonably well and can be a pest with her length. If she can hit threes like she has been, look out. Tara has to get her out there even with such a deep team.
Iriafen looks good, and I think will just keep getting better as she gets more playing time. I get the sense that she is not quite showing all of what she can do yet.
Lepolo to me looked excellent. She plays fast, doesn't overdribble, keeps that ball moving, and passes well in the half court and on the break. I did not notice her getting abused by opposing guards. She was staying in front of them well for the most part. She looked good when she drove too, drive and dish and the one she took all the way. Yes, it would be good if she would get her three ball going but let's maybe give it a few games and see what happens, perhaps?
Demetre had another strong game. Her shot is so good. The issue is where to play her. She is 6'3" and not super quick so she can't really defend little guards and we are so stacked inside. I think they have to just key in on good match-ups for her and get her out there as much as possible when they occur.
Betts seems like she is still coming back from whatever illness she had a week or so ago. Seems like they are playing her just a few minutes here and there. No reason to rush her. It is obvious she can be a game changer once she gets more used to the pace and physicality of the college game. She is not there yet but I am encouraged.
And now I am tired and don't feel like writing more. But I feel very good about all our young players.
Bosgana looks so much improved. We have now two games, albeit against poor competition, where she has played well in all facets of the game. She looks so loose and lanky but she does defend reasonably well and can be a pest with her length. If she can hit threes like she has been, look out. Tara has to get her out there even with such a deep team.
Iriafen looks good, and I think will just keep getting better as she gets more playing time. I get the sense that she is not quite showing all of what she can do yet.
Lepolo to me looked excellent. She plays fast, doesn't overdribble, keeps that ball moving, and passes well in the half court and on the break. I did not notice her getting abused by opposing guards. She was staying in front of them well for the most part. She looked good when she drove too, drive and dish and the one she took all the way. Yes, it would be good if she would get her three ball going but let's maybe give it a few games and see what happens, perhaps?
Demetre had another strong game. Her shot is so good. The issue is where to play her. She is 6'3" and not super quick so she can't really defend little guards and we are so stacked inside. I think they have to just key in on good match-ups for her and get her out there as much as possible when they occur.
Betts seems like she is still coming back from whatever illness she had a week or so ago. Seems like they are playing her just a few minutes here and there. No reason to rush her. It is obvious she can be a game changer once she gets more used to the pace and physicality of the college game. She is not there yet but I am encouraged.
And now I am tired and don't feel like writing more. But I feel very good about all our young players.
I was thrilled with our young players. I know SDSU is not a very good team, but they are relatively experienced. Nivar played very well and I agree with those who think she may end up getting a lot of time as the 2 guard/defensive pest that Emma-Nnopu is playing. She is very fast, very quick, quick hands, and a nice shot. She ran the point well when she played there too. Impressive debut.
Bosgana looks so much improved. We have now two games, albeit against poor competition, where she has played well in all facets of the game. She looks so loose and lanky but she does defend reasonably well and can be a pest with her length. If she can hit threes like she has been, look out. Tara has to get her out there even with such a deep team.
Iriafen looks good, and I think will just keep getting better as she gets more playing time. I get the sense that she is not quite showing all of what she can do yet.
Lepolo to me looked excellent. She plays fast, doesn't overdribble, keeps that ball moving, and passes well in the half court and on the break. I did not notice her getting abused by opposing guards. She was staying in front of them well for the most part. She looked good when she drove too, drive and dish and the one she took all the way. Yes, it would be good if she would get her three ball going but let's maybe give it a few games and see what happens, perhaps?
Demetre had another strong game. Her shot is so good. The issue is where to play her. She is 6'3" and not super quick so she can't really defend little guards and we are so stacked inside. I think they have to just key in on good match-ups for her and get her out there as much as possible when they occur.
Betts seems like she is still coming back from whatever illness she had a week or so ago. Seems like they are playing her just a few minutes here and there. No reason to rush her. It is obvious she can be a game changer once she gets more used to the pace and physicality of the college game. She is not there yet but I am encouraged.
And now I am tired and don't feel like writing more. But I feel very good about all our young players.
Bosgana looks so much improved. We have now two games, albeit against poor competition, where she has played well in all facets of the game. She looks so loose and lanky but she does defend reasonably well and can be a pest with her length. If she can hit threes like she has been, look out. Tara has to get her out there even with such a deep team.
Iriafen looks good, and I think will just keep getting better as she gets more playing time. I get the sense that she is not quite showing all of what she can do yet.
Lepolo to me looked excellent. She plays fast, doesn't overdribble, keeps that ball moving, and passes well in the half court and on the break. I did not notice her getting abused by opposing guards. She was staying in front of them well for the most part. She looked good when she drove too, drive and dish and the one she took all the way. Yes, it would be good if she would get her three ball going but let's maybe give it a few games and see what happens, perhaps?
Demetre had another strong game. Her shot is so good. The issue is where to play her. She is 6'3" and not super quick so she can't really defend little guards and we are so stacked inside. I think they have to just key in on good match-ups for her and get her out there as much as possible when they occur.
Betts seems like she is still coming back from whatever illness she had a week or so ago. Seems like they are playing her just a few minutes here and there. No reason to rush her. It is obvious she can be a game changer once she gets more used to the pace and physicality of the college game. She is not there yet but I am encouraged.
And now I am tired and don't feel like writing more. But I feel very good about all our young players.
11-07-2022, 11:37 PM
(This post was last modified: 11-07-2022, 11:40 PM by BostonCard.)
I wouldn’t draw too many conclusions (good or bad) on Lepolo from a single game against an overmatched opponent. The key will be how she responds to teams daring her to shoot. As chimera notes, there is nothing wrong with a pass-first point guard; given our weapons it is probably what we are looking for, as getting the ball to our high efficiency offensive threats in a position to score is good, actually. The issue, which we couldn’t evaluate in this game is if Lepolo becomes so gun shy that opponents key in our scorers when she has the ball. Time will tell, as they say.
BC
You know who else was loose and lanky on the floor? Kate Starbird. Turned into one hell of a player.
BC
BC
(11-07-2022, 11:36 PM)chimera Wrote: Bosgana looks so much improved. We have now two games, albeit against poor competition, where she has played well in all facets of the game. She looks so loose and lanky but she does defend reasonably well and can be a pest with her length. If she can hit threes like she has been, look out. Tara has to get her out there even with such a deep team.
You know who else was loose and lanky on the floor? Kate Starbird. Turned into one hell of a player.
BC
(This post was last modified: 11-07-2022, 11:40 PM by BostonCard.)
I wouldn’t draw too many conclusions (good or bad) on Lepolo from a single game against an overmatched opponent. The key will be how she responds to teams daring her to shoot. As chimera notes, there is nothing wrong with a pass-first point guard; given our weapons it is probably what we are looking for, as getting the ball to our high efficiency offensive threats in a position to score is good, actually. The issue, which we couldn’t evaluate in this game is if Lepolo becomes so gun shy that opponents key in our scorers when she has the ball. Time will tell, as they say.
BC
You know who else was loose and lanky on the floor? Kate Starbird. Turned into one hell of a player.
BC
BC
(11-07-2022, 11:36 PM)chimera Wrote: Bosgana looks so much improved. We have now two games, albeit against poor competition, where she has played well in all facets of the game. She looks so loose and lanky but she does defend reasonably well and can be a pest with her length. If she can hit threes like she has been, look out. Tara has to get her out there even with such a deep team.
You know who else was loose and lanky on the floor? Kate Starbird. Turned into one hell of a player.
BC
11-07-2022, 11:44 PM
(This post was last modified: 11-07-2022, 11:45 PM by cardfan1996.)
The TV announcer said Marta was in the audience. I am not even kidding. It probably would have been easy to find her
(This post was last modified: 11-07-2022, 11:45 PM by cardfan1996.)
The TV announcer said Marta was in the audience. I am not even kidding. It probably would have been easy to find her
11-07-2022, 11:44 PM
(11-07-2022, 11:33 PM)cardfan1996 Wrote: Lepolo was inverted but in this game it was also just easy enough to shoot over her.
You are clearly a fan of pass [first] [only] guards. I am not. It’s a matter of preference. 11 assist against San Diego mostly in garbage time is inflated. Tara could have given more time to Jzaniya or someone else at point in garbage time to give them experience. I also know Haley’s offense is suffering because she has to waste so much energy bringing up the ball. Similarly, I don’t need to wait and see how the Haley as point guard 90% of the time plays out to know it’s a bad idea. It was a bad idea on paper when I read it this summer. But I also know there is a good chance Tara won’t make any changes (even with these early signs) until there is a scare or an actual loss.
Yeah, once she ended up inside defending a bigger player, and that player did not get the ball, much less score if I recall correctly. No, I am not clearly a fan of pass first or pass only guards. I am a fan of all types of guards. I am not a fan of premature evaluations or of accentuating the negative such as saying Lepolo's assists were all in garbage time. Score-wise the whole game was sorta garbage time, except it wasn't really, and she passed well in all four quarters against the opponents starters and rotation players. That is not garbage time.
I do not like Jones at the point for large amounts of time either, and have never liked that idea. I like when she gets a rebound and leads a break or gets a quick pass and does that, like she did last season. I like when her as pg is used occasionally during a game as a change up thing. This game Jones was on the wing when Lepolo was in the game with her, and I think when Nivar was too maybe. Definitely when Lepolo was. So if you want Jones not at the point, better start loving Lepolo, because her out there lead to Jones playing elsewhere.
(11-07-2022, 11:33 PM)cardfan1996 Wrote: Lepolo was inverted but in this game it was also just easy enough to shoot over her.
You are clearly a fan of pass [first] [only] guards. I am not. It’s a matter of preference. 11 assist against San Diego mostly in garbage time is inflated. Tara could have given more time to Jzaniya or someone else at point in garbage time to give them experience. I also know Haley’s offense is suffering because she has to waste so much energy bringing up the ball. Similarly, I don’t need to wait and see how the Haley as point guard 90% of the time plays out to know it’s a bad idea. It was a bad idea on paper when I read it this summer. But I also know there is a good chance Tara won’t make any changes (even with these early signs) until there is a scare or an actual loss.
Yeah, once she ended up inside defending a bigger player, and that player did not get the ball, much less score if I recall correctly. No, I am not clearly a fan of pass first or pass only guards. I am a fan of all types of guards. I am not a fan of premature evaluations or of accentuating the negative such as saying Lepolo's assists were all in garbage time. Score-wise the whole game was sorta garbage time, except it wasn't really, and she passed well in all four quarters against the opponents starters and rotation players. That is not garbage time.
I do not like Jones at the point for large amounts of time either, and have never liked that idea. I like when she gets a rebound and leads a break or gets a quick pass and does that, like she did last season. I like when her as pg is used occasionally during a game as a change up thing. This game Jones was on the wing when Lepolo was in the game with her, and I think when Nivar was too maybe. Definitely when Lepolo was. So if you want Jones not at the point, better start loving Lepolo, because her out there lead to Jones playing elsewhere.
11-08-2022, 12:13 AM
11 assists, 2 points, 2 steals, 2 rebounds, 0 fouls, 0 turnovers. With a stat line like that, when you have 4 other players scoring in double figures (mostly on your dimes) who needs points?
11 assists, 2 points, 2 steals, 2 rebounds, 0 fouls, 0 turnovers. With a stat line like that, when you have 4 other players scoring in double figures (mostly on your dimes) who needs points?
(11-08-2022, 12:13 AM)TheWildJacko Wrote: 11 assists, 2 points, 2 steals, 2 rebounds, 0 fouls, 0 turnovers. With a stat line like that, when you have 4 other players scoring in double figures (mostly on your dimes) who needs points?
Let's not get carried away by one game against an overmatched opponent. When facing against a top tier team such as South Carolina or UConn with much better defenders, we need all five players on the court to have the ability to score. We've seen it in the past - Sniezek was a great passer and facilitator but she was not willing to make jump shots even when wide open and that allowed opposing teams to sag off of her and provide them more options to double-team someone else.
(This post was last modified: 11-08-2022, 12:26 AM by TheFarm07.)
(11-08-2022, 12:13 AM)TheWildJacko Wrote: 11 assists, 2 points, 2 steals, 2 rebounds, 0 fouls, 0 turnovers. With a stat line like that, when you have 4 other players scoring in double figures (mostly on your dimes) who needs points?
Let's not get carried away by one game against an overmatched opponent. When facing against a top tier team such as South Carolina or UConn with much better defenders, we need all five players on the court to have the ability to score. We've seen it in the past - Sniezek was a great passer and facilitator but she was not willing to make jump shots even when wide open and that allowed opposing teams to sag off of her and provide them more options to double-team someone else.
11-08-2022, 02:05 AM
(This post was last modified: 11-08-2022, 02:44 AM by cardfan1996.)
(11-08-2022, 12:26 AM)TheFarm07 Wrote:(11-08-2022, 12:13 AM)TheWildJacko Wrote: 11 assists, 2 points, 2 steals, 2 rebounds, 0 fouls, 0 turnovers. With a stat line like that, when you have 4 other players scoring in double figures (mostly on your dimes) who needs points?
Let's not get carried away by one game against an overmatched opponent. When facing against a top tier team such as South Carolina or UConn with much better defenders, we need all five players on the court to have the ability to score. We've seen it in the past - Sniezek was a great passer and facilitator but she was not willing to make jump shots even when wide open and that allowed opposing teams to sag off of her and provide them more options to double-team someone else.
Thank you. Those good offensive players look human if Lepolo’s defenders are in their driving lanes (Haley) or double teaming in the post (Cam, Kiki). Stanford has tried to play 4 on 5 on offense many many many many times in the past (honestly it’s like groundhogs day), and you don’t win the big trophy at the end that way. It’s simply a spacing issue. We’ve had some of the very best offensive talent in the post (Nneka for sure and Chiney had to score efficiently against triple teams) but in the end, they fell short time and time again because there was nothing they could do with the cards dealt to them on the perimeter. Haley and Cam haven’t had to consistently face those odds (double or triple teams) (esp. in 2021) because they had willing shooters at every position (even Anna’s %s we’re great during that 2021 run breaking the NCAA 3-point tourney record as a team and still barely beating Arizona by 1 point). Had Anna been able to replicate those percentages in 2022, they’d be the two-time defending champions. The margin for victory is paper thin even with 40% 3-point shooters surrounding your two All-Americans. So what is the probability that a non-shooter makes things better? I don’t have to get use to anyone and I don’t have to reserve judgment from a story I’ve seen play out a lot over the years. I simply know how the story ends and I’d rather focus on rewrites. I certainly don’t have to accept a 70s style pure point guard that Tara seems to love (like Marta) in 2022 when there are winning skill sets on the bench in Bosgana and Nivar (both of whom are better ballhandlers than Lacie and Anna and both can learn the point). Thankfully, WBB has evolved. Stanford has the championship blueprint. Follow that.
(This post was last modified: 11-08-2022, 02:44 AM by cardfan1996.)
(11-08-2022, 12:26 AM)TheFarm07 Wrote:(11-08-2022, 12:13 AM)TheWildJacko Wrote: 11 assists, 2 points, 2 steals, 2 rebounds, 0 fouls, 0 turnovers. With a stat line like that, when you have 4 other players scoring in double figures (mostly on your dimes) who needs points?
Let's not get carried away by one game against an overmatched opponent. When facing against a top tier team such as South Carolina or UConn with much better defenders, we need all five players on the court to have the ability to score. We've seen it in the past - Sniezek was a great passer and facilitator but she was not willing to make jump shots even when wide open and that allowed opposing teams to sag off of her and provide them more options to double-team someone else.
Thank you. Those good offensive players look human if Lepolo’s defenders are in their driving lanes (Haley) or double teaming in the post (Cam, Kiki). Stanford has tried to play 4 on 5 on offense many many many many times in the past (honestly it’s like groundhogs day), and you don’t win the big trophy at the end that way. It’s simply a spacing issue. We’ve had some of the very best offensive talent in the post (Nneka for sure and Chiney had to score efficiently against triple teams) but in the end, they fell short time and time again because there was nothing they could do with the cards dealt to them on the perimeter. Haley and Cam haven’t had to consistently face those odds (double or triple teams) (esp. in 2021) because they had willing shooters at every position (even Anna’s %s we’re great during that 2021 run breaking the NCAA 3-point tourney record as a team and still barely beating Arizona by 1 point). Had Anna been able to replicate those percentages in 2022, they’d be the two-time defending champions. The margin for victory is paper thin even with 40% 3-point shooters surrounding your two All-Americans. So what is the probability that a non-shooter makes things better? I don’t have to get use to anyone and I don’t have to reserve judgment from a story I’ve seen play out a lot over the years. I simply know how the story ends and I’d rather focus on rewrites. I certainly don’t have to accept a 70s style pure point guard that Tara seems to love (like Marta) in 2022 when there are winning skill sets on the bench in Bosgana and Nivar (both of whom are better ballhandlers than Lacie and Anna and both can learn the point). Thankfully, WBB has evolved. Stanford has the championship blueprint. Follow that.
11-08-2022, 04:11 AM
(11-08-2022, 12:26 AM)TheFarm07 Wrote:(11-08-2022, 12:13 AM)TheWildJacko Wrote: 11 assists, 2 points, 2 steals, 2 rebounds, 0 fouls, 0 turnovers. With a stat line like that, when you have 4 other players scoring in double figures (mostly on your dimes) who needs points?
Let's not get carried away by one game against an overmatched opponent. When facing against a top tier team such as South Carolina or UConn with much better defenders, we need all five players on the court to have the ability to score. We've seen it in the past - Sniezek was a great passer and facilitator but she was not willing to make jump shots even when wide open and that allowed opposing teams to sag off of her and provide them more options to double-team someone else.
Let's not get carried away by one player 5 years ago. Anyone who wants to take a single 2-point game as an indictment that Lepolo doesn't shoot seemingly hasn't done their due diligence.
High school stats do not guarantee college stats, but GoStanford indicates Lepolo "Averaged 15.0 points, 8.6 assists, 5.0 rebounds and 4.5 steals per game as a senior". She had 32 points in her final high school game. "Lepolo continually drove to the basket and finished two-point shots, many of them with a high degree of difficulty."
(BTW, Sniezek was NOT a great passer. Her senior year, she had 150 A and 78 TO. In her junior year (I can't find 2018 NCAA individual rankings) she was 99th in Assists/TO and 98th in Assists/game. No doubt she would have done better with this year's team, but, as I recall, she tried too many questionable passes.)
Lepolo's assists per quarter were 2, 1, 5, 3, playing 6, 4, 6, 5 minutes (non-starter).
As to a claim that the assists came during garbage time:
The cumulative time of SDS starters in this game by quarter were 29, 29, 28, 31 minutes. I don't see that "garbage time" is appropriate for what SDS was playing. (Stanford starters played 37, 27, 28, 0 minutes.)
As to a claim that the whole game was garbage time:
San Diego State was ranked #186 (out of 356) by the Net rankings last year.
(In Marta's senior year, she had 5 Assists and 2 TO in 20 minutes against RPI #205 CS Bakersfield, and 4 Assists and 2 TO in 27 minutes against #229 UC Riverside.)
Stanford single-game individual records indicate 11 assists in a single game is tied for 22rd in Stanford history (1x 16, 1x 15, 3x 13, 16x 12).
Marta did have a 13 Assist / 0 TO game in 24 minutes in a loss to Washington as a sophomore in 2016.
Maybe in 5 years we'll look back and see this as the best game in Lepolo's career, but I seriously doubt it.
(11-08-2022, 12:26 AM)TheFarm07 Wrote:(11-08-2022, 12:13 AM)TheWildJacko Wrote: 11 assists, 2 points, 2 steals, 2 rebounds, 0 fouls, 0 turnovers. With a stat line like that, when you have 4 other players scoring in double figures (mostly on your dimes) who needs points?
Let's not get carried away by one game against an overmatched opponent. When facing against a top tier team such as South Carolina or UConn with much better defenders, we need all five players on the court to have the ability to score. We've seen it in the past - Sniezek was a great passer and facilitator but she was not willing to make jump shots even when wide open and that allowed opposing teams to sag off of her and provide them more options to double-team someone else.
Let's not get carried away by one player 5 years ago. Anyone who wants to take a single 2-point game as an indictment that Lepolo doesn't shoot seemingly hasn't done their due diligence.
High school stats do not guarantee college stats, but GoStanford indicates Lepolo "Averaged 15.0 points, 8.6 assists, 5.0 rebounds and 4.5 steals per game as a senior". She had 32 points in her final high school game. "Lepolo continually drove to the basket and finished two-point shots, many of them with a high degree of difficulty."
(BTW, Sniezek was NOT a great passer. Her senior year, she had 150 A and 78 TO. In her junior year (I can't find 2018 NCAA individual rankings) she was 99th in Assists/TO and 98th in Assists/game. No doubt she would have done better with this year's team, but, as I recall, she tried too many questionable passes.)
Lepolo's assists per quarter were 2, 1, 5, 3, playing 6, 4, 6, 5 minutes (non-starter).
As to a claim that the assists came during garbage time:
The cumulative time of SDS starters in this game by quarter were 29, 29, 28, 31 minutes. I don't see that "garbage time" is appropriate for what SDS was playing. (Stanford starters played 37, 27, 28, 0 minutes.)
As to a claim that the whole game was garbage time:
San Diego State was ranked #186 (out of 356) by the Net rankings last year.
(In Marta's senior year, she had 5 Assists and 2 TO in 20 minutes against RPI #205 CS Bakersfield, and 4 Assists and 2 TO in 27 minutes against #229 UC Riverside.)
Stanford single-game individual records indicate 11 assists in a single game is tied for 22rd in Stanford history (1x 16, 1x 15, 3x 13, 16x 12).
Marta did have a 13 Assist / 0 TO game in 24 minutes in a loss to Washington as a sophomore in 2016.
Maybe in 5 years we'll look back and see this as the best game in Lepolo's career, but I seriously doubt it.
(11-08-2022, 04:11 AM)M T Wrote:(11-08-2022, 12:26 AM)TheFarm07 Wrote:(11-08-2022, 12:13 AM)TheWildJacko Wrote: 11 assists, 2 points, 2 steals, 2 rebounds, 0 fouls, 0 turnovers. With a stat line like that, when you have 4 other players scoring in double figures (mostly on your dimes) who needs points?
Let's not get carried away by one game against an overmatched opponent. When facing against a top tier team such as South Carolina or UConn with much better defenders, we need all five players on the court to have the ability to score. We've seen it in the past - Sniezek was a great passer and facilitator but she was not willing to make jump shots even when wide open and that allowed opposing teams to sag off of her and provide them more options to double-team someone else.
Let's not get carried away by one player 5 years ago. Anyone who wants to take a single 2-point game as an indictment that Lepolo doesn't shoot seemingly hasn't done their due diligence.
High school stats do not guarantee college stats, but GoStanford indicates Lepolo "Averaged 15.0 points, 8.6 assists, 5.0 rebounds and 4.5 steals per game as a senior". She had 32 points in her final high school game. "Lepolo continually drove to the basket and finished two-point shots, many of them with a high degree of difficulty."
(BTW, Sniezek was NOT a great passer. Her senior year, she had 150 A and 78 TO. In her junior year (I can't find 2018 NCAA individual rankings) she was 99th in Assists/TO and 98th in Assists/game. No doubt she would have done better with this year's team, but, as I recall, she tried too many questionable passes.)
Lepolo's assists per quarter were 2, 1, 5, 3, playing 6, 4, 6, 5 minutes (non-starter).
As to a claim that the assists came during garbage time:
The cumulative time of SDS starters in this game by quarter were 29, 29, 28, 31 minutes. I don't see that "garbage time" is appropriate for what SDS was playing. (Stanford starters played 37, 27, 28, 0 minutes.)
As to a claim that the whole game was garbage time:
San Diego State was ranked #186 (out of 356) by the Net rankings last year.
(In Marta's senior year, she had 5 Assists and 2 TO in 20 minutes against RPI #205 CS Bakersfield, and 4 Assists and 2 TO in 27 minutes against #229 UC Riverside.)
Stanford single-game individual records indicate 11 assists in a single game is tied for 22rd in Stanford history (1x 16, 1x 15, 3x 13, 16x 12).
Marta did have a 13 Assist / 0 TO game in 24 minutes in a loss to Washington as a sophomore in 2016.
Maybe in 5 years we'll look back and see this as the best game in Lepolo's career, but I seriously doubt it.
Let's not make the same mistake extrapolating from high school stats again. According to Sniezek's Stanford profile, she:
As a junior in 2014, led the Washington, D.C. metro area averaging 30.6 points per game to go along with 8.5 rebounds per game, 6.7 assists per game and 6.6 steals per game.
This also came from an article when Sniezek announced her commitment: "She showed a much improved shot from long range with 46 three-pointers made, including five in a season-high 43-point performance at Georgetown Visitation on Feb. 18."
Also, you misinterpreted my point. I was not trying to say Lepolo is not going to shoot the ball in her collegiate career based on one game. I was saying that we shouldn't jump to conclusions either way from a sample size of 1 against an opponent we handled easily. And that having the possibility of a pass-only PG limits our offensive options as cardfan1996 pointed out.
(This post was last modified: 11-08-2022, 06:53 AM by TheFarm07.)
(11-08-2022, 04:11 AM)M T Wrote:(11-08-2022, 12:26 AM)TheFarm07 Wrote:(11-08-2022, 12:13 AM)TheWildJacko Wrote: 11 assists, 2 points, 2 steals, 2 rebounds, 0 fouls, 0 turnovers. With a stat line like that, when you have 4 other players scoring in double figures (mostly on your dimes) who needs points?
Let's not get carried away by one game against an overmatched opponent. When facing against a top tier team such as South Carolina or UConn with much better defenders, we need all five players on the court to have the ability to score. We've seen it in the past - Sniezek was a great passer and facilitator but she was not willing to make jump shots even when wide open and that allowed opposing teams to sag off of her and provide them more options to double-team someone else.
Let's not get carried away by one player 5 years ago. Anyone who wants to take a single 2-point game as an indictment that Lepolo doesn't shoot seemingly hasn't done their due diligence.
High school stats do not guarantee college stats, but GoStanford indicates Lepolo "Averaged 15.0 points, 8.6 assists, 5.0 rebounds and 4.5 steals per game as a senior". She had 32 points in her final high school game. "Lepolo continually drove to the basket and finished two-point shots, many of them with a high degree of difficulty."
(BTW, Sniezek was NOT a great passer. Her senior year, she had 150 A and 78 TO. In her junior year (I can't find 2018 NCAA individual rankings) she was 99th in Assists/TO and 98th in Assists/game. No doubt she would have done better with this year's team, but, as I recall, she tried too many questionable passes.)
Lepolo's assists per quarter were 2, 1, 5, 3, playing 6, 4, 6, 5 minutes (non-starter).
As to a claim that the assists came during garbage time:
The cumulative time of SDS starters in this game by quarter were 29, 29, 28, 31 minutes. I don't see that "garbage time" is appropriate for what SDS was playing. (Stanford starters played 37, 27, 28, 0 minutes.)
As to a claim that the whole game was garbage time:
San Diego State was ranked #186 (out of 356) by the Net rankings last year.
(In Marta's senior year, she had 5 Assists and 2 TO in 20 minutes against RPI #205 CS Bakersfield, and 4 Assists and 2 TO in 27 minutes against #229 UC Riverside.)
Stanford single-game individual records indicate 11 assists in a single game is tied for 22rd in Stanford history (1x 16, 1x 15, 3x 13, 16x 12).
Marta did have a 13 Assist / 0 TO game in 24 minutes in a loss to Washington as a sophomore in 2016.
Maybe in 5 years we'll look back and see this as the best game in Lepolo's career, but I seriously doubt it.
Let's not make the same mistake extrapolating from high school stats again. According to Sniezek's Stanford profile, she:
As a junior in 2014, led the Washington, D.C. metro area averaging 30.6 points per game to go along with 8.5 rebounds per game, 6.7 assists per game and 6.6 steals per game.
This also came from an article when Sniezek announced her commitment: "She showed a much improved shot from long range with 46 three-pointers made, including five in a season-high 43-point performance at Georgetown Visitation on Feb. 18."
Also, you misinterpreted my point. I was not trying to say Lepolo is not going to shoot the ball in her collegiate career based on one game. I was saying that we shouldn't jump to conclusions either way from a sample size of 1 against an opponent we handled easily. And that having the possibility of a pass-only PG limits our offensive options as cardfan1996 pointed out.
There is another gigantic difference between Sniezek and Lepolo: the team that surrounds them. In Sniezek's day, the rest of the team was frankly not nearly as talented as the rest of the team is that surrounds Lepolo. One of Sniezek's problems in the pre-Kiana era (when Sniezek was a freshman and sophomore) was that people could sag off not only from her but frequently from someone else as well. Bri Roberson was a talented defensive specialist who averaged 6.5 ppg, and so Sniezek's 4.5 ppg meant that two of our perimeter guards were not much of a threat. That allowed other teams to focus almost exclusively on Karlie, who was fabulous but against good teams was limited in how many shots she could get off. (This does sound like it could be a similar problem today if Emma-Nnopu plays alongside Lepolo and neither up their offensive game, allowing defenses to focus on Jump.) But McCall and McPhee were our top two scorers, but neither of them shot over 30% from the arc, so again Karlie could be mobbed on the perimeter while opposing teams clogged the paint to limit McCall and McPhee. Our bigs today, however, are all good jump shooters, which gives us a dimension that we lacked in the Sniezek era.
I think it quite likely that Lepolo's offense will come along and prove to be far superior to Sniezek's, and I think she has already proven that she is far less reckless with her passes.
But let's take a look and see how Sniezek did in her college debut, in a similar game.
On November 13 2015 against Davis, Sniezek started. She did not take a 3 point attempt. She was 1/2 for 2 points. She had 0 assists and 1 turnover.
The next week she started against a good Gonzaga team. She went 0/1 from the field. She had 0 assists and 2 turnovers.
A couple of weeks later we had our infamous loss to a JR Payne coached Santa Clara team. Sniezek scored 0 points, had 0 assists and 4 turnovers. In fact, she did not take a single shot in 25 minutes.
1) I think it likely that Lepolo will prove to be a much better offensive player than Sniezek proved to be. Sniezek was utterly incapable of three point shooting at first, and did not improve much over the years. She did not attempt them in practice or in games--Tara clearly wanted her to but there was something unmovable about that. She finally made 20 attempts her last year, making 6. Lepolo is already draining treys in practice and attempting them in games. This is significantly different from the Sniezek model.
2) In her first college game Lepolo had one of the best 20ish performances by a point guard in Stanford history. If she had one more assist (12) she would have been in our record book, and that is for numbers of assists without paying attention to turnovers. Getting 11 assists with a few turnovers would be remarkable, but doing it with 0 turnovers meant she did not throw a single errant pass. Last year, turnovers were sometimes a significant problem for our team.
3) On defense, it is so much harder for a fan to evaluate. Part of what makes it harder this year is that I am convinced--as others too have remarked--that we have installed a new defense. The amount of switching is much, much higher than previous years. It is rare for one of our players to try to go over or under a screen--we are so used to seeing Anna Wilson do that, it is a shock to see no one trying this year. This is in fact resulting in lots of imbalanced match-ups, where a shorter defender is matched against a taller attacker. But that is not just Lepolo--it is everyone getting scrambled, and seemingly by design. Yes, I can see how our shortest player could be victimized by a team that plans to provoke match-up problems, but this won't be a problem unique to Lepolo. I'm fascinated to see where Tara goes with this defense--I'm sure she has an idea of how to deal with the issues it will pose.
I think it quite likely that Lepolo's offense will come along and prove to be far superior to Sniezek's, and I think she has already proven that she is far less reckless with her passes.
But let's take a look and see how Sniezek did in her college debut, in a similar game.
On November 13 2015 against Davis, Sniezek started. She did not take a 3 point attempt. She was 1/2 for 2 points. She had 0 assists and 1 turnover.
The next week she started against a good Gonzaga team. She went 0/1 from the field. She had 0 assists and 2 turnovers.
A couple of weeks later we had our infamous loss to a JR Payne coached Santa Clara team. Sniezek scored 0 points, had 0 assists and 4 turnovers. In fact, she did not take a single shot in 25 minutes.
1) I think it likely that Lepolo will prove to be a much better offensive player than Sniezek proved to be. Sniezek was utterly incapable of three point shooting at first, and did not improve much over the years. She did not attempt them in practice or in games--Tara clearly wanted her to but there was something unmovable about that. She finally made 20 attempts her last year, making 6. Lepolo is already draining treys in practice and attempting them in games. This is significantly different from the Sniezek model.
2) In her first college game Lepolo had one of the best 20ish performances by a point guard in Stanford history. If she had one more assist (12) she would have been in our record book, and that is for numbers of assists without paying attention to turnovers. Getting 11 assists with a few turnovers would be remarkable, but doing it with 0 turnovers meant she did not throw a single errant pass. Last year, turnovers were sometimes a significant problem for our team.
3) On defense, it is so much harder for a fan to evaluate. Part of what makes it harder this year is that I am convinced--as others too have remarked--that we have installed a new defense. The amount of switching is much, much higher than previous years. It is rare for one of our players to try to go over or under a screen--we are so used to seeing Anna Wilson do that, it is a shock to see no one trying this year. This is in fact resulting in lots of imbalanced match-ups, where a shorter defender is matched against a taller attacker. But that is not just Lepolo--it is everyone getting scrambled, and seemingly by design. Yes, I can see how our shortest player could be victimized by a team that plans to provoke match-up problems, but this won't be a problem unique to Lepolo. I'm fascinated to see where Tara goes with this defense--I'm sure she has an idea of how to deal with the issues it will pose.
There is another gigantic difference between Sniezek and Lepolo: the team that surrounds them. In Sniezek's day, the rest of the team was frankly not nearly as talented as the rest of the team is that surrounds Lepolo. One of Sniezek's problems in the pre-Kiana era (when Sniezek was a freshman and sophomore) was that people could sag off not only from her but frequently from someone else as well. Bri Roberson was a talented defensive specialist who averaged 6.5 ppg, and so Sniezek's 4.5 ppg meant that two of our perimeter guards were not much of a threat. That allowed other teams to focus almost exclusively on Karlie, who was fabulous but against good teams was limited in how many shots she could get off. (This does sound like it could be a similar problem today if Emma-Nnopu plays alongside Lepolo and neither up their offensive game, allowing defenses to focus on Jump.) But McCall and McPhee were our top two scorers, but neither of them shot over 30% from the arc, so again Karlie could be mobbed on the perimeter while opposing teams clogged the paint to limit McCall and McPhee. Our bigs today, however, are all good jump shooters, which gives us a dimension that we lacked in the Sniezek era.
I think it quite likely that Lepolo's offense will come along and prove to be far superior to Sniezek's, and I think she has already proven that she is far less reckless with her passes.
But let's take a look and see how Sniezek did in her college debut, in a similar game.
On November 13 2015 against Davis, Sniezek started. She did not take a 3 point attempt. She was 1/2 for 2 points. She had 0 assists and 1 turnover.
The next week she started against a good Gonzaga team. She went 0/1 from the field. She had 0 assists and 2 turnovers.
A couple of weeks later we had our infamous loss to a JR Payne coached Santa Clara team. Sniezek scored 0 points, had 0 assists and 4 turnovers. In fact, she did not take a single shot in 25 minutes.
1) I think it likely that Lepolo will prove to be a much better offensive player than Sniezek proved to be. Sniezek was utterly incapable of three point shooting at first, and did not improve much over the years. She did not attempt them in practice or in games--Tara clearly wanted her to but there was something unmovable about that. She finally made 20 attempts her last year, making 6. Lepolo is already draining treys in practice and attempting them in games. This is significantly different from the Sniezek model.
2) In her first college game Lepolo had one of the best 20ish performances by a point guard in Stanford history. If she had one more assist (12) she would have been in our record book, and that is for numbers of assists without paying attention to turnovers. Getting 11 assists with a few turnovers would be remarkable, but doing it with 0 turnovers meant she did not throw a single errant pass. Last year, turnovers were sometimes a significant problem for our team.
3) On defense, it is so much harder for a fan to evaluate. Part of what makes it harder this year is that I am convinced--as others too have remarked--that we have installed a new defense. The amount of switching is much, much higher than previous years. It is rare for one of our players to try to go over or under a screen--we are so used to seeing Anna Wilson do that, it is a shock to see no one trying this year. This is in fact resulting in lots of imbalanced match-ups, where a shorter defender is matched against a taller attacker. But that is not just Lepolo--it is everyone getting scrambled, and seemingly by design. Yes, I can see how our shortest player could be victimized by a team that plans to provoke match-up problems, but this won't be a problem unique to Lepolo. I'm fascinated to see where Tara goes with this defense--I'm sure she has an idea of how to deal with the issues it will pose.
I think it quite likely that Lepolo's offense will come along and prove to be far superior to Sniezek's, and I think she has already proven that she is far less reckless with her passes.
But let's take a look and see how Sniezek did in her college debut, in a similar game.
On November 13 2015 against Davis, Sniezek started. She did not take a 3 point attempt. She was 1/2 for 2 points. She had 0 assists and 1 turnover.
The next week she started against a good Gonzaga team. She went 0/1 from the field. She had 0 assists and 2 turnovers.
A couple of weeks later we had our infamous loss to a JR Payne coached Santa Clara team. Sniezek scored 0 points, had 0 assists and 4 turnovers. In fact, she did not take a single shot in 25 minutes.
1) I think it likely that Lepolo will prove to be a much better offensive player than Sniezek proved to be. Sniezek was utterly incapable of three point shooting at first, and did not improve much over the years. She did not attempt them in practice or in games--Tara clearly wanted her to but there was something unmovable about that. She finally made 20 attempts her last year, making 6. Lepolo is already draining treys in practice and attempting them in games. This is significantly different from the Sniezek model.
2) In her first college game Lepolo had one of the best 20ish performances by a point guard in Stanford history. If she had one more assist (12) she would have been in our record book, and that is for numbers of assists without paying attention to turnovers. Getting 11 assists with a few turnovers would be remarkable, but doing it with 0 turnovers meant she did not throw a single errant pass. Last year, turnovers were sometimes a significant problem for our team.
3) On defense, it is so much harder for a fan to evaluate. Part of what makes it harder this year is that I am convinced--as others too have remarked--that we have installed a new defense. The amount of switching is much, much higher than previous years. It is rare for one of our players to try to go over or under a screen--we are so used to seeing Anna Wilson do that, it is a shock to see no one trying this year. This is in fact resulting in lots of imbalanced match-ups, where a shorter defender is matched against a taller attacker. But that is not just Lepolo--it is everyone getting scrambled, and seemingly by design. Yes, I can see how our shortest player could be victimized by a team that plans to provoke match-up problems, but this won't be a problem unique to Lepolo. I'm fascinated to see where Tara goes with this defense--I'm sure she has an idea of how to deal with the issues it will pose.
11-08-2022, 08:09 AM
shout out to harriel on defense. 2nd game in a row that she not only blocked an outside shot, she stole the ball off the shooter's outstretched fingers and took it the other way. highlight reel!
green looked good on defense - as good as any walk-on i can remember.
green looked good on defense - as good as any walk-on i can remember.
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