[stopandpop]

I'm not implying anything.  I'm sorry that my comments bother you, but I never wear rose-colored glasses when I watch the games.  I will agree with you on one thing:  The positions Brink and Jones are playing now are most likely the positions they will be playing in the WNBA and to Tara's credit, she is preparing them for that transition.  That's wonderful, but I'm focused on the present.

Where I disagree with you is that these two players (when they're in the game), should dominate (even in blowouts) and hurt the other team- and they are not.  With Haley, there are multiple defenders who are stopping her dribble drive, causing turnovers, or forcing Haley to reverse pivot and try to pass.  With Cam on the perimeter, there is almost always a defender in front of her- and no Stanford player is setting a screen for Cam to drive and do her thing.  There is little or no spacing on the court that would allow Haley and Cam to operate effectively.  

I hope we agree that we both love these players as with every Stanford player and we want them to succeed, but I will always call it like it is when it comes to performance and I will never make excuses for them.  In fact, in this case, I don't think Cam and Haley are at fault.  They are simply having trouble adjusting to their new roles which (currently) are limiting their performance. I want to defeat South Carolina next Sunday, but the current offensive pattern we play and the roles Haley and Cam are playing will make this extremely difficult.  Dawn Staley is watching our game film and in particular where we are playing Haley and Cam - and she's not worried at all.

Quote got messed up.  I am responding to the above from StopandPop.  Your comments do not bother me.  I am simply disagreeing with them.  Do my comments bother you?  Why do you think you call it like you see it but others don't?  Dismissing comments by trotting out "rose colored glasses" is not helpful for debate.  Whether you meant to or not, you did imply something by stating that you sat next to Haley's parents and then talking about how you saw her as unhappy.  Why mention who you sat near if you were not implying you had information from them?  You should clarify if that is not so.  This has nothing to do with rose colored glasses or making excuses for players. I just do not agree with your take about what is happening on court. I don't even agree that they are not dominating.  If the opponent is trying to stop Jones with double and triple teams on drives, that opens up everyone else and means that she kind of is dominating the game, even if not the stats.  I know that players don't always play great, that stats in blowouts when star players only play 15-20 minutes are not all that meaningful, that it is a team game, not just the Cam and Haley show, good as they are.  


I disagree that these 3 games tell us all that much about how Jones or Brink will do when we play teams where they are challenged more and play bigger minutes.  We know what they can do.  Brink went 5-6 for 13 points and had 8 rebounds and 6 blocks in game 1 in 20 minutes.  She went 4-6 for 11 points and had 11 boards in game 2.  Game 3 was not as good, but those are not the stats of someone who is struggling.  Jones has been quiet by her standards but it is not like she is not getting shots, and she is doing a good job with assists.  She just hasn't made her shots yet.  She has had similar stretches of games in previous years, often in the first half of games.  

I disagree there is any evidence that they are being hindered by the schemes.  They are being "hindered" by blowouts where they are not required to take over or put up big stats, and where the bigger need is to give experience to younger players like Iriafen, Nivar, Lepolo, Betts, etc.  These have been blowout games with a lot of subbing and a lot of different player combos out there.  Not everything will be perfect for every player, certainly not in that sort of game.  Jones tends to save her best for the biggest games.  If she is not 100% settled into her role, well, it is three games in and there is plenty of time for her to get more comfortable. 

I agree we have not seen the best of Jones.  As long as she is healthy, I am confident she will star in plenty of games.  Multiple players have always been trying to stop Jones from driving in previous seasons too.  That is her go to, and other teams scout.  That is not new.  If she becomes a more reliable three point shooter and drives and dishes more, it will also open things up more for her own scoring.  Might need time to get it all right but the time to be great is March, not November.  Brink has had a few nice drives from the perimeter already this season, stuff she did not do that much of last season.  I'm sure it is a learning process for her.  Again, it is early.  The season just started.  If things need to be tweaked, I'm sure they will be.  

I don't know if we will beat South Carolina.  They are very good.  We could play well and still lose.  I don't honestly worry about possibly losing.  I'd much rather win but they will be favored, they are #1.  It is a no lose, almost.  If we win, well we win.  If we lose, as long as we play well, it is not a bad loss, the team would learn a lot, and it would add fire to get them later on.  I see a lot of gloom and gloom predictions.  That sets one up to say told ya so when inevitably the team or a player has a poor game at some point.  I don't like to play that game.

Your post and the posts from others over the months (in reply to my critiques) have convinced me that I am not a good fit for this message board.  I have no affiliation with Stanford but I love this team and want them to succeed as much as any of you.  I just happen to look and analyze things from a slightly different perspective probably because of my background with women's basketball.  My comments tend to be what I would call 'tough love'.

Whether Tara decides to tweak the offensive schemes or doesn't, I hope Cam and Haley have breakout games tomorrow against Portland or certainly against South Carolina.  I hope they defeat the Gamecocks and go on to win the national championship. I hope Tara's plan makes Cam and Haley even more effective than they have been.  I will be cheering them on like you as well as for every player.  We'll be cheering together. You just won't see any more posts.

By the way, at the end of the game in Stockton, Haley bounded up the stairs with a big smile on her face and embraced her parents.  It was a beautiful thing to see.

My best to all of you, even those of you who did not appreciate or understand what I was trying to contribute to the discussions.  I meant no harm to anyone.  If you felt I did, I apologize.

Go Cardinal!

[stopandpop]

I'm not implying anything.  I'm sorry that my comments bother you, but I never wear rose-colored glasses when I watch the games.  I will agree with you on one thing:  The positions Brink and Jones are playing now are most likely the positions they will be playing in the WNBA and to Tara's credit, she is preparing them for that transition.  That's wonderful, but I'm focused on the present.

Where I disagree with you is that these two players (when they're in the game), should dominate (even in blowouts) and hurt the other team- and they are not.  With Haley, there are multiple defenders who are stopping her dribble drive, causing turnovers, or forcing Haley to reverse pivot and try to pass.  With Cam on the perimeter, there is almost always a defender in front of her- and no Stanford player is setting a screen for Cam to drive and do her thing.  There is little or no spacing on the court that would allow Haley and Cam to operate effectively.  

I hope we agree that we both love these players as with every Stanford player and we want them to succeed, but I will always call it like it is when it comes to performance and I will never make excuses for them.  In fact, in this case, I don't think Cam and Haley are at fault.  They are simply having trouble adjusting to their new roles which (currently) are limiting their performance. I want to defeat South Carolina next Sunday, but the current offensive pattern we play and the roles Haley and Cam are playing will make this extremely difficult.  Dawn Staley is watching our game film and in particular where we are playing Haley and Cam - and she's not worried at all.

Quote got messed up.  I am responding to the above from StopandPop.  Your comments do not bother me.  I am simply disagreeing with them.  Do my comments bother you?  Why do you think you call it like you see it but others don't?  Dismissing comments by trotting out "rose colored glasses" is not helpful for debate.  Whether you meant to or not, you did imply something by stating that you sat next to Haley's parents and then talking about how you saw her as unhappy.  Why mention who you sat near if you were not implying you had information from them?  You should clarify if that is not so.  This has nothing to do with rose colored glasses or making excuses for players. I just do not agree with your take about what is happening on court. I don't even agree that they are not dominating.  If the opponent is trying to stop Jones with double and triple teams on drives, that opens up everyone else and means that she kind of is dominating the game, even if not the stats.  I know that players don't always play great, that stats in blowouts when star players only play 15-20 minutes are not all that meaningful, that it is a team game, not just the Cam and Haley show, good as they are.  


I disagree that these 3 games tell us all that much about how Jones or Brink will do when we play teams where they are challenged more and play bigger minutes.  We know what they can do.  Brink went 5-6 for 13 points and had 8 rebounds and 6 blocks in game 1 in 20 minutes.  She went 4-6 for 11 points and had 11 boards in game 2.  Game 3 was not as good, but those are not the stats of someone who is struggling.  Jones has been quiet by her standards but it is not like she is not getting shots, and she is doing a good job with assists.  She just hasn't made her shots yet.  She has had similar stretches of games in previous years, often in the first half of games.  

I disagree there is any evidence that they are being hindered by the schemes.  They are being "hindered" by blowouts where they are not required to take over or put up big stats, and where the bigger need is to give experience to younger players like Iriafen, Nivar, Lepolo, Betts, etc.  These have been blowout games with a lot of subbing and a lot of different player combos out there.  Not everything will be perfect for every player, certainly not in that sort of game.  Jones tends to save her best for the biggest games.  If she is not 100% settled into her role, well, it is three games in and there is plenty of time for her to get more comfortable. 

I agree we have not seen the best of Jones.  As long as she is healthy, I am confident she will star in plenty of games.  Multiple players have always been trying to stop Jones from driving in previous seasons too.  That is her go to, and other teams scout.  That is not new.  If she becomes a more reliable three point shooter and drives and dishes more, it will also open things up more for her own scoring.  Might need time to get it all right but the time to be great is March, not November.  Brink has had a few nice drives from the perimeter already this season, stuff she did not do that much of last season.  I'm sure it is a learning process for her.  Again, it is early.  The season just started.  If things need to be tweaked, I'm sure they will be.  

I don't know if we will beat South Carolina.  They are very good.  We could play well and still lose.  I don't honestly worry about possibly losing.  I'd much rather win but they will be favored, they are #1.  It is a no lose, almost.  If we win, well we win.  If we lose, as long as we play well, it is not a bad loss, the team would learn a lot, and it would add fire to get them later on.  I see a lot of gloom and gloom predictions.  That sets one up to say told ya so when inevitably the team or a player has a poor game at some point.  I don't like to play that game.

Your post and the posts from others over the months (in reply to my critiques) have convinced me that I am not a good fit for this message board.  I have no affiliation with Stanford but I love this team and want them to succeed as much as any of you.  I just happen to look and analyze things from a slightly different perspective probably because of my background with women's basketball.  My comments tend to be what I would call 'tough love'.

Whether Tara decides to tweak the offensive schemes or doesn't, I hope Cam and Haley have breakout games tomorrow against Portland or certainly against South Carolina.  I hope they defeat the Gamecocks and go on to win the national championship. I hope Tara's plan makes Cam and Haley even more effective than they have been.  I will be cheering them on like you as well as for every player.  We'll be cheering together. You just won't see any more posts.

By the way, at the end of the game in Stockton, Haley bounded up the stairs with a big smile on her face and embraced her parents.  It was a beautiful thing to see.

My best to all of you, even those of you who did not appreciate or understand what I was trying to contribute to the discussions.  I meant no harm to anyone.  If you felt I did, I apologize.

Go Cardinal!