[johnnyo53]

Mark your calendar and join us for two open Sunday #CardCamp17 practices this preseason on the Elliott Fields behind Maples Pavilion: Aug 6 and Aug 13, both 2:45-5:15 PM.

http://cardinal.gostanford.com/nl/jsp/m....b27933752b

I'M SORRY, DID YOU SAY "OPEN CARRY" SUNDAY PRACTICES?

[johnnyo53]

Mark your calendar and join us for two open Sunday #CardCamp17 practices this preseason on the Elliott Fields behind Maples Pavilion: Aug 6 and Aug 13, both 2:45-5:15 PM.

http://cardinal.gostanford.com/nl/jsp/m....b27933752b

I'M SORRY, DID YOU SAY "OPEN CARRY" SUNDAY PRACTICES?

[Goose]

My point in this obsessive stat-a-thon isn't that all is lost or the sky is falling.  I know that, basically, in the 3-4 alignment the DL's job is mainly to keep the OL off the linebackers and let the LBs make the play. It's just that last year Solomon Thomas was a game changer with his mad skills. This season is going to much tougher on the front 7.  But this year we might not be able to cope over a long season if our opponents pound it to us on the ground or have a decent grasp of our pass game rush scheme.

Also, it is not unusual for the defensive line to be lighter than the opposing offensive line. UCLA, playing a 4-3, has a starting DL average of 282.5 USC, with a 3 man line, averages 290. In fairness, we would really prefer to have two bigger guys who can play NT. If we could put Wade-Perry out there on a regular basis, we would be bigger than USC. Against most teams, we can probably do just fine without the extra size. However, in some cases it could certainly become an issue.

[Goose]

My point in this obsessive stat-a-thon isn't that all is lost or the sky is falling.  I know that, basically, in the 3-4 alignment the DL's job is mainly to keep the OL off the linebackers and let the LBs make the play. It's just that last year Solomon Thomas was a game changer with his mad skills. This season is going to much tougher on the front 7.  But this year we might not be able to cope over a long season if our opponents pound it to us on the ground or have a decent grasp of our pass game rush scheme.

Also, it is not unusual for the defensive line to be lighter than the opposing offensive line. UCLA, playing a 4-3, has a starting DL average of 282.5 USC, with a 3 man line, averages 290. In fairness, we would really prefer to have two bigger guys who can play NT. If we could put Wade-Perry out there on a regular basis, we would be bigger than USC. Against most teams, we can probably do just fine without the extra size. However, in some cases it could certainly become an issue.

[johnnyo53]

ANOTHER ISSUE IS WHETHER WE HAVE THE DEPTH IN THE DLINE AND LB POSITIONS TO PLAY NICKLE OR EVEN DIME OFTEN ENOUGH, LET ALONE ENOUGH OF A BEAST AT NT TO ALLOW US TO GO MAX COVERAGE WITH A 3 MAN FRONT.  FRONT 7 A BIG PROBLEM, LANCE HAS A SPARSER CUPBOARD TO WORK WITH THIS YEAR...

[johnnyo53]

ANOTHER ISSUE IS WHETHER WE HAVE THE DEPTH IN THE DLINE AND LB POSITIONS TO PLAY NICKLE OR EVEN DIME OFTEN ENOUGH, LET ALONE ENOUGH OF A BEAST AT NT TO ALLOW US TO GO MAX COVERAGE WITH A 3 MAN FRONT.  FRONT 7 A BIG PROBLEM, LANCE HAS A SPARSER CUPBOARD TO WORK WITH THIS YEAR...

[fullmetal]

I thought it was just the DL that was thin and that our LB corps was stocked.  If you go to nickel/dime, then you're leaning on the strength of this defense, which is the secondary.  Akina will have his guys ready for nickel and dime.

[fullmetal]

I thought it was just the DL that was thin and that our LB corps was stocked.  If you go to nickel/dime, then you're leaning on the strength of this defense, which is the secondary.  Akina will have his guys ready for nickel and dime.

[Goose]

I assumed johnnyo53's post was actually a bit of sarcasm, as the secondary is pretty much a consensus great unit, both in talent and depth. The LBs are certainly deep enough, and even if one says that the are no GOTs there, they are at worst "good enough". IF we have a problem, it is DL depth, and if we actually play a lot with only two down linemen on defense, that is certainly minimized. HOWEVER, if you play with 2 DL against Utah and Washington on most downs, you will be at a fatal disadvantage, so in those cases we won't see as much nickel.
We, (well, OK, I) tend to focus on what may be "wrong", not on what is certainly "right". We are going to be able to single up and play tight coverage much more often than ever before. Having that option will certainly help our defense compared to past years. Our speed at LB should help us against teams that run the spread or that throw the ball a lot. Against teams that have the chops to just run at you, we may have issues. We also may play through and overcome those issues.

[Goose]

I assumed johnnyo53's post was actually a bit of sarcasm, as the secondary is pretty much a consensus great unit, both in talent and depth. The LBs are certainly deep enough, and even if one says that the are no GOTs there, they are at worst "good enough". IF we have a problem, it is DL depth, and if we actually play a lot with only two down linemen on defense, that is certainly minimized. HOWEVER, if you play with 2 DL against Utah and Washington on most downs, you will be at a fatal disadvantage, so in those cases we won't see as much nickel.
We, (well, OK, I) tend to focus on what may be "wrong", not on what is certainly "right". We are going to be able to single up and play tight coverage much more often than ever before. Having that option will certainly help our defense compared to past years. Our speed at LB should help us against teams that run the spread or that throw the ball a lot. Against teams that have the chops to just run at you, we may have issues. We also may play through and overcome those issues.

[johnnyo53]

One of the best things about college athletics is to watch new kids take over form established stars. Stanford football in the Harshaw years has taken on one characteristic of the few real traditional powers, that of keeping it going. There is no comparable period including the Vow Boy era. So I will pay attention to the DL this season where somebody beyond Phillips needs to step up. I'm not as concerned with the OL, the backs or the WR's.

"THE HARSHAW" YEARS- THAT'S CLEVER TC, I LIKE IT.  NOW, ABOUT YOUR CELERY PIES...

[johnnyo53]

One of the best things about college athletics is to watch new kids take over form established stars. Stanford football in the Harshaw years has taken on one characteristic of the few real traditional powers, that of keeping it going. There is no comparable period including the Vow Boy era. So I will pay attention to the DL this season where somebody beyond Phillips needs to step up. I'm not as concerned with the OL, the backs or the WR's.

"THE HARSHAW" YEARS- THAT'S CLEVER TC, I LIKE IT.  NOW, ABOUT YOUR CELERY PIES...

[ChicagoCard]

"THE HARSHAW" YEARS- THAT'S CLEVER TC, I LIKE IT.  NOW, ABOUT YOUR CELERY PIES...

Yeah, I prefer it to Shawgren.

[ChicagoCard]

"THE HARSHAW" YEARS- THAT'S CLEVER TC, I LIKE IT.  NOW, ABOUT YOUR CELERY PIES...

Yeah, I prefer it to Shawgren.

[Bruce Wang]

[quote author=johnnyo53 link=topic=17081.msg196158#msg196158 date=1501257289]"THE HARSHAW" YEARS- THAT'S CLEVER TC, I LIKE IT.  NOW, ABOUT YOUR CELERY PIES...

Yeah, I prefer it to Shawgren.
[/quote]

and Shavitagren.

[Bruce Wang]

[quote author=johnnyo53 link=topic=17081.msg196158#msg196158 date=1501257289]"THE HARSHAW" YEARS- THAT'S CLEVER TC, I LIKE IT.  NOW, ABOUT YOUR CELERY PIES...

Yeah, I prefer it to Shawgren.
[/quote]

and Shavitagren.

[Hulk01]

The average D-1 offensive lineman (298 pounds) outweighs the average defensive tackle by six pounds and the average defensive end by 45 pounds.  And on a given play, the offensive linemen outnumber the defensive linemen 5-4 or 5-3.  You'd think coaches would catch on these numbers by bulking up their defensive linemen and going back to the 5-2 or 5-3 defense, but there's much more to line play than heft versus heft. 

Speaking of heft, Harrison is now at 293.  The other players post their new numbers next week, i think.

[Hulk01]

The average D-1 offensive lineman (298 pounds) outweighs the average defensive tackle by six pounds and the average defensive end by 45 pounds.  And on a given play, the offensive linemen outnumber the defensive linemen 5-4 or 5-3.  You'd think coaches would catch on these numbers by bulking up their defensive linemen and going back to the 5-2 or 5-3 defense, but there's much more to line play than heft versus heft. 

Speaking of heft, Harrison is now at 293.  The other players post their new numbers next week, i think.

[Phogge]

What Johnny knows about baking wouldn't fit inside a 1/8 teaspoon.

[Phogge]

What Johnny knows about baking wouldn't fit inside a 1/8 teaspoon.

[Goose]

The average D-1 offensive lineman (298 pounds) outweighs the average defensive tackle by six pounds and the average defensive end by 45 pounds.  And on a given play, the offensive linemen outnumber the defensive linemen 5-4 or 5-3.  You'd think coaches would catch on these numbers by bulking up their defensive linemen and going back to the 5-2 or 5-3 defense, but there's much more to line play that heft versus heft.

Very True. Especially in passing situations, quickness and good technique matter a lot more than heft. With the rules being so favorable to the passing game these days, it is no wonder the Solomon Thomas type athlete is in great demand.

 

Speaking of heft, Harrison is now at 293.  The other players post their new numbers next week, i think.

I take that as good news, in that I expect it won't slow him down any, but will reduce the odds of him getting pushed around.

[Goose]

The average D-1 offensive lineman (298 pounds) outweighs the average defensive tackle by six pounds and the average defensive end by 45 pounds.  And on a given play, the offensive linemen outnumber the defensive linemen 5-4 or 5-3.  You'd think coaches would catch on these numbers by bulking up their defensive linemen and going back to the 5-2 or 5-3 defense, but there's much more to line play that heft versus heft.

Very True. Especially in passing situations, quickness and good technique matter a lot more than heft. With the rules being so favorable to the passing game these days, it is no wonder the Solomon Thomas type athlete is in great demand.

 

Speaking of heft, Harrison is now at 293.  The other players post their new numbers next week, i think.

I take that as good news, in that I expect it won't slow him down any, but will reduce the odds of him getting pushed around.

[Hurlburt88]

Given that Harrison's 293 results from multiple years working out under Turley, my optimism for his performance this coming year just rose peg. 

[Hurlburt88]

Given that Harrison's 293 results from multiple years working out under Turley, my optimism for his performance this coming year just rose peg. 

[ADPATERSON]

The DLine will answer the bell with the new guys stepping up and the LBs filling gaps.  Too much hand wringing.
We should play Nickel A LOT in my view against the PASS FIRST teams.  Let Robinson (a 5star) and veteran Murphy go to work.
Even against the run, Robinson is a quick slasher that nails RBs from behind at LOS.
And with this DB group, we should amp up interceptions from last year, say from 14 to above 20. 

Here's the lowdown on C.Robinson, legit 5star talent we stole from backyard of U$C.  He coulda been the next Sua Cravens there.
But, Robinson "wanted an education" -- note for recruiting. 
Mater Dei HS, Anaheim is a big prenniel powerhouse that made CA State CIF Div 5 semi final in 2015 with Robinson plus WR OStBrown.
SC uses Mater Dei as a feeder school (QBs Carson Palmer, Matt Barkley).  In HS Robinson's team flattened KJ Costello's Marguerita Boys by 45-14 on six sacks and four INTs.  Robinson was offered and woulda been a certified starter for Troyens.
He is perfect panther-quick OLB on 3rd and more than 5.  His closing speed and crunch factor is better than Skov. Wraps up well.


Bryce Love says Robinson can step up cuz Robinson is the only back that can cover Love on the wheel route. 

https://youtu.be/mhubnsCZ8V4

[ADPATERSON]

The DLine will answer the bell with the new guys stepping up and the LBs filling gaps.  Too much hand wringing.
We should play Nickel A LOT in my view against the PASS FIRST teams.  Let Robinson (a 5star) and veteran Murphy go to work.
Even against the run, Robinson is a quick slasher that nails RBs from behind at LOS.
And with this DB group, we should amp up interceptions from last year, say from 14 to above 20. 

Here's the lowdown on C.Robinson, legit 5star talent we stole from backyard of U$C.  He coulda been the next Sua Cravens there.
But, Robinson "wanted an education" -- note for recruiting. 
Mater Dei HS, Anaheim is a big prenniel powerhouse that made CA State CIF Div 5 semi final in 2015 with Robinson plus WR OStBrown.
SC uses Mater Dei as a feeder school (QBs Carson Palmer, Matt Barkley).  In HS Robinson's team flattened KJ Costello's Marguerita Boys by 45-14 on six sacks and four INTs.  Robinson was offered and woulda been a certified starter for Troyens.
He is perfect panther-quick OLB on 3rd and more than 5.  His closing speed and crunch factor is better than Skov. Wraps up well.


Bryce Love says Robinson can step up cuz Robinson is the only back that can cover Love on the wheel route. 

https://youtu.be/mhubnsCZ8V4

[johnnyo53]

I assumed johnnyo53's post was actually a bit of sarcasm, as the secondary is pretty much a consensus great unit, both in talent and depth. The LBs are certainly deep enough, and even if one says that the are no GOTs there, they are at worst "good enough". IF we have a problem, it is DL depth, and if we actually play a lot with only two down linemen on defense, that is certainly minimized. HOWEVER, if you play with 2 DL against Utah and Washington on most downs, you will be at a fatal disadvantage, so in those cases we won't see as much nickel.
We, (well, OK, I) tend to focus on what may be "wrong", not on what is certainly "right". We are going to be able to single up and play tight coverage much more often than ever before. Having that option will certainly help our defense compared to past years. Our speed at LB should help us against teams that run the spread or that throw the ball a lot. Against teams that have the chops to just run at you, we may have issues. We also may play through and overcome those issues.

MY COMMENTS REFLECT MY BELIEF WE HAVE ONE VERY GOOD LB WHO IS MOVING INSIDE WHERE HE IS MOST NEEDED, KALAMBAYI HAS BEEN TOO ERRATIC TO DATE, AND WE HAVE ONE UNDERCLASSMAN AT OLB WHO IMPRESSED ME LAST YEAR (CAN'T REMEMBER THE NAME) BUT 2 LB'S AREN'T ENOUGH, AND OUR DL IS SUSPECT OTHER THAN THE ONE GUY.  OUR SECONDARY HAS TWO GREAT CORNERS, BUT THIS YEAR THEY WON'T HAVE THE UNDERNEATH HELP AND UPFRONT PRESSURE THEY BENEFITED FROM, AND OUR SAFETIES ARE CAUSE FOR GREAT CONCERN.  I AM NOTORIOUSLY PESSIMISTIC, BUT BY MY COUNT THERE ARE MAYBE 5 GUYS OUT OF OUR D STARTING 11 GOING INTO THIS YEAR THAT SHOULD BE SOLID, THE REST IS A QUESTION MARK.  WE WILL FIND OUT IN GAME 2...

[johnnyo53]

I assumed johnnyo53's post was actually a bit of sarcasm, as the secondary is pretty much a consensus great unit, both in talent and depth. The LBs are certainly deep enough, and even if one says that the are no GOTs there, they are at worst "good enough". IF we have a problem, it is DL depth, and if we actually play a lot with only two down linemen on defense, that is certainly minimized. HOWEVER, if you play with 2 DL against Utah and Washington on most downs, you will be at a fatal disadvantage, so in those cases we won't see as much nickel.
We, (well, OK, I) tend to focus on what may be "wrong", not on what is certainly "right". We are going to be able to single up and play tight coverage much more often than ever before. Having that option will certainly help our defense compared to past years. Our speed at LB should help us against teams that run the spread or that throw the ball a lot. Against teams that have the chops to just run at you, we may have issues. We also may play through and overcome those issues.

MY COMMENTS REFLECT MY BELIEF WE HAVE ONE VERY GOOD LB WHO IS MOVING INSIDE WHERE HE IS MOST NEEDED, KALAMBAYI HAS BEEN TOO ERRATIC TO DATE, AND WE HAVE ONE UNDERCLASSMAN AT OLB WHO IMPRESSED ME LAST YEAR (CAN'T REMEMBER THE NAME) BUT 2 LB'S AREN'T ENOUGH, AND OUR DL IS SUSPECT OTHER THAN THE ONE GUY.  OUR SECONDARY HAS TWO GREAT CORNERS, BUT THIS YEAR THEY WON'T HAVE THE UNDERNEATH HELP AND UPFRONT PRESSURE THEY BENEFITED FROM, AND OUR SAFETIES ARE CAUSE FOR GREAT CONCERN.  I AM NOTORIOUSLY PESSIMISTIC, BUT BY MY COUNT THERE ARE MAYBE 5 GUYS OUT OF OUR D STARTING 11 GOING INTO THIS YEAR THAT SHOULD BE SOLID, THE REST IS A QUESTION MARK.  WE WILL FIND OUT IN GAME 2...

[qwerty49]

Doc - were you thinking of Toohill at OLB? He looked pretty tough. The other OLB I like is Tyler, especially in passing situations. Agree that Kalambayi is still unproven at this point.

[qwerty49]

Doc - were you thinking of Toohill at OLB? He looked pretty tough. The other OLB I like is Tyler, especially in passing situations. Agree that Kalambayi is still unproven at this point.

[BobK]

The bigger question is who won't be playing. 

[BobK]

The bigger question is who won't be playing. 

[OutsiderFan]

The bigger question is who won't be playing.

Maybe, but the second biggest question is what is behind this cryptic message?

[OutsiderFan]

The bigger question is who won't be playing.

Maybe, but the second biggest question is what is behind this cryptic message?

[ADPATERSON]

Go through the LB roster
We have had NFL talent:  T.Murphy, Martinez, Skov, but nothing like THIS DEPTH

OLB:  Kalambayi, Alfieri, Toohill, Tyler, L.Veach, Gabe Reid, -- maybe Ryan Johnson, switch from DE
ILB:  Sean Barton, Palma, M.Branch, Okereke, J.Perez
NICKEL (or OLB):  C.Robinson; Murphy

Come Q4, this group will be fresh, and we will post four star talent or better on every down.

[ADPATERSON]

Go through the LB roster
We have had NFL talent:  T.Murphy, Martinez, Skov, but nothing like THIS DEPTH

OLB:  Kalambayi, Alfieri, Toohill, Tyler, L.Veach, Gabe Reid, -- maybe Ryan Johnson, switch from DE
ILB:  Sean Barton, Palma, M.Branch, Okereke, J.Perez
NICKEL (or OLB):  C.Robinson; Murphy

Come Q4, this group will be fresh, and we will post four star talent or better on every down.

[OutsiderFan]

Go through the LB roster
We have had NFL talent:  T.Murphy, Martinez, Skov, but nothing like THIS DEPTH

OLB:  Kalambayi, Alfieri, Toohill, Tyler, L.Veach, Gabe Reid, -- maybe Ryan Johnson, switch from DE
ILB:  Sean Barton, Palma, M.Branch, Okereke, J.Perez
NICKEL (or OLB):  C.Robinson; Murphy

Come Q4, this group will be fresh.

Alfieri is now at ILB. 

I think you are going down the "ifs ands and buts" road a bit too much here, but there does seem to be very good LB depth across the board.

It seems the most likely LB 3-deep is something like:

ROLB Toohill - Robinson - Fox
RILB  Okerke - Barton - Branch
LILB  Alfieri - Palma - Perez
LOLB Kalambayi - Tyler - Reid

Maybe I'm premature, but if Veach hasn't played in his career yet, it's time to look to the younger guys who might have some potential, like Reid and Fox.  But honestly, only the top 8 will play very much.

[OutsiderFan]

Go through the LB roster
We have had NFL talent:  T.Murphy, Martinez, Skov, but nothing like THIS DEPTH

OLB:  Kalambayi, Alfieri, Toohill, Tyler, L.Veach, Gabe Reid, -- maybe Ryan Johnson, switch from DE
ILB:  Sean Barton, Palma, M.Branch, Okereke, J.Perez
NICKEL (or OLB):  C.Robinson; Murphy

Come Q4, this group will be fresh.

Alfieri is now at ILB. 

I think you are going down the "ifs ands and buts" road a bit too much here, but there does seem to be very good LB depth across the board.

It seems the most likely LB 3-deep is something like:

ROLB Toohill - Robinson - Fox
RILB  Okerke - Barton - Branch
LILB  Alfieri - Palma - Perez
LOLB Kalambayi - Tyler - Reid

Maybe I'm premature, but if Veach hasn't played in his career yet, it's time to look to the younger guys who might have some potential, like Reid and Fox.  But honestly, only the top 8 will play very much.

[BostonCard]

[quote author=BobK link=topic=17081.msg196295#msg196295 date=1501513897]
The bigger question is who won't be playing.

Maybe, but the second biggest question is what is behind this cryptic message?
[/quote]

By now you must have seen enough cryptic BobK messages to know that when Bob posts something like that, it's because 1) something has happened and 2) it isn't public yet.  I think you can reasonably deduce that someone will not be playing.  No idea who, but dollars to donuts we will find out soon enough.

BC

[BostonCard]

[quote author=BobK link=topic=17081.msg196295#msg196295 date=1501513897]
The bigger question is who won't be playing.

Maybe, but the second biggest question is what is behind this cryptic message?
[/quote]

By now you must have seen enough cryptic BobK messages to know that when Bob posts something like that, it's because 1) something has happened and 2) it isn't public yet.  I think you can reasonably deduce that someone will not be playing.  No idea who, but dollars to donuts we will find out soon enough.

BC