02-08-2023, 08:03 AM
Dennis Dodd reports that the Pac-12 is considering adding San Diego St. and SMU.
https://www.cbssports.com/college-footba...ghts-deal/
https://www.cbssports.com/college-footba...ghts-deal/
Pac-12 expansion?
Dennis Dodd reports that the Pac-12 is considering adding San Diego St. and SMU.
https://www.cbssports.com/college-footba...ghts-deal/
https://www.cbssports.com/college-footba...ghts-deal/
(02-08-2023, 08:03 AM)terry Wrote: Dennis Dodd reports that the Pac-12 is considering adding San Diego St. and SMU.Interesting, but I think of greater interest than which schools are added is the article's rather depressing and critical look at how the next media rights deal is already screwed up, late, below target, etc.
https://www.cbssports.com/college-footba...ghts-deal/
Quote:The Pac-12's next media rights deal will be heavily reliant on a digital streaming partner. Significantly more than half of each season's Pac-12 football games will be primarily available via streaming as part of the conference's next rights deal, sources tell CBS Sports.
Such a ratio is unprecedented for a Power Five conference and for whichever streaming giant becomes the first to more fully embrace college sports. The move would likely upset Pac-12 coaches, athletic directors and administrators who rely on widespread visibility for their games via linear (cable) and network platforms for everything from athletic recruitment to university enrollment.
The Pac-12 has long suffered from substandard distribution resulting after deciding to go with the standalone, wholly owned Pac-12 Networks. A heavy streaming deal would further limit the conference's visibility.
I don't understand this stuff at all well--I know some of you on this board are media experts. But as bad as Pac-12 Networks may have seemed, it could always get worse....
(02-08-2023, 08:03 AM)terry Wrote: Dennis Dodd reports that the Pac-12 is considering adding San Diego St. and SMU.Interesting, but I think of greater interest than which schools are added is the article's rather depressing and critical look at how the next media rights deal is already screwed up, late, below target, etc.
https://www.cbssports.com/college-footba...ghts-deal/
Quote:The Pac-12's next media rights deal will be heavily reliant on a digital streaming partner. Significantly more than half of each season's Pac-12 football games will be primarily available via streaming as part of the conference's next rights deal, sources tell CBS Sports.
Such a ratio is unprecedented for a Power Five conference and for whichever streaming giant becomes the first to more fully embrace college sports. The move would likely upset Pac-12 coaches, athletic directors and administrators who rely on widespread visibility for their games via linear (cable) and network platforms for everything from athletic recruitment to university enrollment.
The Pac-12 has long suffered from substandard distribution resulting after deciding to go with the standalone, wholly owned Pac-12 Networks. A heavy streaming deal would further limit the conference's visibility.
I don't understand this stuff at all well--I know some of you on this board are media experts. But as bad as Pac-12 Networks may have seemed, it could always get worse....
02-08-2023, 08:37 AM
I'm sure the Pac-12 is trying to expand, but I hope Stanford is finding a life boat to escape the sinking ship.
02-08-2023, 08:43 AM
I just read a rumor. Stanford cal oregon and Washington to the ACC.
To me the Pac 12 channel is awesome.
To me the Pac 12 channel is awesome.
02-08-2023, 08:53 AM
The Pac-12 channel is garbage because it's not on real tv. It reaches like 15 million people. Pathetic. That is annoying for most programs in the Pac-12 that want more eyeballs and revenue but it should be intolerable to Stanford, which needs to recruit nationally. We need to think outside of an insular Bay Area bubble and think about what normal people see on tv. For all intents and purposes, nobody is watching the Pac-12 Network. Nobody. They don't get it in their cable subscriptions.
Some of the criticisms of the Pac-12 for its media rights journey resonate with me because of all the stories of clueless and craven Pac-12 executives, but a lot of them strike me as wishing the sky weren't blue. The Pac-12 doesn't have much leverage in the media because our fans aren't diehards, not many people live in the Pacific time zone compared to the rest of the country, time differences make our games much less attractive to the majority of eyeballs, and the demographic/cultural/other factors that make our fans less diehard also make the product on the field in the most lucrative sport less enjoyable. Hard sell.
The solution to me is for programs that can - USC and UCLA already did, I imagine Stanford, Washington, Oregon looking hard - to bail on the sinking ship. I understand the arguments about tradition and distance/travel, but to my simple mind if we want to maintain major sports we simply have to hitch our wagon to something people care about. Not enough people care about the Pac-12, especially with USC's departure.
Some of the criticisms of the Pac-12 for its media rights journey resonate with me because of all the stories of clueless and craven Pac-12 executives, but a lot of them strike me as wishing the sky weren't blue. The Pac-12 doesn't have much leverage in the media because our fans aren't diehards, not many people live in the Pacific time zone compared to the rest of the country, time differences make our games much less attractive to the majority of eyeballs, and the demographic/cultural/other factors that make our fans less diehard also make the product on the field in the most lucrative sport less enjoyable. Hard sell.
The solution to me is for programs that can - USC and UCLA already did, I imagine Stanford, Washington, Oregon looking hard - to bail on the sinking ship. I understand the arguments about tradition and distance/travel, but to my simple mind if we want to maintain major sports we simply have to hitch our wagon to something people care about. Not enough people care about the Pac-12, especially with USC's departure.
The Pac-12 channel is garbage because it's not on real tv. It reaches like 15 million people. Pathetic. That is annoying for most programs in the Pac-12 that want more eyeballs and revenue but it should be intolerable to Stanford, which needs to recruit nationally. We need to think outside of an insular Bay Area bubble and think about what normal people see on tv. For all intents and purposes, nobody is watching the Pac-12 Network. Nobody. They don't get it in their cable subscriptions.
Some of the criticisms of the Pac-12 for its media rights journey resonate with me because of all the stories of clueless and craven Pac-12 executives, but a lot of them strike me as wishing the sky weren't blue. The Pac-12 doesn't have much leverage in the media because our fans aren't diehards, not many people live in the Pacific time zone compared to the rest of the country, time differences make our games much less attractive to the majority of eyeballs, and the demographic/cultural/other factors that make our fans less diehard also make the product on the field in the most lucrative sport less enjoyable. Hard sell.
The solution to me is for programs that can - USC and UCLA already did, I imagine Stanford, Washington, Oregon looking hard - to bail on the sinking ship. I understand the arguments about tradition and distance/travel, but to my simple mind if we want to maintain major sports we simply have to hitch our wagon to something people care about. Not enough people care about the Pac-12, especially with USC's departure.
Some of the criticisms of the Pac-12 for its media rights journey resonate with me because of all the stories of clueless and craven Pac-12 executives, but a lot of them strike me as wishing the sky weren't blue. The Pac-12 doesn't have much leverage in the media because our fans aren't diehards, not many people live in the Pacific time zone compared to the rest of the country, time differences make our games much less attractive to the majority of eyeballs, and the demographic/cultural/other factors that make our fans less diehard also make the product on the field in the most lucrative sport less enjoyable. Hard sell.
The solution to me is for programs that can - USC and UCLA already did, I imagine Stanford, Washington, Oregon looking hard - to bail on the sinking ship. I understand the arguments about tradition and distance/travel, but to my simple mind if we want to maintain major sports we simply have to hitch our wagon to something people care about. Not enough people care about the Pac-12, especially with USC's departure.
02-08-2023, 08:56 AM
Yeah, the math is as follows:
Eastern Standard Time Zone: 150.2 million (47.1%)
Central Standard Time Zone: 92.3 million (29.0%)
Mountain Standard Time Zone: 21.3 million (6.7%)
Pacific Standard Time Zone: 53.0 million (16.6%)
The rest live in Alaska/Hawaii. The numbers are starker than I expected, with three times as many people on the East Coast than the West Coast.
BC
Eastern Standard Time Zone: 150.2 million (47.1%)
Central Standard Time Zone: 92.3 million (29.0%)
Mountain Standard Time Zone: 21.3 million (6.7%)
Pacific Standard Time Zone: 53.0 million (16.6%)
The rest live in Alaska/Hawaii. The numbers are starker than I expected, with three times as many people on the East Coast than the West Coast.
BC
Yeah, the math is as follows:
Eastern Standard Time Zone: 150.2 million (47.1%)
Central Standard Time Zone: 92.3 million (29.0%)
Mountain Standard Time Zone: 21.3 million (6.7%)
Pacific Standard Time Zone: 53.0 million (16.6%)
The rest live in Alaska/Hawaii. The numbers are starker than I expected, with three times as many people on the East Coast than the West Coast.
BC
Eastern Standard Time Zone: 150.2 million (47.1%)
Central Standard Time Zone: 92.3 million (29.0%)
Mountain Standard Time Zone: 21.3 million (6.7%)
Pacific Standard Time Zone: 53.0 million (16.6%)
The rest live in Alaska/Hawaii. The numbers are starker than I expected, with three times as many people on the East Coast than the West Coast.
BC
02-08-2023, 08:58 AM
(02-08-2023, 08:03 AM)terry Wrote: Dennis Dodd reports that the Pac-12 is considering adding San Diego St. and SMU.
https://www.cbssports.com/college-footba...ghts-deal/
Nothing new to see here. On the one hand, the current P-12 has a hold in socal that it would like to fill. SDSU is the only option. They aren't a great option but they aren't bad. If you want to stay with an even number of schools someone in Texas seems like more potential than anyone in the current footprint. That math has been the case since USC/UCLA left. No real news in this article other than the commissioner visiting SDSU which likely isn't super important.
OTOH, there are only 4 P-12 programs with any real value to another conference. UW, UO, Stanford & cal. cal is by far the least attractive but probably gets dragged along. Where can these schools go? B1G and ACC are the only real options. Both are not terribly likely but rumors will continue....
(02-08-2023, 08:03 AM)terry Wrote: Dennis Dodd reports that the Pac-12 is considering adding San Diego St. and SMU.
https://www.cbssports.com/college-footba...ghts-deal/
Nothing new to see here. On the one hand, the current P-12 has a hold in socal that it would like to fill. SDSU is the only option. They aren't a great option but they aren't bad. If you want to stay with an even number of schools someone in Texas seems like more potential than anyone in the current footprint. That math has been the case since USC/UCLA left. No real news in this article other than the commissioner visiting SDSU which likely isn't super important.
OTOH, there are only 4 P-12 programs with any real value to another conference. UW, UO, Stanford & cal. cal is by far the least attractive but probably gets dragged along. Where can these schools go? B1G and ACC are the only real options. Both are not terribly likely but rumors will continue....
(02-08-2023, 08:03 AM)terry Wrote: Dennis Dodd reports that the Pac-12 is considering adding San Diego St. and SMU.
https://www.cbssports.com/college-footba...ghts-deal/
I grew up in Dallas, and my high school graduation was at SMU's basketball arena. Post death-penalty, SMU sports is an afterthought in Dallas. It's UT, A&M, and, sometimes TCU. If some genius at Pac-12 headquarters thinks that this is their inroad to the DFW media market, we need some new Pac-12 administrators.
Come to think of it, we need some new Pac-12 administrators regardless of how this shakes out. Ugh.
(02-08-2023, 08:03 AM)terry Wrote: Dennis Dodd reports that the Pac-12 is considering adding San Diego St. and SMU.
https://www.cbssports.com/college-footba...ghts-deal/
I grew up in Dallas, and my high school graduation was at SMU's basketball arena. Post death-penalty, SMU sports is an afterthought in Dallas. It's UT, A&M, and, sometimes TCU. If some genius at Pac-12 headquarters thinks that this is their inroad to the DFW media market, we need some new Pac-12 administrators.
Come to think of it, we need some new Pac-12 administrators regardless of how this shakes out. Ugh.
02-08-2023, 12:02 PM
(02-08-2023, 08:56 AM)BostonCard Wrote: Yeah, the math is as follows:Population density by time zone highlights one portion of the problem.
Eastern Standard Time Zone: 150.2 million (47.1%)
Central Standard Time Zone: 92.3 million (29.0%)
Mountain Standard Time Zone: 21.3 million (6.7%)
Pacific Standard Time Zone: 53.0 million (16.6%)
The rest live in Alaska/Hawaii. The numbers are starker than I expected, with three times as many people on the East Coast than the West Coast.
BC
Another problem with time zones is the time.
Someone in the Pacific time zone can easily watch an 8PM Eastern time zone game after work. That game will end at 7 or 7:30PM in our time zone which is close to ideal.
A 7:30PM Pacific tip doesn't really fit into an Eastern or Central time zone lifestyle. That 7:30PM game would start at 10:30PM and end at 12:30AM.
The ACC/SEC game benefits from a vastly greater population and will likely get some viewers in the other three time zones.
The Pac-12 game sits in a far less densely populated region and will likely get almost no viewers from the other time zones.
Once the population density and time zone realities are layered together it is not hard to understand that the Pac-12 and its network are unlikely to ever command SEC/ACC or BigTen rates. If every conference has similarly competent administrators, then the SEC and BigTen will get more revenue than the Pac-12. It is what it is.
(02-08-2023, 08:56 AM)BostonCard Wrote: Yeah, the math is as follows:Population density by time zone highlights one portion of the problem.
Eastern Standard Time Zone: 150.2 million (47.1%)
Central Standard Time Zone: 92.3 million (29.0%)
Mountain Standard Time Zone: 21.3 million (6.7%)
Pacific Standard Time Zone: 53.0 million (16.6%)
The rest live in Alaska/Hawaii. The numbers are starker than I expected, with three times as many people on the East Coast than the West Coast.
BC
Another problem with time zones is the time.
Someone in the Pacific time zone can easily watch an 8PM Eastern time zone game after work. That game will end at 7 or 7:30PM in our time zone which is close to ideal.
A 7:30PM Pacific tip doesn't really fit into an Eastern or Central time zone lifestyle. That 7:30PM game would start at 10:30PM and end at 12:30AM.
The ACC/SEC game benefits from a vastly greater population and will likely get some viewers in the other three time zones.
The Pac-12 game sits in a far less densely populated region and will likely get almost no viewers from the other time zones.
Once the population density and time zone realities are layered together it is not hard to understand that the Pac-12 and its network are unlikely to ever command SEC/ACC or BigTen rates. If every conference has similarly competent administrators, then the SEC and BigTen will get more revenue than the Pac-12. It is what it is.
(02-08-2023, 08:53 AM)msqueri Wrote: The Pac-12 channel is garbage because it's not on real tv. It reaches like 15 million people. Pathetic. That is annoying for most programs in the Pac-12 that want more eyeballs and revenue but it should be intolerable to Stanford, which needs to recruit nationally. We need to think outside of an insular Bay Area bubble and think about what normal people see on tv. For all intents and purposes, nobody is watching the Pac-12 Network. Nobody. They don't get it in their cable subscriptions.
Some of the criticisms of the Pac-12 for its media rights journey resonate with me because of all the stories of clueless and craven Pac-12 executives, but a lot of them strike me as wishing the sky weren't blue. The Pac-12 doesn't have much leverage in the media because our fans aren't diehards, not many people live in the Pacific time zone compared to the rest of the country, time differences make our games much less attractive to the majority of eyeballs, and the demographic/cultural/other factors that make our fans less diehard also make the product on the field in the most lucrative sport less enjoyable. Hard sell.
The solution to me is for programs that can - USC and UCLA already did, I imagine Stanford, Washington, Oregon looking hard - to bail on the sinking ship. I understand the arguments about tradition and distance/travel, but to my simple mind if we want to maintain major sports we simply have to hitch our wagon to something people care about. Not enough people care about the Pac-12, especially with USC's departure.
All sad but true.
I got used to paying the "Pac-12 surcharge" of $60-70/month just for Sling to show/record the Pac-12 Network during football and hoops seasons. I don't watch Sling for anything else. Fortunately Sling lets you suspend your subscription for 3 months so May, June, July = no charge. But yeah, the sad economics of demographics and demand pretty much dictate the reality.
(02-08-2023, 08:56 AM)BostonCard Wrote: Yeah, the math is as follows:
Eastern Standard Time Zone: 150.2 million (47.1%)
Central Standard Time Zone: 92.3 million (29.0%)
Mountain Standard Time Zone: 21.3 million (6.7%)
Pacific Standard Time Zone: 53.0 million (16.6%)
The rest live in Alaska/Hawaii. The numbers are starker than I expected, with three times as many people on the East Coast than the West Coast.
BC
Wow, just wow.
I wonder what the numbers would be for the SEC footprint, and for that matter the other Power 5 footprints (some overlap, doubtless).
(02-08-2023, 08:53 AM)msqueri Wrote: The Pac-12 channel is garbage because it's not on real tv. It reaches like 15 million people. Pathetic. That is annoying for most programs in the Pac-12 that want more eyeballs and revenue but it should be intolerable to Stanford, which needs to recruit nationally. We need to think outside of an insular Bay Area bubble and think about what normal people see on tv. For all intents and purposes, nobody is watching the Pac-12 Network. Nobody. They don't get it in their cable subscriptions.
Some of the criticisms of the Pac-12 for its media rights journey resonate with me because of all the stories of clueless and craven Pac-12 executives, but a lot of them strike me as wishing the sky weren't blue. The Pac-12 doesn't have much leverage in the media because our fans aren't diehards, not many people live in the Pacific time zone compared to the rest of the country, time differences make our games much less attractive to the majority of eyeballs, and the demographic/cultural/other factors that make our fans less diehard also make the product on the field in the most lucrative sport less enjoyable. Hard sell.
The solution to me is for programs that can - USC and UCLA already did, I imagine Stanford, Washington, Oregon looking hard - to bail on the sinking ship. I understand the arguments about tradition and distance/travel, but to my simple mind if we want to maintain major sports we simply have to hitch our wagon to something people care about. Not enough people care about the Pac-12, especially with USC's departure.
All sad but true.
I got used to paying the "Pac-12 surcharge" of $60-70/month just for Sling to show/record the Pac-12 Network during football and hoops seasons. I don't watch Sling for anything else. Fortunately Sling lets you suspend your subscription for 3 months so May, June, July = no charge. But yeah, the sad economics of demographics and demand pretty much dictate the reality.
(02-08-2023, 08:56 AM)BostonCard Wrote: Yeah, the math is as follows:
Eastern Standard Time Zone: 150.2 million (47.1%)
Central Standard Time Zone: 92.3 million (29.0%)
Mountain Standard Time Zone: 21.3 million (6.7%)
Pacific Standard Time Zone: 53.0 million (16.6%)
The rest live in Alaska/Hawaii. The numbers are starker than I expected, with three times as many people on the East Coast than the West Coast.
BC
Wow, just wow.
I wonder what the numbers would be for the SEC footprint, and for that matter the other Power 5 footprints (some overlap, doubtless).
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