[97fan]

Scott emphasized, and Pac-12 officials widely agreed, that making money was not the primary goal for establishing a presence in China.

This brings to mind what St. Louis Cardinals outfielder Lance Berkman said in August when he was asked about what was holding up an agreement between him and the Cards on a contract extension.

""It's always about money. ... No matter what people say, it's always about the money."

[97fan]

Scott emphasized, and Pac-12 officials widely agreed, that making money was not the primary goal for establishing a presence in China.

This brings to mind what St. Louis Cardinals outfielder Lance Berkman said in August when he was asked about what was holding up an agreement between him and the Cards on a contract extension.

""It's always about money. ... No matter what people say, it's always about the money."

[Farm93]

Scott emphasized, and Pac-12 officials widely agreed, that making money was not the primary goal for establishing a presence in China.

This brings to mind what St. Louis Cardinals outfielder Lance Berkman said in August when he was asked about what was holding up an agreement between him and the Cards on a contract extension.

""It's always about money. ... No matter what people say, it's always about the money."

Must be so that the conference can corner the market on Beijing football recruits.

[Farm93]

Scott emphasized, and Pac-12 officials widely agreed, that making money was not the primary goal for establishing a presence in China.

This brings to mind what St. Louis Cardinals outfielder Lance Berkman said in August when he was asked about what was holding up an agreement between him and the Cards on a contract extension.

""It's always about money. ... No matter what people say, it's always about the money."

Must be so that the conference can corner the market on Beijing football recruits.

[81alum]

I don't think this issue is inconvenience to football fans. The issue is inconvenience to student athletes.

Entirely agree.  This should only be done if it could be arranged for the summer before classes begin. 

Stanford has a tradition of protecting its student athletes from such disruptions at the end of the quarter before finals.  Stanford has lots of students from China.  Just ask any of them if they would fly home for a weekend towards the end of the quarter. 

Similar arguments used to happen on a much smaller scale when conferences expanded.  There was a day when conferences tried to keep all their teams in geographic proximity to lower travel time and travel costs.  As the revenues have increased it seems that the door is now open to ignoring those old-fashioned limitations and treating student-athletes as little more than good-will ambassadors for the university public relations team.

All the arguments for why playing in China will be good for Stanford's global image, why it will foster ties with Asia, how it will help connect with our many Asian alums--all these things may be true but should all take a distant second place to the academic well being of our students. 

[81alum]

I don't think this issue is inconvenience to football fans. The issue is inconvenience to student athletes.

Entirely agree.  This should only be done if it could be arranged for the summer before classes begin. 

Stanford has a tradition of protecting its student athletes from such disruptions at the end of the quarter before finals.  Stanford has lots of students from China.  Just ask any of them if they would fly home for a weekend towards the end of the quarter. 

Similar arguments used to happen on a much smaller scale when conferences expanded.  There was a day when conferences tried to keep all their teams in geographic proximity to lower travel time and travel costs.  As the revenues have increased it seems that the door is now open to ignoring those old-fashioned limitations and treating student-athletes as little more than good-will ambassadors for the university public relations team.

All the arguments for why playing in China will be good for Stanford's global image, why it will foster ties with Asia, how it will help connect with our many Asian alums--all these things may be true but should all take a distant second place to the academic well being of our students. 

[JohnR34231]

Stanford playing in Russia?

All I can say to that is:
ХОРОШИЙ
Maybe even
ОТЛИЧНЫЙ

P.S. The Stanford basketball team, IIRC, has played in post season tourneys where they have been gone the entire week of finals.
Nobody got particularly excited about that.

[JohnR34231]

Stanford playing in Russia?

All I can say to that is:
ХОРОШИЙ
Maybe even
ОТЛИЧНЫЙ

P.S. The Stanford basketball team, IIRC, has played in post season tourneys where they have been gone the entire week of finals.
Nobody got particularly excited about that.

[Leftcoast]

Good point, JPRI.

Our outrage seems more than a little out of proportion when compared to the injury.  Suppose the PAC 12 plays one game a season overseas.  Stanford's turn would come once every six years.  Between bye weeks and our academic late start (often three weeks after the season), I think we could solve this without irreparable harm to the team.

There was a not so long ago time when the basketball team did something similar yearly.

Geeesh, these are 18-22 year old kids.  If I can do it then they can.  They even get to skip the late night banquet followed by the early morning concall to the home office.  The coaches will probably insist they skip the drunken karaoke sessions in Mandarin too - but they might enjoy those.

[Leftcoast]

Good point, JPRI.

Our outrage seems more than a little out of proportion when compared to the injury.  Suppose the PAC 12 plays one game a season overseas.  Stanford's turn would come once every six years.  Between bye weeks and our academic late start (often three weeks after the season), I think we could solve this without irreparable harm to the team.

There was a not so long ago time when the basketball team did something similar yearly.

Geeesh, these are 18-22 year old kids.  If I can do it then they can.  They even get to skip the late night banquet followed by the early morning concall to the home office.  The coaches will probably insist they skip the drunken karaoke sessions in Mandarin too - but they might enjoy those.

[yvonne]

http://www.mercurynews.com/stanford-card...i_19534416

Bowlsby said the school is not currently discussing any plans to play Notre Dame in China in 2013, as suggested in a New York Times report Sunday. "It would be a great opportunity for our players to get a taste of China and it would be a tremendous thing for the two universities," he said. "Having said that, I couldn't characterize any prospect for it happening."

[yvonne]

http://www.mercurynews.com/stanford-card...i_19534416

Bowlsby said the school is not currently discussing any plans to play Notre Dame in China in 2013, as suggested in a New York Times report Sunday. "It would be a great opportunity for our players to get a taste of China and it would be a tremendous thing for the two universities," he said. "Having said that, I couldn't characterize any prospect for it happening."

[Roberton3]

Must be so that the conference can corner the market on Beijing football recruits.

I assume you're joking -- but thinking ahead a bit, that might be a reason to do this.  Just think about how much people 20 years ago would have laughed at the idea of NBA teams drafting Chinese centers...

[Roberton3]

Must be so that the conference can corner the market on Beijing football recruits.

I assume you're joking -- but thinking ahead a bit, that might be a reason to do this.  Just think about how much people 20 years ago would have laughed at the idea of NBA teams drafting Chinese centers...

[Farm93]

[quote author=Farm93 link=topic=5160.msg37345#msg37345 date=1323749608]
Must be so that the conference can corner the market on Beijing football recruits.

I assume you're joking -- but thinking ahead a bit, that might be a reason to do this.  Just think about how much people 20 years ago would have laughed at the idea of NBA teams drafting Chinese centers...
[/quote]

I was joking, but those that have been to China recently can back me up on this.  Thanks to only child parents raising only child children there are now kids roaming around China that have 6 dedicated caregivers pampering them at every turn.  (4 Grandparents and 2 parents).  Those kids are easy to identify, and some of them probably will grow "out" to be ideal interior linemen.

If the game is game #1 in late August then I am OK with the idea, but declaring that Notre Dame 2013 might be game #1 implies a trip in November, not August.

If playing a Pac-12 game is oh, so, important to the conference why not...have the Pac-12 championship game in Beijing or Shanghai!

And this time I am not joking, the Pac-12 basketball championship tournament, which draws terribly at the Staples Center, should be moved to China too.  My guess is that the Pac-12 could actually get 20,000 people to see that event in Shanghai.  And that would be far better than playing the games in an empty arena in the USA.

[Farm93]

[quote author=Farm93 link=topic=5160.msg37345#msg37345 date=1323749608]
Must be so that the conference can corner the market on Beijing football recruits.

I assume you're joking -- but thinking ahead a bit, that might be a reason to do this.  Just think about how much people 20 years ago would have laughed at the idea of NBA teams drafting Chinese centers...
[/quote]

I was joking, but those that have been to China recently can back me up on this.  Thanks to only child parents raising only child children there are now kids roaming around China that have 6 dedicated caregivers pampering them at every turn.  (4 Grandparents and 2 parents).  Those kids are easy to identify, and some of them probably will grow "out" to be ideal interior linemen.

If the game is game #1 in late August then I am OK with the idea, but declaring that Notre Dame 2013 might be game #1 implies a trip in November, not August.

If playing a Pac-12 game is oh, so, important to the conference why not...have the Pac-12 championship game in Beijing or Shanghai!

And this time I am not joking, the Pac-12 basketball championship tournament, which draws terribly at the Staples Center, should be moved to China too.  My guess is that the Pac-12 could actually get 20,000 people to see that event in Shanghai.  And that would be far better than playing the games in an empty arena in the USA.

[SUIndian31]

Inconvenience to the student athletes?  No, especially if it is scheduled at the beginning of the season.  There's no way that they would have this game scheduled for Thanksgiving weekend.

The team would probably leave for China a week or so in advance.  If the guys on the team are anything like those who were there 10 years ago, they would love to have a trip to China with a large group of their best friends (and beat the Domers). 

[SUIndian31]

Inconvenience to the student athletes?  No, especially if it is scheduled at the beginning of the season.  There's no way that they would have this game scheduled for Thanksgiving weekend.

The team would probably leave for China a week or so in advance.  If the guys on the team are anything like those who were there 10 years ago, they would love to have a trip to China with a large group of their best friends (and beat the Domers). 

[fullmetal]

NBA centers, garvin.  Like Yao Ming.

Ed Wang was an offensive tackle for Virginia some years ago, but he's an exception.  If you include all of east Asia, some may remember Dat Nguyen, a linebacker from A&M who later played for the Cowboys.

[fullmetal]

NBA centers, garvin.  Like Yao Ming.

Ed Wang was an offensive tackle for Virginia some years ago, but he's an exception.  If you include all of east Asia, some may remember Dat Nguyen, a linebacker from A&M who later played for the Cowboys.

[jayasena]

Um... I don't think anyone's saying people of Asian descent can't play football. I think Garvin's point is that kids who haven't played competitive football in junior high or high school aren't likely to make viable college players (with some very, very rare exceptions). Both Ed Wang and Dat Nguyen grew up here, didn't they?

I think basketball is different -- it's a popular sport in China (and much of the rest of Asia) already. American Football... not so much. Perhaps this is the beginning and the sport may catch on but any recruiting benefits are decades away (if ever). I'm guessing the real appeal is in terms of TV audiences.

I believe Star TV (part of the News Corp empire) has some history broadcasting college football in Asia (I remember once watching a Rose Bowl while in Asia many years ago). Wonder what their experience/ROI has been.

[jayasena]

Um... I don't think anyone's saying people of Asian descent can't play football. I think Garvin's point is that kids who haven't played competitive football in junior high or high school aren't likely to make viable college players (with some very, very rare exceptions). Both Ed Wang and Dat Nguyen grew up here, didn't they?

I think basketball is different -- it's a popular sport in China (and much of the rest of Asia) already. American Football... not so much. Perhaps this is the beginning and the sport may catch on but any recruiting benefits are decades away (if ever). I'm guessing the real appeal is in terms of TV audiences.

I believe Star TV (part of the News Corp empire) has some history broadcasting college football in Asia (I remember once watching a Rose Bowl while in Asia many years ago). Wonder what their experience/ROI has been.

[Roberton3]

I think Garvin's point is that lots of Chinese kids play basketball, but very few play football.  And if they don't play football, they're not going to be football recruits.

He's right, but the counterargument is that they could start playing football.  And even a very small percentage of Chinese kids playing football would add up to a brobdingnagian pool of potential recruits.

[Roberton3]

I think Garvin's point is that lots of Chinese kids play basketball, but very few play football.  And if they don't play football, they're not going to be football recruits.

He's right, but the counterargument is that they could start playing football.  And even a very small percentage of Chinese kids playing football would add up to a brobdingnagian pool of potential recruits.

[pefloresjr]

If this were to come to fruition, it would have to be at the beginning of the season.  The teams involved would have to have a buy the following week.  There is still a lot to work out, and I don't think Stanford will be forced into it.  Putting the game in late summer avoids the academic conflicts and I think there is even a chance that the teams would get an exemption and be granted an extra game.  That can be helpful to building a resume if a team is really good.  Also, a trip to China would be a good learning, cultural, and bonding experience for the team.  Stanford already has a relationsip with Peking University and adding a sports element to the interaction would only serve to deepen those connections.  I'm ok with the fact that Scott's motives may be impure as long as his ultimate actions are not. 

Cheers,
Pete F.

[pefloresjr]

If this were to come to fruition, it would have to be at the beginning of the season.  The teams involved would have to have a buy the following week.  There is still a lot to work out, and I don't think Stanford will be forced into it.  Putting the game in late summer avoids the academic conflicts and I think there is even a chance that the teams would get an exemption and be granted an extra game.  That can be helpful to building a resume if a team is really good.  Also, a trip to China would be a good learning, cultural, and bonding experience for the team.  Stanford already has a relationsip with Peking University and adding a sports element to the interaction would only serve to deepen those connections.  I'm ok with the fact that Scott's motives may be impure as long as his ultimate actions are not. 

Cheers,
Pete F.

[pefloresjr]

If this were to come to fruition, it would have to be at the beginning of the season.  The teams involved would have to have a buy the following week.  There is still a lot to work out, and I don't think Stanford will be forced into it.  Putting the game in late summer avoids the academic conflicts and I think there is even a chance that the teams would get an exemption and be granted an extra game.  That can be helpful to building a resume if a team is really good.  Also, a trip to China would be a good learning, cultural, and bonding experience for the team.  Stanford already has a relationsip with Peking University and adding a sports element to the interaction would only serve to deepen those connections.  I'm ok with the fact that Scott's motives may be impure as long as his ultimate actions are not. 

Cheers,
Pete F.

[pefloresjr]

If this were to come to fruition, it would have to be at the beginning of the season.  The teams involved would have to have a buy the following week.  There is still a lot to work out, and I don't think Stanford will be forced into it.  Putting the game in late summer avoids the academic conflicts and I think there is even a chance that the teams would get an exemption and be granted an extra game.  That can be helpful to building a resume if a team is really good.  Also, a trip to China would be a good learning, cultural, and bonding experience for the team.  Stanford already has a relationsip with Peking University and adding a sports element to the interaction would only serve to deepen those connections.  I'm ok with the fact that Scott's motives may be impure as long as his ultimate actions are not. 

Cheers,
Pete F.

[washingtonismoney]

Ultimately I suppose it depends on the execution. Quite a few of my friends made overseas trips because of their student groups--I think one of the a cappella groups went to South Africa--and it'd be a shame for athletes to be denied the same.*

*(Unfortunately, the NCAA is considering banning preseason tours of overseas countries--for example, of the type the men's basketball team took to Spain this summer--which I think would be a real bummer.)

[washingtonismoney]

Ultimately I suppose it depends on the execution. Quite a few of my friends made overseas trips because of their student groups--I think one of the a cappella groups went to South Africa--and it'd be a shame for athletes to be denied the same.*

*(Unfortunately, the NCAA is considering banning preseason tours of overseas countries--for example, of the type the men's basketball team took to Spain this summer--which I think would be a real bummer.)

[washingtonismoney]

Ultimately I suppose it depends on the execution. Quite a few of my friends made overseas trips because of their student groups--I think one of the a cappella groups went to South Africa--and it'd be a shame for athletes to be denied the same.*

*(Unfortunately, the NCAA is considering banning preseason tours of overseas countries--for example, of the type the men's basketball team took to Spain this summer--which I think would be a real bummer.)

[washingtonismoney]

Ultimately I suppose it depends on the execution. Quite a few of my friends made overseas trips because of their student groups--I think one of the a cappella groups went to South Africa--and it'd be a shame for athletes to be denied the same.*

*(Unfortunately, the NCAA is considering banning preseason tours of overseas countries--for example, of the type the men's basketball team took to Spain this summer--which I think would be a real bummer.)