10-12-2025, 03:00 PM
He won at Vandy....
Is Franklin the #1 Target?
10-12-2025, 03:41 PM
He's probably an A-tier candidate at first glance, imo. But if he doesn't show a willingness to recruit to Stanford's academic standards, and if he can't find a way to instill a winning football culture in line with high academic and character standards, then he'll be more of an $EC coach than a Stanford coach.
He's probably an A-tier candidate at first glance, imo. But if he doesn't show a willingness to recruit to Stanford's academic standards, and if he can't find a way to instill a winning football culture in line with high academic and character standards, then he'll be more of an $EC coach than a Stanford coach.
10-12-2025, 04:30 PM
(10-12-2025, 03:41 PM)fullmetal Wrote: He's probably an A-tier candidate at first glance, imo. But if he doesn't show a willingness to recruit to Stanford's academic standards, and if he can't find a way to instill a winning football culture in line with high academic and character standards, then he'll be more of an $EC coach than a Stanford coach.Puzzled by the above. He won at Vandy, for all intents and purposes not sacrificing the academic integrity of the school (unlike their current coach). Penn State, last I checked, isn't in the SEC.
Free Phogge!!!! And no, crimson doesn't refer to the Tide.
(10-12-2025, 03:41 PM)fullmetal Wrote: He's probably an A-tier candidate at first glance, imo. But if he doesn't show a willingness to recruit to Stanford's academic standards, and if he can't find a way to instill a winning football culture in line with high academic and character standards, then he'll be more of an $EC coach than a Stanford coach.Puzzled by the above. He won at Vandy, for all intents and purposes not sacrificing the academic integrity of the school (unlike their current coach). Penn State, last I checked, isn't in the SEC.
Free Phogge!!!! And no, crimson doesn't refer to the Tide.
(10-12-2025, 04:30 PM)cardcrimson Wrote:I am puzzled by the idea he would be a candidate anywhere right now. The firing by Penn State is too recent. Maybe in a year or two the idea one would be hiring Penn State's rejects who basically "failed" will not be fresh in everybody's mind, but right now it is. Also, since he will be pulling in 7.8+/- million a year doing nothing, I would expect he would be quite selective in where he goes next. He has no reason to rush into anything. The "mitigation" situation with Penn State is still up in the air, as I understand it. He may have absolutely no economic reason to take another job.(10-12-2025, 03:41 PM)fullmetal Wrote: He's probably an A-tier candidate at first glance, imo. But if he doesn't show a willingness to recruit to Stanford's academic standards, and if he can't find a way to instill a winning football culture in line with high academic and character standards, then he'll be more of an $EC coach than a Stanford coach.Puzzled by the above. He won at Vandy, for all intents and purposes not sacrificing the academic integrity of the school (unlike their current coach). Penn State, last I checked, isn't in the SEC.
(10-12-2025, 04:30 PM)cardcrimson Wrote:I am puzzled by the idea he would be a candidate anywhere right now. The firing by Penn State is too recent. Maybe in a year or two the idea one would be hiring Penn State's rejects who basically "failed" will not be fresh in everybody's mind, but right now it is. Also, since he will be pulling in 7.8+/- million a year doing nothing, I would expect he would be quite selective in where he goes next. He has no reason to rush into anything. The "mitigation" situation with Penn State is still up in the air, as I understand it. He may have absolutely no economic reason to take another job.(10-12-2025, 03:41 PM)fullmetal Wrote: He's probably an A-tier candidate at first glance, imo. But if he doesn't show a willingness to recruit to Stanford's academic standards, and if he can't find a way to instill a winning football culture in line with high academic and character standards, then he'll be more of an $EC coach than a Stanford coach.Puzzled by the above. He won at Vandy, for all intents and purposes not sacrificing the academic integrity of the school (unlike their current coach). Penn State, last I checked, isn't in the SEC.
10-12-2025, 05:14 PM
(10-12-2025, 03:00 PM)BigJohn043 Wrote: He won at Vandy....From what I recall, and I read a lot about when he was at and left Vanderbilt (claims of rape), he recruited a decent number of athletes that Stanford should never, ever allow in. Not only on academics but personal ethics and values.
10-12-2025, 10:54 PM
(10-12-2025, 05:14 PM)lancer1968 Wrote: From what I recall, and I read a lot about when he was at and left Vanderbilt (claims of rape), he recruited a decent number of athletes that Stanford should never, ever allow in. Not only on academics but personal ethics and values.That is correct. And when he took the Penn State job late, he took many players and coaches with him, leaving Vandy in a horrible situation.
(10-12-2025, 05:14 PM)lancer1968 Wrote: From what I recall, and I read a lot about when he was at and left Vanderbilt (claims of rape), he recruited a decent number of athletes that Stanford should never, ever allow in. Not only on academics but personal ethics and values.That is correct. And when he took the Penn State job late, he took many players and coaches with him, leaving Vandy in a horrible situation.
(10-12-2025, 10:54 PM)oldalum Wrote:(10-12-2025, 05:14 PM)lancer1968 Wrote: From what I recall, and I read a lot about when he was at and left Vanderbilt (claims of rape), he recruited a decent number of athletes that Stanford should never, ever allow in. Not only on academics but personal ethics and values.That is correct. And when he took the Penn State job late, he took many players and coaches with him, leaving Vandy in a horrible situation.
To be fair, this is now par for the course.
(10-12-2025, 10:54 PM)oldalum Wrote:(10-12-2025, 05:14 PM)lancer1968 Wrote: From what I recall, and I read a lot about when he was at and left Vanderbilt (claims of rape), he recruited a decent number of athletes that Stanford should never, ever allow in. Not only on academics but personal ethics and values.That is correct. And when he took the Penn State job late, he took many players and coaches with him, leaving Vandy in a horrible situation.
To be fair, this is now par for the course.
10-13-2025, 07:33 AM
(10-12-2025, 05:14 PM)lancer1968 Wrote:Exactly why we should not hire him.(10-12-2025, 03:00 PM)BigJohn043 Wrote: He won at Vandy....From what I recall, and I read a lot about when he was at and left Vanderbilt (claims of rape), he recruited a decent number of athletes that Stanford should never, ever allow in. Not only on academics but personal ethics and values.
(10-12-2025, 05:14 PM)lancer1968 Wrote:Exactly why we should not hire him.(10-12-2025, 03:00 PM)BigJohn043 Wrote: He won at Vandy....From what I recall, and I read a lot about when he was at and left Vanderbilt (claims of rape), he recruited a decent number of athletes that Stanford should never, ever allow in. Not only on academics but personal ethics and values.
I think the ideal next/new Coach for us would be a Win/Win for both Stanford football, and for the new Coach.
This isn't unique to us, or to college football, it is kind of an ideal for any hire.
Based on that ideal, I think Coach Franklin is very unlikely to be a good fit as we would be most likely seen as a far step down and backwards in his career. Not to mention surely his very high pay expectations.
You don't have to look far for a great example of a Win/Win hire.
Coach Smith for our basketball.
A win for us because he immediately led Cardinal to first 21+ win season in 10 years, and first post season (NIT) in 7 years.
A win for him because he continues as a head coach in a Power conference.
And at a school with, presumably, some notable resources and NIL to help, based on my understanding of how Maxime was retained last season.
This isn't unique to us, or to college football, it is kind of an ideal for any hire.
Based on that ideal, I think Coach Franklin is very unlikely to be a good fit as we would be most likely seen as a far step down and backwards in his career. Not to mention surely his very high pay expectations.
You don't have to look far for a great example of a Win/Win hire.
Coach Smith for our basketball.
A win for us because he immediately led Cardinal to first 21+ win season in 10 years, and first post season (NIT) in 7 years.
A win for him because he continues as a head coach in a Power conference.
And at a school with, presumably, some notable resources and NIL to help, based on my understanding of how Maxime was retained last season.
I think the ideal next/new Coach for us would be a Win/Win for both Stanford football, and for the new Coach.
This isn't unique to us, or to college football, it is kind of an ideal for any hire.
Based on that ideal, I think Coach Franklin is very unlikely to be a good fit as we would be most likely seen as a far step down and backwards in his career. Not to mention surely his very high pay expectations.
You don't have to look far for a great example of a Win/Win hire.
Coach Smith for our basketball.
A win for us because he immediately led Cardinal to first 21+ win season in 10 years, and first post season (NIT) in 7 years.
A win for him because he continues as a head coach in a Power conference.
And at a school with, presumably, some notable resources and NIL to help, based on my understanding of how Maxime was retained last season.
This isn't unique to us, or to college football, it is kind of an ideal for any hire.
Based on that ideal, I think Coach Franklin is very unlikely to be a good fit as we would be most likely seen as a far step down and backwards in his career. Not to mention surely his very high pay expectations.
You don't have to look far for a great example of a Win/Win hire.
Coach Smith for our basketball.
A win for us because he immediately led Cardinal to first 21+ win season in 10 years, and first post season (NIT) in 7 years.
A win for him because he continues as a head coach in a Power conference.
And at a school with, presumably, some notable resources and NIL to help, based on my understanding of how Maxime was retained last season.
(10-13-2025, 07:33 AM)GK3 Wrote:(10-12-2025, 05:14 PM)lancer1968 Wrote:Exactly why we should not hire him.(10-12-2025, 03:00 PM)BigJohn043 Wrote: He won at Vandy....From what I recall, and I read a lot about when he was at and left Vanderbilt (claims of rape), he recruited a decent number of athletes that Stanford should never, ever allow in. Not only on academics but personal ethics and values.
Quote:Franklin's .160 winning percentage against AP top-10 teams is tied for the third-worst record by a coach (minimum 25 games) at a single school since the poll era began in 1936, according to ESPN Research.
Hiring Franklin would be like some team hiring Shaw in 2023.
Put a glide in your stride and a dip in your hip.
(10-13-2025, 07:33 AM)GK3 Wrote:(10-12-2025, 05:14 PM)lancer1968 Wrote:Exactly why we should not hire him.(10-12-2025, 03:00 PM)BigJohn043 Wrote: He won at Vandy....From what I recall, and I read a lot about when he was at and left Vanderbilt (claims of rape), he recruited a decent number of athletes that Stanford should never, ever allow in. Not only on academics but personal ethics and values.
Quote:Franklin's .160 winning percentage against AP top-10 teams is tied for the third-worst record by a coach (minimum 25 games) at a single school since the poll era began in 1936, according to ESPN Research.
Hiring Franklin would be like some team hiring Shaw in 2023.
Put a glide in your stride and a dip in your hip.
10-13-2025, 11:22 AM
News to me that Shaw took Stanford to the playoffs in 2022. Notwithstanding the fact that Franklin took Penn State to the playoffs as recently as last season (and making it to the semi-final), I agree we shouldn’t hire him, but it is nothing like hiring Shaw in 2023.
BC
BC
News to me that Shaw took Stanford to the playoffs in 2022. Notwithstanding the fact that Franklin took Penn State to the playoffs as recently as last season (and making it to the semi-final), I agree we shouldn’t hire him, but it is nothing like hiring Shaw in 2023.
BC
BC
Franklin's character and history are disqualifying, but the guy can coach, and was responsible for a memorable moment for me. He got the job at Penn State based in part for coaching Vandy to an upset win that season over Georgia 31-27 in 2013. I happened to be at that game, and Vandy scored a touchdown early on a fake field goal in a way I've never seen before or since. Fourth down on the Georgia 2-yard line; the ball was snapped to the holder and the kicker started forward as if to make the kick, but the holder held the ball up, the kicker grabbed it on the run and scored untouched through a small hole that the line had opened up. It was so unexpected that early in the game, a thrilling and well-executed play. I quickly got tired of the Georgia fans barking throughout the game, though (and there were more Georgia fans than Vandy fans in the stadium).
Franklin's character and history are disqualifying, but the guy can coach, and was responsible for a memorable moment for me. He got the job at Penn State based in part for coaching Vandy to an upset win that season over Georgia 31-27 in 2013. I happened to be at that game, and Vandy scored a touchdown early on a fake field goal in a way I've never seen before or since. Fourth down on the Georgia 2-yard line; the ball was snapped to the holder and the kicker started forward as if to make the kick, but the holder held the ball up, the kicker grabbed it on the run and scored untouched through a small hole that the line had opened up. It was so unexpected that early in the game, a thrilling and well-executed play. I quickly got tired of the Georgia fans barking throughout the game, though (and there were more Georgia fans than Vandy fans in the stadium).
10-13-2025, 12:59 PM
(10-12-2025, 06:37 PM)BostonCard Wrote:(10-12-2025, 05:30 PM)Nan3cy Wrote:(10-12-2025, 03:00 PM)BigJohn043 Wrote: He won at Vandy....
If I remember correctly, Walt Harris won at Pitt too.
Yeah, I get distinct Wlat Harris vibes from Franklin.
BC
Agree -- Franklin is damaged goods. I think let the NYJets hire him.
The OffCo at Notre Dame would be higher on my list -- Mike Denbrock (no relation to eminent military historian Hans Delbruck).
Catholic school network -- and could get Offensive Linemen (!), accustomed to a selective institution.
He was our TE coach in 2001 under Willingham, and Willingham took Denbrock to NDAM with him.
(10-12-2025, 06:37 PM)BostonCard Wrote:(10-12-2025, 05:30 PM)Nan3cy Wrote:(10-12-2025, 03:00 PM)BigJohn043 Wrote: He won at Vandy....
If I remember correctly, Walt Harris won at Pitt too.
Yeah, I get distinct Wlat Harris vibes from Franklin.
BC
Agree -- Franklin is damaged goods. I think let the NYJets hire him.
The OffCo at Notre Dame would be higher on my list -- Mike Denbrock (no relation to eminent military historian Hans Delbruck).
Catholic school network -- and could get Offensive Linemen (!), accustomed to a selective institution.
He was our TE coach in 2001 under Willingham, and Willingham took Denbrock to NDAM with him.
10-13-2025, 02:19 PM
(10-13-2025, 11:22 AM)BostonCard Wrote: News to me that Shaw took Stanford to the playoffs in 2022. Notwithstanding the fact that Franklin took Penn State to the playoffs as recently as last season (and making it to the semi-final), I agree we shouldn’t hire him, but it is nothing like hiring Shaw in 2023.
BC
I was thinking more in terms of a coach that had good success in the past, but then his team went downhill fast. But, I will humbly accept your critique of my comment.
Put a glide in your stride and a dip in your hip.
(10-13-2025, 11:22 AM)BostonCard Wrote: News to me that Shaw took Stanford to the playoffs in 2022. Notwithstanding the fact that Franklin took Penn State to the playoffs as recently as last season (and making it to the semi-final), I agree we shouldn’t hire him, but it is nothing like hiring Shaw in 2023.
BC
I was thinking more in terms of a coach that had good success in the past, but then his team went downhill fast. But, I will humbly accept your critique of my comment.
Put a glide in your stride and a dip in your hip.
10-13-2025, 03:07 PM
I think the better analogy, such as it is, was Jim Harbaugh at Michigan after the 2020 season. While Harbaugh had been successful at Michigan, his tenure was dogged by the fact that he had gone 0-4 against Ohio State; Franklin’s tenure at Penn State had likewise been reasonably successful, but was always sullied by a perception that Franklin could not win big games.
Then, Harbaugh went 2-4 in the COVID-shortened 2020 season, and there were questions as to whether he was the right person for the job, just as Franklin’s two big time upset losses to UCLA and Northwestern have made questions about Franklin’s coaching abilities this year.
The difference is that Michigan stuck with Harbaugh, who did revamp his coaching staff after 2020, and eventually took his team to a national title and some NCAA violations before departing for LA. We will never know what Franklin would have done with Penn State. Franklin has been at Penn State over a decade, so it is not unreasonable to think that his ceiling might be top-10 team but not a real national title contender, which I guess is not good enough for Penn State fans.
BC
Then, Harbaugh went 2-4 in the COVID-shortened 2020 season, and there were questions as to whether he was the right person for the job, just as Franklin’s two big time upset losses to UCLA and Northwestern have made questions about Franklin’s coaching abilities this year.
The difference is that Michigan stuck with Harbaugh, who did revamp his coaching staff after 2020, and eventually took his team to a national title and some NCAA violations before departing for LA. We will never know what Franklin would have done with Penn State. Franklin has been at Penn State over a decade, so it is not unreasonable to think that his ceiling might be top-10 team but not a real national title contender, which I guess is not good enough for Penn State fans.
BC
I think the better analogy, such as it is, was Jim Harbaugh at Michigan after the 2020 season. While Harbaugh had been successful at Michigan, his tenure was dogged by the fact that he had gone 0-4 against Ohio State; Franklin’s tenure at Penn State had likewise been reasonably successful, but was always sullied by a perception that Franklin could not win big games.
Then, Harbaugh went 2-4 in the COVID-shortened 2020 season, and there were questions as to whether he was the right person for the job, just as Franklin’s two big time upset losses to UCLA and Northwestern have made questions about Franklin’s coaching abilities this year.
The difference is that Michigan stuck with Harbaugh, who did revamp his coaching staff after 2020, and eventually took his team to a national title and some NCAA violations before departing for LA. We will never know what Franklin would have done with Penn State. Franklin has been at Penn State over a decade, so it is not unreasonable to think that his ceiling might be top-10 team but not a real national title contender, which I guess is not good enough for Penn State fans.
BC
Then, Harbaugh went 2-4 in the COVID-shortened 2020 season, and there were questions as to whether he was the right person for the job, just as Franklin’s two big time upset losses to UCLA and Northwestern have made questions about Franklin’s coaching abilities this year.
The difference is that Michigan stuck with Harbaugh, who did revamp his coaching staff after 2020, and eventually took his team to a national title and some NCAA violations before departing for LA. We will never know what Franklin would have done with Penn State. Franklin has been at Penn State over a decade, so it is not unreasonable to think that his ceiling might be top-10 team but not a real national title contender, which I guess is not good enough for Penn State fans.
BC
10-13-2025, 05:19 PM
(10-13-2025, 02:19 PM)martyup Wrote:(10-13-2025, 11:22 AM)BostonCard Wrote: News to me that Shaw took Stanford to the playoffs in 2022. Notwithstanding the fact that Franklin took Penn State to the playoffs as recently as last season (and making it to the semi-final), I agree we shouldn’t hire him, but it is nothing like hiring Shaw in 2023.
BC
I was thinking more in terms of a coach that had good success in the past, but then his team went downhill fast. But, I will humbly accept your critique of my comment.
Like BC said, Franklin had good success within the past ten games. Totally different than Shaw's slow multi-year decline. I wouldn't hire Franklin; I'd go for the hot shot OC like the guy at Oregon, because Luck is doing 2/3 of the work that head coaches traditionally had to do.
Franklin was in State College for 11.5 seasons. I'm starting to think it is crazy to think you're going to get more than about 8 years out of even the best coach these days.
(10-13-2025, 02:19 PM)martyup Wrote:(10-13-2025, 11:22 AM)BostonCard Wrote: News to me that Shaw took Stanford to the playoffs in 2022. Notwithstanding the fact that Franklin took Penn State to the playoffs as recently as last season (and making it to the semi-final), I agree we shouldn’t hire him, but it is nothing like hiring Shaw in 2023.
BC
I was thinking more in terms of a coach that had good success in the past, but then his team went downhill fast. But, I will humbly accept your critique of my comment.
Like BC said, Franklin had good success within the past ten games. Totally different than Shaw's slow multi-year decline. I wouldn't hire Franklin; I'd go for the hot shot OC like the guy at Oregon, because Luck is doing 2/3 of the work that head coaches traditionally had to do.
Franklin was in State College for 11.5 seasons. I'm starting to think it is crazy to think you're going to get more than about 8 years out of even the best coach these days.
10-13-2025, 05:59 PM
(10-13-2025, 10:12 AM)martyup Wrote: Hiring Franklin would be like some team hiring Shaw in 2023.As far as on-field results are concerned, it would indeed be at least analogous. Neither would be "good" candidates for at least a couple of years after resigning/being fired. While coaches are often recycled, a "decent interval" is required for real face-plants. However, Shaw never brought in athletes that were of questionable character and who definitely didn't belong at Stanford, at least AFAIK. If it happened, it was undoubtedly unintended. Franklin OTOH has at least some record of doing exactly that. IMO that is a very big difference. Nobody hiring Shaw would have to justify Shaw's character.
(10-13-2025, 10:12 AM)martyup Wrote: Hiring Franklin would be like some team hiring Shaw in 2023.As far as on-field results are concerned, it would indeed be at least analogous. Neither would be "good" candidates for at least a couple of years after resigning/being fired. While coaches are often recycled, a "decent interval" is required for real face-plants. However, Shaw never brought in athletes that were of questionable character and who definitely didn't belong at Stanford, at least AFAIK. If it happened, it was undoubtedly unintended. Franklin OTOH has at least some record of doing exactly that. IMO that is a very big difference. Nobody hiring Shaw would have to justify Shaw's character.
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