[BigEasyCard]

The 2019 Recruiting thread included an observation that the Urban Meyer situation at Ohio State might affect Stanford's recruiting, (presumably positively).

A few subsequent posts drifted away from the impact on Recruiting to details of the matter itself.  Matters affecting the head coach of one of the most successful college football programs might be relevant to this community.  I have created this thread because I believe that they are better discussed in a separate thread than under Recruiting.

Geaux Cardinal!

[BigEasyCard]

The 2019 Recruiting thread included an observation that the Urban Meyer situation at Ohio State might affect Stanford's recruiting, (presumably positively).

A few subsequent posts drifted away from the impact on Recruiting to details of the matter itself.  Matters affecting the head coach of one of the most successful college football programs might be relevant to this community.  I have created this thread because I believe that they are better discussed in a separate thread than under Recruiting.

Geaux Cardinal!

[OutsiderFan]

It seems highly unlikely that Stanford would land recruits as fallout from Urban Meyer getting canned at Ohio State. Has a recruit ever decided between Stanford and Ohio State?  Stanford has offered recruits who have chosen Ohio State, but based on my observations, said recruits usually make early commitments, or drift away from Stanford as an option well before signing day.

There may be some rare exceptions, but as a rule guys who choose Ohio State aren't bothering with a Stanford application, AP classes, re-taking tests, etc.

[OutsiderFan]

It seems highly unlikely that Stanford would land recruits as fallout from Urban Meyer getting canned at Ohio State. Has a recruit ever decided between Stanford and Ohio State?  Stanford has offered recruits who have chosen Ohio State, but based on my observations, said recruits usually make early commitments, or drift away from Stanford as an option well before signing day.

There may be some rare exceptions, but as a rule guys who choose Ohio State aren't bothering with a Stanford application, AP classes, re-taking tests, etc.

[martyup]

Urban is toast.  In his own words, a head football coach is responsible for the mistakes of his staff. Prepare for the head coach musical chairs to play out.

[martyup]

Urban is toast.  In his own words, a head football coach is responsible for the mistakes of his staff. Prepare for the head coach musical chairs to play out.

[BobK]

Thanks Big Easy 

Outsider so wrong.  Recently Ohio State beat Stanford for a many AP 34 ACT top top 2019.  Also lost a 4.0 2020 recently to Ohio State.    
Marty my bet is Urban gets a slap on the wrist.   However even if fired Ohio State will remain a brobdingnagian lure for top players

[BobK]

Thanks Big Easy 

Outsider so wrong.  Recently Ohio State beat Stanford for a many AP 34 ACT top top 2019.  Also lost a 4.0 2020 recently to Ohio State.    
Marty my bet is Urban gets a slap on the wrist.   However even if fired Ohio State will remain a brobdingnagian lure for top players

[OutsiderFan]

Thanks Big Easy 

Outsider so wrong.  Recently Ohio State beat Stanford for a many AP 34 ACT top top 2019.  Also lost a 4.0 2020 recently to Ohio State.    
Marty my bet is Urban gets a slap on the wrist.   However even if fired Ohio State will remain a of immense proportions lure for top players

Bob, were the one to whom you refer willing to do the extra application work Stanford demands?  I only consider guys as clear head-to-head misses if they submit Stanford applications and chose elsewhere.  Dax Hollifield choosing VT over Stanford is an example.

[OutsiderFan]

Thanks Big Easy 

Outsider so wrong.  Recently Ohio State beat Stanford for a many AP 34 ACT top top 2019.  Also lost a 4.0 2020 recently to Ohio State.    
Marty my bet is Urban gets a slap on the wrist.   However even if fired Ohio State will remain a of immense proportions lure for top players

Bob, were the one to whom you refer willing to do the extra application work Stanford demands?  I only consider guys as clear head-to-head misses if they submit Stanford applications and chose elsewhere.  Dax Hollifield choosing VT over Stanford is an example.

[BostonCard]

It seems highly unlikely that Stanford would land recruits as fallout from Urban Meyer getting canned at Ohio State. Has a recruit ever decided between Stanford and Ohio State?  Stanford has offered recruits who have chosen Ohio State, but based on my observations, said recruits usually make early commitments, or drift away from Stanford as an option well before signing day.

There may be some rare exceptions, but as a rule guys who choose Ohio State aren't bothering with a Stanford application, AP classes, re-taking tests, etc.

Just yesterday you wrote, "Was really hoping Stanford would land Kane Patterson (Ohio State commit) and Sinclair, but just Sinclair is nothing to complain about."

I don't have any specific knowledge about Patterson, and Stanford may not have been an option for him, but presumably, he contradicts your assertion earlier in this thread that no recruits decide between Ohio State and Stanford.

BC

[BostonCard]

It seems highly unlikely that Stanford would land recruits as fallout from Urban Meyer getting canned at Ohio State. Has a recruit ever decided between Stanford and Ohio State?  Stanford has offered recruits who have chosen Ohio State, but based on my observations, said recruits usually make early commitments, or drift away from Stanford as an option well before signing day.

There may be some rare exceptions, but as a rule guys who choose Ohio State aren't bothering with a Stanford application, AP classes, re-taking tests, etc.

Just yesterday you wrote, "Was really hoping Stanford would land Kane Patterson (Ohio State commit) and Sinclair, but just Sinclair is nothing to complain about."

I don't have any specific knowledge about Patterson, and Stanford may not have been an option for him, but presumably, he contradicts your assertion earlier in this thread that no recruits decide between Ohio State and Stanford.

BC

[BobK]

It’s very rare for a potential Stanford athlete to receive an App before 6th semester grades so I would never ever use your criteria.   Now no question there are those who could receive an App and said no to retaking the ACT or SAT or to the minimum AP requirements.  I agree with you on that point.     

Both of those I referenced committed to Ohio State before getting the APP.  One was a 2019 one a 2020.

[BobK]

It’s very rare for a potential Stanford athlete to receive an App before 6th semester grades so I would never ever use your criteria.   Now no question there are those who could receive an App and said no to retaking the ACT or SAT or to the minimum AP requirements.  I agree with you on that point.     

Both of those I referenced committed to Ohio State before getting the APP.  One was a 2019 one a 2020.

[OutsiderFan]

It seems highly unlikely that Stanford would land recruits as fallout from Urban Meyer getting canned at Ohio State. Has a recruit ever decided between Stanford and Ohio State?  Stanford has offered recruits who have chosen Ohio State, but based on my observations, said recruits usually make early commitments, or drift away from Stanford as an option well before signing day.

There may be some rare exceptions, but as a rule guys who choose Ohio State aren't bothering with a Stanford application, AP classes, re-taking tests, etc.

Just yesterday you wrote, "Was really hoping Stanford would land Kane Patterson (Ohio State commit) and Sinclair, but just Sinclair is nothing to complain about."

I don't have any specific knowledge about Patterson, and Stanford may not have been an option for him, but presumably, he contradicts your assertion earlier in this thread that no recruits decide between Ohio State and Stanford.

BC

What?  What makes you think he chose between Stanford and Ohio State?  I know 247 (yes, they can be wrong) had Patterson going to Alabama, with not a single Stanford prediction.  My hope of getting a recruit, and his interest in Stanford are two separate things, but I feel pretty confident saying Stanford wasn't Patterson's second choice.  I may be wrong, but that's what I believe based on what I can gather.

[OutsiderFan]

It seems highly unlikely that Stanford would land recruits as fallout from Urban Meyer getting canned at Ohio State. Has a recruit ever decided between Stanford and Ohio State?  Stanford has offered recruits who have chosen Ohio State, but based on my observations, said recruits usually make early commitments, or drift away from Stanford as an option well before signing day.

There may be some rare exceptions, but as a rule guys who choose Ohio State aren't bothering with a Stanford application, AP classes, re-taking tests, etc.

Just yesterday you wrote, "Was really hoping Stanford would land Kane Patterson (Ohio State commit) and Sinclair, but just Sinclair is nothing to complain about."

I don't have any specific knowledge about Patterson, and Stanford may not have been an option for him, but presumably, he contradicts your assertion earlier in this thread that no recruits decide between Ohio State and Stanford.

BC

What?  What makes you think he chose between Stanford and Ohio State?  I know 247 (yes, they can be wrong) had Patterson going to Alabama, with not a single Stanford prediction.  My hope of getting a recruit, and his interest in Stanford are two separate things, but I feel pretty confident saying Stanford wasn't Patterson's second choice.  I may be wrong, but that's what I believe based on what I can gather.

[stupac2]

Urban is toast.  In his own words, a head football coach is responsible for the mistakes of his staff. Prepare for the head coach musical chairs to play out.

Based on what I've read that is a ridiculous take on the situation. This isn't just "a guy screwed up who happened to coach under Meyer" it's "a guy with a history of domestic abuse that Meyer was aware of beat the crap out of his wife, Meyer found out, and then used his influence to keep her from coming forward about it so he could save his buddy, and then lied about knowing it when it came back up recently." If that's true (and I have no particular reason to think it's not) then it's completely indefensible. Acting like this is an unfair railroading is absurd.

[stupac2]

Urban is toast.  In his own words, a head football coach is responsible for the mistakes of his staff. Prepare for the head coach musical chairs to play out.

Based on what I've read that is a ridiculous take on the situation. This isn't just "a guy screwed up who happened to coach under Meyer" it's "a guy with a history of domestic abuse that Meyer was aware of beat the crap out of his wife, Meyer found out, and then used his influence to keep her from coming forward about it so he could save his buddy, and then lied about knowing it when it came back up recently." If that's true (and I have no particular reason to think it's not) then it's completely indefensible. Acting like this is an unfair railroading is absurd.

[martyup]

Oh no, I'm not saying he's being railroaded.   I'm saying he's toast because he kept the guy on staff after knowing in 2009 that he beat his wife.  More facts have come out that make it nearly impossible for tOSU to keep him.  And, he really messed up at the Big 10 media day when he claimed that the 2015 story was a fabrication.

[martyup]

Oh no, I'm not saying he's being railroaded.   I'm saying he's toast because he kept the guy on staff after knowing in 2009 that he beat his wife.  More facts have come out that make it nearly impossible for tOSU to keep him.  And, he really messed up at the Big 10 media day when he claimed that the 2015 story was a fabrication.

[Langdude]

In by better moments, I don't wish ill on anyone. But I'm no fan of Urban Meyer (going back to his days at Florida), so this provides a bit of schadenfreude. I think he's an opportunist, politician, liar, and egoist. Though I know that's true for lots of HCs, I've often thought that he, especially, was successful at the expense of his integrity.

At any rate, THE Ohio State University will survive, I think. They are presently even more ensconced as an elite football power than Penn State, where the scandal was much worse, and PSU football is recovering well. I don't know what will happen with Meyer, but if stuff keeps coming out, I'll bet he gets fired, and will resurface in a couple of years. But if they find a way to corral this stuff to a limited number of issues, perhaps he just gets a suspension or something? I dunno. We'll see.

-m.

[Langdude]

In by better moments, I don't wish ill on anyone. But I'm no fan of Urban Meyer (going back to his days at Florida), so this provides a bit of schadenfreude. I think he's an opportunist, politician, liar, and egoist. Though I know that's true for lots of HCs, I've often thought that he, especially, was successful at the expense of his integrity.

At any rate, THE Ohio State University will survive, I think. They are presently even more ensconced as an elite football power than Penn State, where the scandal was much worse, and PSU football is recovering well. I don't know what will happen with Meyer, but if stuff keeps coming out, I'll bet he gets fired, and will resurface in a couple of years. But if they find a way to corral this stuff to a limited number of issues, perhaps he just gets a suspension or something? I dunno. We'll see.

-m.

[BostonCard]

Fearless prediction:

Urban Meyer will not be the last coach in this situation.

BC

[BostonCard]

Fearless prediction:

Urban Meyer will not be the last coach in this situation.

BC

[SamuelMcF]

At any rate, THE Ohio State University will survive, I think. They are presently even more ensconced as an elite football power than Penn State, and the scandal at Penn State was much worse, and PSU football is recovering well.

100% agree. Don't even need to reference another school. There have been multiple scandalous Ohio State coaches in the past, and their status as a blue blood has never been in question.

Woody Hayes, 5x national champion and Ohio State head coach for over 25 years, was fired after he punched a Clemson player in the throat, amongst enough other things that it warrants a "Controversies" section in his Wikipedia article: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Woody_Hayes#Controversies

Jim Tressel, 2002 national champion and head coach from 2001-2010, resigned over his involvement in "Tattoo-gate," where as many as 28 players were trading memorabilia for free tattoos over his tenure: https://www.ncaa.com/news/football/artic...te-scandal

[SamuelMcF]

At any rate, THE Ohio State University will survive, I think. They are presently even more ensconced as an elite football power than Penn State, and the scandal at Penn State was much worse, and PSU football is recovering well.

100% agree. Don't even need to reference another school. There have been multiple scandalous Ohio State coaches in the past, and their status as a blue blood has never been in question.

Woody Hayes, 5x national champion and Ohio State head coach for over 25 years, was fired after he punched a Clemson player in the throat, amongst enough other things that it warrants a "Controversies" section in his Wikipedia article: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Woody_Hayes#Controversies

Jim Tressel, 2002 national champion and head coach from 2001-2010, resigned over his involvement in "Tattoo-gate," where as many as 28 players were trading memorabilia for free tattoos over his tenure: https://www.ncaa.com/news/football/artic...te-scandal

[Goose]

There are plenty of people who were involved with Meyer at Florida that have said he basically has no ethical standards whatsoever. He had guys on his team that he knew were criminals, were continuing to be criminals, and all he did was try to keep it quiet. In so far as he may get fired over this latest issue, I would just say it is ironic that he gets fired over a situation that is not the worst thing he ever did! The current climate around Title IX can certainly lead to Witch/Warlock hunts. Maybe this time it actually found one.
I may be totally wrong, but I don't see how tOSU can get by just suspending him for a few games. If he had done something like kicked the problem upstairs to the AD, even if nothing was done, he could probably survive. However, it appears he took no such action. I don't see any they can keep him. But, it is the B1G.

[Goose]

There are plenty of people who were involved with Meyer at Florida that have said he basically has no ethical standards whatsoever. He had guys on his team that he knew were criminals, were continuing to be criminals, and all he did was try to keep it quiet. In so far as he may get fired over this latest issue, I would just say it is ironic that he gets fired over a situation that is not the worst thing he ever did! The current climate around Title IX can certainly lead to Witch/Warlock hunts. Maybe this time it actually found one.
I may be totally wrong, but I don't see how tOSU can get by just suspending him for a few games. If he had done something like kicked the problem upstairs to the AD, even if nothing was done, he could probably survive. However, it appears he took no such action. I don't see any they can keep him. But, it is the B1G.

[stupac2]

Oh no, I'm not saying he's being railroaded.   I'm saying he's toast because he kept the guy on staff after knowing in 2009 that he beat his wife.  More facts have come out that make it nearly impossible for tOSU to keep him.  And, he really messed up at the Big 10 media day when he claimed that the 2015 story was a fabrication.

Gotcha. I think the main question here isn't "Is he done at OSU?" There's no justification for keeping him. It's "Does he manage to come back or is he done for good?" Time will tell.

The whole thing is particularly rich because he had been getting a lot of press about the good stuff he does. I'm having a somewhat tough time coming up with specifics, but I know I saw a number of articles about this over the past year, and even read a few of them because he just reeked of slime based on his Florida tenure, but it seemed genuine. I guess it was not.

[stupac2]

Oh no, I'm not saying he's being railroaded.   I'm saying he's toast because he kept the guy on staff after knowing in 2009 that he beat his wife.  More facts have come out that make it nearly impossible for tOSU to keep him.  And, he really messed up at the Big 10 media day when he claimed that the 2015 story was a fabrication.

Gotcha. I think the main question here isn't "Is he done at OSU?" There's no justification for keeping him. It's "Does he manage to come back or is he done for good?" Time will tell.

The whole thing is particularly rich because he had been getting a lot of press about the good stuff he does. I'm having a somewhat tough time coming up with specifics, but I know I saw a number of articles about this over the past year, and even read a few of them because he just reeked of slime based on his Florida tenure, but it seemed genuine. I guess it was not.

[needle]

If Colorado found a way to keep Mike MacIntyre, I suspect Ohio State will find a way to keep Urban Meyer.

BTW, if  Ohio State is concerned about legal liability--and they are--it seems Colorado also skated on that issue. Here's a news report on the dismissal of a lawsuit against MacIntyre (and others at the university) filed by the former girlfriend of a former Buffs assistant football coach. She has accused him of domestic violence. Similarly to Meyer (tho the devil is in the details), MacIntyre was told by the woman that she was being assaulted by the coach. He did not follow university policy in relaying the information to the proper people at CU.

But, in dismissing the case, a judge concluded:

"Defendants' alleged failure to follow the university's rules and policies did not increase the risk of harm to (Fine) given that, as someone with no affiliation with or connection to the university, she was not within the group of individuals that the policies were designed to protect," Martinez wrote in the ruling, which was issued Wednesday.

http://www.dailycamera.com/ci_32019470

[needle]

If Colorado found a way to keep Mike MacIntyre, I suspect Ohio State will find a way to keep Urban Meyer.

BTW, if  Ohio State is concerned about legal liability--and they are--it seems Colorado also skated on that issue. Here's a news report on the dismissal of a lawsuit against MacIntyre (and others at the university) filed by the former girlfriend of a former Buffs assistant football coach. She has accused him of domestic violence. Similarly to Meyer (tho the devil is in the details), MacIntyre was told by the woman that she was being assaulted by the coach. He did not follow university policy in relaying the information to the proper people at CU.

But, in dismissing the case, a judge concluded:

"Defendants' alleged failure to follow the university's rules and policies did not increase the risk of harm to (Fine) given that, as someone with no affiliation with or connection to the university, she was not within the group of individuals that the policies were designed to protect," Martinez wrote in the ruling, which was issued Wednesday.

http://www.dailycamera.com/ci_32019470

[OutsiderFan]

In another time, Meyer would certainly return.  My money is on him negotiating a mutually agreed on settlement to part ways with Ohio State.

[OutsiderFan]

In another time, Meyer would certainly return.  My money is on him negotiating a mutually agreed on settlement to part ways with Ohio State.

[Hurlburt88]

Now I see some "piling on" with allegations of player abuse at Florida.  This 6-person committee investigating will have plenty to work through which may take time . . . unless the "mutually-agreed upon separation" emerges in the meantime

[Hurlburt88]

Now I see some "piling on" with allegations of player abuse at Florida.  This 6-person committee investigating will have plenty to work through which may take time . . . unless the "mutually-agreed upon separation" emerges in the meantime

[pefloresjr]

Based on the stories I've seen about this, I think Meyer is back on the job very quickly.  Ohio State doesn't give a damn about ethical standards if they get in the way of championship football.  Meyer seems to have at least minimally plausible deniability and that is enough to keep him coaching.  I saw the victim's interview on CNN and she said nothing about Meyer trying to keep her from reporting anything.  She said that Meyer's wife knew and that she would have to tell Meyer but the victim didn't know if Meyer had ever actually been told.  Based on all of that, Meyer still has deniability and Ohio State will use that to keep him on the job.  Obviously, none of us know the facts that the committee has so we are all speculating at this point.  I just feel like you are likely to win the bet if you take the cynical, "winning is all that matters" side of any bet when it comes to Ohio State and many others.  

Cheers,
Pete F.

[pefloresjr]

Based on the stories I've seen about this, I think Meyer is back on the job very quickly.  Ohio State doesn't give a damn about ethical standards if they get in the way of championship football.  Meyer seems to have at least minimally plausible deniability and that is enough to keep him coaching.  I saw the victim's interview on CNN and she said nothing about Meyer trying to keep her from reporting anything.  She said that Meyer's wife knew and that she would have to tell Meyer but the victim didn't know if Meyer had ever actually been told.  Based on all of that, Meyer still has deniability and Ohio State will use that to keep him on the job.  Obviously, none of us know the facts that the committee has so we are all speculating at this point.  I just feel like you are likely to win the bet if you take the cynical, "winning is all that matters" side of any bet when it comes to Ohio State and many others.  

Cheers,
Pete F.

[Goose]

I just feel like you are likely to win the bet if you take the cynical, "winning is all that matters" side of any bet when it comes to Ohio State and many others.  

Cheers,
Pete F.

If the coach involved was "Coach X". I would for sure agree with you. However, Urban Meyer has a reputation. His reputation makes his "plausible deniability" much less plausible to the average man on the street. Not fair perhaps, but certainly true. That may be enough to make tOSU feel they can't just ignore it. Undoubtedly the "investigation" will have to play out, but I would not be surprised if a "mutual parting of ways" is reached before the final report is made. It may just be easier that way for all concerned.

[Goose]

I just feel like you are likely to win the bet if you take the cynical, "winning is all that matters" side of any bet when it comes to Ohio State and many others.  

Cheers,
Pete F.

If the coach involved was "Coach X". I would for sure agree with you. However, Urban Meyer has a reputation. His reputation makes his "plausible deniability" much less plausible to the average man on the street. Not fair perhaps, but certainly true. That may be enough to make tOSU feel they can't just ignore it. Undoubtedly the "investigation" will have to play out, but I would not be surprised if a "mutual parting of ways" is reached before the final report is made. It may just be easier that way for all concerned.